Day 1 & back to Day 2 Exhaust.....

[68l30]

I’m looking to do a "true" Day 2 exhaust on my Camaro. I have to replace my current headers due to age (31yr) and I’d like to replace the current Flowmaster system, 2-1/2” w/ transverse muffler. I’ve never been a huge fan of this system. The drag days and street racing days are behind me, and I’m thinking of going back to a stock system and mating the headers to it. I know it will choke it up some, but I will build some low end torque and the noise will tone down some. That said, my first choice is a Gardner system, but I’d hate to spend the coin and then whack up the head pipes….Anyone use the Z/28 system from D & R?? It’s looking like a possibility and cost wise it makes more sense to Day 2 it up….Any thoughts or suggestions would be helpful .. THX!

BIG

[MosportGreen66]

BIG, have you thought of going to a chambered system? Since its not going to be exactly original, why not run something fun? Would sounds great with a set of headers.

Also, what brand headers lasted 31 years?! sign me up!

Dan

[RPOLS3]

I am not sure how "day 2" accurate the Pypes systems are, but most everyone seems to like the cost and performance of them.

[68l30]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MosportGreen66</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BIG, have you thought of going to a chambered system? Since its not going to be exactly original, why not run something fun? Would sounds great with a set of headers.

Also, what brand headers lasted 31 years?! sign me up!

Dan </div></div>

I have thought about it...but I'd like to stay as true as I can to 68...&amp; I'm about done with the noise. The headers are by BlackJack, first mod I ever did to it. Put them on and took off the recall safety hold downs and promptly ripped out the motor mounts. Seems like yesterday..

I have a NOS set of Blackjack ready to go back on, getting painted and cured with some industrial stuff we use at work (EGR type application).

BIG

[68l30]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RPOLS3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not sure how &quot;day 2&quot; accurate the Pypes systems are, but most everyone seems to like the cost and performance of them. </div></div>

Pypes would be my first aftermarket choice. The stock+headers sound is just what's calling to me right now...I'm so tired of the noise, and the drone at 35mph...think 4:10's F-70's and a 4500 converter..I'm making some racket. I hate to choke it up, but I'm really not using everything it's making. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/mad.gif

BIG

[olredalert]

----I have to say that the Pypes system on my 1969 SJ Grand Prix is good quality, but has a heavy drone to it at highway speeds. Its enough that I really would like to change out the mufflers for something a bit more user friendly......Bill S

[68l30]

Thank you Bill! That's what I was afraid of....I have that covered with the Flowmaster!

BIG

[Astock]

DynoMax 17749 turbo muffler 2.5''. That's a 20 in case. They also have a 14''. Same performance, just a little quieter with the 20.
Just run 2.5 from headers back to your stock tailpipes. Won't choke anything under 500hp. Quiet until you jump on it.
Google: Exhaust-Pontiac street performance.
Jim Hand did a lot of testing with his 11 second station wagon.

[69 Post Sedan]

I'm running Hooker headers on my 410ci BBC with 2-1/2&quot; Magnaflow muscle car full exhaust system including a x-pipe. I have zero drone.

Flowmaster is known for the drone.....that's why they are called Dronemaster. lol Also, they really aren't the best for performance......they were in the 90's but not in today's standards.

Kurt

[68l30]

Thanks Kurt, My Noisemaster went on in the 90's.The transverse muffler is soft at the weep holes. Flowmaster will warranty the muffler, but getting it off will be counter productive. It ain't budging!

I'm going to look into the DynoMax, &quot;if&quot; there is a way to salvage my 2.5 pipes it may be worth it.


BIG

[69 Post Sedan]

I've heard that Dyno-Max is a good muffler......along with Pypes.

Good luck, Kurt

[68l30]

Thanks!

Well the headers are blasted and reworked a bit to add some custom clearance for the PS and the AC box, hopefully sprayed tomorrow and then into the oven they go.

BIG

[Postsedan]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 69 Post Sedan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm running <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="color: #FF0000">Hooker headers on my 410ci BBC with 2-1/2&quot; Magnaflow muscle car full exhaust system including a x-pipe. I have zero drone</span>.</span>

Flowmaster is known for the drone.....that's why they are called Dronemaster. lol Also, they really aren't the best for performance......they were in the 90's but not in today's standards.

Kurt </div></div>

I can attest to that.....and his 7 grand shifts <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/3gears.gif

Dan

[MosportGreen66]

I have 2.5 inch exhaust mated to Dynomax mufflers on my Z. Makes good noise when you punch it but otherwise quiet. Car has Hooker headers too with a ZZ4 crate motor with hot cam pack. Can send videos if you'd like?

Dan

[68l30]

Thanks Dan! Right now I'm trying not to get too far ahead of myself. I had the headers painted this morning, they will go in the oven tomorrow morning. Should be done Friday...Sooo, maybe this weekend I'll have time to get it up and see what comes apart. If it looks like the transverse will come off without a fight, replacement should be Dyno. If not, it's all coming off and factory stock will be the replacement.

