Musclecar prices and the possible recession

[Hotrodpaul]

Just curious what everyone's take is on the Coronavirus effect possibly pushing the US and China into a recession as the markets are reacting negatively. The oil markets this morning dropping nearly 25% as OPEC increases production. All this reduces comsumers disposable income and could impact the musclecar hobby, pushing prices lower. In know here in Houston the economy is tied to the oil industry and when oil drops into the $30 a barrel range, the big companies stop drilling and spending in the short term. This trend could continue for the rest of the year.

[markinnaples]

That's interesting. I wonder how that negative to the oil industry affects the general population since they now have more disposable income because they're not spending it on gas. My bank relies a lot on the oil industry (heavily focused in Louisiana and some in Texas) so it may affect our bottom line to some degree as well.

If you look at the numbers though, CV isn't nearly as detrimental to the world as several prior viruses such as SARS and Ebola. Will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

[Rumbleguts396]

Agree it’s going to be interesting how it all plays out. Wall Street has been taking it on the chin. Let’s see when it truly starts to hit Main Street. My 401k and retirement accounts have taken a hit. However I’m still currently working, so I don’t feel it in the my wallet yet. I had considered retiring this pass December and decided to plug along awhile longer. I am fortunate that I have paid sick time at work if it’s needed. Hopefully it won’t. There are plenty of people out there without paid sick time. That’s where it will become tricky. How many people can afford to stay home weeks at a time without a pay check. Scary stuff for sure. This is when it’s human nature to prioritize. Cars are a hobby. We will see. Let’s hope for the best, always need to plan for the worst. We will weather the storm. We always do. Rob

[Lee Stewart]

Saudi Arabia has gotten into a pissing match with Russia who refused to cut back on production. So SA has dropped the price of oil in an effort to gain back market share.

Saudis Instigate Oil-Price Clash With Russia

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/saudis-instigate-oil-price-clash-with-russia/ar-BB10TPsR?ocid=spartandhp

The Dow opened almost 1900 points down. This reflects the above and Italy putting tens of millions of people under lockdown in an effort to contain the virus

[Lee Stewart]

As far as muscle car prices . . . if things remain the same . . . what if they held an auction and no one showed up?

Today fear is running rampart. People are afraid to put themselves in large crowds. And that is exactly what an auction is.

Mecum's Glendale AZ auction starts two days from now. Let's see what happens.

[MosportGreen66]

As far as muscle car prices . . . if things remain the same . . . what if they held an auction and no one showed up?

Today fear is running rampart. People are afraid to put themselves in large crowds. And that is exactly what an auction is.

Mecum's Glendale AZ auction starts two days from now. Let's see what happens.

Warmer climates have not seen a spike in the virus, however...

[Lee Stewart]

Warmer climates have not seen a spike in the virus, however...

The general public is reacting to the virus in panic mode. Sales of Corona beer are down sharply yet it has nothing to do with the virus. It is simply because of the name of the beer. They are hearing that the % of deaths is higher than those from the yearly flu. If you look up the virus in AZ you see there are cases. 2 new ones in fact over the last two days.

All kinds of conferences, shows and gatherings are being canceled. There may actually be zero chance of anyone getting the virus at Mecum. But the public doesn't know this or is not willing to accept it.

[70 copo]

Warmer climates have not seen a spike in the virus, however...

That's because COVID-19 is killed by UV exposure in 2 seconds flat.

[70 copo]

The general public is reacting to the virus in panic mode. Sales of Corona beer are down sharply yet it has nothing to do with the virus. It is simply because of the name of the beer. They are hearing that the % of deaths is higher than those from the yearly flu. If you look up the virus in AZ you see there are cases. 2 new ones in fact over the last two days.

All kinds of conferences, shows and gatherings are being canceled. There may actually be zero chance of anyone getting the virus at Mecum. But the public doesn't know this or is not willing to accept it.

All Media driven at this point. When you are in a fight and you think you have hurt the other guy you keep hitting the guy in the same spot. The media delights these days in pushing the panic button and I have to give it to them they are pretty effective in stampeding people and pushing a narrative when they want to.

[markinnaples]

That's because COVID-19 is killed by UV exposure in 2 seconds flat.

Is that accurate?

[Mr70]

No,it's an internet rumor that has been floating around.
It's completely false.
Myth: Ultraviolet lamps kill the COVID-19 virus.
Fact: No, UV lamps do not sterilize hands or skins areas, and can actually cause irritation.
https://www.nationaljewish.org/patients-visitors/patient-info/important-updates/coronavirus-information-and-resources/about-coronavirus-covid-19/myths-and-facts

[Lee Stewart]

Health officials are recommending that you wash your hands for 30 seconds with soap and water. And wash them frequently.

You should only use hand sanitizer only if you do not have access to soap and water.

Avoid buffet lunch and dinner restaurants also.

[70 copo]

Is that accurate?

As reported by the media of course.:grin:

[marxjunk]

1 person in Kansas City area with a confirmed case..she has isolated herself so, she hasnt had contact with anyone..but who knows the truth..its all over the news..and of course no concrete facts, just the news creating havoc..the articlebelow doesnt match the news i am watching right now...so who knows

https://www.kshb.com/news/local-news/kansas-confirms-1st-coronavirus-case

[70 copo]

This about sums it up.:tongue:

[NorCam]

I'm still going to operate my business, still gonna drive my cars and still plan on riding my motorcycle through the Rockies again this summer. Oh, and I am well stocked on 9mm and .45 ACP in any eventuality that someone comes looking for my last roll of toilet paper. (Facts are, I will likely run out of toilet paper, but having lived for 54 years, I've pretty much learned how to wash my a$$ with soap and water)

As long as there's coffee to brew and air to breathe, I'm gonna go on living.

Nuff said!

[SS427]

Can someone with a health background explain something to me? The common flu kills 250,000 to 500,000 people worldwide and 36,000 people in the US annually. Pretty much every four years for the last 20 plus years we have had a major viral outbreak similar to this virus but it just seems this one they are going overboard with it. Why is this virus any different than any of the last 10 we have had and correct me if I am wrong, they are all pretty much similar in fatalities to the common flu or oddly enough even much less. I am beginning to believe this is just another way for the media to gain viewership and ratings. The last bad virus was the H1N1 virus and that 'only' killed 12,500 people in the US in a year which is 1/3 what the common flu kills every year. What am I missing here????

[the427king]

The difference between the flu and the virus is that the virus is looked upon by some as something that will get them their political results. More people died from the flu in the us today, than have been killed by the virus in total . Craziest part is people will pay 500.00 for clorox to combat the virus , but wont get a free flu shot to combat the flu .

[JoeC]

this is from an article on coronavirus

"the global case fatality rate for the coronavirus is believed to be about 3.4 percent"

“By comparison, seasonal flu generally kills far fewer than 1 percent of those infected,”

“You know, the risk is this: We have a brand-new virus in a completely naive population on Earth; we’re all susceptible to it. Everyone is potentially infectable with this virus,” said Christopher Mores, a global health professor at George Washington University. “Even with a high transmission rate and the low case fatality rate, that still becomes a massive number of ill and fatal cases.”

[Crush]

The oil/ gas adds to the hysteria. I woke up today to watch my net worth drop again because of all the fake news widespread loss of common sense. Sheesh may have to go get a job or sell some cars:hmmm:

[Lee Stewart]

The oil/ gas adds to the hysteria. I woke up today to watch my net worth drop again because of all the fake news widespread loss of common sense. Sheesh may have to go get a job or sell some cars:hmmm:

I wouldn't call Italy putting 16 million people under lockdown and Saudi Arabia dropping the price of a barrel of oil down to ~ $30 fake news.

The Dow is now down almost 2100 points.

[the427king]

"a completely naive population on Earth".............How true is this statement. It wasnt long ago that Hostess said they were stopping the production of twinkies,and they were being sold on ebay for thousands of dollars a box. People 70 years ago would have dealt with this alot better and smarter than the current population,I dont recall people here fighting over toilet paper and twinkies during WW2.

[the427king]

Sell your cars, buy oil futures. Then sell the oil in a few months ,double your money, and go buy your car back.

[Lee Stewart]

Unfortunately, due to social media most of the world suffers from "Lemming Syndrome."

Someone who blindly follows a crowd—maybe even toward catastrophe—is called a lemming.

[Lee Stewart]

Sell your cars, buy oil futures. Then sell the oil in a few months ,double your money, and go buy your car back.

Nah . . . sell cruise line and airline companies short. You won't have to wait a few months to make a killing. Maybe 3 or 4 days . . . if it's not already too late to do so.

The U.S. State Department is warning Americans against traveling on cruise ships due to concerns over coronavirus. In a tweet, the State Department said: “U.S. citizens, especially with underlying conditions, should not travel by cruise ship.

[Crush]

I wouldn't call Italy putting 16 million people under lockdown and Saudi Arabia dropping the price of a barrel of oil down to ~ $30 fake news.

The Dow is now down almost 2100 points.

My point is fake news drives panic and fear. The pace and frequency of “news” is like never before and that rhetoric creates a fake reality. It builds and builds this virus does not have people dropping like flies. Most deaths are folks that had underlying health issues. How many kids have died? Zero.

I like what Buffett said

“ We simply attempt to be fearful when others are greedy and to be greedy only when others are fearful.”

[Lee Stewart]

Cruise ship finally will dock in Florida today. All passengers (2500) will be tested. If you test positive you go into quarantine for 14 DAYS! And no . . . they will not put you up in a hotel.

[Lee Stewart]

I've had the flu a number of times. Lay in bed, snooze, eat chicken soup (only homemade) take some pills and lots of cough medicine/syrup.

But the last time I go it, it almost killed me. February 2016. Could not stop coughing, had trouble breathing so I drove myself to the hospital. Parked my car and started walking to the ER. Got halfway there when I ran out of breath and had to sit down on the tarmac. THANK GOD 2 ambulance drivers saw me. One rushed over and asked if I was OK while the other ran into the ER to grab a wheelchair. They got me in the wheelchair and I passed out.

1 hour later I woke up in Intensive care with a breathing tube down my throat, an oxygen mask on my face and 4 different drips going into the back of my hand. When they saw I had come to the removed the breathing tube and started feeding me Theraflu pills. I was on straight oxygen for 4 days. I could barely move any of my limbs let alone get out of bed.

I spent another 3 days there and was finally strong enough to walk up and down a 30 foot hallway 3X in a row. I also had to show them I could go to the bathroom by myself. The nurse hands me two containers . . . I ask what the second one is for . . . stool sample. "Lady I haven't eaten anything in 7 days! Forget about the stool sample." They had no idea that I was going to walk out to the parking lot, get in my car and drive home. I told them my son was coming to pick me up.

I had Oxygen delivered to my home and spent another week with one of those things that goes in your nose.

October 2016 I got a flu shot. And for 2017, 2018 and 2019. I will get one this October. No flu since then.

[69_Mean_Mopar]

I was having some pretty bad health issues a few months ago. I was having serious high blood pressure issues. My Sugar was high and out of wack. Among a few other things. I have been in strict doctors care since. I am doing great now. So I asked him what about this. He said it is overplayed hugely by the media. Remember also, It is an election year. There are over 30,000 deaths in The US this year from the flu. Not a word etc. Mostly older people with already bad health issues. I am over 60 and not worried. Muscle Cars are doing real good. Housing is still great in my area that there is not enough for sale. All I know is My Stock is strong and I am not talking about Wall Street. I am talking about my Garage. Been that way for years.

[SBR]

Sell your cars, buy oil futures. Then sell the oil in a few months ,double your money, and go buy your car back.

Agree, I will back up the truck on crude if it hits 25 per barrel.

