Introducing........RAT’S NEST

[R68GTO]

Newly discovered / now MacNeish certified COPO from where else……..Ohio. I’m a GTO guy as you can see by my sig but always wanted a 69 Camaro. Started seriously looking last fall to get a gauge on pricing, condition, etc. I really wanted an RS/Z28 but found those all to be more than I wanted to spend.
I recalled a conversation I had with a coworker back in the early 2000’s about a Camaro he owned with low miles. We discussed the car off/on over the next few years - I only saw the car once briefly at a local car show. Black Camaro with gold Z28 stripes and an automatic. I thought to myself at that time - eh, not a real Z since it was an auto. The coworker had retired years ago so we lost touch. Fast-forward 15 years……through a mutual coworker I got his number and gave him a call. He still had the car, but didn’t want to sell it. We discussed the car and he told me that he owned it since the early 1980’s it had a 427 / turbo 400 and it only had 15,000 original miles. He was not interested in selling it.
I told him that if he ever decided to sell it, to give me a call. For the next week, I couldn’t get this car off my mind thinking that even though it was an automatic (I wanted a 4 speed), it would be a great car to build off of if the low mileage claim was true……which I was very skeptical about. The next weekend I called him to ask if I could just come look at it and hopefully I would see something I didn’t want so I could stop thinking about it since he didn’t want to sell anyway. He agreed so I went the following weekend. Stay tuned....:wink:

[bbbentley]

I know a little about the car and this is going to be great! Trust me.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

You got the PHS Invoice for it yet ? :nonewfolder:

[R68GTO]

Not yet BVZ....Mattison is having trouble finding his Norwood stuff:wink::wink:

[Bill Pritchard]

This sounds very interesting :naughty:

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

....Mattison is having trouble finding his Norwood stuff:wink::wink:

So typical , and just when you needed him most.

I also have an old affliction with 69 Camaro.
Comes and Goes , have been able to keep it moderated without meds- so far.
Seems like unaware COPO's are the only hope for a poor boy anymore.
Hope you scored a sweet deal.

We are going to lose interest if you dont at least tell us what colors the car originally was ! Goldenrod ? Carousel ? Matador ?

[The Boss]

In for the ride...

[R68GTO]

The owner had mentioned to me years ago that he sometimes wondered if it might be a COPO but didn’t think it was (not original engine) and even had someone come look at it and determined that it wasn’t. With that nugget of info in my head I did some research on what to look for in a COPO car. Being a novice (I still am), I was looking for a curve neck radiator, big block heater core, disc brakes, 140 mph speedo, 12 bolt BE rear end.
When I saw the car and started looking it over, I fairly quickly believed it was true a low mileage car. The owner stated it was rust free and had all original interior. The interior certainly looked the part and the body was pretty rust free with just a couple of spots that looked a little funky in the rear inner wheel houses. Rockers and floor/trunk pans looked perfect. It had a few of the COPO signs I was looking for (disc brakes, BB heater core) but was missing others (curve neck radiator, 12 bolt rear, 140 speedo). He again mentioned the COPO possibility but again dismissed it since he had a local “car guy” check it out - that guy told him it was a small block car. Here’s what the car looked like when I inspected it in his garage.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Man that car really is in nice shape top to bottom. (saw picture of stone lodged in leaf spring shackle)
Looks more like a well kept NC car than a lifelong Ohio resident.

Interior speaks for itself , and the mileage.

The previous owner really took great care of it.
He will be SICK when/if he gets news of the central office deal.

Have never heard anyone say anything negative about LeMans Blue .
Believe you're in pretty good shape with this Chevrolet :biggthumpup:

[Unreal]

For the future, most COPOs did not have the 140MPH speedo. All of Yenko-ordered COPOs for conversion (ie adding badges and stripes) were "Double COPO" (9561 and 9737) as well as a few other COPOs. However most of the estimated 1000 COPOs had standard Camaro 120 MPH speedos.

[m22mike]

Just curious here, where do you get the information that "most" COPO Camaro's were not double COPO's ?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

RE : 9737

I found out about the - COPO 9737 Sports Car Conversion Pkg/Eqpt - not too long ago.
Am also a COPO/Yenko - rookie/novice .

As that it wasn't inclusive part of Standard Base 9561 COPO - 427cid Pkg/Eqpt , as far as what any Chevrolet dealer could have ordered , at minimum requirement.

Most info found generally stated 9737 :
140 mph speedo
15" wheels
Larger front sway bar
*Later cars sometimes included an In-Dash Tach with Center Fuel Gauge

Some info has also given alternatives within the 9737 content - with option price reflecting type of content.
Such as
Plain Wheels versus Rally Wheels
In-Dash Tach versus No Tach

And seen different sources of info stating conflicting size of front bar.
Most seem to say 13/16 , with 11/16 as standard.

Could depend on what they are trying to use to measure with.
But seen it stated as 7/8 , 15/16 , 1" , 1-1/8"
Sounds like as long as a 3/4" open end wrench won't slip over it - its in the game.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Just curious here, where do you get the information that "most" COPO Camaro's were not double COPO's ?

I think when i looked at the COPO Registry here , they mentioned adding more blocks to the info input , to help decipher amount of Double / Triple COPO's , that were Non-Yenko COPO's.

Would have to look back again and see where that stands.

Or have you already done that Mike ?
just asking

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

There are currently more 69 Camaro Yenko/COPO cars accounted for in the Registry , than there are all other 69 Camaro COPO cars combined.

As to say - currently - a Non-Yenko COPO Camaro is rarer than a Yenko.
In terms of what is "documented" within the Registry.
Not by Logic , just by what is still known to be alive within the Registry.

That data would currently put Double COPO's ahead instantly , at minimum.
Since all Yenko's were Doubles , at minimum.

By Logic ,
there are still about another 100+/- un-registered Yenko's.
And about another 700 +/- un-registered Non-Yenko's .

I would be inclined to agree with UnReal's speculation , that of the 800 +/- Total Non-Yenko cars , most were probably 9561 , alone.
Without 9737 or 9511.
:stupid:

Red is being so
s
l
o
w
giving details on his car , we have to pass the time here somehow. :grin:

[R68GTO]

I asked him how it ran. He told me it ran great and was very fast. He told me he hadn’t driven it it two years but hopped in and fired it right up. Man, I tell you, the sound of that 427 firing up inside that closed garage (February in Ohio) made my heart pound - it was awesome! Now I really wanted this car! I wasn’t convinced it was a COPO but it was a very nice clean, original body/interior Camaro with a big block. So I asked him if he would sell it expecting another “not interested”. To my surprise, he said yes! I asked him “what’s your happy price”? I felt the number was reasonable for a low mileage running/driving Camaro, so we made the deal.
Here’s some shots of the car's home for about 35 years and more shots of the car when I got it home.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

There are currently more 69 Camaro Yenko/COPO cars accounted for in the Registry , than there are all other 69 Camaro COPO cars combined.


That was way outdated information.
My fault and sorry about that.

More up to date is June 2014 =

160 non-Yenko COPOs
Of these 160 known cars, 29 are double COPOs.
So, approximately 18% of the known, non-Yenko COPOs are double COPOs.

*in addition , was asked about subtracting Berger cars also =

16 - so, we have only 13 9737 L72 cars registered that are not either Berger or Yenko. It appears that when we remove the Yenko & Berger cars, the percentage of 9737/9561 double COPOs drops to less then 10% of the 9561s produced.

[bergy]

are we off on a rabbit trail by any chance?

[markinnaples]

More pics and info, please!

[R68GTO]

Once I got it home, I began to spend more time online on this site, CRG, & Team Camaro looking for additional ways to confirm the COPO status. Armed with more info, I felt much more confident that I had indeed just bought a COPO. I pm’d a member on this site and gave some info regarding my suspicions. He recommended having Jerry Macneish look at it before posting stuff online just to make sure it was legit. I contacted Jerry to get the inspection set up. In the meantime, I continued to do more research and became close to 100% confident in the COPO status. Ordered the NCRS docs to get the selling dealer - Ray Bryant Chevrolet in Dayton, Ohio. I began to start researching ownership history by contacting the owner prior to the guy I bought the car from - got his name off the title. The mileage on the title stated 12,300 miles. That owner remembered the car well and promptly sent me a photo of the car when he had it back in the early 1980's. The pic below is that photo. He also gave me the name/number of the guy he bought it from.

[1971ls6]

Good luck! Looks like a straight neck radiator, does anybody remember if it was changed? If it is an original what does the tag say?

Does it have the large sway bar?

Is it an original hood? Is the wiring there for the cowl hood?

[R68GTO]

Owner #6 changed the radiator back in the late 70's. Said he pulled it out of a 68 Camaro big block. I'm not yet sure what the radiator is out of....my research says it's a service replacement????
Cowl hood is original and date stamped to line up with the car build date. Normal sway bar, 120 mph speedo. Pic below shows ZL2 hole occupied by the original wiring harness and grommet.

[bergy]

R68GTO has really educated himself with regard to the COPO attributes. Great job & cool car!!!

[R68GTO]

Thanks for the kind words Bergy!
Once I had the name/number of the next owner, this ultimately started a chain of prior owner to prior owner contact. I also took out Craigslist ads and Facebook posts looking for info on the car. Through some of those ads I was able to connect to several members on this site who all were very helpful in educating me on this COPO thing.
Through all of that, here’s where I’m at. I’ve phone interviewed (and took a ton of notes) the consecutive chain of seven prior owners or a close relative of an owner (2 are deceased). I believe I am only missing the original owner, more on that later. I have photos of the car from 4 of the 8 prior owners, two others say they have some, they just haven’t sent them yet. The 2nd owner (deceased) bought the car in 1970/71 from the original owner and fairly quickly turned it into a race car. That’s a cool story on its own!

[markinnaples]

Wow, great story so far and looking forward to hearing and seeing more. Good stuff!

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

:worship: Way to go Red !
Can imagine the excitement of learning/studying all the fine points and then have most of them fall right in place on the car in text-book condition as you went through it methodically.

