lift hooks

[sg1747]

did 69 z28 lift hooks have 1 hole in them or one had two and the other had one.what was stamp on them

john

[Jonesy]

Here is a pic of the correct 69 small block brackets. I think they were stamped with a letter K or a circle with a letter inside, I cant remember.
http://www.yenko.net/attachments/383798-liftbrackets-smallblock.jpg

[Salvatore]

One hole. John, I suggest buying Jerry's book "The Definitive 1969 Camaro Fact Book". Very informative especially if you are not familiar with some parts, colors, options etc. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif Sam

[Jerry@CHP]

That's them and they are painted orange on a Z28 engine too.

Jerry

[camaromb]

The original lift hooks on my '69Z are natural, they were not painted orange.

[farone]

Well they must have been changed..... Jerry wrote the book !!!!

[DarrenX33]

Kenny P's Survivor...

http://www.yenko.net/photos/data/533/Z35.jpg

[ORIGLS6]

"Always" and "Never"


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[47Hammer]

I didn't have any paint on mine.. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a321/megavin/DSCN3902.jpg

[Salvatore]

I beleive the SB's and the BB's would be the same on the aluminum intake motors? Natural http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[Salvatore]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't have any paint on mine.. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a321/megavin/DSCN3902.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]Yea but you got headers Bart! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/3gears.gif

[farone]

O.K. guys, get out the orange paint..... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif

[Mr.Nickey Nova]

I would say that aluminum intake big and small blocks had the natural lift brackets and the cast iron ones were painted when the entire engine was painted.I have seen a few survivor cars that had the natural brackets.Some people that i talked to in the past had there cars judged at big shows said the same thing,natural for the aluminum intakes.

[Jerry@CHP]

True on big block cars but my research has shown that all of the untouched survivors such as Z28s have had painted engine lift hooks.

I will post photos of survivors from my data base when I get back from Iowa.

Jerry

[farone]

See, I told you guys, Get out the orange paint !!!!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif

[Jerry@CHP]

#EN48,

[69SSZL1]

ZL-1's had them painted black. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif

[sg1747]

I found 3 different kinds of lift hooks on ebay and they all say they are for a 69 Z. One set is says VR, one set is a horseshoe and the last has an M. Are any of these correct?

Thanks,
John

[farone]

Let's see, GM was mass producing these engines, but they had, maybe a new guy that couldn't do anything else, take all of the engine lift brackets, hang them up, and paint them, so they could put them on the aluminum intake cars ???? Or maybe just the Z/28's, because they were special. Makes perfectly good sense to me..... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif There were also no runs in any of the paint on the firewalls, nor overspray on the big block manifolds. Also ALL of the spotwelds were absolutely perfect, like the marks that a #2 pencel eraser makes. You know, they took the time to dress the welder tips after every weld. Is the sky blue in your world ????

[Salvatore]

[ QUOTE ]
Here is a pic of the correct 69 small block brackets. I think they were stamped with a letter K or a circle with a letter inside, I cant remember.
http://www.yenko.net/attachments/383798-liftbrackets-smallblock.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]John, You can't go wrong with these. All the survivor Z's I saw were this style. I personally have not seen any in an orange tone of color either. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[ORIGLS6]

[ QUOTE ]
I would say that aluminum intake big and small blocks had the natural lift brackets and the cast iron ones were painted when the entire engine was painted.I have seen a few survivor cars that had the natural brackets.Some people that i talked to in the past had there cars judged at big shows said the same thing,natural for the aluminum intakes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not always.

[Mr Yenko]

Well do we have any progress on these famous painted lift hooks yet, Jerry?
The"MOF"

[Jerry@CHP]

Brian,

I am back from Clear Lake and trying to catch up after being gone for court and the Buddy Holly Event. I had a chance to go through some of my data base photo files. I have over 1200 so it takes time to find and pull survivor car photos of engine bays in between everything else that I have to catch up on. I have found four to post here, all are low mileage cars, and I will post more as time permits.

