Big block or small block?

[markinnaples]

As I've mentioned before, I lost an oil ring in the 302 in my Camaro, so I want to swap it out for something with a little more torque and I've been taking my time and shopping around for what to put in next after I finish some stuff around the house.

I've considered another small block; maybe a 383 stroker or 406, but I've toyed with the idea of putting in a decently built big block with lots of low-end torque. Shouldn't be too hard of a swap as I have manual steering and manual brakes, but I am a little concerned about the extra weight of the BB with the manual steering (eventually changing to power steering but that's down the road some due to budgetary constraints).

So, with all of the extensive experience in here I thought I'd ask you what you'd do, hi-po small block or moderately built big block?

[bbbentley]

Big block has the best wow factor when opening the hood. If it was hard to drive a manual box with a bb, they would have never offered the combo. But they did make them this way, so it will be fine. Power will make it more enjoyable if driven regularly. You will need new front springs. These days ( and I absolutely love my bb’s ), I’d opt for a 427 small block. If torque and drive ability are the deciding factors?

[WILMASBOYL78]

If money is a factor...the small block route will probably be more cost effective. A big block swap will require a lot of changes and upgrades like; cooling system, exhaust, suspension, etc. A well built small block should be an in/out project with no other changes. You'll probably have the dough for your power steering and money left over.

You could even swap heads, intake, ignition, carb, etc. from the 302 onto a nice 350 short block built to LT-1 specs and be good to go. Plenty of power, the solid lifter music, and minimal aggravation.

less is more...

-wilma

[bbbenny]

If you build a Big block with the following it will be a street beast, and friendly. 10.5 comp, mild roller cam hyd. A set of alum heads, and alum intake. With a 800 holley carb. Nothing beats cubic inches!!! BBBenny

[HawkX66]

No replacement for displacement. :3gears:

[Lee Stewart]

Stay with the HiPo small block. You will continue to enjoy the great handling you are used to. That will lessen greatly if you put in a BB.

[big gear head]

My SS396 came without power steering and I would not add it if it was free. I have no problems with the manual steering and big block.

As others have said, it would be easier and cheaper to put a small block back in place of the 302. I know that it's been done many times, but putting a big block in a small block car can present a few problems. There were several parts that were specific to big block cars, such as the heater core, frame mounts, cross member, radiator and others. You can work around all of this, but a small block would be easier. The large cubic inch small blocks are very powerful. I've seen several 427 crate small blocks that were not expensive.

[markinnaples]

Appreciate everyone's opinion.

Now, what do I do with the old 302? They decked the block so the DZ stamp is gone so not sure what to do with it now. Make it into a table with a glass top? Argh.

[bbbentley]

Appreciate everyone's opinion.

Now, what do I do with the old 302? They decked the block so the DZ stamp is gone so not sure what to do with it now. Make it into a table with a glass top? Argh.

I could liberate it from you. Drop it off at mom’s storage unit in ft myers

[bbbenny]

Mark, What to do with the 302? Advertivse here on the site. If dosen;t sell, try craigs list. But don;t give it away. Standing on edge in the corner of the garage dosen;t take up alot of room! JMO BBBenny

[earntaz]

Mark, What to do with the 302? Advertivse here on the site. If dosen;t sell, try craigs list. But don;t give it away. Standing on edge in the corner of the garage dosen;t take up alot of room! JMO BBBenny

X2 -- don't do something you will regret in the future ... slide it under the bench!! TAZ

[markjohnson]

Everything I own is Rat-powered so I'm a hardcore fan of the BBC. But that said, they are heavy pigs especially when iron-headed and will really shove the nose of the car down. I kinda like the idea of a 427 SBC disguised to look like a stock 302: orange paint, finned valve covers, stock aluminum intake, etc.

[MosportGreen66]

If you change the car to a big block you'll have other costs... Heater core, heater core cover, motor mounts, motor mount stands, headers, modifying exhaust, bellhousing (likely), trans cross member, etc. If you want to keep the build a tad more manageable, you could run a 427 small block or even a 383 stroker. GM Performance Parts as a great 383 stroker that makes good power.

Dan

[Salvatore]

Just rebuild the 302 with some better upgrades. Change the trans and also go with a little lower rear gear. Will run and perform very well. Why go thru all that BB swap and push that 302 motor under the bench just to rust up?

