Interesting day 2 copo on ebay? [Archive]

camaromb

09-06-2005, 07:59 PM

The motor vin was posted on the site in late '03. It appears the motor finally found the car. Probably another Frost Chevrolet car. The owner from the '70s liked visiting junkyards to add options to the car! Thus the bumber guards, deluxe panels, etc. The endura was original to the car back to the '70s. The current owner has a photo from the early '70s. Another barn find surfaces!

69L72RS

09-06-2005, 08:49 PM

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif No the engine didn't find the car.http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif
It is still sitting in my garage, where it has been for the last 12 years. Before that Brad Hillard had the engine in a 67 SS car.
It is still in the same place it was when I first posted details about it on this and another site. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif

Astock

09-06-2005, 08:53 PM

I blew up the area I was focused on,and after a better look I retract my opinion(nothing to do with the heater core).

69L72RS

09-06-2005, 08:57 PM

Because the engine I have (T0423MN) has VIN 19N641030.
I have been tracking this car for over 12 years, with no luck finding it.

Lynn

09-06-2005, 08:58 PM

I'm confused. Details, please.

Lynn

69L72RS

09-06-2005, 09:18 PM

I bought this engine : T0423MN/VIN 19N641030, when I was gathering parts for my car. I found it about 89 or 90 when Brad had it in his car. He bought the engine out of a 69 camaro racecar in Xenia, Ohio. I had to buy the whole car to get this engine. After deciding to not use this engine in my car, I started hunting the body. I tracked it to somewhere around Columbus and lost it.

69L72RS

09-06-2005, 09:35 PM

I asked Kurt about helping track the car down a while ago.
Kurt asked me about the engine in March of this year and I sent him a picture of the deck and the casting dates from the engine.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 9N641030 engine
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 02:11:57 -0500
From: Kurt Sonen <[email protected]>
Reply-To: <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>

Eric,
Do you have the engine code for 9N641030? I assume the VIN was by the oil
filter, right?

Nothing in the db on that car, but there are some COPO's built about the
same time....

Thanks!
Kurt S
CRG - www.camaros.org (http://www.camaros.org)

Kurt let us know what you have on the car.

Has anyone seen this car yet?

Lynn

09-06-2005, 09:36 PM

Bear with me. Still a little confused. So is the car in the auction 124379N641030? I don't see a VIN listed in the description.

If so, does he have a restamped engine he is passing off as the original?

Lynn

Astock

09-06-2005, 09:44 PM

69L72RS,
It looks like you've found your car.
Good luck with the purchase.

69L72RS

09-06-2005, 09:46 PM

Another member got the VIN from the seller and called me.
I also verified it with the seller.
I am not saying that "he" restamped the engine that is listed with the car, "it is the way he got it", but think about the following.

There are several members that that have seen the engine in my shop.
There is one member who tried to buy it from me in 91.

Lynn

09-06-2005, 11:32 PM

Good luck. Hope you get the car and engine reunited. You will have beat some pretty long odds.

Lynn

raw muscle cars

09-06-2005, 11:45 PM

If someone else gets the car are you selling the engine so they can go back together?

69L72RS

09-07-2005, 12:18 AM

The engine belongs with its original car, no matter who ends up with the car. I haven't given up yet.

69L72RS

09-07-2005, 08:07 AM

I won't be the one reuniting the engine and the car.
I can't justify the numbers he is placing on the cars value. I spoke to the seller tonight about buying the car or selling him the engine.
I offered him the engine and the BE 0424 rear and he didn't seem interested in anything but the contact info for some possible documentation on the car.
He stated that someone has offered him 90K+ to end the auction early. He didn't appear to care that the engine he lists as "original" is a restamp and didn't see anything wrong with the way it was listed. He says he is ending it early Thursday.
He also stated that the car was verified by a "Mr. Lopata"
and a "Mr. Cuneen". He said Tim had him just about completely disassmble the car to verify it was original.