[EZ Nova]

Posted on another site:

First 2 Coronavirus deaths recorded in Germany

WHO's Dr. Tedros says threat of pandemic has become "very real"

Confirmed cases near or pass 1,000 in France, Germany and Spain
US deaths hit 22

Canada reports first death in British Columbia

Germany state of Brandenburg has between 4k and 5k in home quarantine

Trump to meet with Wall Street CEOs Wednesday

South Korea imposes travel advisory, confirms another 96 cases; 3 new deaths (total: 54)

Hungary stops flights to and from Northern Italy

PM Johnsons says UK won't close parliament

Trump to hold WH meeting on fiscal stimulus

Italian PM promises "massive shock therapy" to save economy from coronavirus

Amazon asks employees in NY, NJ to work from home

Deutsche Bank cancels 150-year-anniversary celebrations

Dozens of flights leave northern Italy despite quarantine, even as airlines cancel routes

Moody's says US economy headed for recession

Cuomo confirms 142 new cases in New York State, bringing total confirmed in NYC to 19
NY has started making its own sanitizer

Columbia University cancels classes, Princeton moves lectures online
78 new public health labs open across US Monday

Spain PM says he will have 'emergency plan' to tackle outbreak

UK confirms another 45 cases

VP Pence will hold press conference at 5:30ET Monday

Amtrak shutters 'Acela Corridor'

Korean construction worker contracted by US military tests positive

Total number of cases jumps above 9,000 while deaths hit 463

'Grand Princess' docks in Oakland

Another cruise ship disaster might be shaping up in Fla.

Trump congratulates VP Pence via tweet

New cases in South Korea drop as Philippines case total doubles

EUCO President says conference call will be held to coordinate EU response

Germany and France finmins hold talks to discuss crisis

Missouri declares first "presumptive" positive Sunday night; father of patient breaks quarantine

Dutch infections climb to 321

And if you want some interesting reading, TRY THIS, says Corona Virus created in a lab in University of North Carolina in 2015 with a joint venture between China and USA with a Chinese DR. from Wuhan Province??

https://capitalisteric.wordpress.com/2020/03/08/coronavirus-blunt-truth/

[70 copo]

I wouldn't call Italy putting 16 million people under lockdown and Saudi Arabia dropping the price of a barrel of oil down to ~ $30 fake news.

The Dow is now down almost 2100 points.

It is not fake. It is the way it is being pitched to the public. It is called lying by omission.

Saudi’s and Russia are in a Petro dollar pissing match right now and Iran and the proxy war in Yemen is front and center. Every one knew this was coming when the talks broke down over the weekend.

[Charley Lillard]

"And if you want some interesting reading, TRY THIS, says Corona Virus created in a lab in University of North Carolina in 2015 with a joint venture between China and USA with a Chinese DR. from Wuhan Province??"


The way I read it they did not create it but discovered it.

[EZ Nova]

Charlie, the way I see it is 5th paragraph under AND NOW, states in the first line:

This virus was created at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, and they published the highlights of their creation in November 2015.

So it looks like UNC with China and Fort Detrick!!!!!!

[carnut4life]

I agree with most of the post here and feel this is a nothing but a big hail mary by the media who desperately don't want to see Trump get re-elected.

[mprice]

I agree any virus should be taken seriously but I think carnut4life has just summed it up very accurately.

[Vern B]

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nCoV/summary.html

I think it's generally agreed within the medical community that SARS, MERS, COVID19 and other corona viruses began from bats, passed on to animals, then to humans. Reports I saw from the CDC today said that also. If you read the above link above it says the same.

I think the concern with this one, as opposed to SARS, MERS or the common flu is the fact that this one is so much more easily transmitted from person to person. At this point the
Incidence of death is about 3% as opposed to flu being 1%, but the CDC expects it to fall to 1% long term.

One good thing is, it seems to have little serious effect on children and younger people in good health, hopefully it stays that way.

[Charley Lillard]

If it was just a anti Trump media thing you would not see Italy close it's borders etc. Let's leave politics out of this discussion.

[442w30]

Am I the only one who sees hysteria on this forum? :naughty:

[the427king]

"Let's leave politics out of this discussion."........WE can, but the media wont .
__________________

[carnut4life]

I'm only referring to it as it pertains to muscle cars and the possibility of a recession Charley, I have zero interest in getting into a political debate with anyone.

[JRC99]

I bet this ends up being exactly like Ebola in 2014. We heard about it non stop for a month, and then it was never in the news again.

[Bill Pritchard]

I bet this ends up being exactly like Ebola in 2014. We heard about it non stop for a month, and then it was never in the news again.

Let's all hope you are correct :biggthumpup:

[the427king]

H1N1 Pandemic in 2009,spread fast,killed people[ approx 545,000] and was soon gone. No hysteria,stock market collapse,and no media hype every day. I think its obvious as to why

[Billohio]

I have been dabbling in an oil fund called USO. It's an ETP, exchange traded product. It was down 25% yesterday to lowest it's been in several years. I think it closed in the 6.50 range yesterday. It's a way you can follow the market without having to pay what barrels of oil cost.
For the last couple weeks it has been down more than the stock market and really took it on the chin yesterday. When I first got in to it, the price was in the 10 to 11 range. Seems to have days it moves quite a bit

[Crush]

Market will make a nice come back today, be ready!

[SS427]

My whole point. This was this morning.

[442w30]

H1N1 Pandemic in 2009,spread fast,killed people[ approx 545,000] and was soon gone. No hysteria,stock market collapse,and no media hype every day. I think its obvious as to why

Why?

[Late BrakeU2]

I bet this ends up being exactly like Ebola in 2014. We heard about it non stop for a month, and then it was never in the news again.

Kung Flu rate of mortailty .5%

Ebola virus was 70%

The fact the Kung Flu is spreading worldwide tells you it's mild, where as Ebola never left the continent because it generally killed most folks who got it, regardless of age.

China is already through the peak of it, and getting back to producing I Phones.

As the weather gets warmer in the Northern Hemisphere, it's going to fade away.

Respective to muscle car valuations, i'd be more concerned with millenials not being in to cars in general than a virus.

Speaking of China and Kung Flu, anyone else just slightly curious to know why quite a few of the high ranking officials in Iran were the first to contract it outside of mainland China?

[EZ Nova]

Ok back to the musclecar market. Like everything thing else at this time, this market WILL take a hit and be down some. Will there be a 20% hit like some of the markets, don't know. I can see the average run-of-the-mill cars and not the cream of the crop stuff being down. Driver quality and others down as well.

AND HERE LIES THE PROBLEM. Parts are NOT going down! Body work prices are NOT going down! But with markets being down for the foreseeable future, the market will likely be hit. Now some may dump of their cars, but when a average 7/10 say late '70's F body (like 78-81 Trans am and Z28's) is going in the 20 range, makes it hard for a guy who has one that needs paint and some parts to get some decent $$$ for it.

I just finished a meeting with my financial guy, and what my stuff is down, NOT GOOD.

[x33rs]

I don't worry about it, I'm not selling anything.

[x33rs]

My whole point. This was this morning.

Ha, I was just going to post when I saw this.

They were just saying on the news this morning the regular flu has killed more people this year (as it does every year) than the Corona virus, yet we never hear about the regular flu in the news.

Kind of interesting how all this has blown out of proportion.

[Late BrakeU2]

Keepin it real..
https://ncov2019.live/data?fbclid=IwAR2_xYlM2OqhCATCqYpXyDBmw9FBp-nKCE-rELVu_I-V00ZLzlq_9h-3RvQ

[SBR]

Guys, do you think China and now Italy would go on lockdown for a flu bug? Do you think there would be mass school closings, trade shows, conferences, trips cancelled globally? I am 55 and have never heard of these types of measures taken. I hope this runs its course when it warms up.

As for the car market, they will take a hit just like everything else but over time the best examples will make new highs. My 2 cents :)

[70 copo]

Ease of spread and long live loiter time on surfaces is what makes it very different and difficult to control.

Otherwise it is the latest big Hoax for the media to exploit.

[Rumbleguts396]

I certainly don’t pretend to understand the severity of this situation. I do see the world’s financial markets on a rollercoaster ride. Not just the US. It’s happening across the globe. Don’t have an answer other than to take my Camaro for a ride after work. Nothing Fake about that. Rob

[the427king]

The only reason H1N1 pandemic and its 545,000 deaths was downplayed in 2009 was there was no wish on the medias part to blame or tarnish the then current president. Italy Im sure doesnt know something secret about the virus that nobody else does, they are just trying to prepare for the worst.

[Crush]

[QUOTE=SBR;1487802]Guys, do you think China and now Italy would go on lockdown for a flu bug? Do you think there would be mass school closings, trade shows, conferences, trips cancelled globally? I am 55 and have never heard of these types of measures taken. I hope this runs its course when it warms up.

If they renamed the flu the “millervirus” and hyped it from day one and created mass hysteria through every media channel, yes the world would be on lockdown. The reality is we have become accustomed to living with the flu. There is not one vaccine that will prevent these types of viruses and again the people who are and will always be the most vulnerable ie people with underlying health issues will unfortunately be impacted the most. My 89 year old mom takes extra logical precautions each year. Most years she has been fine in past years she caught “ something”.
We all need to relax, get educated, talk to people around you, take precautions as needed but live life!!

[Hotrodpaul]

I have not heard any news about the summer Olympics in Japan. I wonder if there will be spectators allowed? Maybe the spread will have died down by then.

[70 copo]

An example of responsible reporting. The facts as they are:

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/health-environment/article/3074469/coronavirus-south-korea-cuts-infection-rate-without

[SBR]

^^ Good link but I don't see people in the US wearing masks since there are none and there very limited amounts of testing kits too.
I do agree that the media is loving this.

[70 copo]

Our media would report as follows:

South Koreans struggle to contain COVID-19 outbreak still nearly 450 infections daily, Millions at risk.:rolleyes2:

[SBR]

^^ Sad but true.

[the427king]

There was a report out that" worst "case it could kill 50,000,000.....I'd like to see what data was used to come up with that number

[Lee Stewart]

These underlying conditions make coronavirus more severe, and they're surprisingly common

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/these-underlying-conditions-make-coronavirus-more-severe-and-theyre-surprisingly-common/ar-BB10ZdOC?ocid=spartandhp

[Billohio]

I was in the Orlando airport sunday night and saw 4 people with masks. I dont know what language they were speaking but looked Asian. I saw 2 college aged guys eating with latex gloves on. I did see people using hand sanitizer and some on the plane wiped the seats off but that was about it.

[Steve Shauger]

I just deleted a post that was completely political in nature (Sorry EZ Nova). I understand the emotions and to some degree hysteria surrounding the Corona Virus, but this forum is about like minded people sharing our common interest ...our cars.... NOT POLITICS!


Regarding our car values, purchasing anything has its inherent risks. As we mature most tend to be less of a risk taker. My definition of a risk is purchasing something purely on speculation(stock market traders and classic car dealers are experts at).


The cars I own are very important to me and as a matter of fact during the meltdown yesterday I was thrashing on the orange RS/Z and quite honestly it took my mind off my stock market portfolio and 401k. Oh and filled and took advantage of the low cost of fuel.

[70 copo]

Steve,

What are you running for fuel?

[EZ Nova]

I just deleted a post that was completely political in nature (Sorry EZ Nova). I understand the emotions and to some degree hysteria surrounding the Corona Virus, but this forum is about like minded people sharing our common interest ...our cars.... NOT POLITICS!


Regarding our car values, purchasing anything has its inherent risks. As we mature most tend to be less of a risk taker. My definition of a risk is purchasing something purely on speculation(stock market traders and classic car dealers are experts at).


The cars I own are very important to me and as a matter of fact during the meltdown yesterday I was thrashing on the orange RS/Z and quite honestly it took my mind off my stock market portfolio and 401k. Oh and filled and took advantage of the low cost of fuel.

