1965 409 Impala 2 Door

[BowtieGent]

Looking for some opinions here, Good, Bad OR Ugly. I expect no less from the MANY knowledgeable members here. Here goes:

I have a good buddy that came upon a '65 Impala for sale. Born a 409 2-door, NON SS, NON Posi diff (Dana?), Cypress Green Metallic (JJA) with Green cloth & vinyl Bench seat interior (826G). It's in need of full restoration, but is a solid platform in which to build on. Built 5th week of Dec '64 (12E). Has the 1/4" return fuel line from pump as well as the ballast resistor on the firewall, which i'm told is 409 ONLY. (396 had no return line).

The car needs full interior, hood, trunk lid, floor and trunk pans as well as some patching around the front and rear windows (typical for his neck of the woods), and paint.
Engine and trans have long been removed.

Looking for any and all thoughts and opinions about what to do with this car, considering only 2828 were built with 409's in '65. He is thinking of selling it, and would like to know what a respectable asking price would be, as it currently sits. He bought the car as a parts car due to it being a 12-bolt, but once he found out it was a 409 car, he changed his mind; and the fact that it was a non-posi Dana diff.

Thanks in advance everyone.

[BowtieGent]

Anyone?

[BowtieGent]

Nothing?

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

I would throw out a number if I knew more about big cars.

She needs all the stuff.

5K to 7K ?

Ryan

[tom406]

That's a neat car, and the '65 409s are always interesting to me. With all that said, they're a somewhat obscure car. That car needs quite a bit of work and you really just described a circumstantial 409 car-an early build with some telltale signs. That's not enough to justify a full tilt restoration because the buyers will consider it a maybe/probably 409 car. Unless there's some paperwork to be found or original engine to verify originality, I think it will probably remain unrestored. I hope it finds a happy ending! Thanks for posting.

[BowtieGent]

I was hoping that it would garner some input from those here that might be familiar with the 409 cars specifically. I agree that with the circumstantial 409 evidence being what it is, it IS still there as proof and has been unmolested.

I realize that 2828 units produced does not make it a super rare platform, but doesn't the fact that it's a bench seat NON SS make the production number even less?

I'm not looking to use this forum as a platform to just find out what it might be worth to sell, but to also learn more about the car itself.

[BowtieGent]

Being that 409s seem desirable, maybe someone here knows of a 409 that could go back into this car?

The car was purchased in Ohio.

[Lee Stewart]

Rare does not always equate to being valuable. The big news for the 1965 Impala was the brand new L78 396/425 HP engine option. This killed the 409. Plus the 1965 409 is a "lower performance" engine with just a single 4BBL carb @ 400 HP as compared to the 1964 409 with dual quads @ 425 HP.

https://s26.postimg.org/61lkf2gft/image.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://www.mecum.com/lots/SC0516-243489/1965-chevrolet-impala/#&gid=1&pid=1

This 1965 409/400 HP 4 speed Impala sold for $40,000 in May 2016. So how much money does your car need to get it into this shape?

[BowtieGent]

Ah, Here we go. Thanks for the reply, Lee.
My buddy's recent purchase happened to come with the powerglide as opposed to the 4-speed. I know that in itself hurts it. I know that if I were to live closer to him, I could get the metal work done for a decent price, but paint and upholstery would need to be farmed out.
Getting a hold of a 409 produced as close to his cars production date wouldn't be easy, but just having a 409 in the hole again would be cool.

[Lee Stewart]

Ah, Here we go. Thanks for the reply, Lee.
My buddy's recent purchase happened to come with the powerglide as opposed to the 4-speed. I know that in itself hurts it. I know that if I were to live closer to him, I could get the metal work done for a decent price, but paint and upholstery would need to be farmed out.
Getting a hold of a 409 produced as close to his cars production date wouldn't be easy, but just having a 409 in the hole again would be cool.

Cool yes - but probably a money losing situation.

In My Opinion . . . I would sell it as is for whatever you could get for it and call it a day. Projects like the one you are suggesting take lots of money and LOTS of time to complete. I would think you would want to at least break even on the money and frankly I just don't see how. You car needs so much because it has so little to start with.

[Postsedan]

Cool yes - but probably a money losing situation.

In My Opinion . . . I would sell it as is for whatever you could get for it and call it a day. Projects like the one you are suggesting take lots of money and LOTS of time to complete. I would think you would want to at least break even on the money and frankly I just don't see how. You car needs so much because it has so little to start with.

Lee - Gets it.

Hi Lawrence, the last time you asked for advice (for your own car) you ran away and hid under a rock....now it's a friend you are asking for....so I assume you will not run this time.

I first saw, this thread....but I waiting until someone else replied.....so you would not think I was saying the same old song and dance. This car needs a lot of love....and money. Hope she gets saved....but will need someone with a deep love and deep pockets.

Best of luck to your friend, and don't run away Lawrence :D

Dan

[BowtieGent]

He has found someone willing to trade another vehicle for it, so now the project is in someone else's hands. I offered to post about the car for him here to see what others would say, not for my benefit, but for his. I suggested he register here and start a thread, but he was unable to post for some reason. This was so he could read the replies. Other than costs to restore the car, which he wasn't planning on doing, he was hoping to just learn more about the car being a 409 than anything else to help him figure out a respectable price to list it for.

[BowtieGent]

Lee - Gets it.