:headbang:
Lots of Awesome all going in your favor !


Is that you standing in the doorway at previous owner garage ?

Guessing nobody from Owner #3 upwards knew it was a Faktry COPO ?

Have been reading a lot of the discovery threads for the past week in this COPO section. Your car is definitely speaking for itself more clearly than "most" of the others i have read about.

One of the best condition "previous owner unaware" COPO Camaro's that i can recall in those readings. I'm back to 2012 in the archives, currently.

[R68GTO]

The guy in front of the garage is the guy I bought it from. The guy I bought it from wondered aloud to me if it was a COPO several times over the years, the guy before him had no clue (at least he never mentioned it to me), everyone before that (we're now back to the late '70's) essentially said the same thing to me when they first understood what I was calling about "I wondered where that car went, did you know that was a factory 427 car?!" The best I can tell (this kinda amazes me), this car has never had anything but a 427 in it, ever.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Pure Fuggn Groooovy Man :wink:

Sure wasn't expecting to see any of my old Pontiac people to be on here posting up about a fresh find on a COPO when i recently signed up.

I'd rank this similar to finding a previously unknown 68 RamDeuce Firebird .


In one of these upcoming episodes tell us what kind of hardware is bolted together on that engine. Does it have rectangle port heads etc ...


Hey Boss , you bought any COPO or Yenko cars you need to come clean about ?
I know you'll buy a Chevrolet when the price is right. :blush:

[The Boss]

Sorry Todd, no COPO's, couple 1LE's and a few old Pontiacs. Nothing special. ;)

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

same old , same old over this way too.

i did try to influence a relative about the yella 69 copo project that is listed for sale on here, in Charlotte NC .
Think he just wants to grow old in peace and quiet.
to Hell with that :3gears:

[R68GTO]

Let’s get to that 2nd owner story so the title of this thread makes sense. Owner #5 gave me the name of the guy who used to race the car regularly (turned out to be the 2nd owner). He didn’t have a phone number but said the guy still ran a local business. I called that business looking for the guy. The kid on the other end said he never heard of that guy. I told him why I was calling, he said, “oh, I know who you're probably looking for!” He connected me with that guy (I’m keeping names out because I haven’t asked their permission yet). He told me it wasn’t his car, but was his best friend’s / drag racing buddy’s car and knew it well. I got the same “did you know that’s a factory 427 4 speed car?” statement. His buddy had passed away about 8 years ago. The guy I was speaking with actually painted the car shortly after his buddy bought it! In our conversation, I asked if he knew if the car had Camaro fender emblems when his buddy had it? He pretty quickly said yes. I asked how in the world he knew that so quick. He said cuz I have a picture of the car hanging above my desk! :cool2:He asked me if I could call him back around 5:30? He said that the 2nd owner’s son would be at his business then and I could then talk to both of them! Both guys are still drag racing today. :3gears:Of course, I called them back and we talked about an hour about the car. The son told me he clearly remembered when his Dad brought it home. Blue, dog dish hubcaps, no spoilers. He drove it on the street for a short time, then turned it into his drag car. The photo below is the one hanging above the guys desk. My first look at RAT’S NEST! :worship: The son still has his Dad’s racing helmet (painted to match the car) hanging in his garage!

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

.. everyone before that (we're now back to the late '70's) essentially said the same thing to me when they first understood what I was calling about "I wondered where that car went, did you know that was a factory 427 car?!"


I got the same “did you know that’s a factory 427 4 speed car?” statement.

Okay , i see what you did there. Not quite the same .
:hmmm:
oh no
no
No F'n Way !
say what ?
omg
:faint:

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Rats Nest race car is Wicked and Wild
now its a bona-fide bull fighter !

... but Red
whats this about 427 - 4 speed

typo ?

or is hate about to take on a new dimension here :p

[R68GTO]

Owner #6 bought it as a roller, no engine or trans. He owned a 69 Camaro convertible with an automatic. He wanted a 4 speed in his vert, so he swapped the pedals and related stuff into his convertible and put the auto stuff in this car. This swap took place in the late '70's I think.
Rat's Nest is an original 4 speed car - 2nd owner's racing partner said it had a rock crusher in it when his buddy bought it with around 1,000 miles on the odometer. They raced it that way. At one point they trashed the tranny - had Doug Nash rebuild it with stronger internals is the story they gave me.

[Mr70]

Owner #6 changed the radiator back in the late 70's. Said he pulled it out of a 68 Camaro big block. I'm not yet sure what the radiator is out of....my research says it's a service replacement????
Cowl hood is original and date stamped to line up with the car build date. Normal sway bar, 120 mph speedo. Pic below shows ZL2 hole occupied by the original wiring harness and grommet.


Radiator #3017838 originally came on only:
*1968 & 1969 Novas with TH400.
*1970 Novas 396 with Auto Trans.
*1969 Camaros with TH400,but not when Heavy Duty cooling or Air Conditioning was ordered.

[markinnaples]

Awesome, just stinking awesome. Congratulations.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

..Rat's Nest is an original 4 speed car - 2nd owner's racing partner said it had a rock crusher in it when his buddy bought it with around 1,000 miles on the odometer.

Damn
so you go out and find a Clean Solid Shiny low mile COPO with Peachy original interior thats been garage kept for at least the past 35 years.
Still has some form of 427 in it , running and driving , street legal.
You wanted a 4spd car but compromising on an Automatic.

The owner cant convince himself that it has hardly any chance of being a COPO , so you likely get a pretty handsome deal.
And thats all really sweet stuff.

Then its LeMans Blue, double bonus
Then its Faktry 4 speed possibly M22, quadruple bonus

We've been posting alongside on PY/Ames Pontiac Forum for many years,
so don't take this too personal,
but i'm going to need to hate you for at least 24 hours-maybe 48.

yep Congratulations
Damn

[R68GTO]

We've been posting alongside on PY/Ames Pontiac Forum for many years,
so don't take this too personal,
but i'm going to need to hate you for at least 24 hours-maybe 48.

LOL, not a problem, my Pontiac Brutha! I'm sure if I post something over on the PY site, I'll get "flamed" for buying a "Crapmaro" as some like to say over there.

I do kinda feel like I hit the "car guy lottery" with this one. I am a Pontiac guy mostly but have always liked all makes/models - really just a car guy, no politics, BS, etc.
I'm not going to try to make this car into something it's not, it's far from being a "survivor" / "numbers matching" or any of those other terms people like to throw out there to talk a car up. Having said that, it does have some great attributes beyond the COPO status which I will post about along the way on this thread. I'm sure I'll make some mistakes along the way since I'm still learning, but I hope the knowledgeable people on this site :youguysrock:will help me out when that happens.

[R68GTO]

Aside from what I already posted, here's some other info on the car.
Body: Original body panels date stamped to line up with build date. I can't find a date stamp on driver's fender. I can't read the date stamp on the trunk lid.
Quarter gills & wheel opening trim added by owner #6 when he painted it its current black/gold stripe paint scheme. Owner #7 added the drip rail moulding. Owner #2 added the spoilers.

Interior: Original interior (including carpet) except for dash pad. Owner #7 replaced the pad (bought at GM dealership) when he removed the pedestal tach that was bolted through it.

Engine: VIN stamped 427 "942" block cast in October of 1965. Owner #6 rebuilt it to L88 specs with hyd. lifters. Said he pulled it out of an Impala SS. 840 heads, 163 intake, List 4295 GM Holley carb (factory original, not a reman). Aftermarket distributor (Accel) and alternator (Powermaster).

Transmission: CM Turbo 400 built with a reverse manual valve body by owner #6. I think this codes out to a motorhome trans!:headbang: Should have a M22 Rockcrusher according to owner #2.

Rear end: original multi-leaf setup with vintage Lakewood traction bars & driveshaft loop. PE (so close, but yet so far!) code 10 bolt posi. Owner #8 (the guy I bought the car from) didn't like the 4.10 unit so he swapped a guy for this rear. Keep in mind, this guy drove the car a total of 3,500 miles in 35 years! Why on earth would you feel compelled to swap out the rear for drivability:no:! I do have a lead on where it went, but it's a weak lead, we'll see.
Here's some photos of seats and door panels. Enjoy!

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Made it through the 48 hour LeMans Blue 4spd COPO hate period.

Engine sounds like a worthy keeper. Congratulations
That interior stuff is NICE !
Sorry about the axle deal. Those things sure have some proud prices on them. Good Luck

Rats Nest was a semi-popular nickname.
Found a few others -
69 Camaro X22 - Missouri - Brent396 owns it now
68 Nova COPO - Missouri
Mid 50's Vette

And saw where Black with Gold stripes was the original 69 Camaro ZL-1 pilot/proto paint scheme.


Keep the updates rolling
You and the Dynamic Duo found in Cali have the front center stage

[R68GTO]

Rats Nest was a semi-popular nickname.

Yeah, but do they have the legit evidence to back it up?:haha:

And saw where Black with Gold stripes was the original 69 Camaro ZL-1 pilot/proto paint scheme.

Now why did you have to tell me that? I am already confused enough on what to do with the car....return it to 1972 Rat's Nest trim, restore back to original, sell it, and now ZL-1 pilot clone!:confused2:

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

LoL
the audacity of some little tiny mouse sneaking into the big bad rat nest !
they just wanted to be a rock star for a little while


I dont know all its heritage - if it has a Big Time winning record local legend on the track - i'd maybe go with Race trim.

If it had a chrysler transmission and a ford rear axle with tubs - i'd go back with Race trim.

Just personally - i'd want a LeMans Blue 4spd COPO first and foremost.
with a rear spoiler, white stripes, and 427 Call-Outs
probably a personalized license plate COPO-427
real low profile and everything. :wink:

True story on that Black/Gold pilot/proto deal - report is they did 2 of them.
No sin rocking that scheme while getting all the pedals back in place and sourcing at least some type of 12bolt axle.