Sorry Steve, it was a joke and not intended to be political. Didn't mean to offend anyone.

[69LM1]

Can someone with a health background explain something to me? The common flu kills 250,000 to 500,000 people worldwide and 36,000 people in the US annually. Pretty much every four years for the last 20 plus years we have had a major viral outbreak similar to this virus but it just seems this one they are going overboard with it. Why is this virus any different than any of the last 10 we have had and correct me if I am wrong, they are all pretty much similar in fatalities to the common flu or oddly enough even much less. I am beginning to believe this is just another way for the media to gain viewership and ratings. The last bad virus was the H1N1 virus and that 'only' killed 12,500 people in the US in a year which is 1/3 what the common flu kills every year. What am I missing here????

Because its an election year?

Another news item that oddly enough cycled through and has no traction is this:

(actual DOJ link, not news site January 2020)
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/harvard-university-professor-and-two-chinese-nationals-charged-three-separate-china-related

So you have a Harvard professor, who happens to be a biology expert, arrested for (redacted) but something to do with the "top secret" lab the Chinese were running, in Wuhan China.

Nothing to see here......

The Department of Justice announced today that the Chair of Harvard University’s Chemistry and Chemical Biology Department and two Chinese nationals have been charged in connection with aiding the People’s Republic of China....... Unbeknownst to Harvard University beginning in 2011, Lieber became a “Strategic Scientist” at Wuhan University of Technology (WUT) in China and was a contractual participant in China’s Thousand Talents Plan from in or about 2012 to 2017. China’s Thousand Talents Plan is one of the most prominent Chinese Talent recruit plans that are designed to attract, recruit, and cultivate high-level scientific talent in furtherance of China’s scientific development, economic prosperity and national security. These talent programs seek to lure Chinese overseas talent and foreign experts to bring their knowledge and experience to China and reward individuals for stealing proprietary information. Under the terms of Lieber’s three-year Thousand Talents contract, WUT paid Lieber $50,000 USD per month, living expenses of up to 1,000,000 Chinese Yuan (approximately $158,000 USD at the time) and awarded him more than $1.5 million to establish a research lab at WUT

/Rich

[69LM1]

Kung Flu rate of mortailty .5%

Ebola virus was 70%

The fact the Kung Flu is spreading worldwide tells you it's mild, where as Ebola never left the continent because it generally killed most folks who got it, regardless of age.

China is already through the peak of it, and getting back to producing I Phones.

As the weather gets warmer in the Northern Hemisphere, it's going to fade away.

Respective to muscle car valuations, i'd be more concerned with millenials not being in to cars in general than a virus.

Speaking of China and Kung Flu, anyone else just slightly curious to know why quite a few of the high ranking officials in Iran were the first to contract it outside of mainland China?

Exactly... Shows that there was a significant connection between the two with several overlaps. Very interesting indeed and not many people talking about that as well.

/Rich

[Tommy]

I wonder how many will attend car shows and swap meets this spring or if they will get cancelled. If everyone stays home in the garage, next season will be sure to bring out some nice finished projects or some really clean detailed hotrods! If this thing continues and I don't get jammed up because of media reactions or actual real deal problems, I should get caught on up everything I ever wanted to do around the house and in the garage. I do hope everyone stays healthy and we can look back later and Thank the Lord for seeing us through financially and health wise.

Tommy

[Mr70]

This starts tomorrow & will be a good litmus test.https://www.mecum.com/
Mecum has reserves,so it'll be interesting to see if enough people show up to get past those reserve prices.

[Lee Stewart]

New York State Setting Up 1-Mile Coronavirus Containment Zone With National Guard

The state of New York is setting up a special coronavirus containment zone in the city of New Rochelle in Westchester County with the help of the National Guard, according to a press conference with state officials on Tuesday afternoon.

Westchester, which currently has 108 cases and is just north of New York City, became one of the worst hotspots in the country after a Manhattan lawyer who lives in the county was infected with COVID-19. His wife, two children, and the neighbor who drove him to the hospital also contracted the disease.

https://gizmodo.com/new-york-to-set-up-coronavirus-containment-zone-in-new-1842241803

[the427king]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/10/24/h1n1.obama/index.html

H1n1 declared a pandemic in April 2009 ,yet declared an emergency 5 months later only after millions already infected,20000 hospitalized and over 1000 dead, and that was just counting the United States. Heres the best part. From the start of the pandemic to its finish, the stock market in 2009 INCREASED by 40%.................No bad media means no hysteria

[Lee Stewart]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/10/24/h1n1.obama/index.html

H1n1 declared a pandemic in April 2009 ,yet declared an emergency 5 months later only after millions already infected,20000 hospitalized and over 1000 dead, and that was just counting the United States. Heres the best part. From the start of the pandemic to its finish, the stock market in 2009 INCREASED by 40%.................No bad media means no hysteria

CDC estimated there were 60.8 million cases (range: 43.3-89.3 million), 274,304 hospitalizations (range: 195,086-402,719), and 12,469 deaths (range: 8868-18,306) in the United States due to the (H1N1)pdm09 virus.

That is a very low mortality rate. And it was only 5 months after the pandemic started that a vaccine was found,

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/2009-h1n1-pandemic.html

[Lee Stewart]

The latest stats are:

119,176 cases

4,295 deaths

https://i.postimg.cc/PJMPJWbb/screenshot-7684.png (https://postimages.cc/)

[tom406]

I would hope everyone interested in this virus situation do your own homework. In Seattle, life is currently quite different. To give you an idea of how much less people are going out right now, my wife drove home from work yesterday going through downtown at 5pm GOING THE SPEED LIMIT. Not saying that to be funny-I can't remember being able to do that on a work day in 20 years.

My wife is in the medical field, and has some doctor friends keeping tabs. She showed me the postings of a couple of doctors on the ground in Northern Italy. This is a well developed and supported part of the country. The thought was they downplayed the risks and it spread suddenly and quickly to the population. Though the percentages of people with bad reactions probably wasn't out of line with previous viruses, they all got sick at the same time and overloaded the hospitals and ER's, to the point where they're not doing elective procedures because they're trying to keep the ER afloat. The ventilators needed to keep folks alive are getting to be in short supply, so some of the hospitals are having to prioritize who gets them. If you have a pre morbidity or are into retirement age, they're going to prioritize otherwise healthy or younger people ahead of you-they're simply a better bet given the odds. This is what is feared by the other countries in Europe, and here as well.
Let's say this bug just takes out a good, quick number of the gray haired and infirm among us. That's pretty much the population every Goodguys, NCRS, and car club meeting I've been to in the last few years. Who's interested in being the one who brings the bug to your club, or your parents? Nobody here wants to die, but nobody REALLY wants to be Typhoid Mary of the Northwest, either.
I may be sensitive being in the eye of the storm here, but until you start seeing the fear and empty streets and stores, I don't think you're quite getting it.

[Zedder]

Good luck with things Tom. We were a hot spot for SARS in 2003 and have about 30 cases of Covid-19 currently, so I completely understand where you are coming from. Some of the comments here are absolutely mind boggling. No one has immunity to this virus nor can the vulnerable get a vaccine to help protect them. Given that, a mortality rate 30 times higher than influenza and a much higher rate of transmission, I can’t understand how anyone would think it is nothing to be concerned with (unless you live in the boonies and don’t visit medical centers).

[the427king]

I sure wouldnt want to have to fly or be in large groups of people right now. Fortunately I dont have to do either . I have family members in New Rochelle and that area is said to be the biggest cluster of cases currently in the US.

[EZ Nova]

I sure wouldnt want to have to fly or be in large groups of people right now. Fortunately I dont have to do either . I have family members in New Rochelle and that area is said to be the biggest cluster of cases currently in the US.

Well, I'm going to be at Buffalo airport Saturday to fly down to visit my mom in Phoenix. Hoping we will be fine.........

[Tenney]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3URhJx0NSw

[Zedder]

Back to the car price question...I suspect the aging population will have more to do with prices softening over the next few years than anything else. It seems that more cars are popping up for sale lately, but very few appear to be changing hands. The same ads are run over and over again. It would be interesting to know what the distribution of ages are on sites like this. I'm 57 and suspect that the median age might even be north of that. If so, another 5 years will have a dramatic impact on the hobby.

[Steve Shauger]

Back to the car price question...I suspect the aging population will have more to do with prices softening over the next few years than anything else. It seems that more cars are popping up for sale lately, but very few appear to be changing hands. The same ads are run over and over again. It would be interesting to know what the distribution of ages are on sites like this. I'm 57 and suspect that the median age might even be north of that. If so, another 5 years will have a dramatic impact on the hobby.


Mark, if your buying look at it as an opportunity. Investing no so much... however just like water front property, ultra rare and iconic cars are virtually inelastic and will always be valuable.

[Zedder]

I agree with you Steve. I've never looked at old cars and bikes as investments, but I have always thought that they would hold most of their value over my ownership. I suspect that will still be the case, or they might drop 10-20% - which isn't a big deal in the overall scheme of things. The low Canadian dollar affects my purchase timing more than anything else. Almost a $1.40 Cdn today to buy a US buck...makes shopping in the US pretty difficult!

[Mr70]

And now for something completely different.
~Toilet paper maker Marutomi Paper Manufacturing which holds 10% of the Japanese market for toilet paper,saw orders jump tenfold from normal levels on Thursday and Friday.The company usually sells around 1,600 packs of toilet paper at most per day.But it received over 40,000 online orders over the two-day period.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Coronavirus/Coronavirus-rumors-fuel-panic-buying-of-toilet-paper-in-Japan2

[Lee Stewart]

Here's why people are panic buying and stockpiling toilet paper to cope with coronavirus fears

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/heres-why-people-are-panic-buying-and-stockpiling-toilet-paper-to-cope-with-coronavirus-fears/ar-BB112sCl

[Vern B]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3URhJx0NSw


Everyone should watch this, pretty sobering.

[Lee Stewart]

New York officials traced more than 50 coronavirus cases back to one attorney

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-york-officials-traced-more-than-50-coronavirus-cases-back-to-one-attorney/ar-BB112jj6?ocid=spartandhp

[fiveforty]

Back to the car price question...I suspect the aging population will have more to do with prices softening over the next few years than anything else. It seems that more cars are popping up for sale lately, but very few appear to be changing hands. The same ads are run over and over again. It would be interesting to know what the distribution of ages are on sites like this. I'm 57 and suspect that the median age might even be north of that. If so, another 5 years will have a dramatic impact on the hobby.

I am 60 yrs old. Last year bought a 72 RS Z28 from a guy a little older than me who had it for 19 years. Sold it to a guy who was older than me. he just sold it to a guy who was 66 yrs old. Was kind of disapointed in the responses I had for a car that only had 2500 made.

[markinnaples]

Want to keep a close eye on CV? Here is something a colleague who works for our IT Department sent me:

This page is put together by a 17 year old tech wizard. It is updated each minute. It is the best information that I have found about the beer virus’ infection numbers.

https://ncov2019.live/

Computer whiz Avi Schiffmann, 17, spends much of his time these days constantly updating and improving the website, which automatically scrapes data from reliable sources from all over the world. The site, which originally updated every 10 minutes, now updates every minute to provide the latest statistics on the number of confirmed cases, serious cases, deaths, and recovered — both worldwide and in each country — in real time. The site also hosts an interactive Google map, a Twitter feed, travel advisories, information on the disease and its prevention, as well as tips for preparing for quarantine situations.

“I started working on this project at Christmastime, when there were fewer than 1,000 confirmed cases — all in mainland China,” said Schiffmann, a high school junior. “It was hard to get clear, concise, and accurate information on what was going on, and I wanted to do something to fix this.”

