1968 Catalina 2 door sedan, 428-4spd

[427strato]

Hi; has anyone heard of one of these cars? I would have thought they would have been available in 1968 and that at least a few would have been produced. I'd be interested in acquiring one if possible. I know that sleepers really were not that desirable at that time, or maybe even now, as the factories procuced all of the packages you could want, however, you would think some would have been in existence. I've been looking for them for a number of years but to no availe. In any event, its food for thought. Thanks, Doug.

[442w30]

There was one for sale a few years ago. It was in eastern PA. I chatted with the owner. He said it was a documented HO 4-speed. Even an automatic HO would be fantastically rare.

[427strato]

Hi. I'm sorry I didn't reply to you earlier however I seldom check the site. It would have been nice to have had the individuals name that had the 68 Catalina 2 door sedan, 428 car. I'm glad there is such an animal out there somewhere though. The equivalent in Canada was a 68 Strato Chief with a 427 chevrolet engine of which I am just completing a body off restoration on mine. We have GM documentation here which shows they made 5 of them and I'm the original owner. We had roughly 30 million people in Canada in the 60's while the USA had approximately 300 million so if we had 5 you should have about 50 428 2 door sedan Catalinas. I've been searching sites for years and have never run across one so I was starting to think there really wasn't such a vehicle made. It was nice to here from you and thanks for the information. Doug.

[442w30]

Were you friends with Hillar?

[twertsy]

I got my 428 in my firebird out of a '68 catalina in ?Vestal? at Harry's You Pull-it (salvage yard).

[427strato]

With respect to 442W30 post; yes, I was a good friend of Hillar. I sold him a 1970 Pontiace Laurentian, 2 door, 454 cu. in.car that was one of 221 full size cars made with that option in Canada in 1970 and it had 31,000 original miles, probably less than 10 of those particular cars made. I knew him for many years prior to that and he frequently came to see me. We would discuss the Canadian hi-performance Pontiacs with great enthusiasm during that time as they were not made in the United States. There is no forum to discuss these hi-performance cars now and they are a dying breed. There were few original B-body big block cars made from 1965 to 1970 in the Canadian Pontiac line and documentation of these is somewhat rare. Hillar was a wonderful, energetic person, so full of excitement about the Canadian Pontiac hi-performance cars and he infused this excitement in everyone he met. There was no pretence as to what made a high performance Canadian Pontiac, just that they did exist and were made in various models, Acadians, Beumonts and full size B-bodies, mostly being big block cars, although some small block 350 hrs cars were made. They were all built on a Chevrolet frame and drivetrain, hence the big block chevrolet engines. I've seen many Pontiac forums where people tend to resent and dismiss these cars because they are not made as a pure Pontiac. In any event they look like a Pontiac, were built like a Pontiace, were purchased as a Pontiac, can be documented by GM of Canada as a Pontiac and then MUST therfor be a Pontiac. I miss him and his knowledge as to these cars very much. Its disappointing now that there is no one to discuss and get excited about these cars with. Doug.

[427strato]

By the way; I'm still looking for an original documented 1968 Pontiace, Catalina, 2 door sedan, 428, 4 speed car. They must exist and someone must have heard of one. They cannot be so rare that they haven't been seen. Doug.

[ZAPPER68]

Its disappointing now that there is no one to discuss and get excited about these cars with.

The guys over on the Canadian Poncho website are passionate about all things Pontiac. They are a very knowledgeable about the big block cars. The 'Two Carls' are the big block go to guys over there.

[442w30]

Doug, I've known about your cars for years. I may even have pics of them. I knew Hillar from my time in MI. It's probably 4 years this month since he passed? What a shame. :-(

[Charley Lillard]

Is there a pic of one of these 68's ?

[442w30]

It would look like this:

http://image.hotrod.com/f/28955302+w660+h440+q80+re0+cr1/hppp-1007-01%2b1968-pontiac-catalina%2b.jpg



http://image.hotrod.com/f/28955302+w660+h440+q80+re0+cr1/hppp-1007-01%2b1968-pontiac-catalina%2b.jpg

[427strato]

Hi guys. That is the only one I have ever seen. If I remember correctly it is in Texas and a 400 cu. in. 3 spd. stick car; must be rare.

