Casting dates vs. build dates

[Hawkeye]

My engine block has a cast date of A-13-69, heads cast C-28-69 and intake cast 3-27-69, but the engine pad is stamped with a build date of 04-10. What would the cast date ranges be for the exhaust manifolds, distributor, water pump, carb, and fan? I unfortunately do not know the build date of the car itself. Would some of the parts be prior to the build date of the engine and others attached on the assembly line? Is there a time line as to when parts were cast and then assembled onto the engine? Are there any publications available that explain this topic well?

[JRSully]

anything a few days to 6 months prior than the engine build date would be in range, exceptions have taken that time frame out even further

[Hawkeye]

Thanks for the response. What items would have been installed at the engine assembly plant vs the car assembly plant?

[Mr70]

Would some of the parts be prior to the build date of the engine and others attached on the assembly line?
In general,an engines components were cast/made prior to the assembly of the engine as a whole.
There are a few extreme examples of some that weren't.


Is there a time line as to when parts were cast and then assembled onto the engine?
Flint & Tonawanda both had similar,yet different procedures..The late Fran Preve shared these procedures with Alan Colvin,and Dale has them listed on his site..
http://www.chevellestuff.com/tech/engine_assembly_order.htm

And afterwards from CRG..
..The beginning of the engine dress line was a sea of racks full of engines and transmissions:small-block V-8's from Flint V-8 Engine and Tonawanda,big-block V-8's from Tonawanda,and L-6 engines from Flint Motor,plus manual transmissions from Saginaw and Muncie and automatics from Toledo,Cleveland,Warren,and Willow Run.
In the engine schedule area,the operator grabbed the next broadcast copy from the printer,verified the sequence number,noted the engine code required for that car,and moved an air-powered overhead hoist on traveling bridge rails over the correct engine rack.The specified engine was hoisted out of the rack and transferred to the next hook on the overhead engine dress line conveyor,where the throwout bearing (on manuals) was greased and installed,along with the clutch fork boot.Another operator on the other side of the line repeated the process with the specified transmission,
which was then installed and bolted to the engine.On automatics,an air tool was used to rotate the flexplate,and the converter bolts were driven,followed by the lower cover.
The VIN derivative numbers were stamped in the next operation on both the engine pad and the transmission,using a gang-stamp holder and a dead blow hammer.From here on,all the crucial detail dress ornaments were added like plug wires,coil,engine harness,battery cables,carburetor,pulleys,alternator,starter,fan and clutch,A/C compressor,power steering pump,transmission cooler lines and fill tube,A.I.R. pump,diverter valve and air manifolds,drive belts,dipstick and tube,oil filter,engine and transmission mounts,PCV plumbing,vacuum fittings,fuel pump and fuel line,radiator hoses,and (if applicable) the transmission-mounted 4-speed manual shifter and linkage was installed and adjusted (3-speed manual floor shifters were mounted on the cross-member and adjusted later on the Chassis line).
Engine oil and transmission lube were added,and the completed engine/transmission assembly was conveyed to the chassis line for installation in the subframe.The engine line inspector wrote the engine,transmission and carburetor codes on the broadcast copy and put the sheet in a box for pickup by the scheduling clerk,which was needed to create the Protecto-O-Plate at the end of the assembly line.

[COPO 70 RS/Z28]

Rick, Is there any general policy on Carbs and Dist for date ranges. I have heard from a couple weeks to 4 months????

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[Mr70]

From what I've seen,the distributor was installed on the engine early on before it was deemed a self reliant running unit & reached the vehicle.It's date would've been anytime prior,(usually weeks before),to the engines stamped completed assembly date.

The carburetor was installed after that date,so it's date was more prior to the vehicles cowl tag started assembly date,weeks to a few months in general.

Understand these were just components sitting on a shelf,waiting for installation somewhere so some examples may differ from above.

[COPO 70 RS/Z28]

So a 052 carb date would still be within the range for a 05E cowl date ????

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Mr70]

Absolutely,and makes sense.
1970 May,2nd week assembled carb,on a 1970 assembly started May 5th week vehicle.

[COPO 70 RS/Z28]

Man thats super, I was sure it was to late!!

My car was missing the original carb when I bought it. A couple months after I purchased the car I went into shock when I discovered that I would need a dated 4554 for the car. I was depressed at the possibility and price, let alone the date issues. One day a week or so later I was pecking around evilbay and I was amazed to see an 052 "COMPLETE" 4554 with a BIN of $250.00. Needless to say the button was hit and the payment sent that instant!!!!

Got the carb, correct metering blocks linkages etc.

I look often and I have only seen one other, a week ago missing pieces, I think it had the wrong bowl, not sure about the blocks... etc.

To say the least I got lucky that day.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

Sorry I checked the one last week was a 4490 not a 4554

[Hawkeye]

Wow. That is some great information. Thanks for the clarification. Very helpful. What does CRG stand for and where can I get the publication that you took the excerpt from?

[Mr70]

CRG stands for Camaro Research Group
http://www.camaros.org/index.shtml

Many publications have listed similar info..
Any one of Alan Colvins "Chevrolet By The Numbers" books for one.

[Hawkeye]

More great info. Thank you I greatly appreciate your help. That site is full of some fantastic info.
Thanks again.
Marty

[Nova Research Project]

I have started tracking the big blocks and notice a 2 week span between engine cast date and assembly date on average. Then another 2 weeks to body date on the Novas.

Exceptions are always out there I think a long a 1 year difference.

[Mr.Nickey Nova]

My surviver 70 L34 Nova's engine cast date and assembly date are within one day of each other.

[Nova Research Project]

Mr.Nickey Nova;

Too cool. As I said there are always exceptions.

I am sure they worked the stack of blocks First In Last Out.

Greg

[1969L78Nova]

The casting date on my 1969 Nova L78 is Aug 18 68. Engine assembly is March 19 69....8 MONTHS ! Possible ?

[JRSully]

my 70 L78 block was cast Jan 30 70 and built April 24 70, saw another L78 Nova block that was cast A 29 70 and built April 27 70

[Mr.Nickey Nova]

[ QUOTE ]
Mr.Nickey Nova;

Too cool. As I said there are always exceptions.

I am sure they worked the stack of blocks First In Last Out.

Greg

[/ QUOTE ] Greg, cast date Jan.6 and engine build date Jan.7 for a car assy. date of third week of Jan. Even i thought about that one,but the stampings on the block are correct.

[Nova Research Project]

Think of it this way. You have a stack of blocks. Let's say 100. As engines are built you take some off the stack. Lets say 50. Then you get a new batch of 100 castings. Depending on the type of engine and the demand in the plants, you could have a wide difference in dates on a less popular block (396), and a short range of dates for a popular block (307).

I doubt they would haul out all of the blocks in a storage area just to rotate stock.

While there are certain observable norms, it is entirely possible that you can have a block cast the first week of the model year in the last car built that model year.

And there is no reason you can't have a engine built the day after it was cast.

If you could capture enough cast dates and build dates you can come up with an average time to build.

You would probably see the date difference swing back and forth from days to weeks.

This would apply to all of the dated parts used on the car. However there should be certain minimum from assembly date of the part to the assembly date of the car. After all, the part had to get shipped from the plant to the assembly line. It took time to paint, test, pallet, load, ship, unload, stock, move to assembly line, install.

Two weeks for an engine is a good rule of thumb between assembly and install. However there is no perfect number.

Greg