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/TPBqxpD9/screenshot-7688.png (https://postimages.org/)

[Tenney]

As far as muscle car prices . . . if things remain the same . . . what if they held an auction and no one showed up?

Today fear is running rampart. People are afraid to put themselves in large crowds. And that is exactly what an auction is.

Mecum's Glendale AZ auction starts two days from now. Let's see what happens.

https://www.hagerty.com/articles-videos/articles/2020/03/10/lessons-from-the-2020-amelia-island-auctions?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=20_March_11_Newsletter_NewDD

[Lee Stewart]

The New York Auto Show Has Been Pushed Back to August Amid Coronavirus Concerns

[markinnaples]

Another friend just sent these sites along as well:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu

https://www.hopkins-cepar.org

[Late BrakeU2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3URhJx0NSw

Joe is my next door neighbor, cool cat. Not an alarmist, but you can already see it digging in to most folks mindset. Traffic is holiday light, but it ain't a holiday. Like stated the auctions will be a tell to an extent.. but think folks that are after a car will just pony up the extra 2% for phone bids and send a guinea pig..i mean an inspector to check out a car in person.

[ZiggyL78]

Health officials are recommending that you wash your hands for 30 seconds with soap and water. And wash them frequently.

You should only use hand sanitizer only if you do not have access to soap and water.

Avoid buffet lunch and dinner restaurants also.

And no threesomes till things cool down ;)

[the427king]

Ncaa basketball tournament to be played with no spectators

[Lynn]

And no threesomes till things cool down ;)

Sherri doesn't have to worry about me requesting a threesome. I feel bad enough disappointing one woman.

[ZiggyL78]

Sherri doesn't have to worry about me requesting a threesome. I feel bad enough disappointing one woman.

LOL.Now that's funny!!

[iluv69s]

If I remember correctly, at times when the market dropped in the past, , folks invested more in old cars...which made the price increase. ��

[69LM1]

This time is different, at least for precious metals. Silver and Gold had a small run up, and now a drop. Wonder why.

/R

[Mr70]

..and what good are low gas prices,when there's nowhere to go. :(

[Zedder]

If I remember correctly, at times when the market dropped in the past, , folks invested more in old cars...which made the price increase. ��

That was 10 - 12 years ago. The "market" has a lot more grey hair now and much more at stake if the "investments" don't pan out and end up costing them more of their retirement funds when they cash out.

[Lee Stewart]

What the coronavirus outbreak means for the collector car market

https://www.hagerty.com/articles-videos/articles/2020/03/12/what-the-coronavirus-outbreak-means-for-the-collector-car-market

[ZiggyL78]

That was 10 - 12 years ago. The "market" has a lot more grey hair now and much more at stake if the "investments" don't pan out and end up costing them more of their retirement funds when they cash out.

Absolutely. In the past if you paid too much for a car then it was only a matter of time before it became a good deal. The only exception would be real high end cars like COPO,Yenko,L88 Vettes and Hemi cars. They seem to hold their value,no matter what.

[Mr70]

.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/pX03szGm/3078-coronavirus.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/s2W8f8VW/3-5e68dc6772c1e-700.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/zBjxVY4y/coronavirus-joke-south-africa-696x365.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/PrLMkDfp/screenshot-7689.png (https://postimg.cc/vcsnrcVb)

[the427king]

Pic

[the427king]

actual flight pic from London to Milan

[Mr70]

They just cancelled the entire NCAA Tournament,Men & Women.https://www.cbssports.com/general/news/coronavirus-live-updates-ncaa-tournament-canceled-nhl-suspends-season-mlb-to-halt-spring-training/live/

[PeteLeathersac]

'

Public Schools closing for three weeks here in Ontario Canada.
First week is regular March Holidays + two weeks added for C-19 concerns?:hmmm:
:dunno:
~ Pete

.

[the427king]

Sold more parts today than I have in a few years in one given day ...maybe people are staying home and working on thier cars .

[Lynn]

Want to keep a close eye on CV? Here is something a colleague who works for our IT Department sent me:

This page is put together by a 17 year old tech wizard. It is updated each minute. It is the best information that I have found about the beer virus’ infection numbers.

https://ncov2019.live/

Computer whiz Avi Schiffmann, 17, spends much of his time these days constantly updating and improving the website, which automatically scrapes data from reliable sources from all over the world. The site, which originally updated every 10 minutes, now updates every minute to provide the latest statistics on the number of confirmed cases, serious cases, deaths, and recovered — both worldwide and in each country — in real time. The site also hosts an interactive Google map, a Twitter feed, travel advisories, information on the disease and its prevention, as well as tips for preparing for quarantine situations.

“I started working on this project at Christmastime, when there were fewer than 1,000 confirmed cases — all in mainland China,” said Schiffmann, a high school junior. “It was hard to get clear, concise, and accurate information on what was going on, and I wanted to do something to fix this.”

I don't think this is getting updated hourly any longer. It still shows Oklahoma with 1 case, and there are three confirmed.

I realize we want to take some precautions. Many of the actions in Oklahoma seem a bit extreme considering there are only 3 cases among the almost 4 million residents here. One is an airman that spent time in Seatle last week; one recently visited Italy. Don't know about the third one. Colleges and schools are shutting down. OU and OSU start spring break, and are telling students that all their classes for the two weeks after spring break will be on line.

[Zedder]

Lynn, the reason that they are moving towards mitigation efforts is because there are many more actual infections than what is being tested and reported. We had 17 new cases in Ontario today...almost half were from travel to the US.

They are closing schools because they believe that many children who are infected exhibit no symptoms, but are spreading the virus. Add to that their poor hygiene habits and cramped quarters and you can spread a virus very quickly! We have about 170 employees in our company. We had 2 employees contacted today telling them that family members had possibly been exposed.

This is a better tracking site from John Hopkins...

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

[Billohio]

Grocery stores in central ohio are low on food. I saw pictures of meat shelves empty and no carts avaliable. I believe there are 4 cases in Ohio now.

[Lee Stewart]

NASCAR to race at Atlanta, Homestead without fans

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/motorsports/nascar-to-race-at-atlanta-homestead-without-fans/ar-BB116CEA?ocid=spartandhp

[Lee Stewart]

Barrett-Jackson's Palm Beach auction, planned for April, has been postponed till October.

The NHRA Gatornationals have been postponed for all but the sportsman classes that race on Thursday, March 12. Those will proceed without spectators, but the series' premier classes will be rescheduled.

[SuperNovaSS]

Schools just closed for a week here in Santa Cruz.


Jason

[Lee Stewart]

Public schools here in New Mexico will be closed for three weeks. We now have 6 cases.

[tom406]

Seattle area schools are closed through April 24. Also, No public events over 250 people.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/5tCC7cJ6/BB10X6AY.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Unreal]

If you're in a falling elevator, there's not much to worry about, until the very end. You might say the hysterical lady standing next to you is overreacting, but maybe she understands the situation better than you do.

[Crush]

We need to relax
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/03/12/health/coronavirus-survivor-elizabeth-schneider/index.html

[markinnaples]

If you're in a falling elevator, there's not much to worry about, until the very end. You might say the hysterical lady standing next to you is overreacting, but maybe she understands the situation better than you do.

Or maybe she's bought into the panic you haven't. There are several sides to this story. I think caution and not putting yourself into compromising positions, especially if you're on the higher end of the danger spectrum, is the best course of action. Otherwise, go about your business, intelligently living and staying informed.

[Crush]

Reality

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/media/woman-coronavirus-hysteria-out-of-control.amp

[SBR]

Schools now closed here through March 29th.

[Astock]

Use cars for an example:

3,250 killed daily, around 100,000 injured-disabled every day.

Maybe 100 years ago, this virus would be a different story.

Restrict travel from heavily infected areas. Airlines need to take the big hit, along with other businesses like hotels, cruises. Not too late to short travel related companies.

Things will be back to normal in 4 to 5 months, or less.

[markinnaples]

Unconfirmed of course, but heard a rumor the President is declaring a state of emergency at 3 pm today. Not sure if that will happen, or what it means if it does.

[Mr70]

Sigh.

[Lee Stewart]

Unconfirmed of course, but heard a rumor the President is declaring a state of emergency at 3 pm today. Not sure if that will happen, or what it means if it does.

Trump to declare a national emergency in response to coronavirus

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/live-updates-president-trump-declares-a-national-emergency-in-response-to-coronavirus/ar-BB117JUw?ocid=spartanntp

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/PJXLtzf1/0VNxFTl.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[NorCam]

LOL :worship:

[the427king]

Stock market up 2000 pts today or 10%....but I can find an article about it like yesterday when it was more important than the virus coverage as it dropped 10%

[Lee Stewart]

New Coronavirus Test 10 Times Faster Is FDA Approved

U.S. health regulators have approved a new coronavirus test that will speed up by tenfold the ability to test patients, helping solve a significant obstacle to American efforts to contain the virus.

The Food and Drug Administration granted “emergency use authorization” to the test, which runs on Roche Holding AG’s cobas 6800/8800 systems. The 8800 system is capable of testing 4,128 patients a day, and the 6800 version can test as many as 1,440. The tool also is available in Europe and countries that accept its CE marking for medical devices.

Roche shares traded 11% higher at 1:29 p.m. in Zurich, the steepest intraday increase since 1997.
“We are increasing the speed definitely by a factor of 10,” Thomas Schinecker, head of the Swiss drugmaker’s diagnostics unit, said in an interview.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/health-news/new-coronavirus-test-10-times-faster-is-fda-approved/ar-BB118ePt?ocid=spartandhp

[the427king]

Yes. Quest and bdx as well. The market went up almost 1500 alone just duing his 30 minute speech, but here is the headline "trump gives worse speech of his presidency" https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-just-gave-worst-speech-204700719.html

[Unreal]

Or maybe she's bought into the panic you haven't. There are several sides to this story. I think caution and not putting yourself into compromising positions, especially if you're on the higher end of the danger spectrum, is the best course of action. Otherwise, go about your business, intelligently living and staying informed.

True. Or maybe she's trained in falling elevators, so she knows what she's screaming about.

Another analogy; guy falls off a 20 story building. At the 10th floor, he says, "So far, so good"

I'm with you, I believe in prudence, not panic, but I think those who are recommending prudence may be better informed than we are. Some confuse prudent measures with panic. My son is a doctor, and he has called twice this week to stress how serious this is, and that we are still in the early stages. Smart people are giving us advice, that I plan to follow. Others may choose a different course of action.

[fortim]

Yes. Quest and bdx as well. The market went up almost 1500 alone just duing his 30 minute speech, but here is the headline "trump gives worse speech of his presidency" https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-just-gave-worst-speech-204700719.html
What does that tells us about the "Market"...

[Zedder]

True. Or maybe she's trained in falling elevators, so she knows what she's screaming about.

Another analogy; guy falls off a 20 story building. At the 10th floor, he says, "So far, so good"

I'm with you, I believe in prudence, not panic, but I think those who are recommending prudence may be better informed than we are. Some confuse prudent measures with panic. My son is a doctor, and he has called twice this week to stress how serious this is, and that we are still in the early stages. Smart people are giving us advice, that I plan to follow. Others may choose a different course of action.

Well said Unreal. The last 2 days have been exhausting at work trying to figure out how to deal with all of the restrictions, anxiety, slow down in business, employees worried about other employees returning from vacation abroad and bringing Covid-19 to the office, calls about family members quarantined, customers asking for our written Pandemic plan...I’m on my second whiskey...

