69 GTO Judge RA IV convertibles

[mrays]

I was looking through some old muscle car magazines I have from the 80's and came across two features of supposed 69 GTO Judge RA IV convertibles. One was Carousel Red and the other was Liberty Blue and they both had automatic transmissions. I'm not a Pontiac expert, but I believe there were only 5 Judge convertibles built in 69 with the RA IV and they were all 4 speeds. Is that correct? I know Milt Robson had a black one. Are there any others that are known?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Those articles were probably done before PMD released 69-Newer Invoices free of charge to the public via 1-800-PONTIAC .
They started doing that around 1986 or 87'ish .

You are right , Five 69 IV J-Verts , all were 4spd.
4 Orange , 1 Black
All are accounted for , 3 are in deep hibernation.

Steve Ames former owner of Ames Pontiac Parts has an Orange - then Milts former one in Triple-Black.
The only 2 that are public.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Just to add -
prior to PMD hooking us up with Invoices - there were a generally small number of supposed cars with feature articles that were fakes.

One that really shocked the hardest was a 70 Formula Ram IV car.
Turns out 0 were ever built .
Heartbreaker

When Mattison put PHS together and opened up the older Billing History Cards for 1968 - Older , 64-65 GTO's were running about half & half on cloned LeMans's for the first several years or so.

Restored Tri-Power 4spd cars were coming back as 4bbl Auto and 4bbl Manual on a regular basis also.

[old5.0]

The Liberty Blue car came out of Scott City Kansas, iirc. If its the one I'm thinking of there was some interesting backstory on it being round port powered, I believe.

[442w30]

The blue automatic car was in Guide to Muscle Cars magazine, I believe. Not a real RAIV car. I think it was from the Midwest.

In fact, I think there was a Carousel Red one in the same magazine, perhaps an older issue, and it may have even had a Dual-Gate tranny if I recall correctly.

As been pointed out, all of the 5 built were 4-speeds. That makes 40 4-speed and 14 automatic GTO ragtops that were not Judges.

[442w30]

I just remembered that in Musclecars magazine, there was a guy from Flemington, NJ who had a RAIV auto Judge ragtop with really low mileage, possibly in a drag test against other cars. I wonder what the true story of that car is?

[442w30]

4 Orange , 1 Black
All are accounted for , 3 are in deep hibernation.

Baron, do we know for a fact there were 4 in Carousel Red? Someone asked me if it's documented or simply assumed.

And all are indeed accounted for? I only know of two but I'm not in-the-know.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Thats the gospel as we know it .
From within the inside loops.
Same original source as most all other accounts. (FS)

So far, after 30+ years of patience , no others have shown up for the party with documentation to contradict. But we all know there is always a slim chance of that possibly happening ... but so far , no.

Those other 3 are in DEEP recluse.
Haven't changed any hands for a loooonnggg time now.
At least 1 is still with original owner.

[mrays]

Yes, both cars I mentioned at the beginning of this thread were featured in Guide to Muscle Cars. The blue one was in the October '89 issue. It was owned by B. Tibbs at the time and had a blue bucket interior with a column shift. It also had 3.55's which I don't believe were available with the RA IV. Only 3.90's or 4.33's. The red one was in the August '87 issue. It was owned by T. Benko and had a black bucket interior with a console.

[njsteve]

I just remembered that in Musclecars magazine, there was a guy from Flemington, NJ who had a RAIV auto Judge ragtop with really low mileage, possibly in a drag test against other cars. I wonder what the true story of that car is?

I live in that town! Any more info. How long ago was that article?

[442w30]

It may even have been Ringoes. I'd guess early 1990s. I'm overseas currently so I can't look in my stash, but look out for a drag test among a few cars.

[PeteLeathersac]

'


Cool subject and thanks for sharing known details!
Were any of the '70 RA1V 'Verts Canadian delivered new?
:beers:
~ Pete


.

[cudino]

Five 69 IV J-Verts , all were 4spd.
4 Orange , 1 Black
All are accounted for , 3 are in deep hibernation.

Thats the gospel as we know it .
From within the inside loops.
Same original source as most all other accounts. (FS)


Hi Baron,

For the "FS" you are citing as the source of this info, are you referring to Fred S?

- Wade

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Yes
and i think it has also been cross-checked by you know who, too.

Its holding up so far , either way.

[cudino]

Yes
and i think it has also been cross-checked by you know who, too.

Its holding up so far , either way.
Yes, Fred has been contacted. As I understand he can vouch for the part about five RAIV ‘69 Judge Convertibles, and all being 4-speeds. But I’m sorry to say that No, as I understand he has no knowledge about what colors were used, whether all 5 are accounted for or not, or that 3 are in hibernation.

I have heard this 4 Carousel Red / 1 Black color breakdown mentioned before, but I have yet to hear the source of this info. I’m not saying this info is incorrect, it may be. Given the high percentage of Judges painted Carousel Red 4 out of 5 is certainly plausible. I’m just saying that I know of no factual basis for this breakdown, and that Fred has not made this statement, so I’m concerned this may have been an estimate that has grown legs over time.

As for known cars, I only know definitively about Milt’s Black one (which I own), and Steve Ames’ car which is Carousel Red. As for the other 3, the only other one I’ve heard anything about is Carousel Red with parchment interior that was drag raced, and I’ve heard it may have been owned by a member here on Yenko.net. If anyone has specific information they would be willing to share about the hibernating 3 cars I would be very excited to hear, if anything just to be confident about the color breakdown.

- Wade

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Yeh well you just keeping panning for that info Wade.
Good Luck to you

Invoices tell colors. btw

[PeteLeathersac]

'

So no Canadian delivered '70 RA1V 'Verts?
Hey Wade and great to see you're about!
:beers:
~ Pete


.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Cool subject and thanks for sharing known details!
Were any of the '70 RA1V 'Verts Canadian delivered new?


The only 70 Ram4 Convertible that i know for sure that sold new in Canada - is a GTO , non-Judge. There could be others.

White / Sandal / Sandal
Automatic on Column , Bench Seat , Pwr Windows , Povert Caps

Was a very popular car in the poncho community a few years back.
Been in the states for a while.

----

then there is an Automatic White IV Judge Vert that was painted Hugger Orange , that is/was in Canada , but forget which country it sold new in.