OR

have just the stripes masked/sprayed over in white.
Black /White stripes is really my favorite combo all in all.
Might get less of the " hey thats so&so's old Black/Gold Camaro you're driving aint it "

[bbbentley]

[I]And saw where Black with Gold stripes was the original 69 Camaro ZL-1 pilot/proto paint scheme.
Now why did you have to tell me that? I am already confused enough on what to do with the car... sell it, ...!:confused2:

THAT option above is only viable if I am known in the equation as “buyer”?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

pfffft
that car wouldnt bring enough to pay somebody to mow the lawn !

Quit getting Bentley's hopes up :bs:

[R68GTO]

Here's some more photos from prior owners...
Black/gold paint is from owner #7 in the early 1980's. This was taken shortly after he acquired the car. He had not yet added the drip rail trim or removed the big tach on the dash.
The guy washing the car is owner #5. He added the keystones.
The last photo is from owner #2 with the car on his trailer. This would have been 1971/72, prior to accumulating the all speed part stickers

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

So lucky with these previous owners and their pictures/stories.

Like those Keystones.
Thats what most guys in my area were running on 69 Camaros back in the 70's-80's-90's.

This is my favorite non-stock Keystone look.

http://www.yenko.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=118146&stc=1&d=1529608796

[R68GTO]

Honestly, I'm not a big fan of Keystone Classics, but those pictures you posted BVZ are just Bad A$$!

[69LM1]

I am a fan of the Keystones!

/Rich

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

After highschool a friend had a Red/White/White 69 Camaro Vert.
Keystones with white letter tires almost that wide - similar stance etc...
Car was a dead solid P@ssy Magnet / Sex Pistol with a hair trigger.

It was all we could do to keep from hating that sumvabich. :mad:

Car looked like a Valentine Card on steroids , laced with Aqua Velva and English Leather.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

.. but those pictures ...
Now i know why that was plural , only posted 1 picture there.
Turns out just about every picture i have posted on here so far is double posting onto threads. lol

My user settings don't display pics when i'm logged in.
Came on w/o logging in and saw the mess.

Will try to prevent it , going forward.
sorry for all that

[ZLP955]

Great story, love the suspense as the story builds.....
And that car with the Keystones looks just perfect.

[NorCam]

Just read this thread and gotta say congrats on the find. Since the entire drive line is MIA, IMO it would make a great throwback car to it's earlier life and the semi original paint scheme. Restore it back as a 427 street machine with these colors. It's totally deserving of that. Or sell it to me and I'll do that. :biggthumpup:

https://www.yenko.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117855&stc=1&d=1529097735

[Copo_Cartel]

You have a great car I love that history especially watching it do what it was made to do congratulations on your find and the future with the car can’t wait to see the car

[R68GTO]

Thanks guys! I had a great day today.....my brother and I took the car to the home of the 2nd owner's son so he could see the car again for the first time since around 1974. The guy that painted the car red/white/blue was also there today - those two still hang out and race together nearly 45 years later.
I flipped him the keys and told them to go have fun with just two rules....don't blow it up or wreck it......other than that, go have fun! We spent a couple of hours together and I learned some more interesting stuff on the car's history. I'll post some more tomorrow when I have time to download some pics.

[69LM1]

That's awesome to see someone's face light up when they get to see their old battlewagon again. You probably gave him a great memory. Stand up thing to do considering these cars value today.

/Rich

[R68GTO]

You should have seen his mother's face when we rolled up in her driveway! She was there the day they picked the car up. She took her husband to get the car in her 69 Z28 (Cortez/black stripes). She said her husband complained when they got home that he couldn't keep up with her in her Z because he couldn't get any traction with those skinny 14" tires!
She originally thought the car we were in was her old Z, when her son told her it was the blue car, she about fell over.

[R68GTO]

One of the first questions the 2nd owner's son had after we arrived was "is there a dent in the floor pan under the back seat on the drivers side? When I told him there was, he proceeded to tell me that his Dad blew a driveshaft during a run and it hit the floor pan so hard that it dislodged the rear seat from the bracket on the driver side.
I was also able to confirm that they had added the engine torques bracket to the front subframe. I assumed a piece of chain was used between the bracket and the engine, but was told that they used a piece of flat stock instead of chain. I guess I need to ditch the chain I added and make a piece of flat stock!
Below is a photo of the 2nd owner's son holding his Dad's helmet that was painted to match the car & photos of the same guy with the guy that painted the car back in 1971. Just a note on the year.....while going through some other photos they had of the car just out of paint, the Kodak paper on the back has a 5/70. Now I'm wondering if it wasn't 1970 when the car was painted? I'll do a separate post about the scrap book he loaned to me.....lots of cool stuff in there too.:cool2:
One of these days I'll figure out how to get these photos rotated correctly:frown:

[The Boss]

The cars are cool but it's the stories we get with them that are great!

[R68GTO]

As part of the scrap book, there was a pencil tracing from the photo that I posted earlier in this thread of RAT'S NEST leaving the starting line. I asked them what that tracing was done for? The son stated that he gave that to the tombstone-maker to have that image of the car engraved on his tombstone (2006 timeframe)! He asked if we could take the car out to the cemetery, which of course, we did. This car obviously was a big part of their family even though it was sold almost 34 years earlier!
As BOSS stated in the above post, it's the story that is the coolest. I just feel great having given this family a way to reminisce about their husband/father/friend that obviously meant a lot to them.
It is a little surreal that this car I bought to clone into an RS-Z28 has turned out to be a COPO that an image of it is engraved on a headstone in southern Ohio.

[The Boss]

Damn!

[mockingbird812]

Great story!:headbang:

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Man that is some extra-extra wild stuff .
Tombstone is well done and over-the-top awesome.

These COPO's must have some kind of gypsy magic in them.

When i was doing a lot of previous reading in the archives of this COPO section , there was another "lucky unknown find" story where a woman had previously owned it for a couple of decades.

She died gradually with cancer, and having her 69 Camaro on her tombstone was one of her requests. And it was done.

Car was originally 4spd Orange/Orange Dogbite.
Had been painted Black with some mild custom accents in mid 70's.

[carnut4life]

Hi R68GTO,

Kinda freaky how many similarities our cars and stories have in common. Glad to hear you're you having lucky tracking down it's history and meeting previous owners, that's always my favorite part of having a old car. Congratulations, Chad

[R68GTO]

In the late 1960's, the 2nd owner campaigned an L79 Nova post car. Here's a scan of one of the scrapbook pages with some photos. The top photo shows him in the far lane at the US Nationals going up against Grumpy's Toy. According to his racing partner, his buddy had the jump on Jenkins but broke a valve spring during the run and ultimately got beat as this photo shows.
The smaller photo in the upper left shows my car's 2nd owner checking out his new race car....if you look closely you can see the signature chrome dual opposed snorkel L79 air cleaner.

[R68GTO]

Hi R68GTO,

Kinda freaky how many similarities our cars and stories have in common. Glad to hear you're you having lucky tracking down it's history and meeting previous owners, that's always my favorite part of having a old car. Congratulations, Chad

Chad, your post prompted me to re-read your car's story.....wow, there are quite a few similarities. Maybe someday I'll find out who my car's OO was, although it doesn't sound like he had it very long.
Jim

[carnut4life]

I sure hope you do Jim, I love hearing about and reading stories like this. Best of luck, Chad

[67BelAir427]

Great story and research on owner history ! I have a question, and I am in no way attempting to dampen the spirit or be critical in any way. The difference between the price you paid and the actual value of the car on the day you took delivery, I assume is not a small amount ? There was a landmark court case here in Canada where a sale was reversed because the purchaser was slightly more knowledgable than the seller . The amount was less than $5000 . Seeing as we all have had our "great score" stories, but few have been as fortunate to have one as spectacular as yours, I just wondered if you were at all concerned that the seller might have remorse and want it back ? Or ask you for more money ? With our litigation prone society and the internet I just wondered if it was a concern?

[big gear head]

I noticed that you got a curved neck radiator for it.

[R68GTO]

Great story and research on owner history ! I have a question, and I am in no way attempting to dampen the spirit or be critical in any way. The difference between the price you paid and the actual value of the car on the day you took delivery, I assume is not a small amount ? There was a landmark court case here in Canada where a sale was reversed because the purchaser was slightly more knowledgable than the seller . The amount was less than $5000 . Seeing as we all have had our "great score" stories, but few have been as fortunate to have one as spectacular as yours, I just wondered if you were at all concerned that the seller might have remorse and want it back ? Or ask you for more money ? With our litigation prone society and the internet I just wondered if it was a concern?

It's not a concern of mine for a couple of reasons....1) I myself was not sure what the car was when I bought it. 2) the owner openly discussed with me the possibility of it being a COPO car several times over the years including the day I bought it. Several years prior, he had a "local expert" check it out for that very reason and was told it was not. He had ample opportunity to get on the internet and do some homework.
I know the guy and like him very much, and will likely pay him a visit if/when I sell the car - if my investment total is significantly lower than the selling price. Tough to do these days.....as the saying goes "ya know how to make a small fortune selling collector cars? Start with a large fortune!"

[cook_dw]

There was a landmark court case here in Canada where a sale was reversed because the purchaser was slightly more knowledgable than the seller . The amount was less than $5000 . Seeing as we all have had our "great score" stories, but few have been as fortunate to have one as spectacular as yours, I just wondered if you were at all concerned that the seller might have remorse and want it back ? Or ask you for more money ? With our litigation prone society and the internet I just wondered if it was a concern?



Are you serious..??.. That is one of the dumbest court cases I have heard of in a while.. Shame on the seller for not doing their homework.. He agreed to the selling price originally. Suck it up buttercup and learn from your life lesson. What is this world coming to..


Now in the case of this car like I have seen with others in the past local to me if a car was purchased cheap and then flipped for considerably more money MOST people with a conscious will go back to the previous seller and give a little "kickback".