[EZ Nova]

Well I'm going to say it's not looking good for ANY markets, musclecar or stocks/bonds!Looking at the Glendale Mecum so far, I would say it looks like there down? Now you guys know a lot more then me, but some of what I'm keeping an eye on, '78/'79 Lil Red Express for example, this is the 3rd auction in a row that they didn't hit $20K. Isn't this down for a Yenko Camaro:

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-423538/1969-chevrolet-yenko-camaro/

Or this Hemi Coronet 500, thought these were in the $70K range:

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-404935/1966-dodge-hemi-coronet-500/

And something MUST be up with this SD TA:

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-404903/1973-pontiac-trans-am-super-duty/

[njsteve]

Well I'm going to say it's not looking good for ANY markets, musclecar or stocks/bonds!Looking at the Glendale Mecum so far, I would say it looks like there down? Now you guys know a lot more then me, but some of what I'm keeping an eye on, '78/'79 Lil Red Express for example, this is the 3rd auction in a row that they didn't hit $20K. Isn't this down for a Yenko Camaro:

And something MUST be up with this SD TA:

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-404903/1973-pontiac-trans-am-super-duty/

Not a single engine photo in the listing. hmmm. But a beautiful looking car from what photos were on the site. Anyone have the VIN of this car?

UPDATE: I asked over at PY. These were supposedly comments made by the seller who was dumping some of his cars in need of work:

[Mr70]

A lot of internet bids are winning the cars at MECUM in Glendale AZ. right now,meaning looks like not as many bidders are there in person today.

[Billohio]

as big as the arena is, it makes it look like very few people there from the TV. Are the cars all in the arena or do they have tents?

[NorCam]

Been watching the auction today. Some cars going below value, many not hitting reserve, and others doing well including the Chevelle LS6 convert. Does anyone know the deal with the GT500 going for 57K?

https://i.ibb.co/JQNpyn6/59-Corvette-GS-200-K.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/4NyYB9p/70-L78-62-K.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/8DknLkW/70-LS6-Vert-300-K.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/6mY0Vdq/Copo-Chevelle-150-K.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/qmVcrG5/Shelby-GT500-57-K.jpg

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/2yGpKxRt/screenshot-7695.png (https://postimages.org/)

Highlights

Shelby no. 00498
427 C6AE engine
4-speed manual transmission
Power steering and brakes
Fold down rear seat
Restoration work done in 1989
Driven 700 miles since restoration
Listed in the Shelby Registry
Same family owned for 36 years
Prior ownership documents
Copy of the vehicle invoice and production order

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-427800/1967-shelby-gt500-fastback/

[NorCam]

Pair of Hemi Cuda's both stalling out at 130K. Has the shine begun to tarnish on the Hemi cars perhaps?

https://i.ibb.co/m9xYgjP/Hemi3.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/8z3hyDH/Hemi2-130-K.jpg

[Lee Stewart]

^^^^^^^^^^^

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-405220/1970-plymouth-hemi-cuda/

Description says nothing about original drivetrain.

https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-405266/1970-plymouth-hemi-cuda/

Claims original hemi but it's an auto

[NorCam]

Yup. The first one has been inspected and states NOM on Galens Certificate

https://cdn1.mecum.com/assets/images/media_group/lots/az0320-405220/1970-cuda-pg-2_931552.jpg

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/TYP3gtDF/screenshot-7697.png (https://postimages.org/)

[drce500]

Sold prices shown on Mecum website include buyers premium.
https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-423534/1970-plymouth-hemi-cuda/
https://www.mecum.com/lots/AZ0320-404935/1966-dodge-hemi-coronet-500/

[Lee Stewart]

So my son and I decided to checkout our local Walmart Grocery as I have been reading about panic buying. Yep . . . most shelves were empty. ALL fresh meats were gone. As were can goods. About the only things not sold out were candy and booze. And somehow we spent $75!

BTW, went to buy cigarettes ($34.50/carton) at the Indian reservation near us. Gas was $1.70 for regular. Phillips 66 brand

EDIT:

We went food shopping 3 days ago and all shelves were full. Doesn't take long for "panic buying" to kick in.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/vBNXHqF9/76t.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[the427king]

Red hemi has been updated on danas site from 130k to 151k? Maybe bid goes on kicked it higher up

[Lee Stewart]

Red hemi has been updated on danas site from 130k to 151k? Maybe bid goes on kicked it higher up

Now shows SOLD

https://i.postimg.cc/KzTSbgCZ/screenshot-7698.png (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

School closures of 8 weeks or more may better mitigate coronavirus spread, CDC says

(CNN)Closing schools for eight weeks or more may have a greater impact on mitigating the spread of the novel coronavirus than two- to four-week closures, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has said.

Shorter-term closures will likely make little difference in the spread of the disease, new CDC guidance states, even as K-12 school districts across the country began announcing school closures within the shorter time frame.

Further, short-term closures may actually have detrimental effects, negatively impacting older caregivers at home, the CDC said.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/14/us/school-closures-cdc-long-term-trnd/index.html

[EZ Nova]

Lee,

Ontario schools are out for possibly 3 weeks. My wifes a high school shop teacher (teaches welding and machine shop). They have been told to be ready for early call-back, DO NOT leave or be out of the country country after Sunday the 22nd. They had to notify there board IF they were planning on being out of the country this week, March break so they could get subs in order for the 2 week isolation terms.

I think this is a pretty good plan. Rumour mills says there is going to be temperature taking upon returning to school and anyone with a temperature will be denied entry for possibly another 2+ weeks. I feels this is good to slow to stop the spread that way too also seek out new cases and deal with them.

2 months is CNN's "the-sky-is-falling" fear mongering plain and simple. IF the known case on the ships were only 2 weeks, then why would 99% of the populations that don't have it need 4X's the time.

[EZ Nova]

Pair of Hemi Cuda's both stalling out at 130K. Has the shine begun to tarnish on the Hemi cars perhaps?

Seems Mopars in general were down??? The 2 A-12's RR in the $50's before premiums. And the Superbird around $130.

I know they might not be as nice in person, but still seems like delas for real cars to me. And don't get me started on the black '69 rag GTX that was "no sale" @$42K!!!!

[JoeC]

this looks like a corona discount

[Charley Lillard]

Both of the A12 cars were really good cars, Yenko was a good car but still unrestored underneath which is kinda nice to see. This might be the new normal. Without shows like MCACN etc I wonder what high end musclecars would be worth.

[EZ Nova]

Charlie, I'm now 54. I've been following and liking the musclecars since I was 14. I actually TRIED to get the loan for a car (1970 440 Duster at the time) when I was 14. Had to wait till I was 16 and first bought a 1970 440+6 B5 4sp 4.10 Dana Cuda. Did that in late Feb. of '82. That owner was a high steel worker. Went overseas and as of first week of May, still wasn't around. Offered my deposit back and went and offer the guy the $200.00 less then the Cuda for a '68 GTX 440 4sp 4.10 Dana CLONE I did end up buying and owning.

So have followed '69 1/2 A12's some and they were usually DOUBLE what those 2 went for. The yellow '70 Hemi Cuda for well under $100??? Maybe the market is "correcting" (as my financial guys has been saying of that MESS) and hopefully the cars can be more affordable to actual car people and not just an investment to collect dust and $$$ somewhere.

[drce500]

The 1966 Hemi Coronet i posted sold for $37,000 before fees.

[EZ Nova]

I know. I posted it in post #144 saying these were "usually" in the $70K range???

[the427king]

I was offered a low mile original 70 hemi cuda from a collection 18 months ago for 160K w original motor which i passed on .
It went to auction and got 165K ....the mecum car wo original motor did 151K......whats the panic about ? Maybe people associate the 70 hemi cuda with the ultra high dollar 70 and 71 cuda convertibles and the 71 hemi cudas and lump them all together as similar,which they certainly are not production number and value wise .

[70 copo]

Here in Ohio Gov, DeWine is ordering bars and restaurant dining rooms closed; carryout is still permitted.

[Lee Stewart]

Here in Ohio Gov, DeWine is ordering bars and restaurant dining rooms closed; carryout is still permitted.

Illinois followed right afterwards.

[Lee Stewart]

Coronavirus in NY: NYC schools will close

New York City’s schools will close Monday and remain shut till at least April 20, Mayor Bill de Blasio said Sunday.

De Blasio — who had been facing a coup from parents and teachers over his refusal to close city schools amid the coronavirus — added that it is possible “we may have to go out” for the rest of the school year.

https://nypost.com/2020/03/15/coronavirus-in-ny-nyc-schools-will-close/

[EZ Nova]

Just seen that the USA has but there rate to ZERO to .25%! And 700 Billion is relief $$$. That might stop the bleeding but markets and cars will still be down for the short term.

Like 427 said hi end exotic stuff will still be pricey but I feel normal stuff will be down or a buyers market.

But I could be wrong.

[Lee Stewart]

I believe it's going to be much harder to establish market value for any cars in the $50,000 to $100,000 price range especially as many auctions are either cancelled, postponed or online only. Using just the Mecum Glendale auction as a barometer isn't enough. Will Mecum have it's Houston auction (April 2-4)? B-J's next auction is Northeast Auction - June 24-27, 2020.

With the Dow Meltdown, many average investors have probably seen their "Toy Money" disappear. Less buyers in the market. Sellers may pull back cars and wait to sell unless they absolutely need the money.

[tom406]

The '67 GT500 isn't really a good barometer of that market. Its a good starting point for a COMPLETE restoration-as it will be an early inboard light, 4sp, dark blue/black GT500 when its restored correctly. But there's lots wrong including current engine (trans?), paint color, wheels (should have Magstars), and who knows how much hardware given the
choices made back when it was redone in the late 80s.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/d3D3RhcC/screenshot-7699.png (https://postimages.org/)

March 12th trucks lined up outside of Proctor and Gamble off of Route 6 in Tunkhannock PA - all trucks waiting for toilet paper and paper towels loads.

[njsteve]

With the Dow Meltdown, many average investors have probably seen their "Toy Money" disappear. Less buyers in the market. Sellers may pull back cars and wait to sell unless they absolutely need the money.

The interesting thing for those of us that went through the 1987 crash and were into these cars back then, is that the prices for quality cars went up in the period after the market crash. This was due to the "investors" who decided to exit the stock market and buy up tangible collector assets (cars)- something they could actually enjoy, versus the intangible stock market investments. While the market was still floundering, these cars were being bought and flipped rapidly. For example, the price of a Hemicuda (or Challenger) Convertible doubled with every transaction.

A couple months after the November '87 crash, in early 1988, I bought an unrestored 19,000 mile red, 1971 440+6 Cuda ragtop for $25K. I sold it a couple months later to Steve Juliano for $38K. (the same one that sold for $1,155,000 at Mecum Indy '19). https://www.mecum.com/lots/SC0519-371530/1971-plymouth-cuda-convertible/

Now would be the prime time to be shopping for the quality cars.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/xCQNDjDJ/screenshot-7700.png (https://postimages.org/)

https://journal.classiccars.com/2020/03/15/more-car-events-cancelled-or-postponed-by-coronavirus/

[Lee Stewart]

Dr. Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, made the morning show rounds on Sunday, answering questions from news anchors about the ongoing outbreak of the novel coronavirus in the United States.

Fauci, who is considered the top expert on infectious diseases in the United States and is a member of President Donald Trump's coronavirus task team, spoke at length during appearances on Fox News Sunday, ABC's This Week, NBC's Meet The Press, and CNN's State Of The Union. In each appearance, he stressed the importance of containing and slowing the number of COVID-19 cases, the official name of the disease caused by the new coronavirus strain.

However, while speaking to Fox News Sunday host Chris Wallace, Fauci also listed three reasons why COVID-19 is different from the flu or another virus when asked by Wallace to explain it to those who might not understand.