I should also note that when I was writing my first Camaro book back in 1988, I interviewed several Norwood employees who were transferred to Baltimore due to the plant closing. I asked many questions about engine fasteners and was told that small block Chevy engine pieces like engine lift hooks and wire loom holders were painted or dipped Chevrolet orange before they were installed on the engines. Cars I have inspected over the years have also reflected what I was told by these plant workers. Were some of them not painted? Probably so but this has not been the trend that I've documented over the years.

Jerry

[Jerry@CHP]

My 1968 Z28 survivor with 22,000 miles that I've owned since 1990. Bought from the original owner. Full docs.

Jerry

[Jerry@CHP]

#3, 26,000 mile Z28,

Jerry

[Jerry@CHP]

This car has headers but was very much untouched other than headers. Still had original motor mounts.

Jerry

[1969grb]

Could these front brackets have been painted silver from day one? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
Grady

[Jerry@CHP]

Not according to what the Norwood workers told me. Also remember that when I interviewed them, it was only 20 years that had past since the cars were built, and all of these guys were consistant with what I was told. This is where I learned about the PTB stamps designating paint, body and trim inspections.

Jerry

[Keith Tedford]

I realize this is a small block post. I have two day one COPO Chevelle engine pictures and the lift hooks are silver on both. Doesn't prove or disprove anything. Just a little added info. I don't recall the Oshawa workers installing the lift hooks. From what I remember, they were on the engines when they came from the engine plants. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Jerry@CHP]

Keith,

I bought a B/B Chevelle new. Front engine lift hook was stamped steel, no plating, natural, rear hook was painted orange. This has been pretty consistant from what I've seen over the years.

Jerry

Jerry

[Steve Shauger]

Take a look at Charley's 1100 mile car. On page 17 of the thread he posted pics and the hooks are unpainted. That is also consistent and a example of what I have seen on unrestored cars we have certified. Here is a link to two pics: http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385223-tn_012.JPG

http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385222-tn_019.JPG

Remember these are production cars and variations occurred based on build date, shifts and plants. Lets keep this thread civil and respect our fellow members. Personal attacks serve no purpose.

[farone]

KP's survivor car looks more authentic to me.... His engine compartment has not been "fluffed up" as the ones in Jerry's pics... I'll stick with NOT PAINTED.... Just my two cents, but what do I know...I didn't write any books... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[Jerry@CHP]

Frank,

Write a book and call it Fluffy, that's a good title. Also heard through the Camaro grapevine that Kenny P. had to buy some parts for that "survivor" car including a smog system from B. Hodel? Is that true?

Pixs that I posted were not fluffed, but you're the new expert, so what you say goes. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

Jerry

[lzdick]

Latest release...

<font color="red"> "The Fluffy Definitive 1969 Camaro Z/28-SS396 Fact Book" </font>

Soon to be at your local retail bookstore.

[farone]

I will post pics of a survivor 69 Z/28 that is with the second owner who has had it since the very early '70's. His next door neighbor purchased it new, and the intake has NEVER been off of it. Guess what, the brackets are natural. Imagine that !!!! Do you really want me to go into all of the instances where you have been proven wrong ??? You really don't know everything that you want people to believe that you do. In your mind, there's only one way, and it's yours !!!!! If the pages were softer your book might be good toilet paper !!!!! Also, KP's car had an original smog system installed. So what, The last time that I checked, the lift hooks didn't have to be removed to install the system.... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif

[Mr.Nickey Nova]

I am finding this very interesting.It seems that some came with them painted and some didn't.Were the lift brackets installed at the Flint plant or at the assy.plant??

[COPO 70 RS/Z28]

It's all fun and games until someone puts an eye out http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[DarrenX33]

I am pretty sure that the low mile BB Z that Chad just picked up has natural hooks as well..

[Verne_Frantz]

I have a dumb question (from someone who doesn't know anything about Camaros). Were all the Z-28 engines built at Flint, or were some built at Tonawanda? The two plants had different assembly/paint procedures.

Verne http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[lzdick]

SB--Flint
BB--Tonowanda

[lzdick]

[ QUOTE ]
If the pages were softer your book might be good toilet paper !!!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

http://usera.ImageCave.com/lzdick/Sometimes I Pee.bmp.jpg

[Jerry@CHP]

Fluffy Frank,

We should have dialogged at your shop this summer when I was there to see the restamped special. You could have made up a list of questions and we could have went over all your talking points and sang happy songs together.