[Tracker1]

Are you serious..??.. That is one of the dumbest court cases I have heard of in a while.. Shame on the seller for not doing their homework.. He agreed to the selling price originally. Suck it up buttercup and learn from your life lesson. What is this world coming to..


Now in the case of this car like I have seen with others in the past local to me if a car was purchased cheap and then flipped for considerably more money MOST people with a conscious will go back to the previous seller and give a little "kickback".

Agreed.

[iluv69s]

Agreed.

I disagree... sounds good in theory, but I believe that very few would do that.

Jmho

[bergy]

I have negotiated an agreement with the seller for a future additional payment if I am able to document a rare car. I think that it's a good idea if you are paying a "maybe" price for a rare car. I've actually paid out on the agreement in the past.


To be honest, I really hate those stories of buyers who know for certain that a car is rare and valuable and proceed to rip off widows and other sellers who are not knowledgeable. However, I believe that it is fair to offer $50k for a car that has a future worth of $150k if the buyer is faced with a $100k restoration bill! Many people don't understand how expensive these restorations are - especially if rare parts are missing or damaged.

[67BelAir427]

I have negotiated an agreement with the seller for a future additional payment if I am able to document a rare car. I think that it's a good idea if you are paying a "maybe" price for a rare car. I've actually paid out on the agreement in the past.


To be honest, I really hate those stories of buyers who know for certain that a car is rare and valuable and proceed to rip off widows and other sellers who are not knowledgeable. However, I believe that it is fair to offer $50k for a car that has a future worth of $150k if the buyer is faced with a $100k restoration bill! Many people don't understand how expensive these restorations are - especially if rare parts are missing or damaged.

Well said, I totally agree. The flip side of the " score of the century" should never be someone elses's loss. You should be commended for your honesty.

[Copo_Cartel]

It was great seeing this car at the supercar reunion this weekend .

[PeteLeathersac]

'

Here's a few old newspaper ads that may help w/ clues or more leads to follow.
The first 427 car in the 3'rd ad sounds promising also is the same car under the below Bryant ad but w/ more details.
May be worth asking the painter guy if anything rings a bell w/ him including AM/FM?
Congrats also kudos for your efforts and well deserved success so far!
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[PeteLeathersac]

'

:beers:
~ Pete

.

[PeteLeathersac]

'

:beers:

,

[PeteLeathersac]

'

Bottom of this 02/70 ad is the same Ph.# and car but last time offered, perhaps sold soon after?:hmmm:
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[R68GTO]

Thanks for posting those ads Pete! The car's interior is all original except dash pad (replaced in early '80's due to tach mounting holes) and still retains its original am radio so those ads do not line up. The timing is about right as the 2nd owner bought the car in the spring of '70. OO only had the car about 6 months.

[PeteLeathersac]

'

I took another look and found this interesting Bryant Chev used car ad!
427 + 4-Spd. + Dealer location all fit perfectly but not the SS thing, emblem added or ad mistake?
Sorry if I missed this above but what does the painter pal know of where and what he paid?
Tough to see your tag build date too, please clarify as it can help w/ timelines/subject possibilities.
Keep rockin'!
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[R68GTO]

The 2nd owner purchase story initially came from the racing partner and was later repeated by the 2nd owner's wife in a separate conversation.
She was with her husband at Ault & James speed shop (Dayton, OH) picking up parts for his A990 factory lightweight hemi engine when this "college kid" walks in and says has a 427 Camaro for sale. The kid said he couldn't deal with the manual steering and 4 speed. They essentially made the deal on the spot and picked it up a few days later.
I've never asked her the month or time of year, was more focused on trying to get her to remember the college kid's name. Good idea though, I'll update if I get anything.
Car is an 09D build - official production date of 9/26/69. One of the scrapbook photos of the car shortly after it was painted had a "5/70" printed on the back of the photo. I'm not sure how photo paper was produced/used back then or if it is even a date stamp. Paper might have been made in May of 70, but the photo may not have been developed until months later? Dunno.

[Copo_Cartel]

Awesome

[Mr70]

Inked on dates on the back of,or on the front of old photos were the date the photo was developed at the store/lab.

[R68GTO]

Here's the photo I was referring to. As you can see, the car is just out of the paint shop. There are leaves on the trees which tells me it's sometime between April and October timeframe. The 5/70 is in the lower left of the back of the photo.

[R68GTO]

It's been a few months since I last posted info on Rat's Nest. Since my last post I've met a lot of great people in the hobby (thanks included below) including a few other Ohio COPO owners - first class people!
Much to my wife's dismay, I've been gathering parts for the car with a goal of bringing it back to how it looked in the early 1970's as an SS/D drag car. I did sell my GTO convertible that I owned for 12 years which made her more agreeable toward my part collecting:grin: As I stated in post 37, I'm not going to try to make this car something it's not so I'm being transparent with y'all so down the road sometime when the car changes hands, it's all documented as to how it got there.

Key pcs. I've sourced thus far:
1969 dated M22 with original GM gears from Dennis V. (DLV4540). Hurst SuperShifter was a facebook find and is the same model as the 2nd owner's racing partner told me he ran in the car back in the day.

Correct dated 4346 carb. Thanks to Eric Jackson of Vintage Musclecar Parts who played a big part in making it run right!

Correct dated BE rear. Many thanks to Frank Arone for being willing to part with this very nice piece! Frank was kind enough to have multi-leaf perches professionally welded on as part of the deal.

Correct dated curve neck from (wrench). It has all original core, tanks, & header plates. Just missing the tag.

bbbentley, aside from being a great "technical consultant" he has provided me many smaller, but correct and important items including survivor valve covers, 621 bellhousing, vintage Hurst roll control, fender braces, booster check valve, ww squirters and other great items.

I also picked up a Lakewood scatter shield & vintage slots to go with my SS/D goal - car still has the original drive shaft loop and traction bars from 1970/71.
So that's the main stuff for my winter project - get it back to a 4 speed with a 4.10 :headbang:12 bolt!

I'm open to opinions on this as I'm not quite sure what to do yet. As you know from my prior posts, the car is 15K+ original miles - the engine compartment (firewall & inner fenders) need to be repainted due to the gloss black applied in the late 1970's. My question is around the core support, crossmember, suspension, brake components, etc., and underside of the car. Should I restore or just clean/de-rust and leave it as-is to maintain the original finishes to preserve that low mileage look?

[mockingbird812]

Looking real good. I like the direction you are taking it. Keep going! :smile:

BTW, not sure if you can receive my pms. I need an update on feedback from Bob A. at MCACN on yr COPO. Doug and I need to finish up planning. You can pm. Or email [email protected] if you like.

Thanks!

[bbbentley]

Someone close to you, Jim, and a well respected authority on restoration that I would recommend is Mike DeAngelo (m22mike). He did Grady’s COPO. I wish I could get him interested in finishing my car? But anything he recommends is how I think you should proceed. Just ask if he is willing to give technical advice.

[JBALL]

Jim,

Great progress! Let's make sure your car gets a spot at the Pumpkin Run next year. Sorry I missed you and Mike.

[DW31S]

Awesome story and awesome car. I have a somewhat similar car and story and I, too, will be making a transformation back to the "Summer of '69".....even the paint schemes are/were alike. Please allow us to follow your build via pictures and posts. Can't wait to see this one through....

[markinnaples]

Love the direction of your build. I'm not remotely an expert, but to give you an opinion on your question above, if it were me, I would "just clean/de-rust and leave it as-is to maintain the original finishes to preserve that low mileage look" as you stated.

Best of luck.

[cook_dw]

Paint and letter it back like it was in the photo above (05/70). It has racing history and I will walk past 100 restored to factory spec Camaros to look at a vintage racer.

[R68GTO]

Took the car for a spin yesterday to run some fuel out of the tank. Began the teardown today.I have three main missions:
1) swap out the turbo 400 for an M22 which is what the car was built with according to the 2nd owner's racing partner. Also swap in the BE rear I got from Frank.
2) eliminate the gloss black the 6th owner sprayed all over the firewall, core support & inner fenders back in 1978 when he painted the car its current black/gold
3) clean up the underside including suspension, brakes, subframe, floorpans, etc.

I am going to attempt to preserve the original finishes rather than restoring since it's a low mile car. We'll see what it looks like when I start cleaning. So far it's all coming apart like a low mile car that's never been stored outside. I'm finding a few mismatched fasteners so I'm keeping a list and will likely be asking y'all a bunch of questions on head markings, finishes, etc.
I am fairly certain I found faded remnants of the "427" grease pencil writing on the driver side front fender extension - tried to get a pic but it didn't show well. I'll see what I can get once I get the fender off.
I added a shot of the front spoiler sticker - this spoiler was put on in 1970 by the 2nd owner! Car is a no spoiler car. In between disassembly activities, I have been working on "fin straightening duty" on my curve neck radiator - good beer drinking activity:beers: Did you know there are about 18,960 fins in a curve neck? It will take a lot of beer to get this one done!:eek2:

[R68GTO]

A trip to MCACN yesterday "super-charged" my motivation to keep going on my project so I went back at it today. I posted a few questions over in the preservation forum so I don't clog this thread up. Here's a couple of shots of where I'm at with the teardown as well as the underside of the cowl panel showing the original Lemans Blue overspray. The original foam dividers are still in place and you can see where a few exterior gauges were once mounted - holes were welded shut by the guy who painted the car in 1978/79. I'm not sure what gauges were mounted there, but am assuming a fuel pressure gauge - what else would have been typical back in the day? I think the tach was mounted on top of the dash. Also posted a shot of the cowl VIN stamping - not sure if I posted it before or not.

[R68GTO]

Did some more teardown and made a quick attempt at cleaning some of the frame and undercarriage areas. In general, the vertical surfaces have a good amount of original paint, but the horizontal surfaces have most of the paint gone. Here are a few pictures....

[R68GTO]

Also found a couple of "week" stamps on the firewall and cowl - both stamped "38" which are the same week as one of my rear quarters. The top sides of the suspension where the gloss black was not sprayed, seem to have most all their original finishes intact. Any thoughts, tips, or suggestions on direction are welcome!