"One thing, it's brand new, so we don't have any prior experience about what it's gonna do, what its dynamics are gonna be," Fauci said. "Number two, it spreads very easily, there's no doubt about that. It isn't like some of the outbreaks that we had that just didn't adapt itself to spread among humans. And number three, it's very serious in the sense of morbidity/mortality, particularly among, and very heavily weighted towards, individuals who are more susceptible — the elderly and those with underlying conditions."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/fauci-warns-young-americans-about-ignoring-advice-on-social-distancing/ar-BB11e3SC?ocid=spartandhp

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/9fLHV1sd/screenshot-7701.png (https://postimages.org/)

[Crush]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/wuhan-medical-workers-remove-masks-after-last-temporary-hospital-closes-2020-3%3famp

[Crush]

There is a light!!!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/wuhan-medical-workers-remove-masks-after-last-temporary-hospital-closes-2020-3%3famp

[Lee Stewart]

Well that's really great news.

Does anyone see the US taking the same draconian measures that China took? Personally I don't see it . . . yet.

IMO any of the actions states and the Fed are taking today are nowhere near enough to contain the pandemic.

China knew that it's economy absolutely depended on quick containment. Here in the US it seems any containment rules are half assed and won't really do enough to stop the spread of the virus. They are trying to stop panic by offering quasi containment rules.

We are not doing enough and it's going to show when the deaths in the US begin to approach those that Italy is currently experiencing and the entire country of Italy is on lockdown.

Look at that POP by Age chart I posted. 29% of our pop is highly susceptible. That's almost one out of every three people.

And keep this in mind . . . go to any hospital. They aren't sitting around playing gin rummy. They all have sick people who are sick by other issues, not by the virus.

Where is the response like we saw after 9/11?

[the427king]

I'm certainly no scientist but I'd love to get an answer to this question from one ... if this is so much worse than the flu because the death to infection rate ratio is so much higher, how do they know how many people are infected If hardly anyone is getting tested ????? Some say the infected numbers could already be huge,which would bring the ratio way down
.

[Lee Stewart]

I'm certainly no scientist but I'd love to get an answer to this question from one ... if this is so much worse than the flu because the death to infection rate ratio is so much higher, how do they know how many people are infected If hardly anyone is getting tested ????? Some say the infected numbers could already be huge,which would bring the ratio way down.

Yes that is a very important question and has been on everyone's mind for quite some time. Due to the fact that we are not getting enough test kits into the hands of qualified people which has been a very sore point.

Here in N.M. they opened the first drive-thru test center in ABQ. But Santa Fe which has a few cases has no public testing center. Tri-Core, one of our biggest labs says they are all set for testing. So send in the tests . . . and all they have is silence . . . until today. We only have 19 positive cases in NM. No deaths.

All we can go on is the world wide stats that say 150,000 infected with 5000 deaths. And I am not even sure that is up to date.

[Lee Stewart]

Schools closures were the first step. Here is the second:

SANTA FE, N.M. - The New Mexico Public Health Secretary announced new restrictions to restaurants and bars that would limit occupancy in order to prevent the spread of COVID-19. Secretary Kathy Kunkel issued the emergency order on Sunday.

Beginning Monday, March 16. all restaurants, bars, breweries, eateries and other food establishments shall operate at no greater than 50% maximum occupancy and no greater than 50% of seating occupancy.

Additionally, no more than six patrons will be allowed to be seated together at tables or booths and all occupied tables and booths must be separated by six feet. Patrons also may not be seated at bars and standing patrons will not be served.

The public health order also prohibits gatherings of 100 people or more, but includes exemptions for shelters, retail or grocery stores, courthouses, correction and detention facilities and hospitals, among others.

All casinos and horse racing facilities must also close until April 10. Casinos operating on tribal land are exempt from the provision.

“The best thing New Mexicans can do right now is self-isolate and limit person-to-person contact,” said Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham in a press release. “We all have to pull together in this effort. Keep washing your hands with soap and water regularly. Stay at home. Remember your neighbors and buy only what you need when you are shopping.”

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/covid-19-state-issues-public-health-order-limiting-restaurant-bar-occupancy-to-no-more-than-50/5674949/?cat=500

Once again IMO . . . it's not enough. I understand that no states want to decimate their small businesses. But these namby-pamby restrictions just aren't going to accomplish what is needed to contain the virus.

I would rather see 2 full weeks of total lockdown and accept the damage, which the Fed can help alleviate, then instituting half assed measures like these.

[markinnaples]

IMHO, I think we should all take precautions, but overreacting in rampant. Considering the recovery rate of those who have had it is really good, I think that the panicking is overblown. Just my opinion.

[Crush]

IMHO, I think we should all take precautions, but overreacting in rampant. Considering the recovery rate of those who have had it is really good, I think that the panicking is overblown. Just my opinion.

Totally agree
Of the hundreds of thousands tested in South Korea 98.x % were NEGATIVE!

[Lee Stewart]

Totally agree
Of the hundreds of thousands tested in South Korea 98.x % were NEGATIVE!

How South Korea Scaled Coronavirus Testing While the U.S. Fell Dangerously Behind

By learning from a MERS outbreak in 2015, South Korea was prepared and acted swiftly to ramp up testing when the new coronavirus appeared there. Meanwhile, the U.S., plagued by delay and dysfunction, wasted its advantage.

https://www.propublica.org/article/how-south-korea-scaled-coronavirus-testing-while-the-us-fell-dangerously-behind

[Crush]

How South Korea Scaled Coronavirus Testing While the U.S. Fell Dangerously Behind



https://www.propublica.org/article/how-south-korea-scaled-coronavirus-testing-while-the-us-fell-dangerously-behind

Yep read that too. I think we need to see more in the news about negative test results and recovery. If the media reported every minute on all the ways people died per day and of what, we would turn into a helpless society.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282929#heart-disease

[Lee Stewart]

Massachusetts is allowing takeout and food delivery only, banning people from dining out.

What we need are draconian measures like this one!

[markinnaples]

Absolutely disagree. People should be smart, but this complete shutdown is not needed.
Where was this panic for the H1N1 epidemic that was far worse?
I'm not saying that people should needlessly put themselves in harms way, and if you have a compromised immune system or elderly, then stay home and stay safe, but for the rest of society to completely shut down is just not needed, IMHO.

[EZ Nova]

Well the news here in Ontario is due to limited test kits, those who seem not infected and more apt to recover will NOT be tested.

So I'm wondering with Lee replys IF the USA can or will handle this as well as Chinese? For Trump to succeed thus is imperative for re-election. if he can do better then China in dealing with this, he is done in the Whitehouse I think. The USA has to get a handle on this and defeat this outbreak ASAP.

I also wonder WHY everything is closing down to roughly April 6th???

[Lee Stewart]

Absolutely disagree. People should be smart, but this complete shutdown is not needed.

Yes it is. The first and most important step is containment.

Where was this panic for the H1N1 epidemic that was far worse?

The H1N1 epidemic (not a pandemic) happened during The Great Recession: April 2009. The panic was centered on people losing their homes, not on getting sick.

The COVID-19 happened during a Bull market with housing fully recovered from TGR and very low unemployment. You could say we were "Lotus Eaters."

I'm not saying that people should needlessly put themselves in harms way, and if you have a compromised immune system or elderly, then stay home and stay safe, but for the rest of society to completely shut down is just not needed, IMHO.

It is if you want to contain this. Almost all the infected people got the virus through some kind of contact with hotspot areas, except where a husband infected his wife and visa versa. Here in NM most of the infected people had just come back from trips to NYC and Italy. And BTW, our newest four cases: man in his 20s, two men in their 30s and one man in his 40s. So don't believe that COVID-19 only targets the elderly

[Zedder]

Read this to understand why social distancing works better than total short term lockdown

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/world/corona-simulator/

[Lee Stewart]

Well the news here in Ontario is due to limited test kits, those who seem not infected and more apt to recover will NOT be tested.

So I'm wondering with Lee replys IF the USA can or will handle this as well as Chinese? For Trump to succeed thus is imperative for re-election. if he can do better then China in dealing with this, he is done in the Whitehouse I think. The USA has to get a handle on this and defeat this outbreak ASAP.

Read that article I posted a few post ago how South Korea has handled their outbreak of COVID-19. Do you see ANY resemblance to what the USA is doing today?

I also wonder WHY everything is closing down to roughly April 6th???

Here is the main problem: we are dealing with an unknown virus. We don't have antivirals which facilitate recovery and we don't have a vaccine.

Flu season is almost 100% during the cold weather months. Just by higher temps, greater indoor humidity and stronger UV rays, these really help in killing off the flu. So our leaders are placing their hopes that warmer weather will help eradicate COVID-19. IMO - it's wishful thinking and nothing more.

[Lee Stewart]

The COVID-19 Coronavirus Is Now A Pandemic - Can We Ethically Deal With Lockdowns?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/fernandezelizabeth/2020/03/13/the-covid-19-coronavirus-is-now-a-pandemiccan-we-ethically-deal-with-lockdown/#5c3d68ff3e57

[EZ Nova]

Lee, honestly I really don't know how the USA is handling it as I do not live there. My mother is there but coming home this week due to losing 7 figures in her investments and out of country insurance not covering covid 19 stuff. She has been battling a respiratory illness for a couple months now and being 78 would not do well if she gets this.

Dirty-ass crowded China is coming out with what 5 new cases today? Most populated county in the world and they came from behind to seemingly get a handle on it. Can the USA do that now?

I myself am not too worried about it to tell you the truth. I'm only 54, wife is 39 and son is 2. Our odds, even if we get it, are good for FULL recovery. I have enough to think of with my family business and my family to not really get to concerned about other continents of the world. I pay attention, rationalize a thought or reaction, and move on.

[Crush]

Read that article I posted a few post ago how South Korea has handled their outbreak of COVID-19. Do you see ANY resemblance to what the USA is doing today?



Here is the main problem: we are dealing with an unknown virus. We don't have antivirals which facilitate recovery and we don't have a vaccine.

Flu season is almost 100% during the cold weather months. Just by higher temps, greater indoor humidity and stronger UV rays, these really help in killing off the flu. So our leaders are placing their hopes that warmer weather will help eradicate COVID-19. IMO - it's wishful thinking and nothing more.


Man I must say when I read your comments it sounds like panic. I mean no offense I just feel we need to stay strong and provide some form of positive direction and maintain a level of confidence that the world is not ending. Like many I have lost a significant amount of money and yes I’m concerned .

I spoke to my 90 year old mom who was born during the depression , definitely scary times , but you know what, we got through it and got stronger and I’m confident we will this time! My Mom was very positive and ENCOURAGING !
For those of you that have faith, God gave me comfort in this verse today

Psalms 23
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm23:1-6&version=NIV

[Lee Stewart]

Ontario, Canada: second largest province, covering more than one million square kilometres (415,000 square miles) - an area larger than France and Spain combined. With a population of more than 13.5 million, Ontario is home to more than 1 in 3 Canadians.

Ontario currently has 145 COVID-19 cases 304 in all of Canada:

https://i.postimg.cc/59rYfWzt/screenshot-7704.png (https://postimages.cc/)

Just as a comparison, New York City - much less population, but a much smaller geographic area - has 329. Total for NY State is 729.

The last stats I saw for cases versus deaths was 150,000/5000 which is a .03 mortality rate. The problem is the shape of the above curve. When you hear "flattening the curve" now you can understand what they are trying to accomplish: containment. Give scientists the chance to come up with antivirals and a cure. If we look at H1N1 it took 8 months to discovery a cure: April 2009 to December 2009.

The flatter we make the curve the more people will not only recover but also not become infected or die.

[Zedder]

Lee, we have 145 cases in Ontario as of 5 minutes ago. 304 in all of Canada.

[70 copo]

Looks as though we will be looking to stop the virus here and then set the example for the world.

If the US pulls it off then it will be a once in a generation shift in the global landscape.

