Western New York Supercars

[Diabl07]

Hello everyone!
I’m Jacob, I’m new to the forum and I’m looking for information if anyone has it. I’ve been browsing stuff on this site for a while getting info for my registry of the rare muscle cars that have resided where I live in Buffalo and Rochester in western New York. I have a couple cars, Yenkos and COPOs and Mopar and Pontiacs and all that, but I was wondering if anyone knew of any Yenkos or COPOs delivered new or that resided at one point or now in Western New York. I have a couple already, but I’m trying to expand the registry because I know there’s more out there. I believe there’s a few I’m missing from Taylor Chevrolet, Glen Campbell Chevrolet (who had a Z-11 Impala that’s in Texas now I think) and Bokman Chevy who may have had a few Yenko/COPO cars.
Here’s a small list of what I have so far

124679N709626 (which I believe to be in a collection here)
124379N666301 (delivered new to Molyne Chevrolet in Rochester)
And 124378N472062 which is the really pretty bronze car Bill Wertheim had for a time
And an unknown Z-L1 in Rochester in the 1970s

There’s a lot more on the Mopar/Shelby/Pontia side but I’m definitely more interested in the Yenko and COPO stuff.
If anyone has any information that could help me find some of this stuff I’d really appreciate it! Or if you have stories or cars delivered new to WNY, I’d love to hear them

Thank you all so much!
Jacob

[smallblockhero]

Im from Buffalo and can tell you about many that once resided here. many of the best were sold years ago and went out of state or to canada. i only know of one local sold COPO from Bokman chevrolet, and as far as i know it has not surfaced. there was 2 local 68 Hemi Darts sold and campaigned at Niagara. Holiday oldsmobile (now Basil Ford) sold many local Hurst Olds in the area. There was 1 local small block AC Cobra years ago. And everybody knows the legend of Steve Battaglia owning 7 Superbirds that he bought in the 80s and drove them everywhere.

[David C.]

One of the eight 69 TA convertibles was sold new in Clarance. I worked on a yellow 69 yenko which was drag raced in NY and eventually restored to stock trim again.

[smallblockhero]

One of the eight 69 TA convertibles was sold new in Clarence. I worked on a yellow 69 yenko which was drag raced in NY and eventually restored to stock trim again.

Not only that.. but 1 of them wound up at Bob Harris's place. not sure if it was the one sold new in Clarence. it was partially restored in one of the pole barns. When i saw i,t i looked wide eyed at Bob, he just smiled and said, " yep its a real one". needless to say i touched it all over just to be able to say i did.

its not actually WNY but, Neal Robbins in Bath NY had and restored at least 4 Yenko Deuces of his own. They were in magazines a bunch of times. None of them were sold in WNY as far as i know of. Still kinda local COPOs nonetheless.

[smallblockhero]

Not that theyre anything special.. But the 2 1971 Cutlass's were sold new at Holiday Oldsmobile. They were both dated and put on the lot within 2 days of each other. we had paperwork and grease pencil markings in the same hand writing on the core supports dating them both.

The green car is a weirdly optioned 350 2 bbl car. rear defrost, trunk release, hood lock , AM/FM with a rubber mat. my buddy still has the build sheet, he sold the car.

The Gold one was original paint, 455 TH400 car with console and A/C. Same friend owned this car as well.. recently sold to a guy in New Jersey.

[Kayli69]

There was a Boss 429 in West Seneca from the mid 80s to 1998 when it was sold to someone from the mid-west

The owner of this car also had a friend with a 70 Hemi Cuda and a 69 Hemi Satellite, both in West Seneca. I am unsure what happened with these. I last saw them in 1998

[fortim]

Not only that.. but 1 of them wound up at Bob Harris's place. not sure if it was the one sold new in Clarence. it was partially restored in one of the pole barns. When i saw i,t i looked wide eyed at Bob, he just smiled and said, " yep its a real one". needless to say i touched it all over just to be able to say i did.

I tried to buy that car when it was sitting on the side of a machine shop covered in a tarp...not for sale. A '69 SS427 L72 triple black conv. 4sp was special ordered from Glen Campbell Chevrolet who sponsored our race car. FWIW, I bought a local '68 400 Firebird from Bob around 2008 that needed to be finished, nice car.

[smallblockhero]

There was a Boss 429 in West Seneca from the mid 80s to 1998 when it was sold to someone from the mid-west

The owner of this car also had a friend with a 70 Hemi Cuda and a 69 Hemi Satellite, both in West Seneca. I am unsure what happened with these. I last saw them in 1998

The red Hemi cuda with the black hockey stick stripe? There was a Black Boss 429 that was hidden in Marilla since 1973, my friend bought it around 2010. thats the only one i heard of.

[Kayli69]

The red Hemi cuda with the black hockey stick stripe? There was a Black Boss 429 that was hidden in Marilla since 1973, my friend bought it around 2010. thats the only one i heard of.

Yes, it was a red Cuda with black stripe. Is it still around?

The Boss was Maroon. The owner never took it to shows and took me and his daughter out for ice cream once or twice a year. It also went to the Woodward Dream Cruise around 1996-7 Otherwise it sat covered in his garage. The last I saw of it was it loaded on a trailer bought from a man from Ohio

That car is what started my obsession with musclecars

[smallblockhero]

This is the Marilla Boss 429 that's was parked in 1974 actually. There was a street racing incident and the owner hid the car for 35 years. It has 13k miles on it. this was the day they pulled it out of a shed that the car barely fit in. It went to Musclecar Alley in Arcade , all they needed to do was was clean it. The original motor was refreshed and reassembled and dyno'ed up to 5k. It went to one of the big auction houses.

I havent seen that Cuda in twenty years.. last time I saw it, it was driving down the 400 getting off at the Union exit.

[Kayli69]

This is the Marilla Boss 429 that's was parked in 1974 actually. There was a street racing incident and the owner hid the car for 35 years. It has 13k miles on it. this was the day they pulled it out of a shed that the car barely fit in. It went to Musclecar Alley in Arcade , all they needed to do was was clean it. The original motor was refreshed and reassembled and dyno'ed up to 5k. It went to one of the big auction houses.

God damn. Incredible car

[smallblockhero]

a few more pics of the Boss 9 when it got to musclecar alley. Its kinda crazy because this car was a mile from my friends house and he drove past it for 20 years never knowing the owner or that the car was in his shed. The owner contacted him by word of mouth that he was a restoration guy.

[1967Z28]

Glen Campbell Chevrolet got one of the first 25 '67 Z-28 Camaros in January of that year. Not sure if they were racing it or it just became a street car or what. Don't even know the color. If somebody knows anything about it, please share. Thanks.

[smallblockhero]

I talked with my friend that bought the Boss 9 today and he sent me a few more pics he had. Youll notice one is exactly how it sat since the 70s when he opened the shed.and then a few others after they cleaned it up and put the fender decals back on.

[Pacecar1969]

There was a black COPO automatic that was sold in the Rochester area. Don't know whatever happened to it. Think there were 4 69 Hurst Olds sold in Rochester - B&B Olds, Philanz Olds.

[Pacecar1969]

Heinrich Chevrolet in Rochester sold a 67 Z28 that was SCCA raced. That went to a collector in Canada.

[smallblockhero]

There was a black COPO automatic that was sold in the Rochester area. Don't know whatever happened to it. Think there were 4 69 Hurst Olds sold in Rochester - B&B Olds, Philanz Olds.

i know of at least 2 1969 H/Os sold in Buffalo, my Dads friend owned one of them and it was a mess by 1976. My mom has a pic of me standing next to it and you cant even tell it was a 69 H/O. The other one i havent seen in 35 years..it was perfect with 30k on it at the time.

[bergy]

I remember seeing Hans Schmidt II winning regularly at Batavia drag strip in his Cobra. I believe that the Cobra was delivered at Muck Motors dealership. Also recall the full size Ford lightweight sponsored by Al Maroony (sp?) Ford beating the Cobra. The Ford went on to win at the nationals, but was dq’d on teardown. Hans’ father was a famous wrestler back in the 60s. His best move was the “nasty nostril” ��

[smallblockhero]

I remember seeing Hans Schmidt II winning regularly at Batavia drag strip in his Cobra. I believe that the Cobra was delivered at Muck Motors dealership. Also recall the full size Ford lightweight sponsored by Al Maroony (sp?) Ford beating the Cobra. The Ford went on to win at the nationals, but was dq’d on teardown. Hans’ father was a famous wrestler back in the 60s. His best move was the “nasty nostril” ��

Funny you say that... the only real Cobra I ever saw in the area was a black small block. I saw it at Ja Fa Fa Hots cruise night once in the mid 80s. i have no idea if it was the El-Cid Cobra or not. it wasnt lettered and i never saw the owner. but that makes me wonder.

Al Maroone Ford sold a lot of Hi-Po cars back then, We believe thats where the black Boss 9 came from. We had a Marti report but cant remember.

[muscle_collector]

i know of at least 2 1969 H/Os sold in Buffalo, my Dads friend owned one of them and it was a mess by 1976. My mom has a pic of me standing next to it and you cant even tell it was a 69 H/O. The other one i havent seen in 35 years..it was perfect with 30k on it at the time.
not sure if it was the same car, but around 25 years ago i bought a 69 H/O out of the buffalo area and it had just a little over 30k on it.

[smallblockhero]

not sure if it was the same car, but around 25 years ago i bought a 69 H/O out of the buffalo area and it had just a little over 30k on it.

wow...25 years ago, if the same guy owned it.. he wouldve been in his mid 30s. i was about 15-16 when i saw the car and met him around 88ish. i was totally obsessed with it. and he was real knowledgeable about the car and olds. What are the odds that its the same car? pretty good id say. he only took it to cruise nights..and even then it was rare. it was by far the best H/O in the Buffalo area.

side note: the first time i saw the car he left the cruise night, and lit it up. smoke pouring off the tires thru the first 3 gears and swinging... we heard the 4th gear chirp and saw the tailights wiggle a little bit. that has been burned in memory , i can still see it.

[muscle_collector]

wow...25 years ago, if the same guy owned it.. he wouldve been in his mid 30s. i was about 15-16 when i saw the car and met him around 88ish. i was totally obsessed with it. and he was real knowledgeable about the car and olds. What are the odds that its the same car? pretty good id say. he only took it to cruise nights..and even then it was rare. it was by far the best H/O in the Buffalo area.

side note: the first time i saw the car he left the cruise night, and lit it up. smoke pouring off the tires thru the first 3 gears and swinging... we heard the 4th gear chirp and saw the tailights wiggle a little bit. that has been burned in memory , i can still see it.

all of the 69 H/O's were automatic cars. so if that one had a 4 speed it wasnt the one i bought

[smallblockhero]

all of the 69 H/O's were automatic cars. so if that one had a 4 speed it wasnt the one i bought

Geez.. i never thought of that until now. 35+ year old memories can get fuzzy. Obviously it was an auto then. Im still betting it was most likely the same car.

[WILMASBOYL78]

Im from Buffalo and can tell you about many that once resided here. many of the best were sold years ago and went out of state or to canada. i only know of one local sold COPO from Bokman chevrolet, and as far as i know it has not surfaced. there was 2 local 68 Hemi Darts sold and campaigned at Niagara. Holiday oldsmobile (now Basil Ford) sold many local Hurst Olds in the area. There was 1 local small block AC Cobra years ago. And everybody knows the legend of Steve Battaglia owning 7 Superbirds that he bought in the 80s and drove them everywhere.