With respect to ZAPPER68's comment I would beg to differ. The only cars there are stroked cars, ie, 6 cyl. or small block cars with wrong engines and no inclination to do real cars unless its really, really cheap and it can be done the same way. Take a look at the Purist forum; it gets used about every 3 or 4 months. The guys with the good cars don't seem to show up on there any more and bull***t does not baffle brains. There are still tidbits of good information on there but not on ORIGINAL big block Canadian Pontiac cars or the parts used to restore one. A thousand posts does not make one an expert. Many of the parts are 68 Chevrolet but many of them are only very similiar when it comes to body and interior; I've actually restored B-body cars and its really difficult as neither the American Pontiac or Chevrolet parts always interchange. Floor pans, package trays, etc are similiar but not the same. I don't just "guess" they are the same, I actually try them, sort of trial and error but eventually you can figure it out and get the right parts or make them fit. It gets expensive at times but thats the trials and tribulations of doing a proper restoration and it all works out in the wash. Have a great day, Doug.

[442w30]

2,546 Catalinas were built with manual transmission. The owner of that white car thinks it's 1 of 29, but I'm betting he's WAY off - generally, the El Cheapo cars came with a higher rate of 3-speed manuals than other models. I'm sure the Chevy folks on this site will have seen a host of Biscaynes with 3-on-the-trees.

[StealthBird]

Here's another 2-door sedan.

[ZAPPER68]

With respect to ZAPPER68's comment I would beg to differ. The only cars there are stroked cars, ie, 6 cyl. or small block cars with wrong engines and no inclination to do real cars unless its really, really cheap and it can be done the same way.

Really....that is a rather interesting if not inflammatory statement..YIKES!

[427strato]

The truth is not inflammatory; it is what it is. All you have to do is look at that site and read back through the posts to the beginning to see the regression. Its not very difficult. I research for a living and I don't forget much about what I have read, but I don't remember everything. I often look back through that site to find information that I know is there in the early years and is good, but I never actually wrote it down. There is some really good information there and you have to find it and apply it to your restoration project as best you can. Its not a big deal; these people will not pay for a rare Canadian car, but its a shame they run down all the few originals that are left; ie the derogatory statements as to the values of those cars and what people ask for them; what could they possibly know, they haven't purchased any and never will, hence how could they possibly have any true knowledge of the actual values. I think most of us that have rare cars have moved on to other forums; truly a shame; whatever. Doug.

[CDNL-78]

Doug,

I have a buddy with 2-68 Canadian 427 pontiacs. They both have Canadian GM documentation. They are rare as hens teeth. He's 10 minutes from my place. They both need to be restored. Due to the fact that the cost of a proper restoration on these cars is some much, they are both just sitting there as he slowly gathers parts to complete one of them. As you said, not much inter changes with these cars which makes for a pricey/tough project to complete.

Post us some pictures of your 427 Canadian Pontiac. I for one would like to see it. I'm sure others would also like to see pics.

Cheers

[442w30]

Me too!

[quik9r]

My first 4 speed car I drove was a 69 Pontiac 2+2 427-390 HP, was in a hay field north of Toronto, I was 14. This was my uncle's winter beater and it was 1 of 12 by GM Canada documents. Car was pretty far gone but drivable for 1983 standards!!

Quik9r

[68_427]

HERE ARE A COUPLE PICS OF THE 2 68 427 CARS DARCY IS REFERING TO. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/04/full-18553-24030-1654895.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/04/full-18553-24031-capture.png

[PeteLeathersac]

Lovin' all this Canadian B-body Pontiac MkIV talk!
My all time dream car is a W-powered '61 Strato-Chief 2-Dr. Batwing Post no rear seat Utility Sedan w/ late build 409/360 4-Spd ...it's a dream right?
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif
~ Pete

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

Dream big!!!