[mockingbird812]

That is some good archaeology there! Keep it up!!:laugh:

[R68GTO]

The original inner fenders cleaned up pretty nicely with only a couple of spots of surface rust. Original flaps are decent, just coated with that damn gloss black paint:mad: Also found a couple of gems....positive battery cable had this melted portion wrapped with about 1/4" thick section of electrical tape. Also found a chunk of fan belt down inside the lower cowl area on the driver side....wonder how that got there:confused2:

[R68GTO]

Dropped the gas tank and pulled the drivetrain this weekend. My "clean bay" is filling up! Factory overspray on the trunk pan is seeing the light of day for the first time since it left Norwood. Also discovered the PO sprayed the gloss black over the cowl flapper relay and the wiring gutter! Looks like factory finish underneath in those areas. If y'all see anything that is not correct, let me know so I can address it during the resto......still learning:smile:

[bbbentley]

I see something wrong...it’s not sitting at my place :tongue:

[R68GTO]

Took the interior out today...found some more interesting stuff, at least to me. PO stated original carpet yet so I was able to check it out more closely with it out of the car. It looks to me like the front is original, but the back was replaced. Tag on the back has what looks like a date code of 8 8 79, which times out about right for when the car was done in its black/gold scheme. The backing looks different from the front as well. Found some chalk writing on the front carpet....anyone see that type of thing before? PO hacked up the front carpet pretty bad when he put the auto in so it won't be saved.

[R68GTO]

Now have all the interior trim out except for headliner related stuff. Good view of original color on the top of the rear quarter widow panel area, as well as factory primer/overspray details on the interior areas. Found some white tags with a "week code?" printed on them. Anyone know why the factory needed those?These were still in good shape though the printing is a little faded. Rear interior panels and watersheds are pretty "minty" yet. With the interior out, was able to remove the driveshaft loop.....a little cleaning revealed the Lakewood sticker:headbang: Also a good view of the primer color on the floorpan.....unfortunately, the PO went crazy with trunk spatter on the whole interior floor pan - guess he thought it was a good idea in 1979?:dunno:

[R68GTO]

Worked on cleaning the underside of the trunk pan today where the fuel tank used to reside. It cleaned up really nice....found a couple of stamps, one on each side of the centerline of the car. Assume date stamps but can't read them.
Also started cleaning up my buckets seats. I thought they were pretty clean to start with, but it took a while to cut through God only knows how many layers of Armor All. Used Magic Eraser which worked pretty well....it doesn't show as well in pictures as in person, but the RH one is cleaned, the LH is not. Also added a couple of shots of the headrest...still amazed how well-preserved these parts are:biggthumpup: Also included a pic of my speedometer cable. Anyone familiar with this marking? I need to figure out if it's original to the car or not.

[R68GTO]

Found some more cool stuff today on the car....fuel tank date code of 5 70, horns are dated 9H3 - which I think is 3rd week of August 1969. Also did more work cleaning up the floor pans, they are really cleaning up nicely - it's going to be a tough decision to restore these or not. Included a shot of where the Lakewood drive shaft loop was installed - not much doubt it was installed very early in the car's life, there was no dirt in that area!

[R68GTO]

Great way to start the new year - I've been following the new Philly COPO find thread (Fast67VelleN20) on this site and saw DW31S's post about joining a Facebook site dedicated to vintage drag racing. So yesterday I joined a 60's-70's drag racing group and posted a pic of my car. When I woke up this morning I saw two new vintage racing photos of my car were posted:headbang:
Looks like both were taken at Edgewater, the poster said they were taken in 1973. A different poster said he knew Doug Davis was an entry at the US National in 1972 & 1973.:biggthumpup:

[olredalert]

----Seriously cool pics. The 69 Chevelle in the backround appears to be getting serious air!......Bill S

[Postsedan]

----Seriously cool pics. The 69 Chevelle in the backround appears to be getting serious air!......Bill S

Indeed.....this will be us after the Ribs :)

Dan

[Postsedan]

What a wonderful New Years gift to wake up to!

Love the pictures....is now your game plan to restore and letter her up, just as she was back in 1973?
I would :)

Dan

[R68GTO]

Planning to paint it back to Lemans Blue and use vinyl to do the red, white & graphics. Add race stickers on top of the vinyl. The guy that painted it back in 1970/71 said he used a color called "Ice Blue" for the base which is quite a bit lighter than the Lemans Blue (2nd photo really shows that) but I can't see going through all that restoration work and not painting it the correct color.

[Copo_Cartel]

Get it ready for some track time at SCR22 :burnout:

[Copo_Cartel]

Great to see the progress

[Postsedan]

I agree....go back to the original color....and sticker her up just as she was.....you could easy duplicate everything with today`s Vinyl Wraps.

Dan

[R68GTO]

I have yet to research high quality vinyl vendors....if anyone has a good reference, let me know.
Mostly worked on the floor pans again today. In the process removed the fuel line and clips. I believe the fuel line is not original, but it looks like the frame clips are? Can anyone confirm? Also have a question on the floor pan finish. A lot of restorations have black floorpans with body colored overspray. I'm not really finding that. Mostly a gray/blue primer with some body color overspray. Found some areas with black primer and even a little reddish primer. Car was painted twice after it left Norwood so who knows for sure, but the pans sure don't look like they've been messed with except for maybe the very outer edges from post-factory overspray - definitely seems to be some black from 1978. BTW...check out the Hurst Super Shifter floorpan mod....it's almost as nice as the factory torch-job!
Thoughts and opinions needed!

[jer]

As far as the bottomside paint, you really have to clean and do a little archeological analysis, which I think you're doing a fine job of. Use your best judgement when it comes to back logging the layers of paint.
The fuel line clips, they're oem. They should have a bluish color once you clean them. Looks they're in survivor condition
Nice ride and thanx for the ride-along!!

[R68GTO]

More floorpan work done this weekend. Added a couple of shots showing an area (rear trunk pan) representing what the underside looked like before I touched it, then after a heat gun/plastic scraper, then wiping with mineral spirits. Once I get most of the underside through these steps, I'll go back through it all with some "KrudKutter" degreaser which will clean it up a little further. Couple things I noticed was that the reinforcement plates on the trunk pan (rear seat area) was mostly black primer under the crud whereas the insides of the rear frame rails were mostly that bluish/grey primer. The horizontal surface of the trunk pan is more whitish primer with some body color overspray on the ribs that face toward the outside of the car. Also included a shot of the outside edge of the trunk pan that hangs below the rear frame rail - it really got a strong shot of body color overspray. I'm anxious to get back out there and see why the outside of the rear frame rail looks like!

[R68GTO]

Another day of scraping - went after the outer frame rail on the driver side. Couple of pics showing the progress from start to cleaned. That area got a direct shot of LB also. You can really see how the frame rail caused the gradual fading of the LB on the side of the trunk pan. Also took some acetone to the top of the firewall just to see the original LB below that gloss black - yep, there it is! And finally, I think I found a "factory error" from the assembly line. The driver side rear quarter window track mounting stud has never had a nut applied to it. There are no marks in the primer on the inner panel and the stud is equally rusted throughout. The other side by contrast has a glob of "dum-dum" over the entire stud/nut - at least I am assuming there is a nut under there!:hmmm:

[Kurt S]

That the original speedo cable.

[R68GTO]

Thanks for responding and confirming Kurt, I appreciate it. Learning something every day on this car!

[R68GTO]

Did some cleanup work on the front subframe and suspension today. Passenger side is what it looked like before cleaning, driver side after degreasing. Found a few paint dabs on the suspension. Looks like all my hard brake lines and clips are original. Lower brake hoses have been replaced as have the calipers and ball joints. Splash shields look original and I took a shot of where the firewall blackout never made it from the overhang on the cowl. Took the homemade engine torque bracket off the subframe for the first time in about 48 years. They stacked the washers up on one side so the bolt didn't hit the lower a-arm. BB engine stands are original.

[R68GTO]

Did a little "laundry" this weekend. I thought my seat belts were pretty clean to start with but it took two cycles of soaking in a bucket of dishwashing soap/hot water, scrubbing with a bristle brush to get them clean. After the 1st cycle, the water was black, after the 2nd cycle it just had a hint of grey. Did a final rinse and hang to dry! Tags came out like new:biggthumpup: I was surprised to see some tags yellow, some white. The yellow ones were on the buckle assembly for the shoulder belts. All the other floor-mounted belts had white tags. Still need to check my roof-mounted shoulder belts.

[Copo_Cartel]

You have a great winter time project going. Thanks for sharing your progress .

[BigD69]

Are you in need of an original 427 fuel line? I also have a real good vinyl graphics guy I use to restore old race cars. Im not sure where your located, Im in Central Ohio.

[R68GTO]

Sounds like you're somebody I need to talk to....sent you a PM!

[Martin]

Great thread, thanks for posting the pics of all the little details you are coming across, I find it all very interesting & educational

[R68GTO]

Did some work on my fuel tank this weekend. My ambitions to save it are not as good as they once were...we'll see where it ends up. Anyway found some interesting stuff for the guys that care about some details.
I'll start with some pics before I tore into it. Below photos show sending unit wire routing, tape size/method, adhesive application, and jute pad. I'm not sure I understand the purpose of the jute pad especially when it's under the sending unit wire? I believe all this stuff to assembly line original. If anyone sees something that indicates otherwise, please chime in.

[69LM1]

I have seen the same pad under several tanks I have removed over the years. Don't have any input as to why either.

/R

[R68GTO]

Here's some more photos of the sending unit wire with a part number(?), o-ring seal, and sending unit itself. When I removed the tank from the car, there was "loose stuff" rattling around inside. Pulled these four critters out.....non-metallic - look like chunks of galvanize coating? Kinda weird...maybe were laying in there before the two halves of the tank were assembled together?