I did spy my header mtd. Purple Hornies while I drug out my headers....Can I tolerate a summer with just the Hornies?? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif


BIG

[Mr. Chevy]

Just run that baby open headers Steve!!! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/3gears.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

Rich

[68l30]

I'm ready to start working on it, just need to take a day and do it.

BIG

[mockingbird812]

Cool project BIG. But, we are going to need some photos! Good luck and Keep us posted!! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

[68l30]

It's gonna happen on my next scheduled day off.....getting my ducks lined up.

BIG

[68l30]

Well......Got busy today. Job went about as expected, had a few snafu's , but it's running again. I started on the easy side first, just to get my blood pumping. Drivers side header came off in about 20min. That was about as easy as it got. Went to put the new header on and the 4 into 1 collector was about a 1/2 longer. My collector and head pipe were now in the way.Tried to remove the collector, no way. Cut the head pipe behind the collector. Fit like a glove. Time for the nightmare side, Rip out the A/C compressor and get busy with the header. Everything came apart text book, till I got to the last bolt behind #8....How the hell did I tighten that? Oh yeah, custom bent 3/8 box wrench. Out comes the old and the new one slide right into place. Next headache, #6 spark plug. Old one came out no problem, getting the new on started, FML. Took 2 hours and the necessary removal of a layer of skin to get it started. In the end it took a piece of hose over the plug and me laying over the engine from the front. Right in. Everything else went right back together. For now, it's open headers. I will fab up a longer collector and get the system buttoned back up. The Flowmaster system may hang around for another season, we'll see how it goes.


I forgot what kind of animal this is uncorked. It's Awesome. I let it come up to temp in the driveway then launched it in the street. Brought it up on the converter then did a 7k pull, Wide Treds be damned.

I have some video before &amp; uncorked, but have no idea how to post it....

Old &amp; new..

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/05/full-105-43726-both_sets.jpg

Reason for the switch...

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/05/full-105-43727-blowout.jpg

Drivers side..

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/05/full-105-43728-drivers_side.jpg

Fresh set of NOS R44 Acniters

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/05/full-105-43729-acniters.jpg

BIG <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/burnout.gif

[Mr. Chevy]

Steve, lookin' good... BTW got your text the other night.. I LIKE!!!! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/burnout.gif

Rich

[Mr. Chevy]

Steve, here ya go...

Rich

<a href="http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj37/RICHRUTT/th_MOV_4486.mp4" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj37/RICHRUTT/th_MOV_4486.mp4 (http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj37/RICHRUTT/MOV_4486.mp4)</a>

[68l30]

Thx Rich...Audio lost a bit in the Compressed files, Should I bring it by for a better video... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/burnout.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

Had it out for a bit yesterday....it is running good.

Fabricating the new collectors today....


BIG

[Mr. Chevy]

Sounds awesome!!

Rich

[JRC99]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 68l30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can I tolerate a summer with just the Hornies?? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif


BIG </div></div>

Wanna donate those? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

[ban617]

To be more day 2 era correct wouldn't you want some sort of turbo mufflers or thrush style or if your daring Purple Hornies ?

[68l30]

My plan is mating the headers to the factory exhaust, true to Day 2. I did run two turbo header mufflers (only) prior to the Flowmasters....They would rap on the floor boards nicely with the General Kinetics cam I ran!

Right now, it's open headers. To get to enjoy this a bit this year, I plan on mating it back up to the Flowmaster transverse system. Close to finishing ....hope I don't need to stretch the H pipe. Hornies are still on the table, just loud.

Long term goal will be a 2&quot; stock replacement system, transverse and no balance pipe. I have all the hangers, just need to find the correct pipes (ones I can cut without wasting a ton of cash).

BIG

[Day2_69Z]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44553-img_20150825_200516.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44554-img_20150825_200347.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44555-img_20150825_200318.jpg

[ban617]

What were / are the Orange Peelers ? Glass pack style or turbo style ?

[cook_dw]

The size of the box should answer your question but if that doesnt do it then here.


https://hobbydb-production.s3.amazonaws.com/processed_uploads/catalog_item_photo/catalog_item_photo/image/189165/Orange_Peeler_Print_Ads_796762ea-fda2-4313-9437-671cd72298e6.jpg

[68l30]

We ran those on a 71 Nova...header mounted. This was a 327 w/ M-22 and 4.88's ..........old skool noise!

BIG

[Day2_69Z]

BIG INLETS, 2&quot; outlet , dual hookups, round flange or Rarely seen Early Square Collector hook up.
Date of manufactor ; March,1969.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44599-1465494472416.jpg
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44600-1465494571331.jpg

[markinnaples]

Wow, a Tom Martin sighting! How ya doing Tom?