I suspect that all of the Norwood workers that I interviewed were fluffed up on drugs. One of the things that I've learned from being involved with these cars since they were new was you're always learning. Have you been involved since they were new? Still looking for the articles or books that you've written to help the hobby?


Jerry

[ORIGLS6]

[ QUOTE ]

Were all the Z-28 engines built at Flint, or were some built at Tonawanda?

SB--Flint
BB--Tonowanda

[/ QUOTE ]

Rich,

Are you telling us that the engines for the Big Block Z-28s were built in Tonawanda? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[Steve Shauger]

[ QUOTE ]
SB--Flint
BB--Tonowanda

[/ QUOTE ]

Tonawanda also built a # of small blocks.

[lzdick]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Were all the Z-28 engines built at Flint, or were some built at Tonawanda?

SB--Flint
BB--Tonowanda

[/ QUOTE ]

Rich,

Are you telling us that the engines for the Big Block Z-28s were built in Tonawanda? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Now you're on the right track, Dennis...Every single one of them! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif
http://usera.ImageCave.com/lzdick/Cup Of Shut The Hell Up.bmp.jpg

[ORIGLS6]

[ QUOTE ]

http://usera.ImageCave.com/lzdick/Cup Of Shut The Hell Up.bmp.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif OK, I'm done. Back to the http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif





http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[pSYCo]

remember the old batman tv show ? BANG !!!! POW !!!!!

[Mr70]

Back on topic...

In general,here's what I believe happened,that may help answer a few questions that have been brought up,but by no means should this be taken as Verbatim.
The beginning of the engine dress line was a sea of racks full of engines and transmissions:small-block V-8's from Flint V-8 Engine and Tonawanda,big-block V-8's from Tonawanda,and L-6 engines from Flint Motor,plus manual transmissions from Saginaw and Muncie and automatics from Toledo,Cleveland,Warren,and Willow Run.
In the engine schedule area,the operator grabbed the next broadcast copy from the printer,verified the sequence number,noted the engine code required for that car,and moved an air-powered overhead hoist on traveling bridge rails over the correct engine rack.The specified engine was hoisted * out of the rack and transferred to the next hook on the overhead engine dress line conveyor,where the throwout bearing (on manuals) was greased and installed,along with the clutch fork boot.Another operator on the other side of the line repeated the process with the specified transmission,
which was then installed and bolted to the engine.On automatics,an air tool was used to rotate the flexplate,and the converter bolts were driven,followed by the lower cover.
The VIN derivative numbers were stamped in the next operation on both the engine pad and the transmission,using a gang-stamp holder and a dead blow hammer.From here on,all the crucial detail dress ornaments were added like plug wires,coil,engine harness,battery cables,carburetor,pulleys,alternator,starter,fan and clutch,A/C compressor,power steering pump,transmission cooler lines and fill tube,A.I.R. pump,diverter valve and air manifolds,drive belts,dipstick and tube,oil filter,engine and transmission mounts,PCV plumbing,vacuum fittings,fuel pump and fuel line,radiator hoses,and (if applicable) the transmission-mounted 4-speed manual shifter and linkage was installed and adjusted (3-speed manual floor shifters were mounted on the cross-member and adjusted later on the Chassis line).
Engine oil and transmission lube were added,and the completed engine/transmission assembly was conveyed to the chassis line for installation in the subframe.The engine line inspector wrote the engine,transmission and carburetor codes on the broadcast copy and put the sheet in a box for pickup by the scheduling clerk,which was needed to create the Protecto-O-Plate at the end of the assembly line.

*The front &amp; rear engine pull hooks were most likely installed before this moment,to allow many of the procedures that followed to take place.

[bkhpah]

Why don't you clarify why you where at Franks Jerry? Your "re-stamped special" comment is very vague. The fact is you where there after Frank told a customer that his engine etc were re-stamped. That's when you were hired to look into the car. You make it sound as if Frank did something wrong here. At least that's how I read into it...BKH

[Jerry@CHP]

I could feel so much love from Frank that I didn't think it was necessary to do so. I was trying to post positive data on cars that I have documented when I have time.......and have been doing so for many, many years. What do I get out of Frank, smart as.......... answers saying cars I looked at have been fluffed.