The vaccine is the key. We may be looking at the end of open Borders, and a redefinition as to what "globalism" and more specifically multiculturalism really means to a society.

Interesting future I think.

[Lee Stewart]

Lee, we have 145 cases in Ontario as of 5 minutes ago. 304 in all of Canada.

Oops! OK - fixed it. Thanks for the correction

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/x1BVdgRM/screenshot-7705.png (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

BTW - more bad news:

https://i.postimg.cc/Xvfcyzn5/screenshot-7702.png (https://postimages.org/)

[Lee Stewart]

New York City Movie Theaters Ordered to Close Amid Coronavirus Pandemic

The order also includes the closure of nightclubs, small theater houses and concert venues. Restaurants, bars and cafes will be limited to food delivery and take-out only. The closures will take effect at 9 a.m. on Tuesday, March 17.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/new-york-city-movie-theaters-ordered-close-coronavirus-pandemic-1284783

This is what is needed to flatten the curve. Don't leave it in the hands of the general public, who has already proven to be irresponsible about dealing with COVID-19.

[70 copo]

Very Likely that this is it: https://www.dailywire.com/news/report-plasma-therapy-showing-excellent-results-against-coronavirus

[Lee Stewart]

Very Likely that this is it: https://www.dailywire.com/news/report-plasma-therapy-showing-excellent-results-against-coronavirus

That is the second good piece of news I have seen. This was the first:

Roche gets special FDA nod for Covid-19 diagnostic test

https://medcitynews.com/2020/03/roche-gets-special-fda-nod-for-covid-19-diagnostic-test/

[70 copo]

In the mean time 4 weeks ago, I didn't trust the media to know winter from summer or night from day. Just because they're not talking impeachment this week doesn't mean that they suddenly got smart.

Sure there's a virus. But I'm convinced it's danger pales in comparison to the danger of the manufactured panic the media is stoking 24/7.

[Lee Stewart]

I do not want to be looked at as "Chicken Little." At the same time I do want everyone to heed what is recommended by the professionals even if it alters your style of living.

Yes the media is 'stirring the pot" but look at just the headlines:

https://www.bloomberg.com/

[70 copo]

The market has been a day on day off Bull Trap for the last two weeks. Predicted it and sidelined my money.

The media is driving the market and everything else into the toilet.

[70 copo]

The scariest thing about this is that the people of this country cannot trust the media to give them the truth without sensationalizing it or politicizing it, or out and out lying about it. Think about that, your source of information cannot be trusted so the "facts" get twisted to support the politics.

An even worse pox on those who choose to weaponize a national emergency when this ends - and it will.

[NorCam]

This makes total sense to me. More people should be doing this. We are.

https://i.ibb.co/swtHv2C/Example.jpg

[442w30]

Sure there's a virus. But I'm convinced it's danger pales in comparison to the danger of the manufactured panic the media is stoking 24/7.

The media blah blah blah.....love it how the members of the tribe constantly push their agenda in a thread titled "Musclecar prices and the possible recession," ignoring such things as actual experts at the CDC saying one thing and the WH saying another. Hell, my sister works for the NIH and their guy in the big office isn't allowed to say anything official without being cleared by the WH....I mean, really? Is that what we have become? It's effed up.

Do we really have to be subjected to this on Yenko.net?:dunno:

[Lee Stewart]

The media blah blah blah.....love it how the members of the tribe constantly push their agenda in a thread titled "Musclecar prices and the possible recession," ignoring such things as actual experts at the CDC saying one thing and the WH saying another. Hell, my sister works for the NIH and their guy in the big office isn't allowed to say anything official without being cleared by the WH....I mean, really? Is that what we have become? It's effed up.

Do we really have to be subjected to this on Yenko.net?:dunno:

So with all your years of expertise and wisdom, please give us your opinion on "Musclecar prices and the possible recession." I don't see that in your post Diego.

[442w30]

I offer no expertise or wisdom, but I know when I smell $#!+. Apologies if my post was dissonant for you.

[70 copo]

The media blah blah blah.....love it how the members of the tribe constantly push their agenda in a thread titled "Musclecar prices and the possible recession," ignoring such things as actual experts at the CDC saying one thing and the WH saying another. Hell, my sister works for the NIH and their guy in the big office isn't allowed to say anything official without being cleared by the WH....I mean, really? Is that what we have become? It's effed up.

Do we really have to be subjected to this on Yenko.net?:dunno:

I agree. The winners here are going to write the history and it always happens exactly that way, so if some people see a muscle car as an investment and want to debate how world events can impact that investment then who are we to tell them they cannot have that discussion?

[Lee Stewart]

I offer no expertise or wisdom, but I know when I smell $#!+. Apologies if my post was dissonant for you.

Not at all. But I do know that any discussion of politics is forbidden here at Yenko.net.

[Lee Stewart]

https://i.postimg.cc/yNq9T4jd/santa-ana.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

ALBUQUERQUE, N.M. - Santa Ana Pueblo and The Tamaya Enterprises Board of Directors announced they will temporarily close Santa Ana Star Casino Hotel beginning Sunday, March 15.

The 30-day closure is part of an effort to promote social distancing amid the COVID-19 pandemic.

[Lee Stewart]

Inovio Pharmaceuticals set to trial Covid-19 vaccine in April

Inovio Pharmaceuticals has expedited its timeline for the development of a Covid-19 vaccine candidate, INO-4800, with human clinical trials scheduled for April.

The company already had a vaccine candidate in Phase II development for similar coronavirus that leads to the development of Middle East Respiratory Syndrome (MERS).

Inovio leveraged its DNA medicines platform to design INO-4800 within three hours of the publication of the novel coronavirus’ genetic sequence.

In January, the company started preclinical testing of the Covid-19 vaccine candidate and obtained funding from the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations (CEPI) to support preclinical and initial clinical development.

Preclinical testing is ongoing, while the company developed and finalised human clinical trial designs. Inovio has generated 3,000 INO-4800 doses for trials conducted in patients across the US, China and South Korea.

https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/news/inovio-covid-19-vaccine-timeline/

[Hotrodpaul]

I think for those investors that had the foresight to pull their money out of the market 2-3 weeks ago could find some sweet deals on quality musclecars and I told myself 3 weeks ago the market was about to go through a correction but I did not act on it. Now, I am stuck with a 30% loss and have decided to ride it out and may even put additional money in the market since there are some good value's out there. I don't see musclecar prices falling 30% so now they are more expensive to me, forcing a possible purchase to be delayed. Another big factor for me is that my business is tied to the oil industry, so with prices in the $30 a barrel range, income could be cut by 50% or more. This really reduces the cash available to play in the musclecar market and could force the sale of some of my cars.

[Tracker1]

The scariest thing about this is that the people of this country cannot trust the media to give them the truth without sensationalizing it or politicizing it, or out and out lying about it. Think about that, your source of information cannot be trusted so the "facts" get twisted to support the politics.

An even worse pox on those who choose to weaponize a national emergency when this ends - and it will.

I wasn't going to weigh in here, because everyone seems to have become an armchair disease expert and economist on here in the last week, but WOW, WOW... This post....And somebody said there's no politics allowed on yenko.net???? Yeah, right! Holy crap, this reads like a hand-out to all the Junior Interns who got hired at the White House last month.

You don't like your country's media? Then turn on the BBC or the CBC (that's British Broadcasting Co. & Canadian Broadcasting Co. if you're not sure) They speak English, but you'll find that the "news" isn't any less grim and sensational because this is a REAL pandemic with REAL consequences and REAL deaths. To the guys here bashing the media - we get what party you vote for, loud & clear. Don't try and disguise it behind a car comment. Pack it up and take your campaigning somewhere else. This is a MUSCLECAR FORUM not Breitbart.

As to car prices, this will make the slide that's been happening move a little faster. But the good cars will take a much lesser hit, as the Fuller LS6 vert showed. Same as any market downturn, it's a no-brainer.

Now please, somebody lock this thread or start moderating it cuz it's at a B.S. tipping point.

[markinnaples]

I absolutely disagree with your post Tracker; this is an important topic that needs to be discussed. I appreciate different points of view, and so far, there only seems to be some reasonable disagreement (relatively respectable I thought considering the sensitivity of the subject). Why shut it down? It's up to Steve if he wants to, and I understand if he doesn't want it on here so it doesn't degrade, but I'm a full believer in free speech even if it disagrees with my own views, and you seem to be the only one injecting specific politics into it with that statement. Can we not just remain above the fray and have respectful discussions without getting into ad hominem attacks?

[70 copo]

Tracker,

Look when people take the thread into the ditch and away from the cars and start posting media hype the matter becomes matter a fact then doesn't it?

To be fair this is This is a Muscle car forum-- right you are-- so why do links to media keep getting posted here to add to the fear?

That is precisely the point I am making in my replies to this thread to date.

[Late BrakeU2]

Did anyone watch Mecum? Not encouraging. The longer term concern is boomers are in their fall and winter of the hobby, and younger folks can't relate to muscle cars on a scale like our generation.. because they didn't experience it first hand like we did.

[Lee Stewart]

If I am being accused as a Fear Monger let me apologize to all. It was my intention to post articles and discuss issues that would help members get a better understanding of the current situation that is affecting all of us.

I took this liberty with the best intentions. The thread starter asked for speculative opinions: Musclecar prices and the possible recession. I saw that as an opportunity to discuss the possibility of a recession based on the issues that are causing said recession; COVID-19 and what has happened to the Oil market. If you believe it is anything else then we agree to disagree.

I have stopped posting in this thread and have moved over to my thread: You Can't Make This Stuff Up! If you would like to discuss these two issues further it is probably a better place. Of course someone (not me) could start a new thread in the Lounge Forum specifically dealing with the COVID-19 pandemic.

Lee Stewart

[70 copo]

Lee,

I am not sure we need a thread on an issue which will be in all likelihood a non issue in 60 days or less.

We just hurt ourselves and the hobby in the process if we give in to the fear and hype currently surrounding this.

[Tracker1]

Tracker,

Look when people take the thread into the ditch and away from the cars and start posting media hype the matter becomes matter a fact then doesn't it?

To be fair this is This is a Muscle car forum-- right you are-- so why do links to media keep getting posted here to add to the fear?

That is precisely the point I am making in my replies to this thread to date.

YOU said this epidemic was a media "hoax" in your post on March 10 - now, gee, who talks like that and uses that kind of phrasing...hmmmmm....let me think. Try telling families who have lost loved ones to this that they are the victims of a hoax - let's see how that goes for you.

This above phrasing in certain posts is what I am referring to markinnaples - I'm just calling it out. If you don't see it, and smell it, I can't help ya.

There have been some links here that are useful and helpful including Tenney's youtube link. i found it informative and thank him for posting it.

[the427king]

silver down 30%, ford down 38%, oil down 50%,disney stock down 32%,mecum 70 cuda down 8%...........you decide where to put your money LOL

[Tenney]

Flu season is almost 100% during the cold weather months. Just by higher temps, greater indoor humidity and stronger UV rays, these really help in killing off the flu. So our leaders are placing their hopes that warmer weather will help eradicate COVID-19. IMO - it's wishful thinking and nothing more.

It's summer in Australia.

[Steve Shauger]

The media sensationalizes everything as a general statement. For instance when we get 3 inches of snow here on Long Island it's considered a blizzard and half the island shuts down.


I use that as an example of our local media outlets. I certainly don't want to minimize the present situation. Regarding our site quite honestly I get tired of all the updates posted on how far the stock market has dropped. You can get real-time analysis from whatever news outlet you fancy.


The steps that have been taken to curb the spread of the virus hopefully will have the correct effect. There are unknowns and peoples natural reaction is flight or fight. Lets fight through this together.