Is a "base" COPO project with a restamped block/wrong trans/wrong rear worth 90K? Just curious on unbiased thoughts from other members. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

Jeff H

09-07-2005, 04:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I won't be the one reuniting the engine and the car.
I can't justify the numbers he is placing on the cars value. I spoke to the seller tonight about buying the car or selling him the engine.
I offered him the engine and the BE 0424 rear and he didn't seem interested in anything but the contact info for some possible documentation on the car.
He stated that someone has offered him 90K+ to end the auction early. He didn't appear to care that the engine he lists as "original" is a restamp and didn't see anything wrong with the way it was listed. He says he is ending it early Thursday.
He also stated that the car was verified by a "Mr. Lopata"
and a "Mr. Cuneen". He said Tim had him just about completely disassmble the car to verify it was original.

Is a "base" COPO project with a restamped block/wrong trans/wrong rear worth 90K? Just curious on unbiased thoughts from other members. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I just love this type of attitude. Now that you told him you have the original block, he could probably be sued for fraudulently selling the car with a restamped engine claiming it's original. $90K for a non original motor needing restoration is too high IMO, but if his potential buyer really thinks it's the original motor it might not be that far off the price.

Belair62

09-07-2005, 06:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
He also stated that the car was verified by a "Mr. Lopata"

[/ QUOTE ] That and a nickel will get you a cup of coffee.

69L72RS

09-07-2005, 06:51 PM

I did some more checking on the "verification" of the car and wanted to post this to eliminate any possible misunderstandings.

IMO: The car is a true COPO based on the info that I have dug up, but the listed engine is a restamp.

Mr. Lopata did not verify it, nor have any personal knowledge about this car or its originality.

I haven't had a chance to call and see if Ed verified the originality of the car. I didn't see the VIN on his list.
It is close to a few other Hugger Orange cars on the list.

69L72RS

09-07-2005, 07:02 PM

He also used Ed's name when referring to the verification of the car.

Belair62

09-07-2005, 08:36 PM

I would think he would like to have that rear and original; block before he talks verification...I sure would. Ed won't have much to look at..

COPO

09-07-2005, 10:05 PM

As the drivetrain is gone the Body # on the Trim Tag will likley tell if it is legit as it will probably be in sequence with others ordered from this dealership in the same batch.

69L72RS

09-09-2005, 01:29 AM

I have been informed by one of his interested buyers that he is now stating that I restamped my block to match the car after I saw the Ebay auction. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

By saying that, isn't he commiting fraud and defamation of character offenses?

Would it make me a jerk to list the engine on Ebay right next to his auction?

Charley Lillard

09-09-2005, 02:02 AM

That sounds like a great idea....show a great pic of the engine stampings..Put a 100K reserve and mention that whoever buys the car should contact you for the orig engine.

GM-26

09-09-2005, 03:52 AM

I would do it. What this man is doing is absolute http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif.

COPO

09-09-2005, 06:01 AM

Great idea Charley. What a prick.

12bolt

09-09-2005, 07:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He also stated that the car was verified by a "Mr. Lopata"

[/ QUOTE ] That and a nickel will get you a cup of coffee.

[/ QUOTE ]where oh where is Coffee that cheap??? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif

Lynn

09-09-2005, 07:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I have been informed by one of his interested buyers that he is now stating that I restamped my block to match the car after I saw the Ebay auction. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

By saying that, isn't he commiting fraud and defamation of character offenses?

Would it make me a jerk to list the engine on Ebay right next to his auction?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, it would not make you a jerk. It would show him to be the jerk he is. List your engine. Reference his auction in your listing using his auction number as part of the title. Something like: L72 COPO engine matches car in auction 4573162213. Hope all that info fits in the title. If not use the subtitle.

Then tell the whole story, including the part where you posted the partial VIN back in 2003 looking for the car. You can prove your story. Can he prove where he came up with a mysterious second "numbers matching" block?

Make sure and post when you have listed it. I'm sure a lot of guys will have fun asking him where he got his engine.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif

Good luck to you.

Lynn

Belair62

09-09-2005, 07:40 PM

Don't you remember walking to school 3 miles and bread was a dime ???

Xplantdad

09-09-2005, 10:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Don't you remember walking to school 3 miles and bread was a dime ???

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep...ands Yep! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Lynn

09-11-2005, 04:30 AM

Seller has pulled the auction.

Lynn

ZigZag

09-11-2005, 09:43 AM

Okay, so let's just suppose that someone (me) actually wanted to pay the $90K for his car and then buy your legit L72 engine. What would you ask for it? Really.