Keep to personal attacks out just like I have.

Jerry

[Verne_Frantz]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
SB--Flint
BB--Tonowanda

[/ QUOTE ]

Tonawanda also built a # of small blocks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Steve,
My question was specifically, were there any '69 DZ motors built at Tonawanda? If so, that might help to answer the question of the lift bracket differences. If not, then I'll go away and let you guys fight it out.
But I will add my common sense view. It doesn't make any sense for the engine plant (which had to hoist the engines onto racks for shipping) to require the vehicle assembly plants to remove 4 bolts, install 2 lift brackets and re-attach them just to get them off the pallet on their way to the chassis. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hmmm.gif

OK, now I'll shut up.
Verne http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Jerry@CHP]

Here's another survivor engine bay taken about 15 years ago. Don't think this one has been fluffied up.

Jerry

[Jerry@CHP]

Verne,

I have not seen any to date but I think that L. Christensen has. I have seen some 388 blocks used on the 302.

Jerry

[sg1747]

wow,did i start this hole thing over engine hooks.

[Steve Shauger]

I have seen a handful of Tonowanda cast blocks( see comments below for clarification) built as DZ 302 engines. As a matter of fact Kenny P's green vintage certified Z28 was in fact a 388 block.

Let me clarify; 388 blocks are known to be cast at the Tonowanda plant. It is fairly common to have say L48 350/300hp assembled, and stamped TOXXX( Block cast and assembled in Tonowanda).

Now in the case 302 I have seen a handful with 388 blocks, however they are stamped VOXXX indicating they were assembled in Flint. So the question really is was the 388 block exclusively cast at Tonowanda (conventional wisdom)? If that is the case then the block was cast in Tonowanda and shipped to Flint for assembly (not sure that makes sense). Or another theory is that in fact the 388 block was cast at Flint in very, very small quantities, at a specific time period.

Verne to answer your question, I have not seen a DZ 302 with a Tonowanda assembly designation, so at this point I only believe they were built/assembled at the Flint plant.

If anyone has Tonowanda assembled DZ 302 please share the information and provide a picture of the stamping.

The attached photo is a 388 block, which are sans the plug in the front. Also notice the assembly /date starts with VO Flint assembly designation. http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385516-388blockwithflintassembly.jpg

[farone]

Pics as promised..... This is a really cool survivor that was at Vettefest this past fall.

[farone]

another

[farone]

last one

[Salvatore]

same color as my friends 32,000 mile Z is. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[Verne_Frantz]

[ QUOTE ]
I have seen a handful of Tonowanda built DZ 302 engines. As a matter of fact Kenny P's green vintage certified Z28 was in fact a 388 block.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, in that case gentlemen, instead of arguing over plain or painted lift hooks, you might make a list of which ones are Flint &amp; which ones are Tonawanda. As I said, the order of assembly and paint was different at the two engine plants.

Verne http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[RamAirDave]

http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=141893

From JohnZ:

"Tonawanda had two completely separate V-8 lines - one complete system (machining and assembly) for small-blocks, and one for big-blocks. ALL big-blocks were built at Tonawanda. However, on the small-block line, they only built hydraulic-lifter engines, and didn't have the added machining stations in the small-block cylinder head line to add the unshrouding cut in the chamber wall required for 2.02" intake valves.

All small-blocks with solid lifters (and the few hydraulic-lifter engines that used 2.02" valves, like the L-79) were built at Flint V-8, which had the unshrouding-cut stations in their cylinder head lines."

[Steve Shauger]

Survivor front engine lift hook. http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385540-1969Z28Lift.jpg

[Jerry@CHP]

I think there is enough data here to clearly say that the engine lift hooks can be either painted or unpainted. No fluff in that statement.

The last photo that I posted here was from the Brandenburg car which is in the beginning of my '69 Camaro fact book. 22,000 survivor mile car that has been in Baltimore since new. Factory chambered car too.

Has not been flipped many times and has only had two owners in 40 years.

All 302 engines that I've examined have been assembled in Flint, and all had painted engine lift hooks. No Tonawanda that I've documented. I'll ask Larry C.