I would like to jump in on this thread to try and get more info on a black 70 L78 TH400 Nova I bought from Steve in 2003. He didn't give me much to go on at the time...the car was registered to his girl friend. I did try the NCRS search and it came back as Krise Motor Co. in Canton, PA [dealer code 380/zone 12].

But, it didn't seem right so i did some digging...this old thread has some new info. It appears the car came from Laks Chevrolet

https://thesupercarregistry.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126908&page=56



Anyway...this current thread mentioning the Superbird guy caught my eye...he showed me a bunch of those cars when I went there to buy the Nova.

Happy to chat with anyone who has some local info...thanks.

-wilma

[smallblockhero]

I would like to jump in on this thread to try and get more info on a black 70 L78 TH400 Nova I bought from Steve in 2003. He didn't give me much to go on at the time...the car was registered to his girl friend. I did try the NCRS search and it came back as Krise Motor Co. in Canton, PA [dealer code 380/zone 12].

But, it didn't seem right so i did some digging...this old thread has some new info. It appears the car came from Laks Chevrolet

https://thesupercarregistry.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126908&page=56



Anyway...this current thread mentioning the Superbird guy caught my eye...he showed me a bunch of those cars when I went there to buy the Nova.

Happy to chat with anyone who has some local info...thanks.

-wilma

are you talking about the bench seat , column shift L78? lol.. Steve somehow bought that car out from underneath a friend of mine. i saw it at his shop on comet right after he bought it. He didnt know anything about the car at that time, he wasnt even sure it was a real big block car.

[WILMASBOYL78]

Yes...that's the car I'm talking about. It is in my garage as we speak...we put the others away for the winter, planning to do some work on this one over the winter.

Would love to learn more of the history about this car.

thanks,

wilma

[WILMASBOYL78]

Had a great chat today with 'small-block-hero'....getting some history on the black Nova. Took a couple of photos in the garage today...time for some TLC on this old gal :smirk:

-wilma

[Steve Shauger]

Not quite a Supercar by definition, but it was purchased in western, NY at Dave Hallman Chevrolet in Hamburg, NY. It certainly has the look of a Supercar. I purchased this car 25 years ago this past June in 1999.

https://www.yenko.net/forum/showthread.php?t=77828&highlight=dave+hallman

[chadk]

It's not a supercar but here is my '69 L72 Biscayne that was bought new at Maglio Chevrolet in Perry NY. It has had several owners in western NY until 2019 when it made its way to IA and then MN. The original owner is still in Perry and I keep in touch with him.

[muscle_collector]

love that car. did the original owner buy it to drag race only or a driver/racecar?

[chadk]

love that car. did the original owner buy it to drag race only or a driver/racecar?

Thanks!
It was driven on the street for a year before he got serious and started racing modified production at Lancaster Dragway. The vintage photo with the black wheels is from 1970 and the photo with torque thrusts on the front is 1971.

[Diabl07]

Wow! You guys all rock! I’ve heard about that black Boss 429 but I’ve never seen photos, how incredible. All this information is really awesome everyone, keep it coming! I love the stories of my area back in the day.

[Diabl07]

I have tons of new information from this thread, thank you all so much. I have a pretty full idea of the Supercars from WNY, Ill share some stories here. If anyone wants to know if we had anything, I have a pretty compressive list I am more than willing to share! Im only sharing stuff I have vins for, ill add some other stuff I dont at the end!
Enjoy!
But here are some I have,

As far as COPOs, Yenkos, and Bergers and other Camaros go, Buffalo had a couple pass through
67 Yenko 124377N241474 and 69 Yenko 124379N579518 were with Bob Harris being restored as well as the WGI pace car (124679N686263) and a lot of his other Yenkos and COPOs (which I dont have vins for) he's owned and restored like YS-8051, which was owned by
Bill Wertheim in Clarence, and I also believe he has the gold L-79 Acadian (671637003920) and the 2 SD-396 ragtops (which I dont have vins for). also he may own 124679N709626, but im not sure

124377N163228 was the SCCA prototype car raced in Rochester

124377N242082 and 124377N242122 were both 1967 Yenko Super Camaros delivered new in Jamestown just an hour south of Buffalo

124379N666301 is a COPO car delivered new in Rochester

114279W357883 is the Cordia fast Track Nova, absolutely one of the greatest ex-WNY cars ever

136379B401872 Chevelle COPO delivered new to Bokman Chevy that I think is owned by someone on this forum

136670B175145- ragtop LS6 which was one owner in Buffalo until it sold at Mecum just a few months ago

as far as Boss 429s go,
1970s
0F02Z124193- in a great collection in west seneca up until recent
0F02Z104682- owned in rochester and up for sale in Hilton NY a few years ago
0F02Z127597- grabber green, owned by Bob. B in Rochester in his collection with his many Hemi cars
then the 69s are:
9F02Z171596- not sure how long its been around but I see it at cars and coffee every so often
9F02Z150469- early candy apple red car, first owner was in Buffalo

OK now the pontiacs, this is a good one
I mentioned Bob Bartosiewicz in Rochester, Bob has a huge collection which includes/has included
3 1970 Ram Air IV Coupes
(242370P216698, 242379B176476, and 242370P140831)
2 Ram Air IV Verts, a 69 and a 70 (242679B173023 and 242670B129433)
and a 71 H.O. Judge convertible (242671P121426)

There were 2 Ragtop 69 Trans Ams,
223679N107816 which was delivered new here and stayed a while and I think restored by Bob Harris
and 223679N106884 which I know was here but not sure the story on

there were 2 70 GTO Ram Air III cars here new, 242670P158060 delivered to Piehler Pontiac in Rochester and 242670P230708 delivered to Brown Motor Sales in Buffalo

2V87X2N515007 is a 72 455 HO delivered to Al Ives Pontiac in Tonawanda

and a 71 455 HO 228871N110001 which is curious because it seems to me like thats a very early vin. if not #001

Thats what I have, not including the tons and tons of Hemi cars previously in Western New York, Which Ill share if anyones interested. I have more info on most of these cars so ask away if need be

I LOVE sharing stuff like this with people, Ill make another post about cars I know but im missing vins on
Thanks everyone!!

Jacob

[Diabl07]

If anyone knows info on Bob Harris 1969 COPO? Or the 68 Yenko RS they were working on. Also anyone know of a ZL-1 that was in Western New York in the 70s?

[scuncio]

Great thread, NY was a hotbed of performance cars.

[PeteLeathersac]

…Also anyone know of a ZL-1 that was in Western New York in the 70s?

I meant to post the below 10/70 Newspaper Ad here previously but landed it in the Huebner ZL1 thread first where William noted #12 was known to have been in NY.
Sorry, I forgot to get back here w/ the Ad until seeing your postings today, was the car you knew of Blue also do you know if it came from the Manhattan area?
Awesome thread also thanks for the great details w/ your postings above!
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[fortim]

OK now the pontiacs, this is a good one
I mentioned Bob Bartosiewicz in Rochester, Bob has a huge collection which includes/has included
3 1970 Ram Air IV Coupes
(242370P216698, 242379B176476, and 242370P140831)
2 Ram Air IV Verts, a 69 and a 70 (242679B173023 and 242670B129433)
and a 71 H.O. Judge convertible (242671P121426)

There were 2 Ragtop 69 Trans Ams,
223679N107816 which was delivered new here and stayed a while and I think restored by Bob Harris
and 223679N106884 which I know was here but not sure the story on

there were 2 70 GTO Ram Air III cars here new, 242670P158060 delivered to Piehler Pontiac in Rochester and 242670P230708 delivered to Brown Motor Sales in Buffalo

2V87X2N515007 is a 72 455 HO delivered to Al Ives Pontiac in Tonawanda

and a 71 455 HO 228871N110001 which is curious because it seems to me like thats a very early vin. if not #001

Thats what I have, not including the tons and tons of Hemi cars previously in Western New York, Which Ill share if anyones interested. I have more info on most of these cars so ask away if need be

I LOVE sharing stuff like this with people, Ill make another post about cars I know but im missing vins on
Thanks everyone!!

Jacob

My former '69 GTO RAIII 4sp convertible was sold in WNY, and I bought it from the original owner in the 1970s. I still have the VIN if you're interested. I took the car to Lancaster Dragway a couple of times. It was a great street car.

[auwrestling]

This is the Marilla Boss 429 that's was parked in 1974 actually. There was a street racing incident and the owner hid the car for 35 years. It has 13k miles on it. this was the day they pulled it out of a shed that the car barely fit in. It went to Musclecar Alley in Arcade , all they needed to do was was clean it. The original motor was refreshed and reassembled and dyno'ed up to 5k. It went to one of the big auction houses.

I havent seen that Cuda in twenty years.. last time I saw it, it was driving down the 400 getting off at the Union exit.

You only have part of the story right it wasn’t in Marilla . It was in Elma and it was not in the shed. There is a good story about it y it disappeared for so many years.

[auwrestling]

a few more pics of the Boss 9 when it got to musclecar alley. Its kinda crazy because this car was a mile from my friends house and he drove past it for 20 years never knowing the owner or that the car was in his shed. The owner contacted him by word of mouth that he was a restoration guy.

Back in 1972 this black boss 429 was sold from Delaware sports car on Delaware Avenue between Hertel and Tacoma. From there, the new owner took it to Elma and I looked at it in 1978 off Bowen Road. Right after that, the car Disappeared and then soon was recovered And sold to a good friend of mine , it was then put away for 30 years then we brought it back out and decided to sell it.

[auwrestling]

Send me a private message with your phone number and I’ll give you a call .I owned both of the Trans Am convertibles, and good friend of ours had one of the 427 AC cobra it was a red one. He also owned the 67 GT 500 Shelby with the 427 side oiler, also it was another friend of mine that owned s the black 69 boss 429 and sold it several years ago could give you a lot of information and stories about all the super duty Trans Ams and raiv cars in the area .A lot of these rare Pontiacs are still right here

[fortim]

Send me a private message with your phone number and I’ll give you a call .I owned both of the Trans Am convertibles, and good friend of ours had one of the 427 AC cobra it was a red one. He also owned the 67 GT 500 Shelby with the 427 side oiler, also it was another friend of mine that owned s the black 69 boss 429 and sold it several years ago could give you a lot of information and stories about all the super duty Trans Ams and raiv cars in the area .A lot of these rare Pontiacs are still right here

Glad to see you post in the thread, your knowledge of WNY muscle cars is invaluable, especially in the Pontiac world.

[David C.]

The 69 copo Bob H. had was sold new in Toronto and drag raced a few years before being parked. It was a blue on blue RS. He sold it a few years ago as he acquired the RS 68 Yenko which came from Georgia.

[auwrestling]

Here’s a couple pictures of a 71 Judge 455HO we got from the original owner just south of Buffalo . This was a while ago and as you can see it came in the rare color of black with the combination parchment interior ,beautiful car ,12 bolt rear turbo 400.

[smallblockhero]

Here’s a couple pictures of a 71 Judge 455HO we got from the original owner just south of Buffalo . This was a while ago and as you can see it came in the rare color of black with the combination parchment interior ,beautiful car ,12 bolt rear turbo 400.

was this the car owned and redone by the Mariachers and Tom Fischer?