[R68GTO]

Here's some more details on the tape that held the ground wire to the rubber isolator on the 3/8" fuel line as well as the isolator and it's position on the line. Also started stripping some of the junk off the tank. Found overspray remnants of the "ice blue" that was the base color for the Rat's Nest paint scheme in 1970/71:biggthumpup:

[R68GTO]

More work on the tank today - more "ice blue" overspray is evident from the "Rat's Nest" paint scheme. Removing layers of crud revealed the original stencil! The stencil is dead center L-R on the tank, with the Wheeling Pitt logo right below where the recess starts to angle up. It is much easier to read in person than what shows in the photos, but I did the best I could for you guys. Last photo was my quick attempt to recreate the letter/numbers with some photo-shop work. I could not make out what was under the "1969" but in person you can definitely tell something is there. If anyone has seen this version before and have more details of the stencil, please let me know as I will eventually recreate it on the car as part of the resto.

[69LM1]

That's cool, hav'nt seen that before.
R

[R68GTO]

Did some work stripping down the hardware off my header panel and lower valence. Both pieces are in perfect condition with no signs of dent repair or rust. Both pieces show the original Lemans Blue paint under the fastener clips. As always, if you see something not original or correct, please help me out.

[ZLP955]

Nice detail capturing there, thanks!

[R68GTO]

Another update on my progress......sunk my driveshaft in some evaporust and found the original painted stripes. I have no idea if this shaft is original to my car and would assume it is not due to the drivetrain swap over the years, but it's an original GM shaft. Also included some shots of the body stripped down. Very pleased with the lack of "surprises". Original panels are very nice and straight with just some minor work having been performed on the rear quarters back in the late '70's.

[bbbentley]

Talk about your clean virgin sheet metal! Nice! Looks great Jim. Do you ever sleep?

[ZLP955]

Looks great, nice and solid!

[cook_dw]

Great progress. Don’t remember reading it but have you decided on the paint scheme?

[R68GTO]

It will be restored to Lemans Blue. Plan to use vinyl to do the Rat's Nest thing.

[KnoxvillePig]

Very Nice!! Thanks for posting progress pics!! It was great talking with you this AM.

[cook_dw]

Very smart move on using vinyl wrap. Best of both worlds.

[R68GTO]

Worked on my original 9204 brake booster this week. Goal was to get it ready to ship out for re-plating. Of course it had a large amount of the gloss black paint on it so I went to town on it with some citrus stripper. It took 3 or 4 cycles of stripper and scraping with a plastic putty knife but it all came off exposing the original plating. Included a pic of the pedal connector and RBW pin as it also looks to be the original unit.

[R68GTO]

It's been a little while since I posted an update....been busier than a cat covering $hit these days!
I found a correctly dated 512 4 bolt main block and a matching set of 291 casting heads. Block is dated Sept. 8, 1969 and the heads are Sept. 11, 1969 so about 2 weeks before the build date of the car. The long block is built to stock spec.s with all the correct internals and was broke in on a stand. It will be a while before it lands in the subframe.

Went to a swap meet this weekend and met up with the son of the 2nd owner (Rat's Nest creator) again. He shared with me a story about the car's M22 biting the dust during one of the runs BITD. His Dad sent it to Doug Nash for a rebuild. Doug found the input shaft had a slight twist to it so that was replaced. When it was time to pay for the rebuild, his Dad was tight on money so he paid for the rebuild by giving Doug Nash his son's (guy I'm talking to) train set! Apparently Doug Nash was a model train collector in addition to an transmission guru!

Picked up a set of 1969 license plates at the swap meet, thought the MN suffix was appropriate:grin:

Spent some time today working on my 3.5" Fenton Gyros that will end up on the car. They're in pretty good shape with just a couple of nicks on wheel. I have more polishing to do, but am pleased with how it's coming out:biggthumpup:

[ZLP955]

Very cool plate! And the engine and wheels look great too - nice work.

[big gear head]

That's some great work that you are doing. I'm guessing it won't be ready for SCR22. Maybe you can have it at SCR23? Are you going to come this year anyway?

[R68GTO]

Thanks Freddie. I'm hoping to finish the car up this winter so it is ready for SCR23. I'm still on the fence if I'm going to make it this year or not, definitely would like to since it was so much fun last year.

[big gear head]

I think there are going to be some first timers there this year. Should be a good show again.

[R68GTO]

Started to clean up my BE rear today. Found some paint marks on the housing....curious if these are typical? Horizontal white line with runs on the top and a white "6"(?) on the bottom side of the passenger side of the gear housing. Bottom of the gear housing has what looks like (3) wide yellow stripes. All the paint marks look like they are applied to the bare casting. Black paint is on top of both the yellow and white marks.

[big gear head]

Would the black paint have been applied at the factory or was that done by a previous owner?

Are you going to leave the rear end assembled or are you going to rebuild it?

[R68GTO]

My understanding is that the axle manufacturer would have painted the unit black prior to shipping to GM.....experts please chime in on this one. In my stripping process, the paint application on this rear seems to be (from recent to oldest):
1) semi-gloss black
2) chevy orange (side facing rear of car only)
3) semi-gloss black
4) yellow/white paint marks
5) bare steel

Layer 1 came off pretty easily, while layer 3 is adhered pretty good to the hsg. so I'm assuming this is the layer applied by the manufacturer.
My gut feel is to have someone go through it to replace bearings/seals, set backlash, etc. though just my uneducated eye says it all looks basically new now. Any advice is welcome.

Someone (can't remember who at the moment - Frank A. maybe) told me this particular rear was in a 57 chevy in the Columbus and originally came out of a burnished brown Frost Chevrolet RS COPO that had been wrecked BITD.

[big gear head]

Where are you located? You don't have your location listed in your details.

[R68GTO]

Located in Minster, Ohio. Just updated my user details.

[R68GTO]

Pinion yoke - is it correct? Some research I've done says the u-joint should be held in by straps and bolts instead of u-bolts? Found some more paint dabs on the ends of the axles, white in the center and 3 orange dots on the flange. Anyone see that before? I ask because the rear side of this housing was painted orange so don't want to duplicate if it was part of that paint job.
Also curious what the "58" represents above the cast date tag on the housing. Anyone know?

[big gear head]

The way I understand it the high HP cars got the larger yoke for the 1330 U joint and used U bolts instead of straps.

[R68GTO]

Bare, naked BE!

[big gear head]

Please don't take anything out of that rear end without measuring backlash and doing a pattern check on it first. Once you remove parts it's too late to do this and you will have no idea how to set it up again. Also, please do not put punch marks on the left bearing cap and only put one mark on the right cap. Those punch marks can make the cap weak and the left cap carries more of a load than the right one. If the factory paint marks are still on the caps then there is no need to put punch marks on either cap, and even if the caps get mixed up you can still figure out where they go by measuring the bore size.

It looks like that housing is in great shape. Those tubes look like they are free of rust pits and the spring perches look like they haven't been bent or torn from abuse.

[big gear head]

Does this rear end have the 1330 yoke with U bolts?

[R68GTO]

Spring perches are not original to the rear, Frank A. had his guy weld them on as part of the deal when I bought it. Housing and tubes are in fantastic shape with almost 0 pitting. It does not have the correct yoke...William over on CRG says that it should be the larger yoke (3954393) with straps/bolts instead of u-bolts.

[R68GTO]

Stopped to visit the car. Bodywork and initial panel alignment is coming along well. Currently waiting on my hood hinges to get back from resto so the hood can be aligned/fit. Original cowl hood was near perfect - zero rust. They will be protecting/retaining all the factory original interior overspray including the little paper tag on the inside of the door frames and rear panel inners. They will have to blend a little LB on the jamb side of the door inners where the PO sprayed some black.

[enio45]

any possibility of getting a pic of the rear axle tube stamping pls?

[ZLP955]

Looks great!

[R68GTO]

Eddie, here's a pic of of the stamp on my axle.

[Copo_Cartel]

I have the same date in my Copo

[enio45]

Thank you for the pic.....much appreciated

Is it correct that the BE rears, the casting dates would be relative close to the stamp date.

I looked at one recently and the casting was B28 and the stamp was BE 0608 -

[R68GTO]

I'll let others with more knowledge speak to what is "normal" relative to cast date vs stamp date. My housing was cast the last couple of days of April so about 9 weeks apart.

[Flying Undertaker]

Pinion yoke - is it correct? Some research I've done says the u-joint should be held in by straps and bolts instead of u-bolts? Found some more paint dabs on the ends of the axles, white in the center and 3 orange dots on the flange. Anyone see that before? I ask because the rear side of this housing was painted orange so don't want to duplicate if it was part of that paint job.
Also curious what the "58" represents above the cast date tag on the housing. Anyone know?

R68GTO: You are correct that the u-joints were held by straps & bolts for the '69 model year rears. The rear of the axle housing painted orange and the orange dots on the axle flange were done later by an owner as the dots are holes in the rear brake drums, (rear drums were probably painted orange also). Don.

[R68GTO]

Started working on the wiper motor today among other things. Anyone tell me how to decode this tag? Seems to be an original foil tag that is on the wiper motor housing. Covered in black paint...used some acetone to get to the printing.

[R68GTO]

According to NCRS, 9/26/69 is the day my car was built. It was a Friday back then.....probably why they missed the window track mounting nut on the rear drivers side qtr window:smirk:
Here's a shot in her birthday suit along with a couple of shots just playing around with the engine mockup. Whatcha think.....Stock or Super Stock?:smile:

[markinnaples]

Wow, body and engine look great.

[big gear head]

Nice to see some new progress pictures. Those white headers look great. I wish I had the nerve to do that with mine.

[R68GTO]

My brother and I worked on my 4 speed pedal setup today and got it re-assembled for the most part. I think it turned out pretty nice - all original pcs. except the pedal pads - those are repro. Question for the experts....would my X44 car have originally had any pedal trim on the parking brake, clutch, or brake pads?

[KnoxvillePig]

Awesome progress Buddy!! Loving the updates.

[William]

Question for the experts....would my X44 car have originally had any pedal trim on the parking brake, clutch, or brake pads?