Jerry

[Mark_C]

Alleged Tonowanda DZ block. Don't really beleive its real as you can tell by the file name but heres one.

http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385544-enginepad_T0927DZ_restamp_lowres.jpg

[MosportGreen66]

I'll play... from my old 36k original '69 Z28. No fluff here...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/mosportgreen66/1969%20Z28/CarFiles076.jpg

[MosportGreen66]

and from the local burgundy 40k original mile car...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/mosportgreen66/burgandy%201969%20Z28/P1010006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/mosportgreen66/burgandy%201969%20Z28/P1010009.jpg

[1969grb]

From an original 69 big block

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn180/1969grb/LiftBrkt001.jpg


http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn180/1969grb/LiftBrkt002.jpg

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn180/1969grb/LiftBrkt003.jpg

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn180/1969grb/LiftBrkt004.jpg

[Mr.Nickey Nova]

[ QUOTE ]
wow,did i start this hole thing over engine hooks.

[/ QUOTE ]
You opened a can of worms on this subject,but that's ok because we all learn something new this way which makes this web site so great.

[69SSZL1]

I can see the remants of orange paint on the hooks. Can this be the case of the other "natural" hooks? the aluminum manifold throws off alot more heat then the cast iron ones. And the Chevy paint was not heat rated, went away fast.

[Salvatore]

Dan, very good pictures! Thanks, Sam

[1969grb]

The orange paint on the bracket appears to be spatter from when the engine was painted when new. At least that what it looks like to me.

Grady

[Steve Shauger]

Here is another unpainted. http://www.yenko.net/attachments/385681-05AVNbuiltZ28resized.jpg

[mockingbird812]

And the final tallies are in:

50 for and 50 against.........

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v697/mockingbird812/Icons/beating_a_dead_horse.jpg

You be the judge!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[sg1747]

