$75k COPO Camaro Project, MacNeish Certified

[scuncio]

Jerry states this one began life as a Lemans Blue COPO. Anyone familiar with this car? I don't remember seeing it for sale before.

1969 Camaro (http://ebay.to/2sfWDI4)

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/2mgAAOSwbopZVV4l/s-l1600.jpg

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/fHIAAOSw-29ZV57u/s-l1600.jpg

[PeteLeathersac]

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Subject VIN 124379N648989
Is there an NCRS Dealer report?
:beers:
~ Pete


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[COPO]

I thought an 05D COPO should be coded D80 on TT.

[William]

Wasn't built with D80.

[mr 707]

king chevrolet copo camaro. cincinnati ohio

[cook_dw]

I don't see the BIN price nor the $140k finished price that's stated in the ad..

[Bill Pritchard]

Darrell, the $75K BIN price is shown in the eBay listing. Also, in the description, it states: "If restored to original as much as possible this car can be worth upwards of $140,000.00 dollars."

[cook_dw]

Lol Bill, I can physically see the info but I don't think it's realistic. I guess I should have worded it a little different.:beers:

[PeteLeathersac]

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:beers:
~ Pete


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[Bill Pritchard]

Lol Bill, I can physically see the info but I don't think it's realistic.

Duh....I get it now! :beers:

[enio45]

because of the lack of docs on the car - and we have only jerry's certification - has anyone
taken the body sequence number and checked to see if the body numbers FITS in a group of other COPO's ?

With the BE Rear gone.....there is no other way to tell?

Jerry lists the other items to check - but is it possible it is not a COPO?

[the427king]

Its either a cowl piercing docd car or it falls in between other copos by vin if it was the latter it probably would have been mentioned so im going with the first .. bb heater box means nothing that can be changed......if anyone starts reproducing correct hole punched repro firewalls for cowl induction there are going to be 10000 more copos

[bergy]

There are 15 to 20 "tells" on a copo - Jerry's really good at sorting things out. Cowl hood piercing is one "tell", but with X11 & exh reinf on driver side it could also have been SB SS. Jerry lists other copo items on his paperwork. VIN & body numbers fall in line.

Really a nice car in great color (now & original) - heck of a deal IMO

[frankk]

The body # falls in line with mine which has similar build date.

[Stefano]

I owned COPO VIN 648998. The car is probably a COPO but not beyond a resonable doubt in my mind, based on what has been presented. Not many other clues, but for the date code on the heater core.

[bergy]

Please explain - if the car has:

-original X11 TT

-original driver's side exh reinforcement plate

-original 3/8" fuel line without return line (Jerry's inspection report only says 3/8 line, but I'm sure that he would have indicated if it had evidence of a return line)

-original cowl hood piercing

what else can it be but a copo?

[Stefano]

I have never seen this Camaro in person, but based on what I see in the pictures I feel comfortable saying that this is not an untouched, unmolested survivor. All of the items you mentioned above can be added to a regular Camaro (along with a piercing or two) and an SS with ZL2 would only need a big block heater core and box which is a bolt on item and a fuel line, clamps and bolts, which are also bolt on. Based on the VIN, Trim Tag, items present, build date, area the car was sold new, etc....it might indeed be a COPO 9561.

[Steve Shauger]

Maybe because I'm a purist, but id ratther spend 75k for an original drivetrain l78 with history and gm documentation.

[enio45]

to me the body numbers is a key element and unfortunately the BE rear is gone ( which would have cinched it) - the piecing is duplicable for sure as well as the hole for the solenoid IMO.

[COPO]

I seem to recall a previous discussion on this board regarding body numbers and William gave a pretty convincing response with a number of examples that the body numbers on the TT really mean nothing in regards to whether a car is a COPO or not. All of the other physical signs certainly support it being a legit COPO, but I sure wouldn't want to invest in a full restoration without some history and paperwork.

[the427king]

Bolt on items dont document cars. Imo

[enio45]

I believe there are good examples of sequential body numbers for the COPO cars. Not saying that is definitive, but a good indicator if you are weighting risk on a car without paperwork.

[bergy]

car is sold?

[enio45]

i don't know - don't think so....last indication as reserve not met......

[William]

I believe there are good examples of sequential body numbers for the COPO cars. Not saying that is definitive, but a good indicator if you are weighting risk on a car without paperwork.

At one time I would have agreed with that; not any longer.

Consecutive body numbers are a byproduct of a dealer submitting a group of orders. If a dealer ordered several Camaros at a time and they and were quickly confirmed they typically have consecutive body numbers regardless of equipment. The CRG has 4 examples of COPOs with body numbers consecutive with a non-COPO. One of them is a Camaro SS350 with an X11D80 tag, an easily cloned car. There are several other examples within a few numbers of each other.

Has to be more there than a body number consecutive with a known COPO.

[mr 707]

its a REAL COPO

[Steve Shauger]

its a REAL COPO

Do you know the selling dealer or any history on the car?

[bergy]

JM cert says King Chev.

Really nice floors/underbody - wouldn't be surprised if the 3/8 fuel line w/o return is factory.

[the427king]

The only person that has to be convinced its real is the next buyer

[firstgenaddict]

I found the car at a cars and coffee probably 2 years ago... posted it here at the time.

I saw the big block heater box, muncie piercing, cowl throttle arm, then an X11 tag with the sequence number in line with other known copo's. looked at the fuse box - and then went and found out who the owner was - we put it on a lift and the 427 marks were in the fender extensions along with the original fuel line and 5 leaf springs... rear antenna, U17 car with the correct 7k 6k red tach - he bought it as a non numbers big block 5-7 years ago up in Tennessee -

[PeteLeathersac]

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Great story JAG and congrats to whoever nabbed the car!
What of the Dec. '68 ad for the LB 427 car as posted previously also again below, too long between order and 05D build or could it have taken this long?
:hmmm:
~ Pete



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[enio45]

So - did it sell?

[camaromb]

[QUOTE=PeteLeathersac;1359877]'

Great story JAG and congrats to whoever nabbed the car!
What of the Dec. '68 ad for the LB 427 car as posted previously also again below, too long between order and 05D build or could it have taken this long?
:hmmm:
~ Pete



.[/QUOTE

Aluminum heads? Looks like pre-production advertising, they must have had some very early knowledge of the Copo program. Its only a month or so after the first 50 Yenko orders were submitted.

[PeteLeathersac]

[QUOTE=PeteLeathersac;1359877]'

Great story JAG and congrats to whoever nabbed the car!
What of the Dec. '68 ad for the LB 427 car as posted previously also again below, too long between order and 05D build or could it have taken this long?
:hmmm:
~ Pete



.[/QUOTE

Aluminum heads? Looks like pre-production advertising, they must have had some very early knowledge of the Copo program. Its only a month or so after the first 50 Yenko orders were submitted.


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Yep but interesting how Lemans Blue is mentioned in the ad as if an LB 427 car had been ordered w/ the noted 4 x Z-28's?
If it had indeed been ordered in Dec. '68, when would delivery have come true?
:beers:
~ Pete



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[firstgenaddict]

FWIW If the order had been confirmed in December the body number would be MUCH lower. As Jim Mattison has stated, the body numbers were assigned when the orders were confirmed beginning in 69.
It is interesting that the colors are the same as well as being a style trim car with special instrumentation...

[PeteLeathersac]

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Good info and thanks for weighing in!
Considering all, there may have been more than one LB 9561 ordered/delivered by King Chevrolet?:hmmm:
:beers:
~ Pete


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