Ryan

[427strato]

Hi. I love that green car. I remember when I had my car new there was a guy, not too far from me, that had a 2 dr. hardtop car, also new, obviously, that was a 396 car. He followed me home one day however I don't remember anything else about that car, other that it was pretty; probably should have bought a 2 dr. hardtop. There likely are a few other original 427 B-body Pontiacs in Ontario, although the only ones I can think of are in the London area, probably the best collection of big block B-body Pontiacs in Canada. I haven't spoken to the owner in years, however he has a fantastic collection, some of them being in what Hillar called, the single digit club. I've lost touch with him over the years and I often wonder whether the collection has developed past the last time I saw it. Doug.

[442w30]

Here's a few docs that I have....

[427strato]

Hi guys. I love that documentation.

In any event, where are the 428 cu. in. 2 door sedan 1968 Catalinas'? Maybe I'm on the incorrect forum to ask this question as there seems to be no American input. We had roughly 30 million people in Canada producing 5 Strato Chief 427 cars, while the US had 300 million people, hence it seems to be ridiculous to think there were no 68 Catalina, 2 dr. sedan cars with a 428-4spd, much less no interest in finding them. There is a huge interest in 68 Biscayne 427 cars out there so why not 68 Catalina 428 cars. Does anyone other than me question this? Doug.

[442w30]

Well....

- It's Chevrolet versus the world - I think you find much more wide-ranging interest in Chevys than other brands.

- The 427 big Chevys were known, credible performance cars, while the 428 Catalina never had that luxury - even the 1967 2+2 is quite obscure.

- Full-size Pontiac interest curtails after 1966.

- By 1968, full-size performance cars were practically non-existent, with only the SS 427 as being the only &quot;proper&quot; big muscle car.

I have production figures for a lot of obscure Pontiacs from the late-1960s, and you'd be quite surprised how rare the 428 HO was. In fact, more were ordered in Bonnevilles than Catalinas, which shows that a loaded chariot was more interesting to Pontiac buyers than a fast big car. Many of them are as rare as their Canadian brethren.

[quik9r]

That is the car that I drove in a Hay field in 1983. Morley Brown is my uncle!

Quik9r

[442w30]

Funny!

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

Small Canadian world!!

Shelburne is about an hour from me, the hay field may be closer?

Ryan

[442w30]

Last month, my friend bought the '68 HO 4-speed I had mentioned. It's an honest-to-goodness 2-door sedan with that combo. Production numbers don't exist from the GM Heritage Center, unfortunately - the pages are missing.

[daverd]

I love the Canadian full size pontiacs!
So cool !and different !

[PeteLeathersac]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 442w30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Last month, my friend bought the '68 HO 4-speed I had mentioned. It's an honest-to-goodness 2-door sedan with that combo. Production numbers don't exist from the GM Heritage Center, unfortunately - the pages are missing.
</div></div>

Hoping you can share a few pics here of this rare Poncho Post!
Looking forward to your book Diego!
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif
~ Pete

[442w30]

You can find pics here:

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=791278

Regarding the book, I got an advance copy on Sat, with the rest of 'em coming in around a month from now. Once I get my webpage up and running (this week), I'll post an announcement. Much appreciated for your enthusiasm!

[Tracker1]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 442w30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Last month, my friend bought the '68 HO 4-speed I had mentioned. It's an honest-to-goodness 2-door sedan with that combo. Production numbers don't exist from the GM Heritage Center, unfortunately - the pages are missing. </div></div>

Pics?

[427strato]

Hi. I tried this once already however I'm too old to be computer literate. The 1968 Catalina 2 dr. sedan should look like this other than it should likely have 428 emblems rather than 427 emblems. I have no idea what they look like, ie the 428 emblems however they should likely be extremely rare, as is the car. The colour should be as on the car on the right. Doug. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2017/02/full-5542-57302-img_0956.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2017/02/full-5542-57303-img_0955.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2017/02/full-5542-57304-img_0926.jpg

[442w30]

Hillar showed me pics of your car almost 20 years ago.

Those 428 badges you mention are not terribly rare. They would look like this:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/5f/e3/ba/5fe3ba7f6d72bd522be8005f4788d46e.jpg