Component
Camaro Nationals Seminar
MacNeish Book

AIR adjusting brace: Semi-gloss black Black paint, 60 percent gloss
AIR anti-backfire valves: Gold cadium Gold cadium dichromate
AIR pump support brace: Chevrolet orange paint Chevrolet orange paint
AIR pump bolt: Phosphate (not specified)
AIR smog pump housing: Natural aluminum finish Natural aluminum finish
AIR smog pump pulley: Phosphate Semi-gloss black paint or gray phosphate
AIR smog tubes: Black zinc Semi-gloss black paint or gold cadium dichromate
Air cleaner base, open element: gloss black 60 percent gloss black paint
Air cleaner lid, standard open element: Chrome Chrome
Air cleaner stud: Silver cadium (not specified)
Alternator assembly: Natural aluminum finish Natural aluminum finish
Alternator pulley: Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
Alternator fan, 1967 Z/28: Semi-gloss black paint Semi-gloss black paint
Alternator bolt, lower: Phosphate (not specified)
Alternator bolt, upper adjusting: Silver radium with special extra thick washer (not specified)
Alternator Brackets, lower/upper: Semi-gloss black orange (not specified)
Alternator brackets, lower (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Alternator brackets, upper (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Alternator brackets, rear: (not specified) Chevrolet orange paint
Alternator bracket spacer: Semi-gloss black or natural 30-60 percent gloss black paint
Battery hold-down clamp: Phosphate Natural metal finish
Battery tray: Semi-gloss black 30 percent gloss black paint
Bell housing: Natural with orange over-spray Chevrolet orange paint
Bell crank, throttle linkage: (not specified) 30 percent gloss black paint
Brake hose bracket: (not specified) Natural metal or silver cadium dichromate
Brake lines: (not specified) Natural metal finish, stainless steel acceptable
Brake switch/manifold: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Bumper brackets, front and rear: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Bumper jack base: (not specified) Semi-gloss gray paint
Bumper jack adapter: (not specified) Semi-gloss gray paint
Bumper jack mechanism: (not specified) Semi-gloss gray paint
Bumper jack pole: (not specified) Gold or silver cadium dichromate
By-pass elbow (water pump 67-68 302): (not specified) Silver or gold cadium dichromate acceptable
Carburetor body: Gold dichromate Gold cadium dichromate
Carburetor lever and arms: Gold cadium on Holley (not specified)
Clutch fork: Natural metal finish Natural metal finish
Clutch linkage: Phosphate Semi-gloss black paint or natural finish acceptable
Coil bracket: Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
Coil: gloss black (not specified)
Coil bracket mounting bolts: Silver cadium (not specified)
Column locking mechanism: (not specified) 30 percent gloss black paint
Control arms, front, upper and lower: Semi-gloss black 30 percent gloss black paint
Control arms, mounting bolts: Phosphate with silver cadium nuts (not specified)
Control arm shaft, upper: Natural 30 percent gloss black paint
Core support: Semi-gloss black 30 percent gloss black paint
Cowl plenum air cleaner assembly: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Cylinder heads: Chevrolet orange paint Chevrolet orange paint
Dashboard, top, 1967-68: (not specified) 30 percent gloss paint
Deck lid striker, 1967 all: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Dip stick and tube: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Disc brake caliper mounting brackets (not specified) Gold cadium dichromate
Disc brake backing plates: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Disc brake calipers: (not specified) Semi-gloss black paint or natural finish acceptable
Distributor: Natural Natural aluminum finish
Distributor hold-down bracket: Natural Chevrolet orange paint or natural metal finish
Door latch mechanism screws, (three in door) 1967: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Door striker: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Drive shaft: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Engine block: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Engine lift hooks: Natural Chevrolet orange paint
Engine vent tube: Semi-gloss black 60 percent gloss black paint
Exhaust manifolds: Natural Natural cast iron finish
Fan blade: gloss black Black paint, approximately 60 percent gloss
Fan clutch assembly: Natural Natural metal, silver or gold cadium dichromate
Fender bolts: Phosphate Black phosphate
Fender skirts, front: Semi-gloss black 30 percent semi-gloss black paint
Firewall: Semi-flat black 30 percent semi-gloss black paint
Firewall stamps "P", "T", "B": orange or green paint orange or green paint, Norwood cars only
Floor pans: (not specified) 30 percent gloss black paint, original cars usually have body color over spray on the floor boards
Flywheel shield: (not specified) Chevrolet orange paint
Front springs: (not specified) Natural finish
Front cowl area under cowl panel: (not specified) body color to edge of firewall, where firewall and body color meet is a feathered line, not a crisp taped line
Front cowl panel retaining screws: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Front fender support bars: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Front spindles: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Front sway bar mounting kits: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Gas lines: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Gas tank: (not specified) Natural finish, galvanized
Gas tank straps: (not specified) Natural or semi-gloss black paint
Grille, front 1967 RS and non-RS: (not specified) Black
Ground straps, engine bay: Natural copper Natural copper finish
Harmonic Balancer: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Heater box cover: gloss black 60-70 percent gloss black paint, (more gloss than firewall)
Heater hose nipple Intake: , Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
Heater hose nipples, water pump: Chevrolet orange (not specified)
Hood hinges: Phosphate gray or black phosphate
Hood latch assembly: Phosphate gray or black phosphate
Hood latch assembly spring: (not specified) gloss black paint
Horns: gloss black 30 percent gloss black paint
Horn relay: Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
Hose clamps: Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
Intake manifold: Natural aluminum Natural aluminum finish (clear coating intake manifolds not acceptable!)
Intake manifold bolts, 302 "TR", "M", "A", non-shouldered hex head style: Silver cadium Silver cadium dichromate
"L" bracket, (holds master cylinder manifold/switch to stud on brake booster): (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Leaf spring shackles: (not specified) 30-60 percent gloss black
License plate mounting brackets: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Master cylinder: Semi-gloss black 60 percent gloss black paint or natural finish acceptable
Master cylinder cover: Gold cadium Gold cadium dichromate
Master cylinder cover retaining wires: Silver cadium Natural metal finish
Oil cap: Chrome Chrome
Oil fill tube: Chrome Chrome
Oil pan and bolts: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Parking brake cables: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Power brake booster: Gold iridite Gold cadium dichromate
Power steering brackets/braces: Semi-gloss black 60 percent gloss black paint
Power steering pump: gloss black (not specified)
Proportioning valve: Natural or semi-gloss black Semi-gloss black paint or natural finish acceptable
Proportioning valve bracket: Gold cadium Gold cadium dichromate
Pulley, crankshaft: Natural 60 percent gloss black paint or gray phosphate acceptable
Pulley, power steering: Semi-gloss black (not specified)
Pulley, power steering crankshaft (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Pulley, power steering pump: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Pulley, water pump: Semi-gloss black gray phosphate or 60 percent gloss black paint
Radiator: gloss black paint full gloss black paint
Rally wheels: (not specified) Semi-gloss Argent Silver paint front side, semi-gloss black paint back side
Rear axle housing: (not specified) 30-60 percent gloss black paint, natural finish acceptable
Rear brake backing plates: (not specified) 30-60 percent gloss black paint
Rear springs: (not specified) Natural finish or gray paint
Rear wheel wells: (not specified) Black undercoating
Shift linkage: (not specified) gray/black phosphate finish
Shock absorbers: (not specified) Semi-gloss gray paint
Spark plug shields: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate
Spark plug wire loom brackets: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Starter motor: Semi-gloss black 30-60 percent gloss black paint
Starter motor brace: Semi-gloss black 30-60 percent gloss black paint
Starter bolts: Silver cadium (not specified)
Steering box: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Steering knuckles: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Steering linkage: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Sub-frame: (not specified) 30 percent gloss black paint
Sway bar, front: (not specified) Semi-gloss black paint or natural finish acceptable
Sway bar brackets: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Thermostat housing: Natural aluminum Silver or Chevrolet orange paint
Throttle linkage: Phosphate (not specified)
Throttle rod: (not specified) Silver cadium dichromate or natural metal finish
Timing chain cover and bolts: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Traction bar, 1967 only: (not specified) 30-60 percent gloss black paint
Transmission: (not specified) Natural aluminum finish
Transmission crossmember: (not specified) 30-60 percent gloss black paint
U-bolts, driveshaft: (not specified) Natural metal finish
Underside of front hood: (not specified) 60 percent gloss black paint
Valance panel, front lower: (not specified) painted body color on inside of panel
Valve covers: Chrome Chrome
Voltage regulator: gloss black painted cover with silver cadium base gloss black painted cover with silver cadium base
Water pump: Chevrolet orange Chevrolet orange paint
Water pumps bolts: Chevrolet orange (not specified)
Windshield washer pump cover: Black plastic, natural finish Black plastic, natural finish
Wiper motor: gloss black paint gloss black paint