[markinnaples]

Thanks for the opinions and advice. That little 302 just doesn't have the torque for what I want to do with it. Something like a 383 or 406 (a SB 427 would be awesome but out of the budget) should give me what I need.

I'm going to get the 302 down to a short block and put it up for sale. LOL, anyone interested?

[big gear head]

Does the 302 still have the VIN for your car stamped into the side of the block? If it does then you need to keep it with the car. Even though the block has been decked the VIN will still identify it as a 302 if it matches your true Z28.

[VintageMusclecar]

You can make some pretty obnoxious torque with a garden variety 400 small block, even with factory heads. Built right, these make for stupid--and cheap-- fun on the street.

For whatever reason they seem to have somewhat fallen out of favor, so the prices for a decent core are down. If you choose to go that route, be mindful that they are known for cracks so make sure you're starting with a good core. Also, the 2 bolt blocks are actually stronger than the 4 bolts in stock form. If you plan on really stepping on it, it doesn't cost much to convert the center 3 mains on a 2 bolt block to splayed caps.

As I've mentioned before, I lost an oil ring in the 302 in my Camaro, so I want to swap it out for something with a little more torque and I've been taking my time and shopping around for what to put in next after I finish some stuff around the house.

I've considered another small block; maybe a 383 stroker or 406, but I've toyed with the idea of putting in a decently built big block with lots of low-end torque. Shouldn't be too hard of a swap as I have manual steering and manual brakes, but I am a little concerned about the extra weight of the BB with the manual steering (eventually changing to power steering but that's down the road some due to budgetary constraints).

So, with all of the extensive experience in here I thought I'd ask you what you'd do, hi-po small block or moderately built big block?

[markinnaples]

Freddie, the engine isn't original to the car, so there's no intrinsic value of keeping it with my car. I'd love to find the original Z but the chances of that are pretty slim. I'm going to pull the engine over the next couple weeks once I get some house stuff done and will look for that VIN on the side. I'm all for a large displacement small block.

[big gear head]

House stuff. That's very close to me right now. I've got the inside of my house pretty much torn apart right now and the Camaro is sitting in the shop waiting for me to get it ready for SCR21.

[Lynn]

I run a 70 LT-1 spec engine in my Z. Standard bore. Factory LT-1 pistons, factory 2.02 heads (186) with no porting, Federal Mogul copy of the 178 camshaft, wide ratio muncie, 4:10 rear gear, frame connectors, traction bars (SSM Lift bars) and 255 60 15 BG Goodrich tires. Didn't even grind the valves or put valve guies in these old used heads, so it smokes a bit.

I can smoke the tires all the way to redline in the first three gears even with SF connectors and traction bars. What would I do with more torque? I have all the pieces here (set up Eric helped me put together) that include RacTec pistons, fully ported heads, port matched high rise, more aggressive cam, etc. I have never put it together because, even though it will probably produce about 100 more hp than what I have, I don't know that I can take advantage of the extra power without figuring out how to get bettter traction.

For a street car, it is plenty fun. If I was willing to put slicks on it and risk carnage, perhaps I could make it "drag strip" faster. I really don't care to to that. Will it keep up with modern high performance cars? Not a chance. No traction control. No way it could keep up with Sherri's CL600 (V12 twin turbo laying down 543 HP and even more torque).

Yes, you can build a first gen Camaro that will run with the CL600, but not cheaply.

My 02 cents: if it isn't going to be a race car, don't build a race car. Without huge rear meats, your not putting much of that torque down anyway. Find a good forged 350 crank, use a good set of heads (if it were me, I would go AFR) and get a good camshaft rec from Eric, small tube headers, and go have some fun.

[WILMASBOYL78]

I read this article this morning [again] about a fairly simple build on a 1966 L79 engine....output with cast iron manifolds was 361 hp and 401 torque. They added headers and it went up to 391 hp and 422 torque.

I'm not sure if your current block can be fixed, but if it can, this seems like a simple route to look at. Lots of power, you can use most of the original pieces, just need a 327 crank and the camshaft and lifters...and normal rebuild stuff.

https://www.pressreader.com/usa/muscle-car-review/20180201/281547996345412

worth a look..

-wilma

[markinnaples]

Thanks, I'll check that out.