[earntaz]

Just a heads up -- if you're going to bolt them to the collector, make sure you support/hangers in the back end or you'll never keep the header bolts up on the heads tight ... been there, done that. They will bounce around and loosen those bolts. TAZ <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif

[Day2_69Z]

Nope, cutting the flanges off....mufflers are going behind head pipes....then intermediate pipes , tailpipes all clamped &amp; using original style exhaust hangers. The headpipes coned and banded over the STAHL Adjustable Collectors.

[novadude]

I couldn't bring myself to use a muffler bolted direct to the header collector, especially with a 2&quot; outlet.
Not sure of the original purpose of header mufflers, but it sure wasn't for performance. Give me appropriate sized headpipes with a x-pipe or balance tube, and mufflers mounted somewhere downstream. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

Let's face it... some of those old Day 2 &quot;improvements&quot; weren't actually well engineered. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/wink.gif

[68l30]

What was once high tech.........is now obsolete... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/scholar.gif

My stereo 8-Track and Vigilite were cutting edge......Now there are iPod's the size of a gum stick. I still play it thru my 8-Track!! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif


BIG

[novadude]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 68l30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What was once high tech.........is now obsolete... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/scholar.gif

My stereo 8-Track and Vigilite were cutting edge......Now there are iPod's the size of a gum stick. I still play it thru my 8-Track!! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif


BIG </div></div>

Yup! I totally get building to a theme and trying to capture a certain look. I like your idea of a stock system matted to headers better than header mufflers. Putting a huge restriction right at the collector is never a good idea. Plus, I'm too old and don't like the racket of glass packs on highway cruises. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/wink.gif

If you look at what Mopar did on OEM Hemi cars in the late '60s (balance pipe, large case mufflers, etc), I get the idea that they had it all figured out way back then.

[Day2_69Z]

Mark, not a sighting. a whisper is more like it.....a new grandson, a new hobby/business venture &amp; a 'break' have kept me silent....hmmm.
Plus I re did our townhouse top to bottom with ever changing antiques....

Yes, header mufflers were developed for.. . Ummm, show off sound and ummm , ,,, 'budget Ricky racers.,....
The farther away from headers does any muffler perform.
You guys should of seen the 1 5/8&quot; inner dia. toilet plunger glass packs that came with the exhaust kit......they were like a 50 HP choker ......
Big, there isn't just one kinda Day 2 exhaust set up.....True Corvair Turbo mufflers would be a top choice....
2 1/2 in &amp; 2 1/2 out ....not the 'newer ones' set below the back seat bulge right before the floor kick up for the rear end...

[68l30]

It's back together. My extended collectors tied into the 2-1/2&quot; system with little trouble. I did have to pull a head pipe ove a bit, but it worked out well. Now, as far as noise.... It's got some at the rear. I do like the fact that you can't see the H pipe, stock location dumps at the rear, and still use a transverse muffler. The Cons, a bit loud and missing the &quot;correct&quot; look. Is it text book Day 2? No, but it's pretty close. Stay tuned for that to happen down the road.

I have a before and after video, just no way to post.......can't post pics from my phone anymore either. Dumb!




BIG

[Day2_69Z]

Text book Day 2 ?
The Old Magazine Ads are &quot;text book&quot; .....2 1/2 inch is a good choice as is the Transverse H.P. muffler.....Walker &amp; other exhaust companies had a master interchange / available application with dimensions of mufflers available as substitute/upgrade replacements in the index are
(Back of catalog) a lot of guys back then put those Hemi type or HD truck mufflers in place of transverse or resonators......to avoid glass packs altogether.
I removed the Chambered exhaust &amp; went Vintage aftermarket Duals to show off the details of the rear under carriage and to mount the NOS vintage Holley Blue pump to the floor/frame kick up .....instead of in the &quot;trunk&quot; oops.http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2016/06/full-13370-44807-img_20140927_114812.jpg

[cook_dw]

I cant remember about the old Holley blue pumps but the newer pumps are pushers not pullers and I used to see 100's of failures when I worked there because of people mounting them above the tank. Just a word of caution.

[earntaz]

Yep -- installation should start by reading the instructions ... TAZ

[whitetop]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cook_dw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I cant remember about the old Holley blue pumps but the newer pumps are pushers not pullers and I used to see 100's of failures when I worked there because of people mounting them above the tank. Just a word of caution. </div></div>

Agree 100% that pump needs to be mounted on a frame rail as low as possible for efficiency and safety. . Also not sure if Day2 Z28 replaced all the old. maybe dry rotted or inflexable rubber internal parts but would hate to see what happens if that pump leaked and all the fuel puddled into the trunk floor.
Plus the look of an Holley Blue Pump hanging down in back looked badass.

[Day2_69Z]

Pump is NOS...No rubber issues...very pliable.

The pump mounted in the trunk was for effect at the time....
More common to see trunk mounts on early to mid 60's cars than say a 70 build....pumps were different between the two eras....

The blue pump is down low now....with no &quot;puddles&quot; .....