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[beater68427]

Good quote on Jerry's book, I should buy it for a barometer, I'm curious on the rear my BE 12 bolt looks like the tubes are painted but the center natural and rear cover as well, who knows..... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[Jonesy]

Here is a pic of a supposedly real Tonawanda DZ engine and supposed POP for the car.
http://www.camaros.net/showroom/data/500/DSC00998.JPG

http://www.camaros.net/showroom/data/500/DSC00989.JPG

[William]

[ QUOTE ]
Good quote on Jerry's book, I should buy it for a barometer, I'm curious on the rear my BE 12 bolt looks like the tubes are painted but the center natural and rear cover as well, who knows..... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

John Z, who was there, has stated that rear axles were painted black complete with drums. Lines and cables added later, yoke was masked. There are a number of axle photos in vintage car magazine tests and the axles look shiny black. One of the best is ZL-1 #3 in the Aug '69 HP Cars.

Remember this stuff was not cleaned, degreased or primed prior to paint. I doubt the paint adhered for long.

[Unreal]

Not to switch from paint vs. bare hooks for sb. There was a thread on Camaros.net a few weeks ago with the shape of the driver side hook for bb. There was one with a gusset at the bend in the bracket and rounded corners at the upper edge, one had no gusset and sharp corners, and one like in the pics above with rounded corners and no gussets. No resolution as to what years might have gotten what, except that I'm fairly certain mine (which are like the above pics) are for 69.

[beater68427]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Good quote on Jerry's book, I should buy it for a barometer, I'm curious on the rear my BE 12 bolt looks like the tubes are painted but the center natural and rear cover as well, who knows..... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

John Z, who was there, has stated that rear axles were painted black complete with drums. Lines and cables added later, yoke was masked. There are a number of axle photos in vintage car magazine tests and the axles look shiny black. One of the best is ZL-1 #3 in the Aug '69 HP Cars.