X44 did not affect interior trim level or badging. Bright pedal trim was included with Z23 Special Interior Group along with the assist handle and panel plus additional woodgrain trim. Z87 Custom Interior included Z23.

The car does not have the handle on the passenger side of the dash so it should not have the bright pedal trim.

[R68GTO]

Thanks William....another day, another learning moment!

[William]

True!

[R68GTO]

Went to visit the car today....more progress. Panels back on to work on gaps.

[big gear head]

So are you doing a zebra theme on this one? :grin:

Nice to see it moving forward.

[ZLP955]

Panel gaps and alignment look very nice, particularly at the cowl area..... great progress

[R68GTO]

Thanks Tim. Starting with a low mile, unhit, GM sheetmetal car makes the process much easier.

[Copo_Cartel]

Great progress. Thanks for the update. :biggthumpup: Original Sheetmetal makes a world of difference.

[m22mike]

Ditto on the panel gaps, someone knows what there doing :biggthumpup:


Mike

[PeteLeathersac]

'

Awesome updates, looking forward to more!
I like the primer paint too, very Messerschmitt 262'ish.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[R68GTO]

Blocking is mostly complete, just a few minor tweaks needed on the gaps yet, but they look very nice. Won't be long and I'll have the subframe in my garage to work on restoring it back to the factory fresh condition.
Keeping my full transparency theme I've had from the beginning on this adventure...car is an original no spoiler car so I'm having them paint both the spoiler equipped deckled that was on the car when I bought it (NOS GM unit from the late '70's) and an original no weld tab deckled I sourced this year. I also sourced a second wiper panel (orig. GM) in addition to the original one so I could mount some Day 2 gauges like were on it in the early '70's when it ran as an SS/D car.
Also added a closeup pic of the trim tag that I took today. I've been overly obsessive in my communication to the shop doing the bodywork that they cannot "f" up the trim tag because everyone "freaks out" if they see something weird. So heres a pic before they touch it just in case they "f" it up.

[ZLP955]

Looks great, won't be long before the LB starts going on! And good planning with the deck lid and cowl panel.

[69LM1]

Nice, great following up on updates on this car.
/R

[R68GTO]

Received my parts back from Steve Gregori @ BrakeBooster.com - they turned out awesome! Booster (before/after pics) and related components are original to the car. Booster is a 9204 dated the 199th day. The ZL2 / horn relay covers and turn signal housings are also original to the car. ZL2 coil bracket is an original piece from Bentley B. Steve also did my hood hinges and latch components - also turned out great.

[69z2x4]

Nice work..Looks awesome!

[Mr70]

Steve is really a great asset to our hobby.

[ZLP955]

Steve's work on those parts looks outstanding, as always.

[R68GTO]

Picked up my subframe and rear end today. Another step in the process! Took a pic of the rear mounting hole for the subframe showing original floor pan color and remnants of the sealing tape Fisher Body used for their water test. The shop will get the body on a rotisserie and get to work on the floor pans. Dents from a driveshaft explosion and the Hurst Super Shifter mods need fixed. I'll start stripping the subframe and documenting all the various paint daubs as I find them.

[R68GTO]

Started tearing down the subframe over the last few days. Brake lines and stands are original pcs. The flex lines from the stands to the calipers were replaced in '97 if you go by the date on the hoses. Calipers, springs, ball joints, and sway bar links were also changed. Everything else on the subframe is original stuff including 2 pc. rotors brake shields, caliper mtg brackets and steering components. I do not have a picture of the car that shows it without traction bars. Took one snubber off (other one is still stuck) and it shows a date code of 1971 so I'm guessing they've been with the car since then.

[R68GTO]

More stripping/cleaning of the suspension today. Found some "ice blue" overspray from the 1970 paint job on several of the steering linkage/brake components so that confirms to me these items are likely original to the car. Also was able to find a few inspection paint dabs that I can replicate later. Found orange, blue, white, yellow, and pink in various places. Anyone else find something similar on their cars?
Glass beaded one of my disc brake dust shields. You can see where the original AD sticker was applied. It cleaned up nice......any opinions on if I should just reinstall or get them re-plated?

[32KZ]

Your getting this deep into it,,I'd have them redone.
Steve G did mine. Look real purty ��

Just got my hood hinges/springs, release back from him a week or so ago. Nice guy who does great work.But better call quick...

Love these build threads, know that excitement.

[R68GTO]

Got the manual steering box mostly cleaned up today - dated June 12. Also found what I believe to be an interesting assembly line thing. The bolts that hold the two-piece rotor together were different from one side of the car to the other.

[32KZ]

Ref#189
Found my pic of the finished dustshields,,disreguard my steering box bolt markings,,old habit.

[R68GTO]

Finally wrapped up my radiator fin project. I think my needle nose hit every one of the 18,000+ fins on this critter:headbang: Original core just had a few pin holes that needed repaired. It was a good project to pick away at while I waited for the compressor to cool down or some paint to dry. Here's some before/after pics....

[big gear head]

Looks great.

[32KZ]

Wow! Nice job��
Straightened mine using toothpicks, was a little leary of the needle nose. Only leaks,after pressure testing were a few pinholes around the solder joint, top hose.

Looking good.

[32KZ]

Great job��

Used toothpicks for mine, was a little leary of needle nose. Gotta laugh, cause yea...tedious. Then you flip it over for the otherside. I lucked out and only found a few pinhole leaks around the solder, top hose.

Never leaked all the years it was in the car, but worth the time pressure checking prior to reassembly . If not,,guess how that turns out.

[ZLP955]

Looks awesome, nice job!

[R68GTO]

Got my front subframe back from a "bake" and bead blast session today. Turned out really nice and clean. Frame is in great shape with only minor pitting in a few places. Car should be getting some color on it in a few weeks. Won't be long and I can turn the ratchet the other direction and start putting this thing back together!:biggthumpup:

[NorCam]

It's looking really good. I always love the look of a freshly restored subframe when it's all going back together. Painting or powder coating the subframe? Body is looking close to having color.

[KevinW]

Started working on the wiper motor today among other things. Anyone tell me how to decode this tag? Seems to be an original foil tag that is on the wiper motor housing. Covered in black paint...used some acetone to get to the printing.

I have been enjoying reading up on this find and built, very interesting! While I cannot offer any COPO specific I do have some knowledge on wiper motors :)

So the foil labels started coming out sometime in early 69. Prior to that part numbers were stamped on the motor end plate.

The top line is the part number 20043206 looks like a Buick Apollo or similar.
bottom line is Julian date 309 (beginning of Nov), single digit is the year (I guess 1976)
Last item 5A is a line or plant code.

For a non-RS car you want to find a 5045572 labeled motor. Luck!

[R68GTO]

It's looking really good. I always love the look of a freshly restored subframe when it's all going back together. Painting or powder coating the subframe? Body is looking close to having color.

Going to paint the frame. Was afraid that powder coating would fill the "forming marks" on the frame. Same goes for the A-arms.

[R68GTO]

Finally got the BE rear painted and back together. Still need to mount up the brake lines. The yellow stripes on the bottom of the differential were found when stripping the paint as were the white inspection drips and number. I also saw those similar yellow stripes on a 9,000 mile unrestored COPO from Columbus at GoodGuys last summer. I changed the white number from a "6" to a "3" during resto as my car's assembly sequence was "3". Can't say for sure that's what the 6 was for, but I went with it.

[Copo_Cartel]

Jim...thank you for sharing your build. We are all anxious to see your progress.

[mockingbird812]

That there is a beautiful rear end!!!!!

[cook_dw]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/Shjan97TyUJY4/giphy.gif

[R68GTO]

Found a couple more "toddler" photos from back in the day (71-72 timeframe) at Edgewater. I think the Daily's we're from Dayton and were big Mopar guys that ran some factory light-weight hemi cars in the area.
Posted on Facebook, now adding here. Still searching for a "baby" photo!

[69z2x4]

Jerry and Ray Daily from Dayton had some of the fastest hemi cars around. It was something to see back in the day with COPO's and Hemi car going at it in SS/D and A and B/MP.

[R68GTO]

Finally in a phase of doing more tightening than loosening:smile: Restored my original cowl induction frame and flapper. Started putting the front subframe back together. Car should get painted later next week, going to stop in and check it out in a few days before they shoot it.

[R68GTO]

Went to visit the car today and took some pics of some previously unseen areas. One important part of the mission was to document the hidden VIN's on the car so for you guys that are keeping track, there's a few shots for you - BTW they both match the dash VIN plate:biggthumpup:. Also included a pic of the trim tag after a rag and lacquer thinner took several heavy layers of paint off. Removed the original package tray for the first time since the guys at Norwood put it in - nice shot of original body color underneath. Floors are pretty well stripped down to good virgin metal. There's still a punch list of things to do yet before paint so it might be another week or so before she gets some party color on her.

[Mr70]

Nice photos,thanks for sharing this with us.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I haven't checked in to this site for a while.

Looks like the CopoCamaro has you completely under its spell now.
Glad it's turning out to be such a really clean body.
Great Work you are putting into it.

It's going to be an extremely righteous car :headbang:

[R68GTO]

Made some more progress today. Started cleaning up my original disc brake valve. It had remnants of "ice blue" paint that was applied in 1970. Dated 155th day of '69. Also finished up the rear end by mounting the leaf springs - pretty happy with how that all turned out. Cleaned up my original parking brake cable hook - any idea if this was originally natural metal or phosphate? Guy I met at a local car show told me he had an original jack assembly from his car sitting on a shelf. Now it's going to be part of this car, it cleaned up really nice!

[R68GTO]

Well, got the front subframe pretty much completed today. Let me know if you see anything wrong, now's the time to fix it. Most everything you see is original to the car including brake lines/clips, all steering components, 2 pc. rotors. Ball joints, and bushings replaced with OE quality stuff. Brake calipers are originals and dated correct, just not original to this car. Natural metal stuff is all cleaned and coated in Baoshield.

