investment question

[PATRICKJOINER]

so with the current state of the economy & the decline in most 401K & retirement accounts, what is/are the opinions of the members here, buy & hold a nice documented muscle car or continue to invest in your retirement/401K? there are some good buys for some nice, documented cars.

[budnate]

buy property/lots http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif.

[PeteLeathersac]

[ QUOTE ]
buy property/lots http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif.

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That has rental income!.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif
~ Pete

[SBR]

Patrick, this downturn was caused by people living beyond their means due to cheap money. This will take a while to recover from but it will. Collector cars have had a great run but we have seen prices fall becuase easy credit is no longer available and jobs are disappearing. That being said I still feel that the best of the best type cars will always bring strong money and the rest will fall to more realistic levels. Bottom line is to diversify your investments, and if you buy collector cars buy what you like http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Johnny Horsepower]

[ QUOTE ]
Patrick, this downturn was caused by people living beyond their means due to cheap money. This will take a while to recover from but it will. Collector cars have had a great run but we have seen prices fall becuase easy credit is no longer available and jobs are disappearing. That being said I still feel that the best of the best type cars will always bring strong money and the rest will fall to more realistic levels. Bottom line is to diversify your investments, and if you buy collector cars buy what you like http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Well said! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Salvatore]

Add some gold and or silver to your portfolio too. Buy the cars you like at a lesser grade and have some fun with them. If they go up in value when you are ready to sell better yet! If they stay the same well then you did OK. But drive em. Maybe this will begin a new era for the musclecar. Maybe they will call it "The have some fun era." http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/3gears.gifhttp://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Zedder]

Great comments from all so far. Pat, I've asked myself the same question a number of times over the past few weeks after having lost more than the value of a few muscle cars over the same time frame. What I keep coming back to is this...prior to 2004, people bought these cars for fun (just like Sam said). I always viewed the money that I put into muscle cars as "safe" - meaning that I never counted on making any money from them, but also never expected to lose anything either. I could drive and enjoy these cars and 'get my money back" when I wanted to change to a different car. I think many of us felt the same way.
Then prices started to creep up as many of us finally got to a point in life where we could afford the cars of our dreams, or multiple cars in some cases. This is where the speculation started and prices started rising more quickly. Many true enthusiasts started to buy projects "while they could still aford to get into the game" and we all started spending stupid money for cars that should have never demanded it - myself included. Project prices went up, as did resto prices and parts, and consequently the "done" cars went up also. There was lots of money to go around and everyone seemed happy! And don't get me wrong...I made money during this period too. I bought cars to restore and then was immediately offered more money than I had paid. If the offer was good enough, the car went down the road and I have no problems with that at all and would still do the same today. However, I think the times were we can count on this are gone. Yes, a good deal will come around now and then and one might make a quick buck. But we aren't going to have people lining up to buy our cars like we did back then.

And while prices have softened somewhat, I will just about guarantee that we have not even seen the start of it yet! I am in manufacturing and deal with other manufacturing companies, credit companies and bankers every day. Everyone says the same thing....that this is just the beginning of a huge "correction" in many markets and I believe the collector car hobby is one market that will see a massive correction for all but the best of the best - that frankly only the really well-heeled and those somewhat insulated from the credit crunch could afford.

Sure, things will come back somewhat in the future, as everything does with time. But I feel that the craziness is over and we'll get back to a time when we buy the cars thinking that our money is safe for the foreseeable future and not so much as an "investement" with an expected gain in the end. At least I hope that is what happens http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Salvatore]

The 67 Z/28 man nailed it IMO! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[PATRICKJOINER]

Great comments & feedback, thanks. I posed this question hoping to get these types of opinions/responses. In general I feel the same as most have responded. Diversify, be smart about what you are putting your $$ into, be it real estate, investments or some nice muscle. I think everyone has been affected by the current financial mess that is/has been upon us. I feel a lot of it is reverse speculation, vs what we had a few years ago when you could buy just about any type of muscle car and it would immediatley appreciate, as zedder referred to. Alot of this was due to the speculation in the market & the easy credit that was available then. I do beleive that in the current times, the best cars will rise to the top and still command good money, although not what these same cars would have sold for a year or two ago. Not so sure the same can be said about the 401K/retirement accounts out there. I think these accounts are still in for a wild ride for a while.

[SIR-VIVOR]

Nothing can keep going up forever without corrections in any markets. The good thing about cars is they don't disappear overnight, and are much more fun when you go to car shows to bring than stock certificates and bank books. Keep buying!

[ohhawk]

Most of the collectible car buying public is going to be hampered (or nervous) by the continued economic downturn. I wouldn't be viewing collectible cars as part of my financial diversification plan. I would be viewing it as a place for my "toy money", that which I don't need to count on to grow for retirement or other important needs.

I think the stock market in the next 1-2 years will outperform the general car collecting arena without too much difficulty.

[firstgenaddict]

Amen Mr P...

IT is just the beginning, November delivery of OCC bales (old corrugated containers) which is what is used as feed stock for the majority of all recycled paper and paperboard WORLD WIDE is off by 50%... Prices have not been at current levels since 2001... hmmm thats about right, the level before the latest inflationary period. A correction is a necessary evil in order to have any foundation upon which to grow...
"It seems the only thing we learn from history is: We don't learn from History." ~ Ron Paul 2008

[NovaMob03]

You want a 'safe' investment? Buy a gun shop, a pawn shop or a liquor store. They're recession proof http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[firstgenaddict]

Pawn shop is a good one... there are a couple for sale locally...
I heard the guns are flying off the shelves in ATL... allegedly...

[CT Mark]

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...
I heard the guns are flying off the shelves in ATL... allegedly...

[/ QUOTE ]

That's true everywhere. A lot of concern that the new president and democratic congress will curb gun rights. Get 'em while the gettin's good!

As to the original question, buy stocks. Still the best long-term investment. If your not good at picking stocks, buy Berkshire Hathaway. Buffett rocks! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/headbang.gif

[NovaMob03]

There's apparently a run on assault weapons because guys expect the new adminisration to put the ban back in. These weapons always become more valuable when they're banned.
People are flocking to pawn shops to sell personal stuff & get high intrest loans cause they can't get them from banks.
Liquor will always be the average guy/gal's drug of choice, along with cigaretts, especially when they're struggling. JMO http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burnout.gif

[ANDY M]

Berkshire Hathaway is trading right now for about $111k per share. Down $1200 from Friday. I agree with you about Buffett, but I don't think I'm quite able to invest in his company just yet.

[Kim_Howie]

All my guns were stolen on 11-4-08 http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif

[NovaMob03]

Pat, if I lived in Austin and had the money, I'd buy a bldg/bar on 6th St. The college isn't going anywhere & Austin has the best reputation for live new music in the country. Rent is practically guarenteed http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif The South by Southwest music festival is an awesome event...You live in a great place & I wish I lived there.
Kim, sorry to hear that, but if you have guns, you need a 2 ton gun safe that's hard to get into or move. Call your insurance man http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[TimG]

Yes, it's heaven her. I just love the hills, lakes, rivers, and the live music. The women aren't hard to look at, either. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[NovaMob03]

And Chuey's http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gifSP?

[PATRICKJOINER]

[ QUOTE ]
And Chuey's http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gifSP?

[/ QUOTE ] great food @ chuey's!

lots of great places & things to here in austin & tim's right, most of the women are easy to look at.

[L78racer]

WSJ article.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122757588574055233.html?mod=article-outset-box

[PATRICKJOINER]

Interesting reading. Thanks for the post.