Remember this stuff was not cleaned, degreased or primed prior to paint. I doubt the paint adhered for long.

[/ QUOTE ]

I love pics! they speak a thousand words, memory can be short http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif I do have a couple pics of a build sheet stuck to rear cover not painted??? adds question, I did note one on here as well, so what we would be saying is they painted the housings before assembly??? cover added after, that does not make sence to me either, I agree pics are the best source and the older or closer to build time is best, I looked at another 10 bolt car all original today it was black, you could still see most on diff, so http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[JohnZ]

[ QUOTE ]
Back on topic...

In general,here's what I believe happened,that may help answer a few questions that have been brought up,but by no means should this be taken as Verbatim.
The beginning of the engine dress line was a sea of racks full of engines and transmissions:small-block V-8's from Flint V-8 Engine and Tonawanda,big-block V-8's from Tonawanda,and L-6 engines from Flint Motor,plus manual transmissions from Saginaw and Muncie and automatics from Toledo,Cleveland,Warren,and Willow Run.
In the engine schedule area,the operator grabbed the next broadcast copy from the printer,verified the sequence number,noted the engine code required for that car,and moved an air-powered overhead hoist on traveling bridge rails over the correct engine rack.The specified engine was hoisted * out of the rack and transferred to the next hook on the overhead engine dress line conveyor,where the throwout bearing (on manuals) was greased and installed,along with the clutch fork boot.Another operator on the other side of the line repeated the process with the specified transmission,
which was then installed and bolted to the engine.On automatics,an air tool was used to rotate the flexplate,and the converter bolts were driven,followed by the lower cover.
The VIN derivative numbers were stamped in the next operation on both the engine pad and the transmission,using a gang-stamp holder and a dead blow hammer.From here on,all the crucial detail dress ornaments were added like plug wires,coil,engine harness,battery cables,carburetor,pulleys,alternator,starter,fan and clutch,A/C compressor,power steering pump,transmission cooler lines and fill tube,A.I.R. pump,diverter valve and air manifolds,drive belts,dipstick and tube,oil filter,engine and transmission mounts,PCV plumbing,vacuum fittings,fuel pump and fuel line,radiator hoses,and (if applicable) the transmission-mounted 4-speed manual shifter and linkage was installed and adjusted (3-speed manual floor shifters were mounted on the cross-member and adjusted later on the Chassis line).
Engine oil and transmission lube were added,and the completed engine/transmission assembly was conveyed to the chassis line for installation in the subframe.The engine line inspector wrote the engine,transmission and carburetor codes on the broadcast copy and put the sheet in a box for pickup by the scheduling clerk,which was needed to create the Protecto-O-Plate at the end of the assembly line.

*The front &amp; rear engine pull hooks were most likely installed before this moment,to allow many of the procedures that followed to take place.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's exactly how it was done, lifted directly from my "First-Generation Camaro Assembly Process" paper at http://www.camaros.org/assemblyprocess.shtml ; however, the engine lift brackets were installed at the engine plants, and were part of the engine as-shipped to the car assembly plants.

My Group at the Chevrolet Pilot Line in Flint developed the engine lift brackets in 1967 for the 1968 model year, and the corresponding plant engine hooks used on the Engine Dress Lines. Photo below shows the typical assortment of engine hooks required in an assembly plant prior to 1968 for carrying various engines by the exhaust manifolds on the left, and the only two hooks required for 1968 engines on the right.

There were constant battles with the Finance people for the first couple of years over leaving the brackets on the engines vs. removing them at the assembly plants after engine installation and returning them to the engine plants for re-use; this direction changed several times, and eventually they were left on the engines.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-2/13522/EngineHooks(Small).jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[DarrenX33]

Someone forgot their "work cited" page. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif

[luv2sixty9]

I recently took apart a 68Z that never had the engine out or apart and the lift hooks were painted silver. On my survivor 68 Z they appear to be natural or also painted silver. I'll definitely know when I take it apart some day.