Hi Lawrence, the last time you asked for advice (for your own car) you ran away and hid under a rock....now it's a friend you are asking for....so I assume you will not run this time.

I first saw, this thread....but I waiting until someone else replied.....so you would not think I was saying the same old song and dance. This car needs a lot of love....and money. Hope she gets saved....but will need someone with a deep love and deep pockets.

Best of luck to your friend, and don't run away Lawrence :D

Dan

Dan, It wasn't about MY car, but you already know that and that isn't relative to this thread.
I could say more, but this thread wasn't started for YOU to throw jabs, but for someone else who was/is looking for solid advice.

But, with that said, Thank you for solidifying my reason for leaving TDP, and keeping many other registered members from wanting to actually contribute there. I and others walked and not ran, and no rocks were involved. :)

[BowtieGent]

Cool yes - but probably a money losing situation.

In My Opinion . . . I would sell it as is for whatever you could get for it and call it a day. Projects like the one you are suggesting take lots of money and LOTS of time to complete. I would think you would want to at least break even on the money and frankly I just don't see how. You car needs so much because it has so little to start with.

Lee, I agree, and said the same to my buddy about the car. He bought it as a parts car, mainly for the 12-bolt, but wanted to know more about it being a 409 car than anything else. He was never going to restore it since he already has a project in the works, and the diff turned out to be a non posi, so he was just looking for more info about the car itself.

I suggested he run a thread here in case someone here had an interest in it, seeing as so many here are well versed in the more sought after cars and projects that MAY be worth investing the time and money into such a project.

Who knows, someone here may even have the 409 that came out of this...Ya never know.

[Mr70]

Always loved the look of the '65 Impala,both front & back.
I see the dilemma your friend has about it.How cool if it's engine was still out there.
Thanks for posting about it.
Good luck to him whatever he decides.

[BowtieGent]

I'm also partial to the look of the '65, and own a '70 Malibu too.

Seems this particular Impala was pretty basic aside from the fact that someone wanted it with a 409. Based on reactions, or lack there of, there's nothing particularly "special" about it. Which is fine, and good to know that not everything with a 409 is/was desirable.

[Lee Stewart]

In 1965 there were two versions of the 409: The 340 HP hydraulic cam and the 400 HP solid cam. Both had a single 4 BBL carb.

Both were replaced mid year with the 396 325 HP and 425 HP engines.

[RPOLS3]

Verne Frantz is the resident 409 expert here - his opinion would be worthwhile for your friend to consider.

For some reason the 65 409's don't seem to get much love even though they are rare.

[BowtieGent]

Thanks Jake.

[Lee Stewart]

For some reason the 65 409's don't seem to get much love even though they are rare.

Probably because Chevrolet emasculated the 409, by limiting it to a single 4 BBL carb, before replacing the whole W series with the Mark IV.

It had great beginnings as what many feel was Chevrolet's first real muscle car - the 1961 409 Impala Super Sport. From there it became Chevy's first competitive NASCAR engine and drag strip terror - the Z11 427. It was imortalized by the Beach Boys' "409" song.

And once again . . . rare does not automatically mean valuable. Such is the case for the 1965 409 Chevrolet Full Size cars.

[EZ Nova]

Having a 409, I can tell you that parts are usually more than the Mark IV BBc's. I have a 1961 Pontiac for sale here. It has a genie 409 block and 690 425Hp heads. Those 2 things alone usually go for $2500.00 block and $2500.00 heads. Some the Impala guys are really casting date critical and that too affects the value. 409 are neat pieces and people like seeing them and it always draws a crowd. Mine is quite a bit more powerful than the 425Hp though.

I've had some bites at my car, but nothing solid yet.

[BowtieGent]

This is awesome info Guys. Much appreciated. :)

[BJCHEV396]

Would this car be rare and "valuable" with original drivetrain?

[Lee Stewart]

Would this car be rare and "valuable" with original drivetrain?

If it was the high performance 409/400 HP with a 4 speed - yes - to a point. Again you are talking in the $45K to $55K range.

This is what the car would look like as far as color: Cypress Green Met.

https://s26.postimg.org/ygpi5i2wp/image.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

IMO - The only real valuable 1965 409 Chevy would be the 400HP/4 speed in an Impala SS convertible with lots of options. Then you can get into the $75K and up range. The real money is with the L78 396/425 HP cars. They can easily command 6 figures.

https://s26.postimg.org/nh8w7n1vd/image.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Color can also affect the value of a 1965 Chevy. This one is in a 1965 only color called Evening Orchid and is more valuable than all other colors because of it's one year only use.

The car above is a 409/4 speed full restored Impala SS loaded with options including A/C in EO color. It sold in May of 2014 for $70,000

[Verne_Frantz]

'65s are in a league of their own and only the 400hp with 4-spd options would add considerable value. The 340hp with a P/G will add a little valve over a 300hp small block, but not a lot. Those funny shaped valve covers always add an interest and nostalgia factor. Think of it as the difference between a 325hp 396 and an L-78.
The car in question would be very much underwater after a good restoration, especially with a replacement engine.

As for valves that were stated, an original good block is worth much more than $2500. but the value of the hi-perf heads has taken a dive. It's easy to find a good pair for $1500. or less. There are a lot more people in the hobby today who prefer to hot rod them rather than restore them and they go with the Edelbrock heads.

Verne