Bought a REAL tow vehicle

[Lynn]

I have chronicled my journey turning a plain jane 307 PG 68 El Camino into a beast of a tow vehicle. Beast is a relative term here. Compared to any other El Camino on the planet; yes. Compared to a REAL tow vehicle; not so much.

Even with all the upgrading (boxed rear frame rails, built in receiver hitch that would survive a nuclear disaster, air shocks in the rear, cargo coils, big radiator, external oil cooler, extra trans cooler, 5.7 sbc with roller cam, 4L60E with stand alone controller, and 3.31 12 bolt rear, big Corvette/Truck disc brakes in the front and 12 inch drums in the rear) it is still a bit light for heavy towing.

Don't get me wrong, it has NEVER let me down. Came close on the trip to St. Louis and back when a BRAND NEW T-stat failed causing chronic overheating on the trip. But still made it home even with a trailer on the back. It is just too light to haul really heavy loads. I don't do that often, but when I do, I want something a bit beefier. The El Camino is actually on parr with my 04 Yukon XL Denali AWD. But, being a 1500, even that one isn't great with the load is really big. Small car (like the Spitfire I just sold) on my 18 foot car hauler; no problem. Big load, just don't feel as good about it. We want to keep the Yukon as it is incredibly comfortable for a 20 year old vehicle, and it has ALL the creature comforts, even the Bose sound system which still works perfectly. And full time AWD means it is the perfect winter beater when we get ice and snow.

I have been jealous of Ryan's tow vehicle acquisition from last year:
https://www.yenko.net/forum/showthread.php?t=176903&page=5

Such a smart choice for his needs. And, given his location, I certainly get the 4WD choice.

So, I have been keeping my eye out for something similar. I did not want four wheel drive. I won't be driving it in the snow. Wanted the simplicity of 2WD. I agree with Ryan, and decided against the 3500HD dually. Buying four tires sucks bad enough. I didn't care if it had leather, power seats or the high end stereo, auto air, etc. In fact on older vehicles, sometimes simple is better; less to go wrong.

This truck literally fell into my lap. Bought it from a long time friend. His dad gave it to him. 87000 actual miles. Extended cab. Cloth rear in pristine condition. No clear coat peeling. Full 8'2" bed, so I can fit full sheets of plywood in the bed with the tail gate up, even with the camper shell on it (if I choose to keep it). Has the tow package with the self leveling rear. Yeah, my El Camino levels for the most part (until the cargo coils and air shocks get overwhelmed) but it isn't auto. I have to manually fill the shocks which I can do from the cabin. Was nicer when my JacPack controller still worked.

Here's the best part. 496 (8.1) with the Allison trans. What a beast. Yes, I know, it will pass everything but a gas station. The only service light on was "change oil but that is only because it had not be reset last oil change. I reset it this evening. Even the "service engine soon" light is off!!!! Oil has not been changed since March 2023, and it is just as clean and clear as you could hope for. Records indicate QS synthetic, which is what i am using in the Yukon.

What needs addressed (other than standard fluid changes, checking brakes etc. and a really good washing):

1. Front tires are not Load Range E. Rear tires are, but are some brand x made in China. So, a new set of tires is in order.

2. Hickey on the RR of the bed. Most of the damage is below the belt line, so will likely just to a spot repair. The slight damage above the belt line will PDR out I am certain.

3. One big scratch on the tail gate. May or may not fix that. It is a work truck.

4. Odometer read out is intermittent. An internet search indicates there is a peg connector on the back side of the instrument cluster that likely needs to be resoldered. Very common problem that is fixable in 30 min at no cost.

5. There is some glue residue on driver's door where a sign had been. Some of it came right off with brake cleaner. The rest is very dry and old. I was able to lightly scrape a small part and it comes off as powder. Then compound and it the underlying paint comes shining through. So, that will probably take longer than the dash repair.

That's it. I hadn't even HOPED to find an 8.1 Allison combo, as I never see them around here. But I had driven one a few years ago, and was really impressed. I just can't do a diesel, as I can't stand the smell, and don't know how to work on them. Finding an 8.1 with 87k miles made it too good to pass up.

The guy I bought it from gave me a smoking deal, as he wants to be able to borrow it a couple times a year. He would have kept it, but it won't fit in his garage, and barely fits the driveway. He made his wife really happy today.

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

Wow you are completely 100% set up now!!!

What year is your new truck? Looks like a 2000-2005.

The 8.1 and Allison is the best option for sure, and the 2500 HD only comes with 4.10 gears.

Differences:
Mine, Yours
6.5’ Short bed, 8’ Long bed
4X4, 2WD
6.0, 8.1
4L80E, Allison 5? Speed
3.73, 4.10
G80, G80?
2000, 2001?

Great truck, great choice!!!

I’m excited to see how it works for you!!!

I think if I was to buy a truck knowing what I know now I would buy one right in between these two trucks, 4.10 gears for sure, HD for sure, (I’m not sure about the 8.1/Allison as I drive mine semi frequently)

I’m not convinced that one drivetrain is better or worse for mileage as either is terrible, maybe one is less terrible than the other?

I would like my truck to be able to tow my trailer and Cutlass steady at 110kph in OD, in tow haul mode, without shifting at the smallest hill, 4.10’s would sure help.

Very cool!!!


Ryan W31

Ryan 2500 :-)

[dykstra]

Congrats! Looks like a solid truck Lynn!!

[Lynn]

Thanks Ryan. You were part of the inspiration for this.
It's an 02. And yes, the Allison is a five speed. It is the same as the six speed. According to one article I read:

"...the only difference being the valve body and transmission control module (TCM). The five-speed version lacked the solenoids and fluid passageways needed to engage the sixth forward ratio.
A six-speed conversion kit is available to upgrade the five-speed Allison to a six-speed. The conversion kit includes a new valve body, wiring harness, and solenoids, as well as custom TCM tuning. The benefits of the conversion kit include: Smoother shifts, Better fuel economy, Better power delivery, Lowered road noise, and Less wear on the engine."

Unless I am going to be on the highway a lot, don't know that I would do that. The kits are close to $2k. The engine was only turning 2200 rpm at 80 mph driving home last night.

Thanks Dave.

[396 SS/RS]

Nice looking truck that will get the job done. I had a 2k 1500 short bed once and it was a good truck. My only issue was half of the dash lights quit illuminating I ordered new lights from Mouser, pulled the dash and replaced them all. I didn't realize so many were burned out.

[YenkoYS-199Stinger]

Very nice. I special ordered my 03' back in the day with the 8.1 and the Allison. It was a towing beast!!! I did put a program on it and picked up about 1.5 mpg.

[Too Many Projects]

Wow, Lynn, Beautiful truck !! All of them up here in those years have gone back to earth from rust.
I had an '00 with the cloth seats and it was the most comfortable truck I've owned.

Keep the topper on, you'll get used to it and will appreciate it for when you want to transport stuff in inclement weather. It's aerodynamic and paint to match helps it blend right in. My 2011 didn't have one and even though I prefer a truck without a topper, I bought a new ARE and had it painted to match right away.

[jer]

I'll pile on here.......great choice and even around here in the non-rust belt, these trucks are really scarce.
I'd have to guess it's an 01, based on my truck being the same year and I can't find anything that's not of that year.
Mine's an LT 2500HD 4wd with the 6.0 and 4l80.....good all around truck and mine's pewter also.

[Lynn]

What do you guys like for tires on a vehicle like this for highway. No knobbies or off road stuff.

For forty years I have bought Michelin for almost everything.

Starting to second guess their quality control. Last three sets I installed were not as round as what I have expected from them.

I like Continental for quality control, but I don't see where they have a Load range E tire in a highway tread.

[Pro Stock John]

Nice purchase.

My buddy tows with the same truck, it's an 04. He swapped out the 4.10s for 3.42s.

[Donnie]

What do you guys like for tires on a vehicle like this for highway. No knobbies or off road stuff.

For forty years I have bought Michelin for almost everything.

Starting to second guess their quality control. Last three sets I installed were not as round as what I have expected from them.

I like Continental for quality control, but I don't see where they have a Load range E tire in a highway tread.

I would stick with the Michelin's

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&partnum=475R6LTXAT2V3&&autoMake=Chevrolet&autoYear=2002&autoModel=Silverado+2500HD+4wd&autoModClar=

[olredalert]

----I have Michelin's on my 3/4 Suburban which is more or less set up for very heavy towing (11,000 lb boat). I specified a quiet tire as there are so many yahoo's here in Michigan that tire dealers expect everyone that comes in the door to want "rock climbers". Am very happy with the ones I ended up with. If you need to I'll get the numbers for you, Lynn.....Bill S

[Too Many Projects]

WOW, tires have gotten expensive !! I run E's on my summer wheels and will need to replace them next year. Looks like I need to figure at LEAST $1,000-1,200. I don't recall what the tires on it now cost but it wasn't near that much. I live near a Tire Rack DC and get a $15 per tire discount for picking them up there.

[67since67]

Michelin's Defender LTX M/S here, recently replaced the OE GY's on the 2500 with Defender "E's", and on the 1500 the summer 22" Defenders ride and quiet is better than the winter OE GY 20's.

That's a great score on that truck Lynn!! That 8.1 Vortec/Allison combo is a beast!

[scuncio]

Nice truck! My 04 is still my go-to tow vehicle.

[Lynn]

Bill S. Thanks so much for the offer. Unbelievably, a member has reached out and has five tires that will work perfectly, and they are local to me.

Things just keep falling into place on this deal.

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

Bill S. Thanks so much for the offer. Unbelievably, a member has reached out and has five tires that will work perfectly, and they are local to me.

Things just keep falling into place on this deal.

Can’t wait to see this truck towing something!!!

Ryan W31

[Ryan1969Chevelle]

Have you taken the truck for a few test drives?

The 8.1 and Allison and 4.10’s must be kick ass for towing!!!

Ryan W31

[Lynn]

Have driven very little. Don't trust the rear tires (made in China).

Headed out early in the morning to meet a fellow member about 90 miles from home to pick up five new tires already mounted and balanced on the correct 8 lug wheels. He made me a deal I couldn't refuse. Bridgestone V-Steel tires with almost no miles. He decided to go with off road tires instead of highway.

Truck has 3.73 rear screw.

I MAY get a chance to swap out the tires and wheels tomorrow, but may not. We are hosting a fundraiser at the museum on the 24th, and my time is almost all spoken for the next two weeks. Headed to bed now, as I need to be up at 6.

[olredalert]

----Geez, Lynn. I was going to mention Bridgestones. When I used to haul around Red Alert I needed a set of tires on my old 1-ton dually and went to buy Michelins. The dealer said I'd be happy with Bridgestones compared to M's, especially the price. I went with them and put almost 90,000 miles on them. I was in California for the Hot Rod Reunion and finally needed new tires again. Put another set of B's on and actually sold the old ones to a guy in Bakersfield at the track....Bill S

[Lynn]

I have used Bridgestones several times on my old Bimmer. Never been disappointed.

Picked them up early this morning. Getting ready to head down to the shop to install them.
Will be gone most of the day.

Many thanks to Gary (muscle_collector) for giving me such a smoking deal on these. Almost no miles. Spare has never been on the ground.

[396 SS/RS]

The shop that services my company truck highly recommended the Cooper over Michelin as he said Michelin quality has gone down. I went with the Cooper AT3 on my company truck since I travel on caliche roads a lot here in Texas. I was concerned about road noise and there was virtually none up until about 40k. Now there is some road noise but not that bad.

FWIW, I like Michelins for their ride, grip, long wear. I'll probably go with them on my '21 HD 2500.

[Lynn]

Got my new tires and wheel installed. Took me a while to figure out how to get this beast up on my lift. 157.5 inch wheel base. My Studebaker dump truck is only 131. That's about what the Yukon XL Denali is as well.

Rode really well. No vibration, so I guess the balance is good. I would have checked the balance on my wheel balancer, but I didn't have a large enough cone. Got one ordered.

While on the lift, I checked brakes; about 75% material left.

Also looked at the spin on filter for the trans: Fram. Yikes. Guys on the Ferrari forum have a saying: "Friends don't let friends use Fram filters."

Trans fluid is a little dark. I know the oil has been changed once a year over the last 9 years, even though the PO was only putting about 1500 miles a year on it. Doesn't look like the trans has been properly serviced, so will get that taken care of with proper filters.

Forgot to measure my pan, so don't know if it has deep or shallow.

Any Allison gurus here? What about TranSynd fluid?

[Lynn]

After a LOT of reading, I bought the Transynd fluid. Also bought Baldwin filters.

We have our Museum fundraiser next week, so I am buried in prep for that, but may still get to my trans service this weekend.

Man, I love this truck.

[Too Many Projects]

Have driven very little. Don't trust the rear tires (made in China).

Headed out early in the morning to meet a fellow member about 90 miles from home to pick up five new tires already mounted and balanced on the correct 8 lug wheels. He made me a deal I couldn't refuse. Bridgestone V-Steel tires with almost no miles. He decided to go with off road tires instead of highway.

Truck has 3.73 rear screw.

I MAY get a chance to swap out the tires and wheels tomorrow, but may not. We are hosting a fundraiser at the museum on the 24th, and my time is almost all spoken for the next two weeks. Headed to bed now, as I need to be up at 6.


Seeing as how it has the 3.73 rear gears, I don't think you will want the 6th gear conversion in the trans. It may drop the rpm too low for efficient towing with the gas engine.

[Donnie]

Lynn, while your at it check the transfer case for pump rub... do a google search

[Andy]

After a LOT of reading, I bought the Transynd fluid. Also bought Baldwin filters.

We have our Museum fundraiser next week, so I am buried in prep for that, but may still get to my trans service this weekend.

Man, I love this truck.

Yes, to both Transynd and Baldwin Filters. Make sure there is a magnet on top of the spin on filter. I use same fluid and filter in my 05 LLY Duramax. The GMT800 platform is one of the best trucks GM ever made. I love mine. Seats in them are almost like a lazy-boy recliner! Enjoy the truck!

[Lynn]

Seeing as how it has the 3.73 rear gears, I don't think you will want the 6th gear conversion in the trans. It may drop the rpm too low for efficient towing with the gas engine.

I agree. Already did the math. Just makes no sense.

[Lynn]

Lynn, while your at it check the transfer case for pump rub... do a google search


2WD. No transfer case.

[Lynn]

As for the math on the trans:

Right now, with .71 OD in fifth gear my RPM at 75 MPH is 2190.
If I did the conversion (at about $2000 even doing everything myself) I would have a .61 sixth gear and would drop cruising RPM to 1878.

Might make sense with 4.10 rear gears, but makes no sense with the 3.73.

I have no trouble getting underway with the 3.10 first gear.

Happy with it just the way it is.

Serviced the trans yesterday using TranSynd. Wish there were a way to tell for certain what fluid was in it. Had a really crappy aftermarket spin-on filter on it, but I don't THINK the pan had ever been off. Just to make certain I get as much of the old fluid out as possible (without using a very expensive pump set up) will drive it a few days, then do a drain and fill one more time.

Man, the underside of this truck is clean.

Also, it drives great with the new Bridgestone V-Steel tires. Gary made me a helluva deal on those, and I am very thankful.

[Too Many Projects]

Well, after reading your picky butt liked these tires, :laugh: I went looking for them to see what a set would cost....make yours last, they seem to be discontinued...:rolleyes2:. This happens all too often with me...find something I might like and they have become unobtainium.
I can't stand the Coopers I bought several years ago off tire rack. The pic was a true 5 rib, P series but the LT series came with a block tread that, even though I am half deaf, drive me nuts from the road noise and it's only getting worse as they wear...:bs:

[muscle_collector]

i believe they recently renamed them Bridgestone R265 5-Rib Load Range E

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=R265+5-Rib&partnum=475R6265V3&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

[Too Many Projects]

i believe they recently renamed them Bridgestone R265 5-Rib Load Range E

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=R265+5-Rib&partnum=475R6265V3&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes
Yes, but it only comes in 1 size and it's not the size I need.

[Lynn]

What size do you need Mitch?

The R265 5-Rib Load Range E posted is definitely the same tread pattern.

[Too Many Projects]

The size associated with the R265 is listed as 245/75/16. I need 265/70/17. Could be a misprint, but I chased this around the web for 1/2 hour this morning trying to find a 265.

[Lynn]

Do you need load range E?

[Too Many Projects]

Do you need load range E?
It's what I prefer as a safety margin for pulling the trailers. Way over rated for a 1500 Silverado, but when I travel with the car trailer, I carry a LOT of "stuff" with for emergencies and such.

[luzl78]

i put falkens on me ram 2500 with the cummins and theyve lasted 45,000 miles. not many tires last long with that heavy diesel in the front. they run super quiet.

[Donnie]

thats why I stick with the MICHELIN LTX A/T 2 ... 60,000 mile warranty and they are quiet.

[Lynn]

Anyone have a truck with the Allison trans from this period. After changing the fluid and both filters, I have a small leak. Didn't even have a drip before the change. Not leaking from either the pan or the external filter. The leak is EITHER from the shift seal OR the gasket/seal located under the electrical plug at the back of the trans.

Guessing neither of those is that difficult to fix.

[Too Many Projects]

Does that trans have an actual dipstick ? Any chance you may have over filled it a little ? As I'm sure you are well aware of, GM has a long history of shift shaft seals leaking when the converter drains back on many of their transmissions. Just a WAG at this, since no other opinions yet...:wink:

[Lynn]

Yes.
Not overfull.

[Lynn]

Follow up.

The leak was at the electrical connector. It is called a "pass through" seal.

There are two ways to approach this. 1. JUST replace the outer seal. or 2. Remove the pan and the internal wire harness and replace the entire pass through seal assembly, which is two pieces plus an "O" ring. There is actually a third way, which is buy a new internal harness, which will include the pass through seal.

The first procedure is pretty simple if you opt for that. Problem is, you won't know if that fixed it until you are done.

Here is a short clip of the removal. New piece just pops in its place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykYvOWujTyk

After a bit of research, it appears that the success rate is about 50%. I had already planned on a second drain and fill, because I don't have the means to do a complete pressurized flush. Figured I would just pull the pan and do the entire thing.

This company offers a kit with all three pieces.
https://fleeceperformance.com/media/wysiwyg/FPE-2023-105_FPE-HAR-GM-LCT-SEAL.pdf

They also provide pretty good instructions.

I ordered one. It was "delivered" to my office on December 23. Problem is, the substitute postal carrier just dropped it on the porch (tracking info said "delivered at or neat mailbox") and someone walked off with it.

Got a second one. Had them ship this one UPS as our UPS driver ALWAYS comes inside the building and drops packages off at the front desk (as does our regular postal carrier.... unlike the moron sub).

Here is a video of a guy replacing the internal wire harness.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYnQgRvSXqk&t=1463s

Super easy job if the trans is upside down on the bench. Not so easy in the vehicle. As you can see, the guy struggled a bit with it.

I could NOT get the exhaust hanger loose to get it out of the way without a torch. So, just worked around it.

If I were doing this again (won't likely need to) I would just buy a replacement harness. They are available on line at anywhere from $120 to $700 depending on where you source it, and if you are buying OEM. Why would I buy the whole harness? Using the kit that I used, I had to remove each wire and pin out of the plug assembly and then install into the new plug assembly, one at a time; all 24 of them. The retainers are really tiny. I have a dental pick I use for stuff like that, but couldn't locate it. Ended up using an ice pic, which was less than ideal. Was really afraid bending or otherwise damaging one of the pins. Also was afraid I would get a couple mixed up. No room for error.

Bottom line is that I got it done, and apparently got everything where it belongs, as the truck drives and shifts as it should. Just increased the pucker factor.

The fluid (Castrol TransSynd) is expensive. Glad I bought a 5 gallon bucket. Having pulled the pan twice, I ended up using 18.5 of the 20 quarts!!!!!

While I was doing this messy job, I decided to replace the oil cooler lines. What's a little more oil dry? One of the cooler lines had just started to drip, so I knew the other wasn't far behind. There is simply no way to pull those without making a mess. Pretty straight forward, just messy.

Best news: no more leaks!!!!

All new belts, idler pulleys and tensioners, as well as an oil and filter change and full chassis lube. Believe it or not, this thing still has grease zerks!!!

Bad news: the battery is definitely getting weak. Starting to crank slowly. This will be my fourth new battery in two months.

[Too Many Projects]

Glad you got the leak stopped and thank you for keeping the battery industry alive and functioning...:laugh: I went thru this a few years ago, where I bought 5 new ones in one summer...gets damned expensive.
My neighbor was having issues with her battery and I did a load test on it and then wanted to check the terminals for corrosion. Damned thing is under the right FRONT seat !! 2011 Jeep Cherokee. The seat is power and goes up like an old fart's lift chair to a 45 degree slant for decent access. Still a PITA working thru the back door.

[Lynn]

Lead acid battery?
Not sure I would want to be on top of one in a crash!!!

[Too Many Projects]

No, it's a sealed AGM that vents out the floor. My '08 HHR had the battery in the spare tire well. That was a lead/acid battery. Not the best place in a hard rear hit.