[Diabl07]

My former '69 GTO RAIII 4sp convertible was sold in WNY, and I bought it from the original owner in the 1970s. I still have the VIN if you're interested. I took the car to Lancaster Dragway a couple of times. It was a great street car.

Sure, send the vin along! Always love the pontiacs and other fun things you know so much about around here

[Diabl07]

The 69 copo Bob H. had was sold new in Toronto and drag raced a few years before being parked. It was a blue on blue RS. He sold it a few years ago as he acquired the RS 68 Yenko which came from Georgia.

I wasnt aware he sold it, very cool. Id love to know the vins on both to find out more info, the stories on the canadian car being holed up in toronto for years and the 68 RS in the junkyard in georgia then sitting in his shop for 15 years, such cool stories all of these cars have

[Diabl07]

Back in 1972 this black boss 429 was sold from Delaware sports car on Delaware Avenue between Hertel and Tacoma. From there, the new owner took it to Elma and I looked at it in 1978 off Bowen Road. Right after that, the car Disappeared and then soon was recovered And sold to a good friend of mine , it was then put away for 30 years then we brought it back out and decided to sell it.

I have a friend who worked for delaware sports cars in the 1970s, he did engine work for the Ferraris they sold new/used. ill give him a call and see what if he knows about that Boss and the other stuff they sold.

[auwrestling]

One of my 69 trans am convertibles
Buffalo car 4 speed , blue deluxe Int , in dash tachometer and gauges

[Diabl07]

Great thread, NY was a hotbed of performance cars.

Thank you! I was sad to never be around when all of the really awesome stuff was here new.
I was born in the 2000s so I missed that era of street racing and muscle cars and of collectors like BeaumontBill (who I would love to find the stories on his cars) and all those guys. I only got into cars seriously recently, my father raced his 442 on Long Island in the 1980s before he went into the navy, so he for sure helped that connection with muscle cars.
there are still a bunch of really neat cars here, lots of guys with cars in the garages and in warehouses collecting.
I love researching all of this stuff, because I do research for lots of other cars like Porsche and Ferrari and Lamborghinis but these classic muscle cars are so abundant around here and have so many stories, it never gets old!

[Diabl07]

One of my 69 trans am convertibles
Buffalo car 4 speed , blue deluxe Int , in dash tachometer and gauges

was this the car sold new at Culligan Pontiac in Williamsville?
his grandson i believe is still in the business, he heads the Ferrari/Alfa/Maserati dealership in williamsville, keeping the family name alive i suppose

[auwrestling]

The second ta convertible I owned was originally from Mississippi and I Took a trip down there and picked it up in New Orleans 1983 . Automatic / gauges And both of my cars had rally twos

[auwrestling]

A very good family friend of ours back into the 60s owned one of the few AC Shelby cobra 427 cars and 67 GT500 with the 427 side oiler

[Diabl07]

A very good family friend of ours back into the 60s owned one of the few AC Shelby cobra 427 cars and 67 GT500 with the 427 side oiler

Mr. Nichter?
SCCA racer and Shelby enthusiast! It’s a shame what happened to that 427

[auwrestling]

Mr. Nichter?
SCCA racer and Shelby enthusiast! It’s a shame what happened to that 427

Yes, him and my father were very good friends and they did a lot of construction projects together. I still remember the night that my dad got the call from Paul Nichter telling him about what had just happened with the car on the scajaquada expressway .

[Mr70]

..I still remember the night that my dad got the call from Paul Nichter telling him about what had just happened with the car on the scajaquada expressway.

What exactly happened?

[auwrestling]

What exactly happened?

Mr Nichters mechanic and friend took the 1967 cobra out on a test ride on a Saturday night leaving from their construction shop on the west side of Buffalo along the Niagara river , they took the scajaquada expressway eastbound , they only made it a couple miles and we’re traveling at a high rate of speed when the driver lost control rolling it over into a concrete abutment along the side of the expressway near Grant Street and both guys were killed . This was 1969

[Diabl07]

What exactly happened?

I’m not 100% sure on the story but I believe he gave it to 2 of his friends to go out driving with in the south towns in Buffalo and the car crashed into a concrete pillar of some kind and burst into flames. CSX3326 was his and the parts they could take from the wreck went into its brother car CSX3327 in its later restoration. Sad story but it goes to show how careful you must be when dealing with these high power tiny cars.

[auwrestling]

Here it is

[auwrestling]

Soon after this cobra was destroyed he purchased another one and drove it quite a while

[auwrestling]

Here’s a couple pictures of the 69 black Boss 429 that started at a Rochester New York Dealership , then came to Buffalo and was sold out of Delaware sports car on Delaware Avenue in the early 70s. The car ended up in Elma New York purchased by a friend of mine named Charlie , eventually the car disappeared around 1978 for a while . Resurfaced about a year later and another friend of mine took possession and kept it for over 30 years

[Diabl07]

Soon after this cobra was destroyed he purchased another one and drove it quite a while

Do you remember the CSX on that car? Buffalo had a ton of cobras. I might post those some day.

[auwrestling]

Do you remember the CSX on that car? Buffalo had a ton of cobras. I might post those some day.

No, I don’t but when Nick (paul Nichter) would drive it from his work shop off Niagara street in Buffalo out to South Wales where he lived , occasionally he would stop on Seneca Street in Elma at a local farm and a friend of mine that worked there at the time remembers putting bushels of sweetcorn in the trunk.

[fortim]

was this the car sold new at Culligan Pontiac in Williamsville?
his grandson i believe is still in the business, he heads the Ferrari/Alfa/Maserati dealership in williamsville, keeping the family name alive i suppose

The previously mentioned '69 RAIII GTO Vert was sold new at Culligan Pontiac and I happened to have lived in Williamsville.
Another WNY car that my friend owned is a '70 Buick Stage 1 'vert auto (1 of 164) that was found in a farmer's field in Lewiston. He restored it in the late 70's as a yellow GSX clone. Later restored to original factory colors, Aqua Mist poly Black/Black and it was a gorgeous car. Last I knew, the car was in a collection in PA.

[fortim]

One of my 69 trans am convertibles
Buffalo car 4 speed , blue deluxe Int , in dash tachometer and gauges

Was this the car parked on the side of Huberts (?) Machine shop under a tarp? I remember the 71 Judge, where did that car go?

[Diabl07]

The previously mentioned '69 RAIII GTO Vert was sold new at Culligan Pontiac and I happened to have lived in Williamsville.
Another WNY car that my friend owned is a '70 Buick Stage 1 'vert auto (1 of 164) that was found in a farmer's field in Lewiston. He restored it in the late 70's as a yellow GSX clone. Later restored to original factory colors, Aqua Mist poly Black/Black and it was a gorgeous car. Last I knew, the car was in a collection in PA.

https://www.mecum.com/lots/495643/1970-buick-gs-stage-1-convertible/ One of 2, can’t be far off from the car if it’s not this one!

[auwrestling]

Picked up this car in Syracuse, New York 1978 not quite western New York but close and it’s one of the very few raiv Judges you’ll ever see with the original drive train in it. Cardinal red with a red interior ,nicely loaded with power steering ,power brakes ,hood tach, Formula steering wheel , power trunk with 390 gears

First picture is 1979 back on the Homestead summertime and the second picture is several years ago, putting all the ram air cars in storage .

[Crush]

Picked up this car in Syracuse, New York 1978 not quite western New York but close and it’s one of the very few raiv Judges you’ll ever see with the original drive train in it. Cardinal red with a red interior ,nicely loaded with power steering ,power brakes ,hood tach, Formula steering wheel , power trunk with 390 gears

First picture is 1979 back on the Homestead summertime and the second picture is several years ago, putting all the ram air cars in storage .

Love the 68 birds!!

[auwrestling]

Love the 68 birds!!

All 3 of the 68 firebirds that you can see in that picture are RA2 four-speed cars. There’s a black one and a green with gold vinyl top in the middle and then to the right is a Ageena blue with black interior and a black vinyl top car ! nothing but round ports .
These three Firebirds are not from Western New York, but very cool nonetheless.
The black one is from Long Island, the green/gold vinyl top car is from Brooklyn, New York Myrtle motors and is the lowest VIN FIRST RA II Firebird and the third one ageena blue is from Boston

[Diabl07]

Picked up this car in Syracuse, New York 1978 not quite western New York but close and it’s one of the very few raiv Judges you’ll ever see with the original drive train in it. Cardinal red with a red interior ,nicely loaded with power steering ,power brakes ,hood tach, Formula steering wheel , power trunk with 390 gears

First picture is 1979 back on the Homestead summertime and the second picture is several years ago, putting all the ram air cars in storage .

You have quite the collection! do you still live around here and keep these cars around the buffalo area? RA Pontiacs are all very special cars indeed, incredibly rare, very very cool stuff, Thank you for sharing!

[jims68nova]

I live in WNY and my business is right down the street from Steve Battaglia's shop. Last I knew his niece got all his cars when he passed? Not a "supercar" but I did rescue a 68 Chevelle SS 396/375 4sp out of the Eastside 8 yrs ago from the original owner that was sold new at Bokman, it needed a full resto so I sold it. If I knew how to post pics of that I would. 2 cars in my collection worthy of this page but aren't supercars are a 68 L34 4sp and 70 L78 auto Nova's.

[Diabl07]

I live in WNY and my business is right down the street from Steve Battaglia's shop. Last I knew his niece got all his cars when he passed? Not a "supercar" but I did rescue a 68 Chevelle SS 396/375 4sp out of the Eastside 8 yrs ago from the original owner that was sold new at Bokman, it needed a full resto so I sold it. If I knew how to post pics of that I would. 2 cars in my collection worthy of this page but aren't supercars are a 68 L34 4sp and 70 L78 auto Nova's.

I had no idea Steve passed away, thats very sad to hear, his collection was legendary. I still am not sure which superbirds he had besides one white one (which I believe is the last superbird made) but he had some wild stories ive heard.
I think you can add attachments in additional options when you quote to reply or reply. We'd love to see your Novas! Supercar or not, L78 Novas are super cool!

[jims68nova]

I had no idea Steve passed away, thats very sad to hear, his collection was legendary. I still am not sure which superbirds he had besides one white one (which I believe is the last superbird made) but he had some wild stories ive heard.
I think you can add attachments in additional options when you quote to reply or reply. We'd love to see your Novas! Supercar or not, L78 Novas are super cool!

Yeah about 2 years ago if I recall correctly. I'll try tonight when I get home with the pictures.

[427strato]

I have enjoyed so much reading the posts in this thread. I started driving in 1965 and over the next few years had quite a few muscle cars and still do. This thread brings back a lot of memories and the sharing of stories by those posting makes for great reading. I live in Ontario and we often crossed over to, I think it was called Niagara Raceway, in the late 60's to watch drag racing. It's great to here about all muscle cars, not just GM's, even though thats what I have. I hope people do not get tired of this thread and keep contributing. Have a great day.

[smallblockhero]

I had no idea Steve passed away, thats very sad to hear, his collection was legendary. I still am not sure which superbirds he had besides one white one (which I believe is the last superbird made) but he had some wild stories ive heard.
I think you can add attachments in additional options when you quote to reply or reply. We'd love to see your Novas! Supercar or not, L78 Novas are super cool!

he sold the white one years ago. he still had 2 blue ones( a B5 and a Petty blue), a yellow one and a limelight one. the limelight one was sandblasted and the panels were warped really bad, so steve put it on the back burner and never got to it.