The best thing we can do is support each other, discuss our projects, new acquisitions and how your car performed on your last drive. For example I took the 67 L78 survivor Camaro out yesterday. With 456's I can't shift fast enough, with D-70-14 the tires grab like I'm on snow, and at 50mph I'm running 3150 rpm's. With that said, I enjoyed the heck out of the drive. Oh I took a picture when I stopped at a Harbor Freight store. met a bunch of motorheads and talked tools :)


Let's stick to the ultimate mission/goal of the site, a place where likeminded enthusiast can exchange ideas, develop friendships, and help other hobbyist and share our car experiences.


Lets get back to our mission......

[Lee Stewart]

Lee,

I am not sure we need a thread on an issue which will be in all likelihood a non issue in 60 days or less.

We just hurt ourselves and the hobby in the process if we give in to the fear and hype currently surrounding this.

Please! Take the time and effort to educate me where you firmly believe the COVID-19 pandemic here in the USA will be a "non-issue in 60 days or less."

[Z15 SS 454]

If I am being accused as a Fear Monger let me apologize to all. It was my intention to post articles and discuss issues that would help members get a better understanding of the current situation that is affecting all of us.

I took this liberty with the best intentions. The thread starter asked for speculative opinions: Musclecar prices and the possible recession. I saw that as an opportunity to discuss the possibility of a recession based on the issues that are causing said recession; COVID-19 and what has happened to the Oil market. If you believe it is anything else then we agree to disagree.

I have stopped posting in this thread and have moved over to my thread: You Can't Make This Stuff Up! If you would like to discuss these two issues further it is probably a better place. Of course someone (not me) could start a new thread in the Lounge Forum specifically dealing with the COVID-19 pandemic.

Lee Stewart
Lee,
No need to apologize as I feel we all appreciate your inputs on this site. I feel it is ok to have healthy debate over things as we are all individuals and cant possibly agree on all things. (as long as it does not turn into personal attacks)

No one knows how this will turn out and that causes worry which makes sense. Sometimes chatting it up with like minded individuals (cars not political affiliation) eases some of the worry.

I have some worry, My wife and I are 44 years old. non smokers and live a healthy lifestyle but she got severe pneumonia 2 years ago and still has respiratory issues.
I have 2 young kids, one in day care...

My wife and I are both Employers to 8 people that have families and rely on us as much as we rely on them.

With that being said I think we are all going to be Ok as long as we have our families and friends/friends of this site around us!

[Hotrodpaul]

Maybe it's time to buy some United Airline stock trading now at 1/3 the price it was back in December. Once the pandemic is under control and people get back to usual life and flying again, the stock should rebound or at least double what it is now in 6-12 months. Then I can afford to buy that nice 66 Nova I have been wanting....

[67since67]

For example I took the 67 L78 survivor Camaro out yesterday. With 456's I can't shift fast enough, with D-70-14 the tires grab like I'm on snow, and at 50mph I'm running 3150 rpm's. With that said, I enjoyed the heck out of the drive. Oh I took a picture when I stopped at a Harbor Freight store. met a bunch of motorheads and talked tools :)

Lets get back to our mission......

Steve, your Camaros are absolutely stunning, every one of them!!!

[RPOLS3]

The media sensationalizes everything as a general statement. For instance when we get 3 inches of snow here on Long Island it's considered a blizzard and half the island shuts down.


I use that as an example of our local media outlets. I certainly don't want to minimize the present situation. Regarding our site quite honestly I get tired of all the updates posted on how far the stock market has dropped. You can get real-time analysis from whatever news outlet you fancy.


The steps that have been taken to curb the spread of the virus hopefully will have the correct effect. There are unknowns and peoples natural reaction is flight or fight. Lets fight through this together.


The best thing we can do is support each other, discuss our projects, new acquisitions and how your car performed on your last drive. For example I took the 67 L78 survivor Camaro out yesterday. With 456's I can't shift fast enough, with D-70-14 the tires grab like I'm on snow, and at 50mph I'm running 3150 rpm's. With that said, I enjoyed the heck out of the drive. Oh I took a picture when I stopped at a Harbor Freight store. met a bunch of motorheads and talked tools :)


Let's stick to the ultimate mission/goal of the site, a place where likeminded enthusiast can exchange ideas, develop friendships, and help other hobbyist and share our car experiences.


Lets get back to our mission......



Amen!

[Crush]

OK here’s some good news we will all benefit from lower gas prices so we can drive our cars. Who knows maybe they’ll get back to 70s prices! Russia and Saudi Arabia are going to continue to produce more and more who knows……

[70 copo]

Yes perhaps I can get a deal on Turbo Blue... Lets go drive em!

[tom406]

I've already talked about some of the reality here on the ground in Seattle. I now have someone close to me who is advanced in years, showing symptoms, and is going to be tested for COVID-19. Its real AF for many of us, so while I'm open to debating responses and policies, I have little patience to engage with anyone referring to this situation as a hoax.

I value this community-its why this is the one website I've frequented pretty much since I began surfing the internet. It has consistently remained informative and above the fray of petty internet BS. I'm hugely appreciative of it in many ways-everything from learning how to analyze Chevrolet engine stamp pads to actually having several people share the wrenching loss of a spouse or child. That's not par for the course on internet boards.

I appreciate the honest and open discussion, and hope it continues in most ways. One thing I took away from the 2016 election/culture war, is that scolding-especially in a snarky, dismissive way-is really only for the poster's ego and isn't going to actually sway anyone's opinion. Nobody is listening after they are insulted. They just aren't, whether they've just been called a "snowflake" or a "deplorable". So, if you read back what you've typed and it reads like a scold for not feeling the way you feel, delete it and try again or go work on your car.

I love these old cars. They've been dominant in my life since I was about 4 (really) and my business for half my life. I'm 50 and I'm fortunate to have a comfortable life, mostly related to marrying a great partner with skills she could monetize. Most of my regular clients and close friends in this hobby are older than me-many are as old or older than my Dad. I'm not really sure where some of you get this endless optimism about the market for these cars, even the "blue-chip" collectibles. I certainly don't think the market is going to end in my lifetime, but I struggle to come up with people I know personally my age or younger who I really believe will EVER line up to pay six figures for a 1960's muscle car, regardless of how well their portfolio is doing. Who is in the BJ/Ebay/Mecum audience in 10 years?

As for the near future, I think that the best stuff will stay strong if the economic fallout isn't too severe. In 2007, I saw a lot of cars hit the market and a lot of serious collectors get squeezed by their debts. Most of them were self-made contractor types and they had too many notes come due. Not only were they no longer buyers, they were having to liquidate some awfully good cars. As for the rest, I can't see the bread and butter middle market doing anything but settling. Few people can be thinking of looking for a random Camaro or '57 Chevy to take to Cars and Coffee in the summer of 2020, whatever they think about their personal risk to Coronavirus.

As ever, thanks to the forum for letting me share my .02c.

TOM

[Late BrakeU2]

Maybe it's time to buy some United Airline stock trading now at 1/3 the price it was back in December. Once the pandemic is under control and people get back to usual life and flying again, the stock should rebound or at least double what it is now in 6-12 months. Then I can afford to buy that nice 66 Nova I have been wanting....

I would wait on that, my buddy said the same thing and i bet him it would be half of what it is now by summer. Airline 1st Q #s will be bad, but will look stellar compared to Q2.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/air-canada-pulls-forecasts-draws-164906718.html
jmho

[70 copo]

Everybody- Stay Calm, Don't Panic, Turn the TV off and give it a rest.

Marking the Calendar for 60 days from today. We will be sure to revisit our progress then as we come together to beat this.

[Astock]

Lee,

I am not sure we need a thread on an issue which will be in all likelihood a non issue in 60 days or less.

We just hurt ourselves and the hobby in the process if we give in to the fear and hype currently surrounding this.

Tracker-
You don't need to be an expert on disease or economics, just common sense.
I posted the statistics on daily car accidents, since it is a car site, and I guess fear over rules logic.
Killed everyday, around 3500. Injured or disabled around 100,000 daily. Add those numbers up since covid 19 showed up. In just 2-3 normal days, more deaths in driving than covid 19 total.
Mortality rate 10x more. Chance of getting in an accident are also 10x more than contracting the virus.
So, don't get in your cars, and drive to the market and clean out the shelves, I had to drink my coffee without cream this morning.

And, I only jump in the market, when there is major fear Driving the stocks down. In this case, the fear lows are not here yet.

[Hotrodpaul]

Wow, DJI falls 3000 points today, worst selloff since Black Monday 1987. Looks like we are in for an extended downturn, this is crazy!

[markinnaples]

While panic and overreaction are rampant, killer gas prices are here as I paid $1.88 at Sam's earlier today. It's been a long, long time since that I've seen that price.

[the427king]

Killer gas prices and real big drop in adjustable rate loans.

[m22mike]

While panic and overreaction are rampant, killer gas prices are here as I paid $1.88 at Sam's earlier today. It's been a long, long time since that I've seen that price.


$1.59 in my hood now, not a good thing , never thought I would say that.:confused2:

Mike

[Astock]

According to professor Chris Whitty, top expert in disease (England's chief medical officer, and UK department of health's top scientific adviser) said a few hours ago, "mortality rate might be 1% or less". That's 1 out of 100 chance of dying from the viral infection, if you even get it.

Just pissed off since yesterday, after leaving the supermarket, and seeing and feeling the panic. Sheep scurrying for their lives, trying to stay up with the herd of other scared sheep. So ridiculous!

Btw: The first community acquired C-19 reported yesterday in Orange County. There's like 3.5 million plus that live here, yet the shelves are empty, and I still don't have cream for coffee in the morning?

[purple panther]

stocks- bonds and gold were all sold today. Probably margin calls

[69LM1]

Just pissed off since yesterday, after leaving the supermarket, and seeing and feeling the panic. Sheep scurrying for their lives, trying to stay up with the herd of other scared sheep. So ridiculous!

Btw: The first community acquired C-19 reported yesterday in Orange County. There's like 3.5 million plus that live here, yet the shelves are empty, and I still don't have cream for coffee in the morning?

Now yall know what it's like living in the south during hurricane season! :)

Joking. Cream is important!

/Rich

[Astock]

We took two direct hits from Frances and Gene months apart in 04, after 3 months of living in Fl. The 68' Harry Mann Camaro came 3 feet away from being crushed dead center, by a 100 year old oak. Hurricanes are inconvenient, to say the least.

[Crush]

Back to the topic of this thread. I was talking with my 25-year-old son tonight who is a professional automotive photographer, And an absolute car nut! Him and his buddies are mostly interested in some of the older European cars like Nissan GTR’s, Datsuns even some V dubs as well as Porsche, Ferrari etc.. lots of his buddies are buying these, along w Supras etc and fixing them up. They are not interested in “ muscle cars” except for a few Vettes. Needless to say he has been around and driven a ton of high end cars old and new and just loves the foreign jobs.
PS he’s not panicking about the corona virus either.. good kid!:laugh:

[32KZ]

My son and his wife, both mid 20's, both engineers. Starting off ahead of the curve, he has no student loans, her's all but paid off. Both pretty frugal, but spend smart money. He's into the old stuff, but not so much his inner circle of friends, just too out of reach. Has a pretty clean 90 F150, highschool truck, hanging onto for a future project. And will eventually get the keys to the Z, but I think he's in the minority. I just don't see his generation having the disposable income to keep supporting this hobby, overall. Unless prices start dropping(like old gassers) plus their kid's college prices....my cousin is a pretty successful electrical engineer, talk at his alumni reunion was the fact of trying to afford sending their kids,,to the college they graduated from. Without mountains of debt.

And like yours crush, not panicking corona. Aware, taking preventive measures, more concerned about spreading to certain target groups vs. actually contracting it.

[Mr70]

Does anyone know what the over/under is on the BBQ? :)