I have the cash and am just crazy enough to do it, as I too believe that the car and engine should be reunited, and furthermore, they should both live in my garage. Actually what would it cost, taking into account that I would throw in the re-stamped block that he has as part of his auction, as a sweetener in the deal.

(Folks FYI, I'm new to the board, I was researching the eBay auction and got more than an eyeful here (very well done gentlemen), I'm not him (the seller) I don't even play him on TV, and I have been looking for a legit matching #'s COPO for quite sometime.

Charley Lillard

09-11-2005, 05:56 PM

Welcome to the site Zigzag. Hopefully you can get it done. You might consider just leaving the stamped engine in the car for awhile and having some fun with it..Like drag racing it at out next Reunion. Just tuck the orig. engine away for when you are ready to restore the car.

Chevy454

09-11-2005, 11:03 PM

Charley has the right idea...wrap up the original engine, and enjoy the car for a bit...and you can thank us for this advice at the drag strip next year at SCR9! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

gtoguru

09-12-2005, 02:45 AM

I live near Mansfield and know the guy that had the car listed on Ebay. I would not deal with him. He is a real squirrel and I would not trust him as far as I could throw him. He has a different car everytime I see him. He doesnt care if the car is made up or real as long as he gets his money out of it. He tried to buy my GTO but I would never sell it to him no matter the price. There is a lot of good feedback on him but also some bad. Hope the car and rightful engine can be put together. Jim

stingray3x2

09-16-2005, 12:43 AM

hi guys ,i`m new to this site , i just had to log on to set things straight. i owned this car for almost 20 years,here in mansfield ohio . when i learned this car was listed on e bay ,i read it an reported to ebay ,that the ad was a fraud.the motor was gone from this car by 1976 ,yes i was young and crazy for adding other parts and changing things but this is a real copo car

SS427

09-16-2005, 12:48 AM

Darrell,
Thanks for loggin in and making that statement. Once again the reason for such sites as this one, to bring to light the True history behind these cars not the http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif that continues to come with some of them. Welcome aboard.
Rick

stingray3x2

09-16-2005, 12:54 AM

this car was plain jane ,clear windows ,am,factory endura,cowl hood ,spoilers nothing else - i added the ALL the bright trim .i`ve looked for the orig motor since 1976-7 with no luck ,there was never any paper with this car .beware of seller ,he contacted me (my name still on title)the add was already listed before he ever contacted me ,i coulded beleive what he wrote ,so i alerted e bay

stingray3x2

09-16-2005, 01:02 AM

the car is real, but this guy that has it knows nothing about this or any other camaro ,he listed a blue 69 with no trim tag ,he got it from a guy i work with ,he listed it as a real SS -he got away with it - but not this time ,now he`s stuck with a 512 block that needs the deck cleaned again

69L72RS

09-16-2005, 01:05 AM

Hi Darrell,
Are the one who sold the engine to Brad Hillard?
Eric

stingray3x2

09-16-2005, 01:09 AM

no i`ve NEVER seen this motor .i owned this car with tons of other camaros ,then i turned to corvettes

69L72RS

09-16-2005, 01:11 AM

I was just curious.
When I bought it, he said it had a 3x2 setup on it.
Eric

SuperNovaSS

09-16-2005, 07:01 AM

I'm confused. Did you have a deal to sell it to the ebay seller but he listed it on ebay before paying you for the car? In order to get pictures of the car he would have to have some sort of access to it.

Jason

SuperNovaSS

09-16-2005, 07:02 AM

I think I understand after rereading. The seller is the new owner but is obviously misrepresenting the car. Is this correct?

Jason

69L72RS

09-16-2005, 07:56 AM

Jason, The seller has the car, I have the engine.
He has relisted it on ebay 4575831409.
I am trying to raise the money to buy the car.
I have had 2 more people tell me tonight that they were told I had restamped my engine. I am getting pi$$ed off about him telling people that I restamped this engine to match the car.http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif
I will not sell this engine before I try to buy the car.
Sorry to sound like such a grouch.