[big gear head]

I don't know enough about it to know if it's correct or not, but it sure looks good!

[JKZ27]

This is really looking nice, Jim. Thanks for sharing!

[69LM1]

I agree with BGH, not a purist but looks good. Especially with mostly original stuff.

/Rich

[32KZ]

Looks beautiful!

Can't tell, but if you didn't "blue" your draglink: Brownells Oxpho-blue. Very simple to do, a little goes a long way, and adds a nice touch to welds on driveshaft.

I also thought it brought back a nice raw cast finish to the yokes, opinions probably vary on that.

I believe engine frame mounts more of a gloss, double check, I'm at work, notes at home.

Very enjoyable thread.

[Tracker1]

Nice work!

Yenko member Edgemontvillage is doing one of the most definitive restorations on a '69 Camaro ever, over on Team Camaro - this is page 23 where he gets into the blue-ing process for drag-links. Following anything he is doing is a good call for your resto.

https://www.camaros.net/forums/133-build-projects/337897-1969-camaro-rs-z-28-brooklyn-project-23.html

[R68GTO]

Thanks for the comments guys. I actually had the engine stands painted a 60% gloss originally and thought they looked too shiny so I re-painted them. Maybe they should be closer to 45% instead of 30% like the subframe?
I've seen Loyd's thread and you are correct, that is an "over the top" resto! I'm not saying the drag link shouldn't be that dark gray finish, I'm just wondering then should the outer tie rod pcs. that hook to them also be that way? I'm assuming same supplier would have used the same process on all those parts?

[R68GTO]

I did a little more archeology on the car tonight now that I'm getting into some of the trim pcs. The 4 corner marker lights are shown in the pic below. The two on the bottom are the rears, the two on the top are the fronts. The fronts have the "ice blue" overspray from the 1970 paint job. The rears were covered in trunk spatter from when the car got painted black in 1978. I started to clean the trunk spatter off and "lo and behold" red paint!??:confused2: I called the guy that painted the car back in 1970 to ask if the rear tail panel was painted red back then. He didn't think so but wasn't sure. As I'm talking to him, I'm looking at some of the photos the 2nd owner's son gave me. I had never noticed it before, but there it was, one pic showed a red tail panel! That pic also shows the trunk lid sans spoiler and where the paint line was between the blue and white. In the conversation, the painter told me that he might still have the old paint cans in his shop - wouldn't that be cool! He said the three colors he used were "ice blue pearl metallic, silver mist pearl white, and candy apple red.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Sort of has the old Sox&Martin race team look in that picture.

[ZLP955]

Very cool carchaeology!

[R68GTO]

Weekend Update: Worked on some more small bolt on parts today. Floor pan plugs all dated H37 - same as some of the other sheetmetal on the car. ZL-2 throttle arm cleaned up good as did the rear axle snubbers and brackets. Kind of a weird group of stamping marks on the snubber brackets - more pronounced on one bracket vs the other. All these parts and original bolts will go back on the car.

[jbtech]

Wow! Very Cool!

[R68GTO]

underside got some color this week. Most of you will recognize the photos taped to the firewall....I told the shop to duplicate the color and overspray patterns of Grady's car as I really liked how that one turned out and it was very close to what I found when I hand-stripped mine. Should get body paint next week.

[scuncio]

That is one heck of a nice restoration....wow.

[R68GTO]

Got some parts back from the plater so I went to work correcting some of the brake line clips per Lloyd's suggestion and also "gun-blued" the drag link per 32KZ's suggestion. Also buttoned up the brake hoses going to the calipers. Started disassembling the steering column, documenting a few of the date codes along the way. Also got back my Hurst 3138 shifter parts - just need to put it back together:biggthumpup:

[R68GTO]

Some more detail stuff.....Cleaned up the door hinge bolts and strikers, uncovered the original LB paint on them. Original floor pan plugs have been re-finished, and got the shifter reassembled. Many thanks to Eric D. (Crash) on this site for posting the YouTube video on shifter re-assembly! Also dunked the original parking brake assembly in evaporust and shot it with Boeshield. The black paint has a few scratches but decided to leave it original.

[ZLP955]

Those parts turned out great! Do you have a link to Crash's YouTube shifter rebuild video?

[scuncio]

Nice work. What type of plating did you use on the shifter?

[R68GTO]

Silver zinc is what they told me they used.

[R68GTO]

Those parts turned out great! Do you have a link to Crash's YouTube shifter rebuild video?


https://youtu.be/tNN10cxa9yg

[R68GTO]

More detail stuff. Restored the original rag joint, before/after pics, pretty happy with the results.

[m22mike]

WOW, great looking rag joint.

[clnovaparts]

The floor drain plates look great. Is that finish actual spangle galvanize?

[R68GTO]

Fresh Lemans Blue is a sharp color. We're getting there....

[ZLP955]

Awesome! What paint system did you go with?

[R68GTO]

The floor drain plates look great. Is that finish actual spangle galvanize?

No. The cost to get the real spangle galv was prohibitive for such a part that is rarely seen once installed. My brother came up with a home-grown method to reproduce the look. Took a few trials but happy with the result.

[Copo_Cartel]

Jim the other short block that I have is cast dated G 9 9 with T0911 on the front pad

[R68GTO]

So the racing partner of the guy that raced my car BITD had told me that the original engine was sold to a local guy who put it in his "pulling tractor". I was finally able to track the guy down (Tom P.), he now lives in Texas. Here's the engine story he relayed to me:
Doug had rebuilt the engine with an 1/8" overbore to sell to another guy. That guy never came through with the money so he bought the engine off Doug. It was a 427 with 4 bolt mains. He then put a tunnel ram and 2x4's on it and dropped it in his pulling tractor. Ran it for two seasons - it was a great running motor....Doug had a reputation as being a great engine builder, particularly Chevys. Tom then sold his pulling tractor with the engine in it to a guy who lived in Georgetown. The guy took the tractor to his first pull in Eaton, Ohio. Tom was their also and watched the guy make his first run with it. On the 1st run, the guy started in the wrong gear (he was a rookie). When he mashed the throttle the engine revved to 9,200 rpm and came apart throwing a couple of rods out the side of the block.
With that said, Tom told me that he wasn't positive that 427 was out of Doug's car. He knew he bought an engine out of Doug's car, but he thought it was a DZ 302 out of his Lemans Blue Z28. Doug's wife had a Z28, but it was Cortez silver, so who knows if this story is about my original motor or not, but thought I would share it here.
Tom also told me that Doug was a very good drag racer. He never used the clutch with that Rockcrusher, shifting under WOT the whole way.

[R68GTO]

In the late 1960's, the 2nd owner campaigned an L79 Nova post car. Here's a scan of one of the scrapbook pages with some photos. The top photo shows him in the far lane at the US Nationals going up against Grumpy's Toy. According to his racing partner, his buddy had the jump on Jenkins but broke a valve spring during the run and ultimately got beat as this photo shows.
The smaller photo in the upper left shows my car's 2nd owner checking out his new race car....if you look closely you can see the signature chrome dual opposed snorkel L79 air cleaner.

Visited Rick Wilkin this week. Rick is the guy that painted Rat's Nest back in 1970. I brought him a 1968 Bell helmet I bought off Ebay. Rick is going to paint it up just like the helmet he painted in 1970 for his buddy Doug using the original helmet as a pattern. He told me the story of this L79...Rick was working at Mattson Chevrolet in Hillsboro in the mid-60's. Rick ordered this car (lower RH in photo) for his friend Doug Davis (2nd owner of my car) strictly for racing. Marina blue, L79 4 speed, 3.73:1 rear, rubber floor mats and no options - didn't think it even came with a radio. Told his boss to not figure on prepping the car as it was going straight to the strip. Got a heads up on the delivery date so he drove his 1959 1 ton Chevy flatbed to work that day. The L79 was backed off the transporter truck and drove up on his flatbed using 2x12 wood ramps in the dealer parking lot.
I was born 15 years too late.......just love these stories!

[R68GTO]

Back to topic.....Rick and I spent some time talking about the paint he used on Rat's Nest BITD. He was not able to locate any leftover paint in his shop like I discussed in an earlier post about the tail panel color. He did go to an old file cabinet and pull out this color card booklet by MetalFlake Corporation. He opened it up and showed me the exact paint colors used on the car. He said he painted the whole car with the white base, then did the entire car in silver mist pearl, taped off and sprayed the Iced Blue pearl, taped off and sprayed the Fire Red candy apple. All in lacquer, then topped with several coats of clear. We talked quite a bit about how all the photos show the silver as very "white". He said that Doug did not like how some of the white pearl paints had that goldish/tan cast to them so they went with the silver over a white base.
The Rat's Nest name was hand-applied by Tom Blackstone "Stoney" (deceased). The letters were gold leaf with a white outline.

[ZLP955]

That is awesome to be able to gather all the paint info direct from the original painter, and even more credit to him for having such a great memory!

[markinnaples]

Those metal flake paints are the same ones they used on my car, pretty cool to see the swatches, thanks.

[R68GTO]

cleaned up my original cage nuts that mount to the inner fenders. Interesting that 3 of the 12 were a slightly different style with a part number stamped on them. Went to work on my door latches - before/after pics that show original LB paint residue.

[Kurt S]

Interesting, those are not the J-clips that I normally expect. Most of the time, 69 NOR used square nuts, not hex nuts.

[enio45]

by the way - a short stent in evaporust helps with the orig finish come thru beautifully

[R68GTO]

Interesting, those are not the J-clips that I normally expect. Most of the time, 69 NOR used square nuts, not hex nuts.

I obviously can't guarantee they're original to the car.....I wonder if it's a late model year thing? Maybe some other owners of "last 3 month" cars will chime in.

[cook_dw]

These are the ones in Nuge’s 69 copo. 09E if I’m not mistaken.

[R68GTO]

Thanks Darrell, yes Nuge's COPO is 09E. It may not make a difference but the j nuts I posted were attached to the inner fender where it bolts to the wheel opening of the fender.