[smallblockhero]

I live in WNY and my business is right down the street from Steve Battaglia's shop. Last I knew his niece got all his cars when he passed? Not a "supercar" but I did rescue a 68 Chevelle SS 396/375 4sp out of the Eastside 8 yrs ago from the original owner that was sold new at Bokman, it needed a full resto so I sold it. If I knew how to post pics of that I would. 2 cars in my collection worthy of this page but aren't supercars are a 68 L34 4sp and 70 L78 auto Nova's.

Yes his neice Shelby inherited the cars.. His brother Daves daughter.

where on the East side was the chevelle? i knew of a garage that had a chevelle and a 69 camaro in it right on Bailey by Walden..seen them once when the door was open and never saw them again.

[auwrestling]

You have quite the collection! do you still live around here and keep these cars around the buffalo area? RA Pontiacs are all very special cars indeed, incredibly rare, very very cool stuff, Thank you for sharing!

Yes in the snow belt

[auwrestling]

I have enjoyed so much reading the posts in this thread. I started driving in 1965 and over the next few years had quite a few muscle cars and still do. This thread brings back a lot of memories and the sharing of stories by those posting makes for great reading. I live in Ontario and we often crossed over to, I think it was called Niagara Raceway, in the late 60's to watch drag racing. It's great to here about all muscle cars, not just GM's, even though thats what I have. I hope people do not get tired of this thread and keep contributing. Have a great day.

Yes, Niagara Raceway and they had a great commercial “Sunday at Niagara.”
Enjoy. https://youtu.be/p-BabhMuH68?si=X_STyNTX8eOAGY9i

[jims68nova]

Yes his neice Shelby inherited the cars.. His brother Daves daughter.

where on the East side was the chevelle? i knew of a garage that had a chevelle and a 69 camaro in it right on Bailey by Walden..seen them once when the door was open and never saw them again.

I bought it on Herman St off Best. I had to remove around 60 screws from the door as he screwed it shut haha. Car was last registered in 71 and it was rough from being in a damp garage, none the less I saved it and a guy from Ohio bought it. No idea what his plans were with it.

[auwrestling]

I had no idea Steve passed away, thats very sad to hear, his collection was legendary. I still am not sure which superbirds he had besides one white one (which I believe is the last superbird made) but he had some wild stories ive heard.
I think you can add attachments in additional options when you quote to reply or reply. We'd love to see your Novas! Supercar or not, L78 Novas are super cool!

We grew up around the block from Steve and Dave Battaglia. Spent a lot of time with them playing sports then cars and just hanging around with them as kids.

[Diabl07]

Yes in the snow belt

Thats awesome! do you still own all those Ram Air cars? Love to see a collection local. have you ever brought out cars to shows around here before?

[jims68nova]

There’s the pictures I could find of me getting the Chevelle and then the last two pictures are of both my Nova’s

[Diabl07]

There’s the pictures I could find of me getting the Chevelle and then the last two pictures are of both my Nova’s

Holy cow! That green on the nova is stunning

[auwrestling]

Thats awesome! do you still own all those Ram Air cars? Love to see a collection local. have you ever brought out cars to shows around here before?

I tried calling and left a message.

[auwrestling]

Very rare occasion would I take a car to a show. But if you’re in the Elma / West Seneca area they can be see here and there as I do drive them quite often.

[Diabl07]

Very rare occasion would I take a car to a show. But if you’re in the Elma / West Seneca area they can be see here and there as I do drive them quite often.

I live in Williamsville but I am out there sometimes, I know I want to go to Online Auto Connection one of these days in West Seneca and see what Mark has in his collection these days
I see you called, but my wonky phone doesn’t show a message. If you have time over the weekend to call do that, I’ve been so busy weekdays but I’d love to talk about the muscle cars.

[auwrestling]

I live in Williamsville but I am out there sometimes, I know I want to go to Online Auto Connection one of these days in West Seneca and see what Mark has in his collection these days
I see you called, but my wonky phone doesn’t show a message. If you have time over the weekend to call do that, I’ve been so busy weekdays but I’d love to talk about the muscle cars.

Marks Shop is just around the corner.

[Diabl07]

Marks Shop is just around the corner.

He has had some really neat Hemi cars and Vipers and whatnot, really awesome collection

Always really cool collections around here. And I’m always finding new collections around here

[jims68nova]

Holy cow! That green on the nova is stunning

Thank you. 😎

[Jim69Z]

I recall seeing the 68 Nova at a show at Gratwick Park over the summer …beautiful car

[Diabl07]

Here’s a couple pictures of a 71 Judge 455HO we got from the original owner just south of Buffalo . This was a while ago and as you can see it came in the rare color of black with the combination parchment interior ,beautiful car ,12 bolt rear turbo 400.

Was this car from Gowanda? I have somewhere in my notes of a similarly specced 455 HO from Fox Motors in Gowanda. Was this the same car?

[Diabl07]

Thank you. 😎

You should bring it out to some of the cars and coffees in the summer at the eastern hills mall. I take photos somewhat professionally and I’m at the cars and coffees often, lots of cars, easy to get lost, but I’d love to take some nice pictures of that green in the sun!

[auwrestling]

was this car from gowanda? I have somewhere in my notes of a similarly specced 455 ho from fox motors in gowanda. Was this the same car?

👍

[Diabl07]

👍

That’s so cool to know it stayed around so long. Was it you who sent it to Mecum in 2012?

[jims68nova]

You should bring it out to some of the cars and coffees in the summer at the eastern hills mall. I take photos somewhat professionally and I’m at the cars and coffees often, lots of cars, easy to get lost, but I’d love to take some nice pictures of that green in the sun!

I'm there every month, I bring a different car each time. I haven't had the the green Nova out in a couple of years, maybe this summer. I had the blue 68 Nova, 2000 GTS Viper and 2021 Audi R8 V10+ there this season.

[jims68nova]

I recall seeing the 68 Nova at a show at Gratwick Park over the summer …beautiful car

My car hasn't been to Gratwick show in probably 5 years, but I do take it to the Wurlizter cruise nite every Monday. Maybe that's where you seen it? Thank you though

[Diabl07]

I'm there every month, I bring a different car each time. I haven't had the the green Nova out in a couple of years, maybe this summer. I had the blue 68 Nova, 2000 GTS Viper and 2021 Audi R8 V10+ there this season.

Oh my goodness! Which Viper/R8 is yours? I might have seen it or taken some photos.

[Diabl07]

My car hasn't been to Gratwick show in probably 5 years, but I do take it to the Wurlizter cruise nite every Monday. Maybe that's where you seen it? Thank you though

I’m often at the Wurlitzer shows on Mondays with my dad, such A good event they put on. I’m gonna look through my photos to see if I have one of your Nova

[jims68nova]

Oh my goodness! Which Viper/R8 is yours? I might have seen it or taken some photos.

Here you go

[Diabl07]

Is that the viper with the RARE GTS NY plate? I see that car everywhere I love it! I might have taken some photos, lemme check!

[auwrestling]

That’s so cool to know it stayed around so long. Was it you who sent it to Mecum in 2012?

No. That was after us

[Diabl07]

No. That was after us

Ah ok. I saw they had a red/red Ram Air IV judge in that collection too, thought it was you.
That’s still very cool.

[Jim69Z]

My car hasn't been to Gratwick show in probably 5 years, but I do take it to the Wurlizter cruise nite every Monday. Maybe that's where you seen it? Thank you though

Yes ..l knew it was one of the two

[jims68nova]

Is that the viper with the RARE GTS NY plate? I see that car everywhere I love it! I might have taken some photos, lemme check!

Yes! And you don't see it everywhere, you're just lucky everytime I have it out as I only put 100 miles on it a year haha.

[Diabl07]

Yes! And you don't see it everywhere, you're just lucky everytime I have it out as I only put 100 miles on it a year haha.

I will absolutely stop and say hi next time, and take some great photos!

[auwrestling]

Ah ok. I saw they had a red/red Ram Air IV judge in that collection too, thought it was you.
That’s still very cool.

I bought the red /red RAIV 70 Judge in 1978 and that is still here.

[Diabl07]

I bought the red /red RAIV 70 Judge in 1978 and that is still here.

Can’t be many of those in that color combo, you might have the best Pontiac collection in WNY, I’d bet on it

[auwrestling]

Can’t be many of those in that color combo, you might have the best Pontiac collection in WNY, I’d bet on it

Maybe Only Pontiac collection around here. Bob doesn’t count. lol. He’s got a couple

[Diabl07]

Maybe Only Pontiac collection around here. Bob doesn’t count. lol. He’s got a couple

Only other one I know about was Bob B. In Rochester, he had a bunch of Ram Air and SD/HO cars, but he moved it all to Florida. (And he never had any 69 Trans Am Convertibles)

[auwrestling]

Only other one I know about was Bob B. In Rochester, he had a bunch of Ram Air and SD/HO cars, but he moved it all to Florida. (And he never had any 69 Trans Am Convertibles)

Yes Bob B , only has a couple Pontiacs these days. Hung up on mopars

[auwrestling]

In 1970 Pontiac built 3196 TRANS AMS and only 88 came with the top dog RAIV engine . 6 of these super rare and desirable RAIV TAs went to dealerships in NYS . All 6 of these dealerships were located between Syracuse and Buffalo (Niagara Falls ) ! Four of these six cars are white and two are blue and out of the six only one white one is an automatic . One can say all six are western NY cars but Syracuse is debateable . More information and some pictures to come. Don’t get too excited because they all have been found.

[Bill Pritchard]

Thanks to all of you who are contributing to this thread, it's fascinating!

[Diabl07]

In 1970 Pontiac built 3196 TRANS AMS and only 88 came with the top dog RAIV engine . 6 of these super rare and desirable RAIV TAs went to dealerships in NYS . All 6 of these dealerships were located between Syracuse and Buffalo (Niagara Falls ) ! Four of these six cars are white and two are blue and out of the six only one white one is an automatic . One can say all six are western NY cars but Syracuse is debateable . More information and some pictures to come. Don’t get too excited because they all have been found.

I know one that was up for sale recently, blue 4-speed car sold new in Rochester. Not sure of the vin
I was looking at SD-455s for 73 and 74 too and I found some vins of cars delivered new here
Lemme see what I got

white/white 73 Trans Am M-20
2V87X3N139695
Delivered new in Dansville NY
Witt Pontiac

2V87X4N162786
Admiralty Blue/saddle 1974 THM
New in Hamburg NY
Hal Casey Pontiac

Buccaneer Red/Black 1974 m-21
2V87X4N157051
Buffalo NY
Don Davis Pontiac

2V87X4N121963
Buccaneer Red/Red 1974 THM
Buffalo NY
not sure who got this one

2V87X4N151836
1974 white/black M-21
Palmyra NY
Bunknam Pontiac

[Diabl07]

2 Ram Air IV 1970 cars, one from Gould Pontiac in Watkins Glen and Scutti Pontiac in Rochester.
2 articles written about these cars in Hot Rod

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-0709-1970-pontiac-ram-air-iv-trans-am/

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-060200-1970-pontiac-trans-am-ram-air-iv/

[Diabl07]

Thanks to all of you who are contributing to this thread, it's fascinating!

I absolutely agree! all of these stories are so incredible! so many people sharing all of their favorite moments, its so cool!
It was a little passion project of mine a few months ago to start compiling information from every crevice of memory and the internet to create a registry of the rare muscle cars that were in the WNY area. this thread has catapulted this project way higher than I expected. I haven't updated my registries totally for a few weeks now, and I've added so much. I'm hoping to have everything updated as much as possible by the new year to post here as Google Sheets or Excel (depends on which works better for everyone here) Ill update it as long as im still looking for cars to add, and im not even 20 yet so expect many more years of these registries expanding everyone!

[auwrestling]

2 Ram Air IV 1970 cars, one from Gould Pontiac in Watkins Glen and Scutti Pontiac in Rochester.
2 articles written about these cars in Hot Rod

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-0709-1970-pontiac-ram-air-iv-trans-am/

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-060200-1970-pontiac-trans-am-ram-air-iv/

The blue car that came from Scotty Pontiac I first saw in the Kmart parking lot at Maple and transit 1977. I wasn’t able to find the owner at that time but several years later I saw it a car show up in Niagara Falls . At that point, I met the owner and tried to buy it from him a Couple times, but it didn’t work out. It Changed hands several times before it got to RM .

I was lucky enough to buy the car from Watkins Glen in the mid 80s , white with a black standard interior 4 speed great car.

[auwrestling]

I know one that was up for sale recently, blue 4-speed car sold new in Rochester. Not sure of the vin
I was looking at SD-455s for 73 and 74 too and I found some vins of cars delivered new here
Lemme see what I got

white/white 73 Trans Am M-20
2V87X3N139695
Delivered new in Dansville NY
Witt Pontiac

2V87X4N162786
Admiralty Blue/saddle 1974 THM
New in Hamburg NY
Hal Casey Pontiac

Buccaneer Red/Black 1974 m-21
2V87X4N157051
Buffalo NY
Don Davis Pontiac

2V87X4N121963
Buccaneer Red/Red 1974 THM
Buffalo NY
not sure who got this one

2V87X4N151836
1974 white/black M-21
Palmyra NY
Bunknam Pontiac

I owned a couple of the red SD 74s you’re talking about.
WE ALSO HAD TWO OF THE 74 ADMIRALITY BLUE FOUR-SPEED CARS FROM THE BUFFALO AREA , not on your list .
The white on white 4 Spd 73 on your list is one of the best ones in the country . It’s is not around here anymore too bad
I’ll cover the 73 SD TRANS AMs later if there’s interest . Some real good ones still around !!

[Diabl07]

I owned a couple of the red SD 74s you’re talking about.
WE ALSO HAD TWO OF THE 74 ADMIRALITY BLUE FOUR-SPEED CARS FROM THE BUFFALO AREA , not on your list .
The white on white 4 Spd 73 on your list is one of the best ones in the country . It’s is not around here anymore too bad
I’ll cover the 73 SD TRANS AMs later if there’s interest . Some real good ones still around !!

Did you have both red cars? I had no idea there were 2 Admiralty blue cars, that’s so cool! I’ll have to look at the registry again to add to to mine with info and stuff.
You really are the most knowledgeable in the area!

[Diabl07]

I owned a couple of the red SD 74s you’re talking about.
WE ALSO HAD TWO OF THE 74 ADMIRALITY BLUE FOUR-SPEED CARS FROM THE BUFFALO AREA , not on your list .
The white on white 4 Spd 73 on your list is one of the best ones in the country . It’s is not around here anymore too bad
I’ll cover the 73 SD TRANS AMs later if there’s interest . Some real good ones still around !!

There’s a white 1971 HO 455 car in Buffalo, not sure who the owner is but the vin is 228871N110001 which is a super early Vin, if not #1. Do you know this car or these vins well enough to know if it’s the first?
I know you said you had the first RAII Firebird, like the white one at Mecum.
Pontiacs galore

[Diabl07]

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-0906-1975-pontiac-trans-am/

This 455 HO was a West Seneca car new!
Buffalo had quite a few rare Pontiacs

[auwrestling]

There’s a white 1971 HO 455 car in Buffalo, not sure who the owner is but the vin is 228871N110001 which is a super early Vin, if not #1. Do you know this car or these vins well enough to know if it’s the first?
I know you said you had the first RAII Firebird, like the white one at Mecum.
Pontiacs galore

A low 1971 455 Ho ta would be 228871N100___
Our 68 RAII FB is a lower vin than the white fb.

[auwrestling]

https://www.hotrod.com/features/hppp-0906-1975-pontiac-trans-am/

This 455 HO was a West Seneca car new!
Buffalo had quite a few rare Pontiacs

Yes, that’s Austin Pontiac , Orchard Park Road in West Seneca doesn’t exist anymore. Been in there many times back in the 70s and 80s buying parts.
never did any tracking or researching on the 75 and newer cars

[Diabl07]

A low 1971 455 Ho ta would be 228871N100___
Our 68 RAII FB is a lower vin than the white fb.

So it just so happens that it’s number 1001 or whatever Firebird made that year? That’s still actually really fascinating.
Your FB is a lower vin? Wouldn’t be the first time a auction house lied but that’s really interesting, theirs was 163680
So was your 68 also built on the first day? Neat to know such a historically Important GM car is so close to home!

[Diabl07]

Yes, that’s Austin Pontiac , Orchard Park Road in West Seneca doesn’t exist anymore. Been in there many times back in the 70s and 80s buying parts.
never did any tracking or researching on the 75 and newer cars

Muscle cars really died out after that point, very neat to know though, one of the last true muscle cars
I wonder if there’s any pre-75 cars I’m missing. I know most of the heavy hitters, Judge Convertibles are really the cool ones. Ram Air IV cars and the super rare 70/71 cars. That $1,100,000 mecum sale really solidified those as million dollar muscle. Wonder if we ever had any of those besides the RA III and IV and Judge cars Bob in Rochester had. I know he had that amazing gold 1971, and a red one I’m not sure about, but that gold one was just incredible. Shame i never got to see it when he owned it here

[auwrestling]

Did you have both red cars? I had no idea there were 2 Admiralty blue cars, that’s so cool! I’ll have to look at the registry again to add to to mine with info and stuff.
You really are the most knowledgeable in the area!
I’ve had at least 6 - 74 Super duties from the Western New York area 3 4speeds the rest automatics ,three red ,two blue and one white. And that’s what I can remember as I think about it . I’ll probably come up with a couple more 74 SDs that I’ve had over the years.

[auwrestling]

Muscle cars really died out after that point, very neat to know though, one of the last true muscle cars
I wonder if there’s any pre-75 cars I’m missing. I know most of the heavy hitters, Judge Convertibles are really the cool ones. Ram Air IV cars and the super rare 70/71 cars. That $1,100,000 mecum sale really solidified those as million dollar muscle. Wonder if we ever had any of those besides the RA III and IV and Judge cars Bob in Rochester had. I know he had that amazing gold 1971, and a red one I’m not sure about, but that gold one was just incredible. Shame i never got to see it when he owned it here

There’s definitely a lot of cars you’re missing when it comes to Pontiacs in this area . I found and purchased Raiv and SD455 motorrs that came from cars in this area that were junked !
I’ve had three Judge convertibles 1. 69 RA three black four-speed that we Bought in 1980 and 2 -70s a green RAIV and a Mayfair maze ra 3 both 4 Spds

[Diabl07]

There’s definitely a lot of cars you’re missing when it comes to Pontiacs in this area . I found and purchased Raiv and SD455 motorrs that came from cars in this area that were junked !
I’ve had three Judge convertibles 1. 69 RA three black four-speed that we Bought in 1980 and 2 -70s a green RAIV and a Mayfair maze ra 3 both 4 Spds

There’s so much I have left to learn
The pepper green car? I think Bob B owned that car.
I think he had a black/black 4 speed RA III vert too. They made a hundred or so of those right? Chances it’s the same may be low, but very cool!
You’re the Pontiac guy!

[auwrestling]

There’s so much I have left to learn
The pepper green car? I think Bob B owned that car.
I think he had a black/black 4 speed RA III vert too. They made a hundred or so of those right? Chances it’s the same may be low, but very cool!
You’re the Pontiac guy!

Yes, the pepper green RAIV 70 judge Conv that Bob has I found and brought home to Western New York..
I went with Bob when he purchased a black on white 69 Gto raiv convertible.
He also had a 69 Gto ra 3 convertible, four speed that was green on green. That one has since been sold

[auwrestling]

My brother Bob and his 69 Judge RA 3 black on black four-speed white top. This is around 1981.

[fortim]

I absolutely agree! all of these stories are so incredible! so many people sharing all of their favorite moments, its so cool!
It was a little passion project of mine a few months ago to start compiling information from every crevice of memory and the internet to create a registry of the rare muscle cars that were in the WNY area. this thread has catapulted this project way higher than I expected. I haven't updated my registries totally for a few weeks now, and I've added so much. I'm hoping to have everything updated as much as possible by the new year to post here as Google Sheets or Excel (depends on which works better for everyone here) Ill update it as long as im still looking for cars to add, and im not even 20 yet so expect many more years of these registries expanding everyone!

This picture was taken at Crystal Beach, Ontario in July of '79. All of the cars were from WNY. I had just turned 20 yrs old and I'm wearing the red shorts...
Left to right: 69 442 4sp, 69 RAIII 4sp (my car), 68 Firebird 400 4sp, 65 Skylark auto, 67 Delmont 425 auto (still owned) and the 70 Stage 1 auto in GSX paint scheme. All but the Firebird were ragtops and unfortunately the the 2 Pontiacs didn't survive. Fun times and Canadian beer!

[Diabl07]

Ok I did some work on the Judge Registry
It’s not all of them but it’s really something

69 Judge Coupe RA IV
242369G133018
WW M-21
Carousel Red/Black
Schoen Pontiac Fairport NY

1969 Judge Coupe RA III
242369P305352
WS M20
Midnight Green Green
Castelletti Pontiac Inc Rome NY

1969 Judge Coupe RA III
242369Р341397
WS M20
Carousel Red/Black
Pitts Pontiac Webster; NY

1970 judge coupe RA III
2423701116131
WS M-21
Orbit Orange/Black
Austin Pontiac Inc. West Seneca NY

1970 Judge coupe RA III
2423701116835
WS M-20
Orbit Orange
Jim Culligan Pontiac Williamsville NY

1970 Judge Coupe RA III
242370P254233
WS M-20 Granada Gold/Brown
Pontiac Motor Div Zone Williamsville NY

[Diabl07]

This picture was taken at Crystal Beach, Ontario in July of '79. All of the cars were from WNY. I had just turned 20 yrs old and I'm wearing the red shorts...
Left to right: 69 442 4sp, 69 RAIII 4sp (my car), 68 Firebird 400 4sp, 65 Skylark auto, 67 Delmont 425 auto (still owned) and the 70 Stage 1 auto in GSX paint scheme. All but the Firebird were ragtops and unfortunately the the 2 Pontiacs didn't survive. Fun times and Canadian beer!

You just have the coolest photos from western New York!

[Diabl07]

Also a red 1970 WS car and a green WS car both from Syracuse

[Diabl07]

My brother Bob and his 69 Judge RA 3 black on black four-speed white top. This is around 1981.

Was this a factory black/black with a white top? That’s an insanely rare combo! Judge registry doesn’t even have one haha. I don’t think they have nearly all of them registered just yet.

[auwrestling]

This picture was taken at Crystal Beach, Ontario in July of '79. All of the cars were from WNY. I had just turned 20 yrs old and I'm wearing the red shorts...
Left to right: 69 442 4sp, 69 RAIII 4sp (my car), 68 Firebird 400 4sp, 65 Skylark auto, 67 Delmont 425 auto (still owned) and the 70 Stage 1 auto in GSX paint scheme. All but the Firebird were ragtops and unfortunately the the 2 Pontiacs didn't survive. Fun times and Canadian beer!

Spent a lot of weekends at Crystal Beach. My buddy had a cottage there and then it was off to Sherkston Quarry .we also spent a lot of time with the cars at Chestnut Ridge. I’ll post a picture.

[fortim]

I owned a couple of the red SD 74s you’re talking about.
WE ALSO HAD TWO OF THE 74 ADMIRALITY BLUE FOUR-SPEED CARS FROM THE BUFFALO AREA , not on your list .
The white on white 4 Spd 73 on your list is one of the best ones in the country . It’s is not around here anymore too bad
I’ll cover the 73 SD TRANS AMs later if there’s interest . Some real good ones still around !!

I'm interested, did the '73 white/white SD 4sp go to CA years ago? I know an original paint lower mileage car in CA that might be white/white, Please include the RAII cars...
To all, not sorry about the WNY Pontiac vibe. :cool2:

[auwrestling]

1980
From left to right
70 RAIV judge,73 SD455TA 4spd , 74 Trans Am 400, 69 Judg RA3 , 74 SD 455 TA automatic,70 Formula 400, 70 Trans Am ra3,70 gto 455 4spd
Everybody in the picture wrestled for Iroquois High school and local college . We were a tight group of friends .

[auwrestling]

Was this a factory black/black with a white top? That’s an insanely rare combo! Judge registry doesn’t even have one haha. I don’t think they have nearly all of them registered just yet.

Yes, my brother Bob ‘s car was black with black interior and a white top four speed 355 posi manual steering manual brakes all original got it out of Hemmings around 1980.

[auwrestling]

I'm interested, did the '73 white/white SD 4sp go to CA years ago? I know an original paint lower mileage car in CA that might be white/white, Please include the RAII cars...
To all, not sorry about the WNY Pontiac vibe. :cool2:

Yes, the White 73 super duty four speed did go to California San Jose area ,super nice car. It Was only a few years ago.

[Diabl07]

Yes, my brother Bob ‘s car was black with black interior and a white top four speed 355 posi manual steering manual brakes all original got it out of Hemmings around 1980.

Wow. wonder if that car exists anymore.
I’ve seen black/black with black top, and black/white with white top but never the mix. Judge registry doesn’t have a 70 in Mayfair Maize either, that’s a true one of one, no doubt about that

[auwrestling]

Wow. wonder if that car exists anymore.
I’ve seen black/black with black top, and black/white with white top but never the mix. Judge registry doesn’t have a 70 in Mayfair Maize either, that’s a true one of one, no doubt about that

Yes, we had it up until a few years ago. It’s now in Ohio and it very good collection.
The Mayfair maze 70 Judge was sold to a guy in Texas I believe . I’d have to go back and doublecheck. I also think that had a sandalwood interior.

[auwrestling]

Wow. wonder if that car exists anymore.
I’ve seen black/black with black top, and black/white with white top but never the mix. Judge registry doesn’t have a 70 in Mayfair Maize either, that’s a true one of one, no doubt about that

1985 my brother’s wedding Holy Spirit Church in North Buffalo just off Delaware Avenue And Hertel

[AnthonyS]

^ that's awesome!

[muscle_collector]

matt, i cant remember because im old and its been several decades ago, what town they came from but i bought a 73 sd ta red/black and a 74 sd ta blue/white seats blue dash etc out of NY. got both from the original owners and ironically both of them were police officers.

[auwrestling]

matt, i cant remember because im old and its been several decades ago, what town they came from but i bought a 73 sd ta red/black and a 74 sd ta blue/white seats blue dash etc out of NY. got both from the original owners and ironically both of them were police officers.

Probably from the other side of the state I don’t recognize the cars.

[auwrestling]

matt, i cant remember because im old and its been several decades ago, what town they came from but i bought a 73 sd ta red/black and a 74 sd ta blue/white seats blue dash etc out of NY. got both from the original owners and ironically both of them were police officers.

Hey Gary, did you look at the picture of the judge convertible in the wedding?

[Diabl07]

1985 my brother’s wedding Holy Spirit Church in North Buffalo just off Delaware Avenue And Hertel

That’s so cool
Judge registry needs to update. No info on those unicorns
If I might ask, what got you into the hobby, into pontiacs and all those especially rare Judge and Firebird cars?
That’s always my favorite question to ask car guys I meet

[auwrestling]

That’s so cool
Judge registry needs to update. No info on those unicorns
If I might ask, what got you into the hobby, into pontiacs and all those especially rare Judge and Firebird cars?
That’s always my favorite question to ask car guys I meet

1974-75 Teammate on my college wrestling team drove a 69 judge and strongly influenced me to pursue Pontiacs. The following year we were at our club practice and one of the high school seniors working out with us had just purchased a 72 Trans Am 4 speed from his neighbor at a local farm . I got to take it for a ride. After that my sights on muscle cars was locked in , this was a Race car with a license plate and looked the Part Inside and out. There was nothing on the road to compare to it short of a Ferrari, but of course three times money . My quest began . As far as the rare cars go, you just had to pick up a book and start reading or magazines and then came Hemmings and I was also lucky enough to live in a area with much to offer .

[muscle_collector]

Hey Gary, did you look at the picture of the judge convertible in the wedding?
just saw it. thats truly a "kodak moment"

[Diabl07]

1974-75 Teammate on my college wrestling team drove a 69 judge and strongly influenced me to pursue Pontiacs. The following year we were at our club practice and one of the high school seniors working out with us had just purchased a 72 Trans Am 4 speed from his neighbor at a local farm . I got to take it for a ride. After that my sights on muscle cars was locked in , this was a Race car with a license plate and looked the Part Inside and out. There was nothing on the road to compare to it short of a Ferrari, but of course three times money . My quest began . As far as the rare cars go, you just had to pick up a book and start reading or magazines and then came Hemmings and I was also lucky enough to live in a area with much to offer .

That’s a fascinating story
Your collection is incredible, Im at a loss for words for how much i have to document now with your cars and all these SD/RA/HO cars I know now.

[Diabl07]

On the topic of muscle, does anyone here know more info on the Red Yenko Deuce that is in the Suydam collection? I believe that car was local in the 90s or 80s
I think the owner had some other Yenko cars in buffalo, yellow Chevelle and a gold Camaro if my notes don’t deceive me

[auwrestling]

On the topic of muscle, does anyone here know more info on the Red Yenko Deuce that is in the Suydam collection? I believe that car was local in the 90s or 80s
I think the owner had some other Yenko cars in buffalo, yellow Chevelle and a gold Camaro if my notes don’t deceive me

Can’t help you with that one but the 67 Green Shelby GT500 427 is from Buffalo , Nichter car

[auwrestling]

just saw it. thats truly a "kodak moment"

The guy driving and the 3 guys standing in front of the doorway are all brothers . The one standing to the left is a national champ for Brockport state wrestling team , his next older brother is driving and he’s a 2x all American 2 & 3rd nationals for univ of Buffalo . The other 2 are pretty tough also . Figured u would appreciate that part of the story and yes a great picture .

[EZ Nova]

Can’t help you with that one but the 67 Green Shelby GT500 427 is from Buffalo , Nichter car

Would that be the 1 of 1 SUPER SNAKE that Charlie owned at one time?

[auwrestling]

Would that be the 1 of 1 SUPER SNAKE that Charlie owned at one time?

No this one came out of frontier Ford , Niagara Falls ny . There was three of them built with the 427 side oiler

[auwrestling]

http://corvettes-musclecars.com/gallery2/v/al_ford/1967+Shelby+GT500+Mustang+Factory+427+Side-Oiler/

[jims68nova]

On the topic of muscle, does anyone here know more info on the Red Yenko Deuce that is in the Suydam collection? I believe that car was local in the 90s or 80s
I think the owner had some other Yenko cars in buffalo, yellow Chevelle and a gold Camaro if my notes don’t deceive me

Bill Wertheim owned a Red Deuce for a short time (early 2000s)

[Diabl07]

Would that be the 1 of 1 SUPER SNAKE that Charlie owned at one time?

I don’t believe it was called a super snake but it had the same
Engine make up as the one of one super snake. 427 side oiler. Paul’s car was ordered and delivered before the super snake car, I believe it was the first to be ordered with the 427 option

[auwrestling]

I don’t believe it was called a super snake but it had the same
Engine make up as the one of one super snake. 427 side oiler. Paul’s car was ordered and delivered before the super snake car, I believe it was the first to be ordered with the 427 option

Check out the link I posted earlier.

[Diabl07]

Check out the link I posted earlier.

I had no idea he had it in his collection, nice to know it’s still around and in an excellent collection

[auwrestling]

I had no idea he had it in his collection, nice to know it’s still around and in an excellent collection

Yes, it is and it was restored here by one of the better shops and he has a great collection also.!!

[Diabl07]

Yes, it is and it was restored here by one of the better shops and he has a great collection also.!!

how long did Paul own it here?

[fortim]

Yes, the White 73 super duty four speed did go to California San Jose area ,super nice car. It Was only a few years ago.
The guy that bought my WW5 has a White/White original paint 4sp that he said he's had since he was 16, he was probably 35 when we spoke. Sounds like there's a couple of these cars in the same area.

[auwrestling]

The guy that bought my WW5 has a White/White original paint 4sp that he said he's had since he was 16, he was probably 35 when we spoke. Sounds like there's a couple of these cars in the same area.

Yes, it’s got to be a different car. This one came from the Rochester area and the original owner had it and sold it to the guy in California believe it was under 20,000 miles on the car.

[Diabl07]

Hello everyone! I have some new registries for everyone,
Ex/Current WNY Wing Cars!
Plenty of Superbirds and Daytonas around the 716 and 585 back in the day and now!

tons of Daytonas delivered new
a green one (XX29L9B356528) that sold new T Transitowne Dodge which stayed here in a barn for decades
an orange car (XX29L9B390024) which was delivered new to McEvoy Dodge
A custom one which was done up in some really cool 1970s paint jobs in period and was delivered new at McEvoy Dodge (XX29L9B356532)
Besides the Orange car and the Custom car, rochester had 5 cars I think (7 total)
XX29L9B356516, Lake Ave Dodge
XX29L9B379753, Culver Dodge
XX29L9B381554, McEvoy Dodge
XX29L9B386671, McEvoy Dodge
XX29L9B386570, McEvoy Dodge
XX29L9B405179, Culver Dodge

there were a couple not new too
A Hemi car from Bob Bs collection in Rochester (XX29J9B412548)
Bob also had an orange 440 car, super nice
Another orange one (XX29L9B383272) which was here for a couple years in the 2010s
There is a blue one here (XX29L9B402967) with a really wild story I haven’t gotten into yet, the owner is a really nice guy

Anyway, the Superbirds
There were a ton here new, Steve battaglia had a bunch, he had a couple blue ones and yellow one and 2 white one, one which was the last Superbird made (RM23V0A172609) (I don’t have vins on the rest) but his collection was cool!
Bob B comes back up again, he had a Yellow hemi car and a white Hemi car (which i don’t have vinformation on) he also had a green Hemi Superbird (RM23R0A172604) and a Petty Blue 440 car (RM23V0A169498)
RM23U175685 was an Orange car delivered new to Webster NY and came out in 2016 and sold out of state
RM23U0A161580 was an Orange 440 727 car, local for a few years, sold out of a great muscle car collection in 2020, same owner recently bought a pistol grip green U-Code car (RM23U0A175663) and he’s been showing it at the cars and coffees at the Little Speed Shop, really amazing car I’ve seen it around
A yellow one (RM23V0A170886) that was for sale at a dealer in Jamestown a year ago
RM23V0A171626 Sold new in Westfield and sold out of WNY in 1983
There was also another white one that sold new at Canandaiguia Motors and stayed until Legendary Motorcar sold it maybe 8 or so years ago
RM23U0A165379 is a white one that has been local to Niagara Falls I think since 2015, was for sale Basil Chevrolet
RM23U0A165435 along with a yellow car were the 2 Superbirds infamously in the basement in Rochester for decades

There’s definitely cars I’m missing, I think Basil had a Daytona new, and dozens of Superbirds I know I don’t know about yet
Those are the wing cars, sometime this week I’ll do the other hemi cars, I’ll have to cut some since there’s just so many.
Happy reading! And happy holidays!

[Jim69Z]

https://www.basilclassiccars.com/vehicles/743/1970-plymouth-superbird

[Diabl07]

https://www.basilclassiccars.com/vehicles/743/1970-plymouth-superbird

That’s the one! Brought to WNY in 2015, they had it originally listed at 245k maybe 6 months or so ago, they tried it on Bring a Trailer and got humbled with the bids, so it’s 199k now, which Is still a lot for a car of that history.

[tjs44]

My 69 gold RAIII 4 speed Judge is still in Calif.Will find the vin and post.It was a cover car for the OPG catalog.Tom

[Diabl07]

My 69 gold RAIII 4 speed Judge is still in Calif.Will find the vin and post.It was a cover car for the OPG catalog.Tom

That color is absolutely gorgeous! What’s the name of the color? I don’t think I’ve seen another GTO in that color

[WILMASBOYL78]

are you talking about the bench seat , column shift L78? lol.. Steve somehow bought that car out from underneath a friend of mine. i saw it at his shop on comet right after he bought it. He didnt know anything about the car at that time, he wasnt even sure it was a real big block car.

I want to say how much I appreciate this thread...it has lead to some great contacts who knew our black Nova back in the day. Having fun 'bench racing' with folks about this car. Plan to start a new thread on our winter project with this Nova...stay tuned.

-wilma:worship:

[tjs44]

The last 6 on the gold Judge is 127826.Cant find the PHS,im sure Matt can tell us the factory color.I bought the car because of the color.Someone over time had painted the Judge red.I had it done back to the original color.Tom

[Kurt S]

It's Antique Gold, code 65, same as Olympic Gold (Chevrolet).

[tjs44]

Thanks Kurt.Tom

[mssl72]

I'm really liking this thread. I'm from Rochester originally as well as my cars. I love what you're finding. Keep digging!! :headbang:

[dykstra]

Agreed. I’m not from New York, but I too am enjoying this thread.

[Diabl07]

Back on this thread after the holidays with a pretty cool find. No doubt the single rarest muscle car western New York has ever seen. So rare it almost doesn’t exist (I don’t think it was supposed to anyway)

One of 3 (I’ve seen 3 but I could be wrong) 1967 Plymouth Hemi Satellite

Here’s an article about it

https://www.440magnum.com/mopars/2004/march/1967hemisatellite.shtml

[George H]

275383

Found this car while calling on a customer - inside the lobby in Wayland,NY. No gas tank or battery due to its being inside a building

[Diabl07]

Cant say I've seen very many of these in this color, is this part of a collection? looks worn but still nice. Didn't stray far from where it was delivered either! love to see it!

[L16pilot]

My 70 L78 Camaro sold new at Heinrich in Rochester and apparently spent it's entire life in that area. I bought it as a project from a guy who said he bought it from the OO's son in 1999 but didn't have a name or contact info. He did say the OO may have been a mechanic at Heinrich during the time, but that's all conjecture. Originally Shadow Gray, it was at some point, painted black and had a 3-pc spoiler added. Sure wish I could find some history on this car. Anyone remember a Shadow Gray or Black 70 L78 Camaro running around the Rochester area?

[Diabl07]

This is the Marilla Boss 429 that's was parked in 1974 actually. There was a street racing incident and the owner hid the car for 35 years. It has 13k miles on it. this was the day they pulled it out of a shed that the car barely fit in. It went to Musclecar Alley in Arcade , all they needed to do was was clean it. The original motor was refreshed and reassembled and dyno'ed up to 5k. It went to one of the big auction houses.

I havent seen that Cuda in twenty years.. last time I saw it, it was driving down the 400 getting off at the Union exit.

When did it go to auction? 13k miles Black/Black 429 was probably worth some change even a decade ago.

[iluv69s]

If I recall, a member here owns a low-mile original paint black 429 mustang. Wonder if it is the same car?

[smallblockhero]

When did it go to auction? 13k miles Black/Black 429 was probably worth some change even a decade ago.

AUWrestling is Matt I believe.. he would know precisely . IIRC he was involved directly with Tom on that.

[auwrestling]

It left western New York in 2013. It was sold as a used car at Delaware sports car used car dealer in Buffalo in the early 70s on Delaware Avenue between Hertel and Tacoma. I lived behind the lot on the next street.

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

:beers:
~ Pete

.

[69W31post]

WOW What a great thread! Some very cool stuff. I'd like to share that we are resurrecting a 1969 Cutlass W-31 bought new in Camden NY at Walters Chevy/Olds. Originally Saffron and completely loaded with options. We have aptly named the car "Mr. Jones" after the original owner, Robert Jones from Oneida NY who purchased it new while in the Navy. Maybe someone recalls the car or Bob Jones? (I know, very common name).
also, for those interested , there's a ton of videos on this project on our YouTube channel, The Auto Refinery.
Looking forward to more stories on this thread.
-steve

[smallblockhero]

i had no idea youre car was in NY... ive watched quite a few of the YT vids you posted. big fan of W-31 cars.. looking forward to more.

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

When did Mr. Jones’ take delivery of his W31/was it a Demo/what options specifically?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Here’s a few random but cool Western NY Ads I spotted while seeking others above.
Any WNY Members wanting to search old Ads for specific vehicles, please speak up w/ details.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[69W31post]

yes yes ! smallblockhero This car "Mr.Jones" was originally sold new in NY and is back in NY with me undergoing its' major reconstruction. Thank You so much for taking the time to watch some of our videos. We really do appreciate that!!

[69W31post]

WOAH!!!!!!!! This newspaper advertisement is amazing!!!! I called Joe this morning with the news of seeing this post !!!!
As I write this, I am texting with one of the sons of the owner of that dealership - Walters Chevy - Olds. !!!! He tells me that his father loved to "check all the boxes" when ordering these cars. He also mentioned that their dealership was known for the high performance cars that they stocked.
That said, there are some oddities regarding the dates of purchase of our car. While the car was built 4th week of March 1969, and the POP was dated 4/8/69, that POP was not mailed to Robert Jones at the Long Beach Naval Base ( attn. USS FIRM) until 1970 after he purchased it as a new car on 6/19/1970. and that envelope is actually post marked Aug. 20, 1970.
Also ,we do have a typed up invoice from this dealership on 1970 letter head listing every single option the same way they're all listed in this advertisement.
But I guess that without a Vin# listed or even a color, we can only assume that this ad is for our car and that it may, in fact, had been used for a demo until our very own Mr. Jones purchased this car. Unfortunately, the real Mr Jones passed away right around the time my brother purchased the car and therefore we were never able to maker contact with him directly for any specific information.
We are so very thankful that you took the time to locate that ad and to post it. You have done this in the past for me for my '69 F-85 W-31 from Courtesy Olds in Tallahassee Fla.
THANK YOU!! We are always - and I mean always - on the hunt for new information regarding our cars. We absolutely love this stuff!!!
-steve

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

If all options the same, it’s doubtful there was another W31 exactly equipped?
Here’s one Ad from 03/70, the 442 part or W31 a mistake also whoever was creating Walters’ Ads seems to have got the 442 and W31 mixed up in some of their other Ads too.
I'll look deeper and post anything more I see that’s relevant also please ask the Dealer’s son if he wants to search any specific cars or salesman names he remembers.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[69W31post]

Oh!! ?? How many other ads from this dealership for W-31's are you aware of ?
Very interesting that there may have been more than a few sold new there.

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Here’s a few more Walters’ Ads, again 442 + W31 mistakenly mixed together makes it tough to know which is what other than 09/69 Ad w/ 400 noted a 442, possibly W30 but not W32 w/ 4-Spd?:hmmm:
Again if Options exact, the 07/69 Ad must be the Mr. Jones car…sorry it’s such a fuzzy copy.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[69W31post]

Ok then! Very cool! Well if nothing else, they (employees writing the ads for Walters) seem to be consistent, as the itemized price sheet we have, typed on 1970 letter head, also references our car to be a Cutlass H Coupe 442 as well as having a locking rear diff, both of which are technically incorrect. hahaha
Thanks again for making these efforts. There is a video from early on in the project where we go over all of the options this car has. I'll figure out which one its is and post a title to that video for anyone interested.
Have great day
-steve

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Cruising the above Ads again including mileage noted in some, all but the one from 09/69 w/ 400 powered 442 may actually be for the Mr. Jones car?:hmmm:
Looking forward to the videos etc but being a past owner of a few W-Post cars, would love to hear/see more of your user name 69W31Post!
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[69W31post]

Good morning. Yes I'd tend to agree with you. Seems that maybe our car was ordered loaded up and just wasn't a strong seller.
Regarding my F-85 W-31, we have done many videos on and about that car on our channel. If you haven't seen them, I'd like to humbly ask that you take a peak. Some of these topics include, how I came about buying it at 15 years old AND ( this is a big one) we towed it to Florida in April to trace it's history..... It's a 3 part video series. We are so proud of
We met the original owner at the building that was the dealership on the 55th Anniversary of him buying it new. - we made the front page of the Tallahassee paper with that one-!
the 2nd and 3rd parts are just as cool!
I can try and post links to these videos or just look at The Auto Refinery on YouTube and look for that 3 part series . I'd be so honored and appreciative to hear your opinion.
Truth be told, the Mr.Jones project is only some of what we have on our plates over here.
thanks again and looking forward to hearing back after you've checked out some of those stories.
Happy Friday!
-steve

[auwrestling]

‘

Cruising the above Ads again including mileage noted in some, all but the one from 09/69 w/ 400 powered 442 may actually be for the Mr. Jones car?:hmmm:
Looking forward to the videos etc but being a past owner of a few W-Post cars, would love to hear/see more of your user name 69W31Post!
:beers:
~ Pete

.

Hi Pete , how about any ads listing 1973 Trans Am SD455 cars? Thanks Matt

[auwrestling]

‘

:beers:
~ Pete

.

Wow , that’s it and like I said I grew up on the street right behind the Delaware motors lot. We would climb over the fences as kids and check out the cars back in the late 60s and early 70s.

[auwrestling]

I have a friend who worked for delaware sports cars in the 1970s, he did engine work for the Ferraris they sold new/used. ill give him a call and see what if he knows about that Boss and the other stuff they sold.

Did you ever talk to your friend?

[PeteLeathersac]

Hi Pete , how about any ads listing 1973 Trans Am SD455 cars? Thanks Matt
‘
Quite a few 74’s but three below the only ‘73 SD Ads I saw advertised in NY pre 1980, the 10/77 + 06/79 Ads both appear to be Long Island but 04/78 Buffalo Ad may be one you’re referring to?
Love to hear of any more WNY cars you remember also cool you lived behind Delaware Motors, do you recall ever seeing any SuperBirds there?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[auwrestling]

‘
Quite a few 74’s but three below the only ‘73 SD Ads I saw advertised in NY pre 1980, the 10/77 + 06/79 Ads both appear to be Long Island but 04/78 Buffalo Ad may be one you’re referring to?
Love to hear of any more WNY cars you remember also cool you lived behind Delaware Motors, do you recall ever seeing any SuperBirds there?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

Yes the 73 4spd is my car. That’s the guy I bought it from a 1978.
1973 TA SD455 Red 4spd black deluxe interior and loaded . Here’s a pic a month after getting it home

[JRSully]

Some serious meats on the back of that rod..

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Cool the 04/78 Ad is your SD, were the Formula Super Stocks added or already on it?
Again, that’s all I saw for ‘73 SD’s but also have lots of ‘74 SD Ads saved I’ll post later.

Here’s a bunch of pre 1980 WNY GTO Judge Ads in chronological order, more to come.
LMK if anything needs expanding/worth digging deeper into/other WNY cars to look for.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[auwrestling]

Yes, those tires were on it when I bought it and we ended up putting them on a 74 Admiral blue 4 Spd Super Duty that my brother bought and I put a set of original Firestone with the rally twos off of another 73 Trans Am on the Super Duty
Here it is about five years later, at my brother’s wedding in North Buffalo about two blocks from the Delaware sports car lot .

[auwrestling]

Yes, please share the 74 Super Duty ads. I may know of some of those a lot of the cars I bought were out of the local swap sheet, which is probably not online.
I don’t recognize any of the judges, but they’re so generic of ads , It’s tough to say and there was a 69 green convertible judge up in the Rochester area, so that’s probably the ad for that one.

[auwrestling]

Another pic of our 73SDs (3-4spds , 1AT) just a couple years ago in the backyard, the 4 speed one I bought in 78 is the second from the right

[turbo69bird]

I didn’t realize western NY was such a hot bed for muscle cars. I bought my hellcat durango up there and was thinking it was odd to find a performance car in such a snowy place after seeing some of the pictures Matt has posted w tractors and 8 ft snow banks. Guess after you get out of all that snow you want to go out and blow off some steam w some serious HP!!

[auwrestling]

Pic of snow removal 1/24 last winter

[turbo69bird]

Is the towne dealerships up there connected to the towne Pontiac that raced the 69 RAIV firebird and the 68 RAII firebirds ? Pretty sure that dealer was in Canada but there’s dealerships in Buffalo area w that name correct?

Notice at that time period stock was required to have exhaust under the car even if just hanging there.

[69M22Z]

Wow!! Cool!!

[auwrestling]

Blizzard pics from 2014 walking from my house to the shop to get on the tractor

[auwrestling]

Is the towne dealerships up there connected to the towne Pontiac that raced the 69 RAIV firebird and the 68 RAII firebirds ? Pretty sure that dealer was in Canada but there’s dealerships in Buffalo area w that name correct?

Notice at that time period stock was required to have exhaust under the car even if just hanging there.

No

[turbo69bird]

Those are the pictures I’m talking about right there.

No shortage of SNOW there.

[turbo69bird]

No

Not the same people?? Interesting Figured w the same spelling and all it would be connected somehow.


Any of those car been found yet?

Feel like I remember a black IV car having been found a while back

[auwrestling]

Not the same people?? Interesting Figured w the same spelling and all it would be connected somehow.


Any of those car been found yet?

Feel like I remember a black IV car having been found a while back

I believe they have

[turbo69bird]

I can’t imagine anyone finding one of those cars and restoring it stock that’s as bad as that white w American flag copo Camaro from CT getting restored stock. Uggg like restoring superman to Clark Kent status.

But back to our WNY thread. I’m surprised the answer wasn’t there’s 2 or 3 of them in that building in the picture.

[69W31post]

Oh Boy! Now this is what I'm talking about... while we love our W-31's, El Caminos, LeMans, Corvette and Mustang ....the next car(s) on our hit list has GOT to be a Trans Am!!!!

[PeteLeathersac]

Yes, please share the 74 Super Duty ads. I may know of some of those a lot of the cars I bought were out of the local swap sheet, which is probably not online.
I don’t recognize any of the judges, but they’re so generic of ads , It’s tough to say and there was a 69 green convertible judge up in the Rochester area, so that’s probably the ad for that one.


I'll share the '74 SD Ads next but check the Judge Ads again as I've updated the posting w/ more also have a few left yet to add.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[auwrestling]

Don’t really recognize any of the judges, but that’s a little before I was in the market still in high school and that’s democrat and Chronicles was in Rochester, which is about 90 miles up the road

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

I finished updating the Judge postings of what I had saved, again they’re all pre-1980.
I'll try searching 80’s later also w/ a wider scope but that usually encompasses Eastern NY Newspapers too which is what I was trying to avoid by searching closer to Rochester.
Considering only minuscule points of a tiny percentage of Old Newspapers have been scanned, it’s often amazing what has been also what can be found w/ a bit of digging, Ads above a good example.
I’ll work on posting the ‘74 SD Ads next…otherwise, anyone please speak up w/ details of any WNY cars worth searching for including Dealer Ads when new.
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[mssl72]

Hey Pete! Thanks for posting all those ads! Cool to see them. I'd be curious to see ads from Piehler Pontiac about July/August 1980. That's where I found my Z. It came from Heinrich when it was new. It ended up down the street at Piehler.

[auwrestling]

Hey Pete! Thanks for posting all those ads! Cool to see them. I'd be curious to see ads from Piehler Pontiac about July/August 1980. That's where I found my Z. It came from Heinrich when it was new. It ended up down the street at Piehler.

Piehler had some great high-performance Pontiacs back in the late 60s and 70s RAII Firebird !!

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Looking quickly, it appears Piehler did little Newspaper Advertising or just few have been scanned?
I did spot this Heinrich Ad below…anything of your car being a Demo or selling there again used Mark?:hmmm:
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[mssl72]

Thanks Pete! My car wasn't a demo. The original owner worked at Heinrich. I don't remember what he did there. I tracked him down and when I met up with him he told me the options he chose and some of the early life of the car before he sold it to his brother-in-law. He showed me some pictures of it (gave me a few too) and still had some parts for it, which i promptly made a deal for. The brother-in-law traded in at Piehler for... a Triumph TR7. That's why I was asking if you've seen any ads for Piehler. A friend of mine told me about the car on the lot so I went to look and ended up buying it. That was 1980. I know way more about my Z than about my Caprice. It would be nice to find info on that car.

[Diabl07]

It left western New York in 2013. It was sold as a used car at Delaware sports car used car dealer in Buffalo in the early 70s on Delaware Avenue between Hertel and Tacoma. I lived behind the lot on the next street.

9F02Z198913 was sold at mecum in 2013, https://www.mecum.com/lots/154104/1969-ford-mustang-boss-429-fastback/?aa_id=52570-0

[Diabl07]

Did you ever talk to your friend?

Yes, He does not remember the car but he does remember many mustangs and Shelbys whenever he went into the showroom. he lived in Rochester and worked on all of the Ferraris and those kinds that came through Delaware.

[Diabl07]

Yes, please share the 74 Super Duty ads. I may know of some of those a lot of the cars I bought were out of the local swap sheet, which is probably not online.
I don’t recognize any of the judges, but they’re so generic of ads , It’s tough to say and there was a 69 green convertible judge up in the Rochester area, so that’s probably the ad for that one.

do you know the color name or interior on that convertible judge?

[auwrestling]

Pepper or Vedoro green

[auwrestling]

9F02Z198913 was sold at mecum in 2013, https://www.mecum.com/lots/154104/1969-ford-mustang-boss-429-fastback/?aa_id=52570-0

Can’t be the same car ,the one we had in Buffalo had only 9000 miles on it when it left here at the same time

[auwrestling]

Yes, He does not remember the car but he does remember many mustangs and Shelbys whenever he went into the showroom. he lived in Rochester and worked on all of the Ferraris and those kinds that came through Delaware.

He lived in Rochester and he would drive back-and-forth to Buffalo every day to work ? quite a haul

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

Not necessarily WNY but here’s a few more NY Ads for Judge ‘Verts, ‘74 SD Ads still to come.
There’s likely more in later years than I’m searching, LMK specifics of any cars/years to try.
Mark, what history do you have on your ‘66 Caprice, did we try before in past threads?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[mssl72]

‘

...Mark, what history do you have on your ‘66 Caprice, did we try before in past threads?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

Pete,
I don't think we tried in the past. I've always read the ads you posted to see if something was there though. I really don't know that much about it's history. The friend I got it from had it at least since the mid 80's. It had been sitting. I bought it in 1995. He told the Caprice was raced. It had ladder bars on it at one point and there's still remnants of the welds where they were attached to the rear axle tubes and frame points. Unfortunately one weld goes right over the date code, but I can still see the DN stamp for the gear ratio. The car was in Rochester when I bought it, but from what I was told it may have come from out of state. It was thought it came from Virginia or maybe Texas. Without some sort of paper trail, who knows. It was built in Norwood. Hey, if something pops up in the ads you dig into, that would be cool. Maybe a lead would come from it. Thanks!

[Diabl07]

He lived in Rochester and he would drive back-and-forth to Buffalo every day to work ? quite a haul

He worked on the cars they sent him, only went up to Buffalo every month or so

[PeteLeathersac]

‘

We can dig deeper later Mark including searching the phone #’s but here’s a couple Ads for you.
2’nd one looks most possible being Rochester also 4-Spd. noted, earlier Ad is Long Island?
:beers:
~ Pete

.

[mssl72]

Thanks Pete! :beers::beers: That one ad from the D&C seems like it could be a potential match. I'll have to touch base with my friend and see how he found it. Whether it was an ad, word-of-mouth, or on the street, I really don't know.

[Diabl07]

He lived in Rochester and he would drive back-and-forth to Buffalo every day to work ? quite a haul

Hey Matt! Do you happen to have any photos from the 2000s when you owned the Green 70 Judge RAIV Convertible before it sold to Bob in Rochester?

[auwrestling]

Hey Matt! Do you happen to have any photos from the 2000s when you owned the Green 70 Judge RAIV Convertible before it sold to Bob in Rochester?

Yes

[Diabl07]

Yes

Hopefully I can find some time to call and chat this weekend. I’d love to see the photos of the cars you have/had