Kurt S

09-17-2005, 08:02 AM

New ebay ad (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4575831409)

Belair62

09-17-2005, 09:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I will not sell this engine before I try to buy the car

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm thinkin the guy who owns the car may not be real happy with you right about now..have you made him a legitimate offer ? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hmmm.gif

69L72RS

09-17-2005, 04:10 PM

As a courtesy, I offered it to him at what I had invested in it.
Keep in mind this engine can be fired and running by simply bolting the carb, dist, and exhaust back on it. They are still boxed up from when I pulled the engine. I ran it for about a month before pulling it and selling the car it was in.
After being accused of restamping the engine, all courtesy goes out the window.

firstgenaddict

09-17-2005, 05:17 PM

"The engine i have is a 3963512 block with the vin # stamped by the oil filter that spot has never been decked. the build dat on the block is Jan OF 1969, the car was built in may, the top of the block on the pad reads,TO423MN, I do not know if it has been decked this is the way i got the motor."
He sure knows how to Cover his A$$... he never says anything about it being the ORIGINAL Engine.
He is VERY VERY Careful about what he does and more importantly DOES NOT say!
You think he had a lawyer check over the statements that he made?

Charley Lillard

09-17-2005, 06:14 PM

I still think you should put the orig engine on ebay with good pics of the engine stamping. Maybe then ask in your auction that the seller of the car put a pic of his engine stamping with his auction so people can compare and make their own decision on which one is the real engine. Since he is telling people you restamped yours I think he has earned that.

Donutblue

09-17-2005, 09:08 PM

To read through the lines of the posted ebay ad, the original rear is GONE, the Tranny IS NOT ORIGINAL, and lacking a statement that the motor is ORIGINAL would definitely create some doubt of it's authenticity in my mind.

69L72RS

09-18-2005, 03:45 AM

Charley,
I started to list it on Ebay, until I saw what i would have to pay if someone hit the reserve (to see how High I listed it). It appeared that I would still be responsible for the fees, the least of which would have been alomost 140.00.
If anyone knows how I can list it without having to pay any fees, I will definitely list it.

I am sure that I sent a picture of the stamp to Kurt in April. Maybe he would make comment on it.

A picture is worth a 1000 words, but seeing in person is better. If any member is close and would like to take a look at the engine then post there opinion, that's cool with me.
Considering that "I was supposed to have restamped this engine after seeing his first auction" and the current state of the engine, I don't believe anyone would think that it is a restamp.

Later,
Eric

allcamaro

09-18-2005, 05:46 AM

Whats the chances that both were hit with the same numbers on the same day by a guy who had a really bad weekend and was having a worse monday????? Being in the retail car business and selling most american cars built for the last 20+ years I could tell you some much more strange stories.

SuperNovaSS

09-18-2005, 05:53 AM

Ebay will refund all your closing costs if the deal falls through. The only part you would lose would be the listed fee. Well worth it to burst this jerks bubble. I'll donate to a fund.

Jason

RED427

09-18-2005, 08:56 AM

I met Eric back in 1995,I went to his house to buy some parts,and the first part that i looked at in his garage was the copo 427 motor in question!!!I wrote down the vin,
casting date and the motor code.it was real then and is the real one 10 years later!!!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif <font color="red"> </font>

TimG

09-20-2005, 01:40 AM

69L72RS, it sounds like you've been playing more than fair with the seller of the car. There is no one on the face of the planet that should have more of an interest in that car than you. It would be great to see the car end up in your hands after having the original engine and searching for the car for years. The fact that you've had the original engine for years completely independent of the car verifies the validity of the car being a COPO. The car by itself with a restamped engine would be raise lots of questions about its authenticity. I'm sure that if the engine with the car is a restamp, it could be spotted by members of this sight. It would be good to see the two broach marks and stamps side by side.

Kurt S

09-21-2005, 07:44 AM

As I posted in the other thread (thread in Cars for Sale) (http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/158992/page/0/fpart/all/vc/1):

I have a pic of Eric's engine pad that he sent to me back in April. It looks legit comparing it to other L72 pads.

Cars,
Can you send a pic of your pad to me? [email protected]

camarojoe

09-21-2005, 07:48 PM

Post the pic here.

Z28DZ

09-21-2005, 08:53 PM

I've could write a book on all the different ideologies in play here - but the bottom line is, I hope these two Ohio guys can come to terms and get this COPO and its motor back together. It's a Buckeye car born and raised and oughta remain so if possible. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif