72 TA : New Project

[njsteve]

Here's the lastest in derusting technology that I found here via the Yenko website: http://www.safestrustremover.com/
Though it takes a long time to work due to the current temperature here (around 45 degress) it is rather amazing. I bought a 5 gallon can of the derusting liquid and just followed the directions. I borrowed one of those curved water tanks that you check leaky tires with, wrapped the back of the car in a plastic tarp and fed it into the water tank. I then filled the tank with the liquid and used a small pump I bought at Home Depot, (they are sold for clearing the water from pool covers), hooked it to a garden sprayer with some hose and let it run.


Here is how I set up the contraption:


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/extview.jpg


here is the before picture showing the light scale behind the rear valance:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/before.jpg

Here is the progess after 2 hours. You can see the shiny metal starting to reappear.


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/tankbrace-2hourB.jpg

This is amazing stuff. It is not an acid, just some magical chemical compound accidentally discovered by the guy who owns the company. I stopped by his shop here in Jersey and bought the stuff directly from him. He said they originally were developing a non-toxic rust and scale cleaning process for use in the Holland and Lincoln Tunnels but it wasn't up to the Port Authority's specs so they didn't buy it. He had brought the excess liquid samples home and dumped them in a rusted barrel for disposal the next day. To his surprise, the next day the inside of the rusted barrel was completely shiny metal. And that's where he got the idea to use it on cars. Gotta love accidental discoveries. Isnt that how Silly Putty and plexiglass were both discovered: by accident.

I will let it run over night and update with more photos tomorrow! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

Here is the same spot after 24 hours of spraying. According to the manufacturer, it would go much faster if the ambient temperature was between 70 and 100 degrees. Since the stuff isn't flammable I think you could probably place an aquarium-type heater in the tank to warm the fluid up to 80 degrees or so and speed the chemical reaction up. Unfortunately I'd need to buy a lot more liquid to get it to a high enough level for the heater to work. So I guess I'll just let it spray as it is. It's kind of like those rock tumblers you had as a kid: you put the rocks and the polishing compound in the tumbler and let it spin for a month and then open it up and see the polished stones.

As you can see in the photo, more shiny metal is magically appearing with no paint/primer damage:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/tankbrace-24hrA.jpg

[firstgenaddict]

I never thought about it but I used the stuff back in May & June, and it did work very quickly... 6-8 hours was all it would take.

[Bill Pritchard]

Steve, your restoration narrative and photo documentation is just outstanding http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif I always enjoy reading about your progress. I guess if I wait to use this stuff on my Chevelle until after I move to AZ, it should work pretty well http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Mr70]

I agree,very informative.
Steve,you should quit your Day job.. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[njsteve]

My old day job, back in the last decade before the turn of the century (never thought I'd be old enough to actually say that) was as a tech editor for Musclecar Review and Mopar Muscle Magazine. Maybe if I keep doing this I can legitimately write the whole restoration off on my taxes as a business expense, since I'm now a "Freelance Internet Published Restoration Technician." http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[Xplantdad]

Whatever you classify yourself as...it's damn interesting to follow along!

[njsteve]

I kept thinking about the heated fluid idea so I stopped by the local PetsMart on my way home from work and picked up a submersible aquarium heater for about $25 (the ones for reptile tanks that can be fully underwater and not hanging on the side of the tank). Well it turns out that is the trick. Just heat up the fluid and it improves the chemical reaction immensely. Here is a spot by the front leaf spring hanger. I aimed the sprayer and let it go for about two minutes to check the aim while I got the camera ready and in that time it already converted most of the surface rust to clean metal.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC140004.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC140003.jpg

[firstgenaddict]

I was so impressed by the stuff... I kept looking around the house for rusty metal objects just so I could throw them in it...

[njsteve]

I have the aquarium heater running full tilt. the temp is about 65 degrees now and you can actually see the rust dissolve away.

here is the same spring perch area after 2 hours:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/drrail2hrB.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/drrailafter2.jpg

[njsteve]

And here's the rocker panel area before:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/drsillb42.jpg

and after about 45 minutes:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/drsillafter5.jpg

[njsteve]

Passenger side before and after:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/psidesillb41.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/psidesillafter3.jpg

[njsteve]

And here is the rear bulkhead area above the rear differential. It had a lot of darkened, rusty areas that cleaned up rather nicely in about an hour. It was a mess to do this area, though. I had to place a kiddy pool under the bucket to catch all the dripping fluid so it wouldn't go to waste (at $25 a gallon it's pretty valuable).

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/rear3.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/rear2.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/rear1.jpg

[Dave Rifkin]

How are you going to treat those areas now? Do you try to reproduce the red oxide primer with overspray?

[njsteve]

The rust removal stuff when dry, gives you some degree of protection for a couple months. That will give me a little time to do some careful touch up on the various spots. Since the center of the trunk floor needs to be replaced we will end up fogging in the areas behind the rear valance. The gas tank braces were the most scaly parts of the car anyway and they will need to be refinished along with the trunk floor.

By the way, here is how the rear bulkhead area looked before the rust dissolver stuff was used:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P1140004-1.jpg

[BARN FIND]

[ QUOTE ]
The rust removal stuff when dry, gives you some degree of protection for a couple months. That will give me a little time to do some careful touch up on the various spots. Since the center of the trunk floor needs to be replaced we will end up fogging in the areas behind the rear valance. The gas tank braces were the most scaly parts of the car anyway and they will need to be refinished along with the trunk floor.

By the way, here is how the rear bulkhead area looked before the rust dissolver stuff was used:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P1140004-1.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

This is off the subject but...I have spent untold hours under a multitude of 2nd Gen Camaros and after seeing the floor and those perfect rear frame rails on your car, I have to say that although I don't know what you paid for the car, I have to say you got a good deal regardless of price. You could look at 1000 cars and maybe not find 1 with rails that nice (I feel like I have crawled under that many sometimes!) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif I love seeing all the pics you post and since I have seen the underside I am really looking forward to seeing it finished. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

[/ QUOTE ]
This is off the subject but...I have spent untold hours under a multitude of 2nd Gen Camaros and after seeing the floor and those perfect rear frame rails on your car, I have to say that although I don't know what you paid for the car, I have to say you got a good deal regardless of price. You could look at 1000 cars and maybe not find 1 with rails that nice (I feel like I have crawled under that many sometimes!) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif I love seeing all the pics you post and since I have seen the underside I am really looking forward to seeing it finished. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I am more amazed than you! The car has 114,000 miles on it and spent 99% of it's life on the West Coast. I bought it from a guy in PA who brought it back from Washington State. It was sold new at Reliable Pontiac in Roseville, California (They're still in business!) I think I paid about $18,000 for the car back in 2004, saw it listed it on ebay and I immediately ran to the guy's house in PA and bought it on the spot. Top dollar at the time, but now you can't even get a rusted hulk for that. (check these links out and you'll see what $18k gets you now: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-F...1QQcmdZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-Firebird-Pontiac-Firebird-Trans-Am-1972-455-H-O_W0QQitemZ120056681488QQihZ002QQcategoryZ6420QQrd Z1QQcmdZViewItem) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-T...1QQcmdZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-Trans-Am-Trans-AM-1972-Pontiac-Trans-AM-V-8-Original-un-restored-car_W0QQitemZ150065813705QQihZ005QQcategoryZ6427QQ rdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

It sounds kinda wierd but I spent a lot of time on the creeper this weekend just looking up at the underside of the car. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

BTW, here is what that derusting stuff can do for hard metal pieces: here is the jack base from the car:

Topside before:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jacktop1.jpg

Topside after 2 days of soaking:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jacktop3.jpg

Bottom before:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jackbottom2.jpg

Bottom after:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jackbottom3.jpg

[BARN FIND]

All I can say is SWEET!!!

[MosportGreen66]

Steve, are you going to keep the faded finish?

Neat how this product wroks... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
Steve, are you going to keep the faded finish?

Neat how this product works... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

If you mean the underside finish, it isn't faded, that's all the original assembly line white paint overspray on the red oxide e-coat primer. I will probably try to match the finish somehow on the under trunk area as we have to replace the bottom of the trunk floor and may end up painting the underside panel up to the upper rear dif area bulkhead. I guess we'll have to prime it and then fog in some white overspray to match.

[MosportGreen66]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Steve, are you going to keep the faded finish?

Neat how this product works... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

If you mean the underside finish, it isn't faded, that's all the original assembly line white paint overspray on the red oxide e-coat primer. I will probably try to match the finish somehow on the under trunk area as we have to replace the bottom of the trunk floor and may end up painting the underside panel up to the upper rear dif area bulkhead. I guess we'll have to prime it and then fog in some white overspray to match.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry for the confusion Steve, I meant the jack base...

[njsteve]

No, it's a little too far gone to keep in its present shape, so I'll be repainting the jack base as soon as I can find the correct color. The guys on the Pontiac website tend to use Ford Dark Blue engine paint but there's got to be an exact match out there somewhere. Anyone know what the correct paint color is?

[firstgenaddict]

What we ended up doing on the black 69 Z was using cosmoline, boeshield, or the like on the underside to keep the rust at bay and just left the finishes as found, (we were going for as much originality as possible) I did not want to shoot any paint on the chassis at all, felt like it would detract from the vintage look and feel of the car.

If I were having to replace metal... I would keep as much as possible in the original finish then spot in just like you are talking about... I think that is the way to go...

Keep up the good work Steve...

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

James

[Denis]

This is the only project I've seen where half the supplies come from a pet store.

[njsteve]

You gotta improvise, adapt, and overcome. Never take no for an answer: I just try to think out of the box (or fish tank as it may be) That's how I ended up using the wife's Abdominizer 5000 as a frame stand, an aquarium heater to warm up the derusting fluid, my kids to finger paint the original paint daubs back on the rear differential....

[njsteve]

People have been asking about the original primer under my car and what paints may be out there that are close to replicating it. I bought a can of the OEM Paints #42030 "Undercarriage Paint Factory Red Oxide Low Sheen" sold by Classic Industies (1-800 854-1280) at $17.95 a can. I sprayed a couple coats on a piece of white cardboard (so it ended up a little bit lighter than it would be over metal) It is pretty darn close to the original stuff under my 12A-built 1972 T/A. It was hard to get a good photo of the comparison because the flash tends to meter off of the card instead of the car itself. Anyway, here it is. It seems to have the correct sheen/gloass as my car has. It should be noted that it was very hard to find a spot on the underside of this car that did not have original white overspray on it, but I managed to find a spot where a hunk of the original undercoating fell off.

Looks like this stuff is the ticket for replicating the original e-coat. Now if we can all chip in and buy about 10,000 gallons, we can dip our cars in it just like the factory did!

By the way, Classic Industries just sent me an email announcing their 15% off holiday sale. You have to use the secret email code to get the discount. Here it is, feel free to use it: HC1157. Happy Holidays!


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/primer1.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/primer2.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/primer3.jpg

[SS427]

This stuff is better than sex! Well maybe not that good but damn close!

Steve, thank you for sharing all of the photos and as others have stated, the narative and progress shots. That car is amazingly clean. Had I known about this stuff a couple of years ago it would have made a few of the original untouched cars I helped clean up go a lot faster.

Chad...............I think we need to talk about doing this to a certain Red and the other Blue '70 Chevelles. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif
Rick

[njsteve]

I just checked the Classic Industries website and they have raised the price on the red oxide paint. It's now $31.95 a can. I guess they must have been following this thread and now expect a rush on orders just in time for the last minute holiday gift giving season.

[njsteve]

How this for the final result on color matching: After doing the usual search of the unsual places (every autoparts store in a 20 mile radius) I found the exact color for the 70 and up GM jack bases and jack mechanisms: judge for yourself:

It's Duplicolor DE 1609 Chevrolet Blue Engine Enamel


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jacktop1.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC240002.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/jackbottom2.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC240003.jpg

[mockingbird812]

Very nice Steve. I think you nailed it! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[firstgenaddict]

Here are some old pieces of Corvette ignition shielding I had laying around... check out how nice it works...
http://www.yenko.net/photos/data/500/PICT0226.JPG

http://www.yenko.net/photos/data/500/PICT0221.JPG


http://www.yenko.net/photos/data/500/PICT0219.JPG

http://www.yenko.net/photos/data/500/69_Z_Photos_11_29_06_009.jpg

[Bill Pritchard]

[ QUOTE ]
I found the exact color for the 70 and up GM jack bases and jack mechanisms: judge for yourself:

It's Duplicolor DE 1609 Chevrolet Blue Engine Enamel

[/ QUOTE ]


Hmmmmmm, maybe you've also solved the mystery of why Chevy all of a sudden in the mid-70's switched from orange to blue on engine paints....

(....dropping in on a conversation in GM purchasing dept in mid-70's....) "I told you to order 500 gallons of blue paint for jack bases and you ordered 500,000 gallons! Now what are we gonna do with all that extra paint?" http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[njsteve]

I've been playing around with the derusting liquid again. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif This is what it did for two rusty spark control solenoids in my parts bin. This was after a two day soaking.

Here's the before:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1060002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1060001.jpg

and the after:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1100017.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1100018.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1100021.jpg

[kwhizz]

Great examples............Are we having "Fun" yet???? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

Ken http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

[njsteve]

ENOCH just stripped the drivers side fender on the T/A and the he found this. It looks like the result of a tire getting loose and caving in the fender. The metal is extemely overworked, brittle, and stretched and the best bet according to ENOCH is to weld in a section from another fender that would go from the lower body line to the upper body line. Does anyone have a regular 70 to 81 Firebird fender that is wrecked in the front that would be good as a donor? I dont need a whole fender and the shipping costs are crazy for a complete one. I am open to suggestions.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1140001.jpg

[njsteve]

Here's the drivers door getting the NOS doorskin fitted and tack welded. A lot of hammering and welding going on here in order to make the original factory doorskin fit the original factory door!

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1140005.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1140007.jpg

[Camaroinaz]

Steve,

I checked Desert Valley Auto Parts, and they have a slew of firebirds in the yard. If you contact them and they are willing to cut the bottom off the fender you need, let me know and I can pick it up and get it shipped for you, or if they will only sell a full fender, we can find one that is damaged in front and I can cut it down and get it shipped. Let me know if you want to go that route. Here is a link to the search page where you can check the Firebirds they have in the yard and see pics of them:

http://www.dvautoparts.com/

[njsteve]

I called them and they will look for a wrecked fender but normally they will only sell a complete one for $300. That's a bit steep for something I'm going to cut and use only a 1/4 of.

[VintageMusclecar]

Steve;

Check your PM's

Eric

[njsteve]

Eric, thanks for the heads up. I remember reading about your experience with them. Looks like I will search elsewhere for a half a fender.

Camaroinaz, I sincerely appreciate the offer of help but it looks like those guys have a not so hot reputation for accuracy in advertising.

[Camaroinaz]

Steve - Not a problem. If you prefer, I can actually go to the yard and see what they have. It is only about 20 minutes away from where I am at. I can check over the fenders and pick the best one, see what the price would be and go from there. I had not heard about problems with them, as they have been okay to deal with in person. Let me know if you want me to take a look at what they have in person.

[Dave Rifkin]

This thread's been kind of quiet lately; anything new going on with the TA Steve?

[njsteve]

I've really been waiting for my body man to move forward on the front sheet metal so I can get the rest of the body to him. We have been looking for a donor driver's side fender for that patch panel section we need, to no avail so far. I would really like to get the car on the road this year.

I'm running out of things I can do to the car at this point. I spent the past few weeks identifying and locating the correct ECS (Electronic Spark Control) temperature sender for the passenger side cylinder head. With some help from the guys at the Performance Years forum I was able to identify the part as AC Delco #6490384. 1972 was a strange year as they used the 3 prong sender unit but only connected two of the three prongs to the wiring harness. I ended up lucking into one of these senders on ebay. I found an NOS one for $30 and snapped it right up.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tcsNOS.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P2160005.jpg

[njsteve]

My bodyman (ENOCH) was listening. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif He emailed me these photos of the progress on the hood, which he and his crew stripped by hand the last few days. Luckily it is very straight and rust free. Other than a possible warpage issue from the original carb/engine bay fire it seems to have survived the ordeal relatively unscathed. We're still looking for a driver's side fender to cut up for a patch panel in case anyone has one from a 70 to 81 Firebird laying around.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN000112.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN000214.jpg

[njsteve]

More progress from ENOCH's shop. He has the passenger fender, hood and door in epoxy primer as of this afternoon. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807a.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807b.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807c.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807d.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807e.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807f.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/022807g.jpg

[micky69396]

I have a fender, not sure what side though. I'll let you know.

[Bill Pritchard]

Steve,

Pardon my ignorance, but why would they strip the underside of the hood by hand? That seems to me like it would be incredibly labor intensive, as compared to some form of blasting or chemical stripping.

[njsteve]

Chemical/media stripping will dissolve/destroy all the original sealer that is between the two panels. There is no way to replace that sealer. In a double panel piece of body work like a hood, the lack of support that removing the sealer creates will result in the panels vibrating against each other and eventually buckling/denting/dinging up the top painted surface.

[SuperNovaSS]

Plastic blasting will destroy the sealer that quickly?

Jason

[micky69396]

I have had several of these T/A hoods done with plastic media with no issues at all. I cant imagine the time it would take to strip that. No finger tips left either...lol.

[njsteve]

It was a really nice California hood, no rust or scale, just some charcoaled factory paint from the carb fire. ENOCH couldn't find a blaster he trusted: He gave some small parts from the car to a guy who ended up using some material a little too aggresive, so he decided to stick with the old tried and true.

[SuperNovaSS]

Looks like the got the job done. That's what matters.


Jason

[KevinW]

Steve, have you checked out craigslist? I found this ad in hudson county.

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/pts/272030490.html

email this posting to a friend

camaro doors and fenders - $1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reply to: [email protected]
Date: 2007-02-01, 7:45PM EST


i have left and right doors solid off a 80 camaro 175 each, i have 2 front fenders for standard camaro 78-81 75 each, 2 front fenders for z28 78-81 fenders are there but need little work, i also have a nose for 78-81 75 each(rubber)

http://d.im.craigslist.org/Lc/NF/Fcrxuy8PAi2SKSWhwVYEdgJOhCqx.jpg


Location: hudson county
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests

[njsteve]

Unfortunately the Camaro has different body/fender lines and a lower rocker line that the Firebirds dont have. Thanks for keeping an eye out, though Kevin.

[KevinW]

I will keep looking http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[njsteve]

Here's the bottom of the hood and the passenger door in complete primer now.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/030107a.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/030107b.jpg

[KevinW]

Maybe this one is willing to talk http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1977-PONT...tem300086187322 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1977-PONTIAC-FIREBIRD-DRIVERSIDE-FENDER_W0QQitemZ300086187322QQcmdZViewItem?hash=it em300086187322)

[njsteve]

I ended up finding a stamped patch panel on ebay for $45. It should provide the needed donor section to repair the original fender. Hopefully, ENOCH will get me some photos to post in the near future.

[njsteve]

Here's the most recent acquisition for the project: an NOS rear tail panel. These things were made out of one giant piece of injection-molded plastic, about five feet wide. They were extrememly fragile and always broke at the outer section where it narrows down to the thin outer extensions. This was because people tried to remove them without unbolting the two outer studs and eventually found out the hard way after they broke it into three pieces.

The original one from my car had been repaired (badly). It looked fine from the outside but from the inside you could see that it had a hacksaw blade fiberglassed onto the back to support the broken outer extension on one side. (Nice professional repair).

I found this one on ebay. Cost about $280 (actually a bargain since the only other one I've ever seen up for sale, the guy is trying to sell for $750!)

This one was stored up in the seller's attic for about 20 years. He had primed the outside but from the back you can see it was never installed: the mounting studs have never had a nut turned on them.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P3310005.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P3310006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P3310008.jpg

[njsteve]

I posted the same photos of the tail panel on the Performance years website and the guys there indicated that the primer on the outside was factory applied. This was exactly how they came out of the box back in the 1970's. So I guess I got more of a bargain than I bargained for. It hasn't been altered in any way since it was left the dealer parts counter. Happy, Happy, Joy, Joy

[mockingbird812]

As the great John "Hannibal" Smith said, Don't you love it when a plan comes together?! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[njsteve]

Well, here we are home during the Nor-Easter and wondering what I can do while the water rises. I have been trying to figure out a way to remove all the black spraybomb overspray that is on the orginal honeycomb grills for the T/A. So I ended up doing a little websurfing of the term "plastic paint stripping" and wound up finding a model car website where they compared a variety of different techniques for removing paint from plastic models. We have all heard of the old "Easy Off" oven cleaner being used for paint stripping but the fumes are noxious and the results are very slow and require scrubbing which damages the plastic. Their new favorite plastic paint stripping technique now employs the super-degreaser formerly known as "Castrol Super Clean". I guess they sold the formula off because it's now just called "Super Clean." Well, anyway here is the before photo of one of the grills all covered in black spray paint:

Here's the top:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4150001.jpg

and the bottom:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4150003.jpg

[njsteve]

I bought two 2-1/2 gallon jugs of the stuff from my local autoparts store. -cost about $50. I initially tested it in a three gallon pail for half an hour and here is the result:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4160002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4160004.jpg

[njsteve]

This stuff is safe on the plastic and only attacks the paint's ability to stick to the underlying layer. According to the modelers it can be used on clear plastic model car windshields with no damage to the clear plastic. So I guess it would be fine for gauges and other similar clear automotive plastics. Make sure you use rubber gloves when using this stuff as it will remove all the oils from your skin (or else your hands will wind up looking like Abe Simpson's).

Here is a photo after about three hours of soaking, once I got a bigger tub and fully submerged the grill. The paint just seems to break up and flake away with just a little persuading from a soft plastic bristle brush. (Do not use metal bristles as they will scratch the plastic!)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4160006.jpg

[njsteve]

Here is the link to the model car website that tested the various methods of plastic paint stripping including brake fluid(!), Easy Off Oven Cleaner, specialized model car paint strippers and Super Clean:

http://www.bonediggers.com/1-3/strip/strip.html

Once all the stripping is done make sure you flush the entire object in cold water till it is squeaky clean. This stuff tends to leave a slimy feeling if there is still any residue left on the part.

***By the way, the modeler guys also use this stuff to strip chrome from plastic so I wouldnt use it on any plastic part with chrome accents like a dash bezel.

[kwhizz]

Steve........That Cleaner is Awsum on Seat Belts also.....

Ken

[njsteve]

Here is the progress after 24 hours of soaking and gentle brushing with a plastic bristle scrub brush. For the honeycombed areas I have been using a .45 caliber plastic bore brush, though a shotgun bore brush might be a better fit if I could find one. The Super Clean is even progressing well on the the thick argent paint material on the inside of the grill. There has been no effect on the plastic so far. It is still hard, no softening of the outer surface whatsoever.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4170001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4170002.jpg

[ANDY M]

Steve, would a pressure washer do a better job on the tight places? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[VintageMusclecar]

Steve;

Are you running that SuperClean diluted or at 100% strength?

Eric

[njsteve]

Running at about 90%. I added some water just to get it at a high enough level to cover the grill. I may try the pressure washer soon on the honeycomb area.

[njsteve]

And here is the final result after 48 hours of soaking and some scrubbing with a bristle brush and 000 steel wool. Now its time to soak the other side grill...

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190004.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190002a.jpg

[mockingbird812]

You do nice work Steve. I like your MacGyver-like approach to tuff problems. Lookin' good! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
You do nice work Steve. I like your MacGyver-like approach to tuff problems. Lookin' good! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

You should see the size of my Swiss Army knife. It comes with its own golf cart. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[chevelleheart]

Steve , Excellent info and pictures ! As Mockingbird said , you do nice work !!

[CamarosRus]

Steve, Very interesting info, much appreciated. If you repaint or touch up the "Argent Siver" will you show or list the specific paint brand and COLOR NAME you thought best!!!!!!!

Thanks,

[njsteve]

I will be using the extra can of OEM Paints Pontiac Honeycomb Wheel paint that I used for refinishing the wheels earlier in this saga. I compared the grills to the wheels before I stripped and it is pretty darn close, right down to the sparkle and grain texture. Stay tuned for further episodes...

[njsteve]

I had to repair a missing 1/2" wide section of the honeycomb in the grill. I have an extra set of grills but was not about to chop out a piece to repair this grill (That would be sacreligious, I think). Here is the broken section before:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190002b.jpg

And after I filed the mating areas flat in anticipation of glueing in the repair section:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190001a.jpg

[njsteve]

I hunted around the house and finally found an old broken plastic wiring harness retainer from, of all things, my old 1971 Hemicuda Convertible! (So at least there's now some Mopar in this Pontiac...) It was made of the same type of heavy plastic as the grill.

I cut a small section off and filed it to the correct width but left it with an extra amount of material 3/8" long so I could handle more easily while fitting it into the grill space. I also pre-scored a line before the 3/8" tab so I could break it off once it was glued in and set.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190004a.jpg

[njsteve]

I used a two-part epoxy called "Plastic Weld" and mixed it as directed. (It sets very quickly and dries hard so you gotta move fast!) I set the piece in place and smoothed over the repair. You only have about 45 seconds to do this as it is hardening. It goes from clear to white as it sets. Once it dries in about 15 minutes, you can sand it and reapply it if you need to refill a spot.

Front view:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190005.jpg

Rear view:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190009.jpg

[njsteve]

Once it is set and hardened. I snapped off the 3/8" tab and sanded the repair. For sanding the inside areas of the honeycomb I used a plastic knife from Wendy's (they're much better than the cheap McDonalds plastic kinives) and wrapped it in sandpaper. It fit perfectly and was able to flex to fit the interior areas. Here is the finished repair:

Front view:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190012.jpg

Rear view:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4190014.jpg

[mockingbird812]

Nice job "Mac" http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif !

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v697/mockingbird812/macgyver5.gif


BTW, Richard Dean Anderson makes the mullet look good! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

[njsteve]

Thanks for the support.

You should see my wedding photos from Florida: I proudly displayed my full early 1990's over-the-shoulder, southern mullet with the optional Sun-In Tinted, Farrah Faucet side hair flairs, left and right of course.

-NJMacGyver: The right mechanic when restorations go wrong...

[bulletpruf]

Great thread; wish I could pull up the pics, but think my security settings are too high. Can't wait to get home from this place so I can get started on my GTX...or maybe the red Judge...or the SS...

Scott

[njsteve]

Scott, your work is lot more important to us all than most people will ever realize. Keep it up.

I know what you mean about work computers. Sometimes they block the stupidest things. I have a companion post on the Performance Years website that has been following along. You should be able to open those photos individually.

http://forums.performanceyears.com/forums/showthread.php?t=433662

Tell me if it works.

[bulletpruf]

I was able to pull up the pics on PY. Have been a member there for a year or two, but usually hang out in the Judge forum. Anyway, I made it through a few pages, but it's bedtime in Iraq. Will check out more tomorrow.

Thanks,

Scott

[njsteve]

Here is the finished product. I ended up masking off the outside and painting the front and back of the blacked out grill section first. It took a lot of masking tape and newspaper. I sprayed it with flat black, let it dry and then masked off the black area and sprayed the inner part of the grill face with the OEM Paints Pontiac Honeycomb Wheel paint. As long as you follow directions, it sprays out nice and dry and leaves a nice consistant sparkly, argent finish. Once that dried I reattached the outer molding and retaining clips and I was (half) done. The other grill is still soaking at the moment and I will be finishing that one in the next couple days.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4220001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4220002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4220003.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4220005.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4220006.jpg

[SuperNovaSS]

Very nice!

[Xplantdad]

Keep it up Steve...I enjoy reading about your tips and tricks... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Dave Rifkin]

I love watching your progress; I love the second generation F-bodies. Your dedication and the results that you have gotten at home have been an ispiration to me and my '69 Corvette project.
I don't have the tools, skills or the room to tackle a job such as your T/A but it has inspired me to tackle the interior of my Corvette as well as a heater core replacement in the 'Vette.
I thought I was done with the heater core this afternoon when I noticed that I screwed up installing one of the foam gaskets. Under normal circumstances I would have said the hell with it and just left it as is but, I think I am going to order another seal kit and re-do it so it's done right.
I found myself asking myself "What would Steve or any of the other Yenko members do?" We all know that answer which is why I am ordering a new seal kit.

You guys all do great work and, although I doubt I will ever turn out the results that you do, I have been inspired to get my hands dirty and not accept half assed results. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[njsteve]

That's scary when someone wonders "What would NJSteve do?" http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif Maybe I should get my own sign now?

I would probably figure out some way to dissolve the foam gasket into something 1/100th its size and then inject it into the area using a single tube Dunkin Donuts coffee stirrer (never use Starbucks, you risk a bad chemical reaction). Once installed I would then inject it with the replenisher agent to enlarge it back to its original size. Barring that ...I would take it apart again and put that stupid foam o-ring back on (BTW I have done that a couple time myself on A/C-equipped cars).

Good Luck with your project. I am happy to have the chance to entertain and enlighten.
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

BTW Part II: You don't really need that foam o-ring thingy that much. You could buy some 3M strip caulk and just feed a bunch of it into the gap around the heater core tube until you have sufficient amount on both sides to fill the space. The purpose of the foam is to keep out engine smells and moisture, and to keep the tube from rubbing against the metal of the firewall. You may want to try this instead of yanking the heater box out again and risking damaging the new heater core (been there, done that, too).

[Dave Rifkin]

Where I made the mistake was not the foam insulation around the heater core tubes; I actually got that right. Where I messed up was, there's a foam gasket that is supposed to go around the opening in the firewall ,from the inside, before the heater box is installed. That's how I installed this foam seal, only to find out after everything was all nicely routed and buttoned up, that there were instructions on the flip side of the paper I had been looking at. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
Like a dope, I never realized that there were instructions with my heater core seal kit and just reviewed the pictures. It looked like the foam seal went on the firewall (engine side) before the blower motor assembly was installed.
I don't know how much of a big deal that is, I just figured you guys would probably take it apart and do it the right way.

[njsteve]

And here is the final pair all finished and awaiting the nose assembly to put it in.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4240001.jpg

[njsteve]

ENOCH sent me a couple more photos today of the block sanding progress. He has both doors done, (including the NOS skin on the driver's door), the hood and the trunklid. These were a couple of the in-process shots. More to come...

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN1839.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN1838.jpg

[njsteve]

I was doing some more finagling around with the car today, cleaning up the headlight buckets. While I was waiting for them to dry off I unbolted the trunk latch. I took some photos for documentation purposes. As you can see the trunk latch was installed when the car went into the giant primer dunk tank back at the Norwood plant in December 1972. You can see the red primer covered with traces of the exterior white overspray as well as the black and turquoise trunk spatter paint over that. It's interesting to see that the undersides of the mounting bolts have the primer on them as well. That e-coating did its job: it got everywhere.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/trunklatch2.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/trunklatch1.jpg

[njsteve]

I went to Carlisle a week or so ago and picked up a new gas tank for the car. I have been holding off on ordering one since I didnt feel like paying $50+ in shipping for a $150 part. I bought the tank there and carted it home. My original tank has two large screw holes in the top where someone in the past had drilled through the trunk floor to mount something and went right through the tank. Ouch! Yeah, I could have repaired it and kept it but when it comes to safety items like brakes, brake hoses, fuel lines and gas tanks, I dont play around with my life. Replace them, save the originals for posterity and don't ever worry again.

My original tank still had the factory silkscreened stencil barely visible on the bottom with the 12-20-71 date code on it. I have been scratching my head on how to reproduce it when I stumbled across the website www.inlinetube.com (http://www.inlinetube.com) and found that they reproduce the stencil! (go to their website and look under "gas tanks" and you will find it). I had to do some modifications to get my exact date code but in the end it reproduced it exactly.

Here's the original tank with the ghost image of the factory US Steel Stamp still visible (barely):

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/oldtank.jpg

[njsteve]

The stencil is more like a decal with cutouts in it. You clean the tank with lacquer thinner and carefully peel the front off of the decal and place it one the tank. Then use a squeegy and make sure it is firmly attached. You then carefully peel the backing off making sure all the centers of the letters stay on the tank.



http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/stencil.jpg

[njsteve]

The stencil was close but it did not have the cutout for the day, only the month and year. (They accidentally sent me the wrong year "72" instead of "71"). I ended up taking a photo of a ruler next to the decal and printing out the correct scale photo on my printer. I then used an exacto knife and cut out the "20" and the "71" from the photo. I then cut out a spot for the month in the center of the stencil and applied both sets of numbers.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tankmeasure.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tankstencil.jpg

[njsteve]

Next, I masked off the tank and sprayed the stencil lightly with several coats of flat black.

The final result duplicated the original tank stencil perfectly.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tankpaint.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tankfinal.jpg

[SS427]

Looks great Steve. Dedication and attention to detail pays off. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif
Rick

[njsteve]

Here's another bit of useless trivia for everybody. The date on the original gas tank is 12-20-1971. According to the cowl tag, the car was scheduled to be built the first week of December 1971 (12A). It was completed and shipped on 12-21-1971 to Reliable Pontiac in Roseville, California. How's that for "just-in-time" parts delivery at the plant?

[njsteve]

I have been slowly refinishing the headlight assemblies over the past week. Nothing high tech: I just disassembled one of them, took a lot of photos of where the little clips and attachment points were installed and then used paint stripper to completely strip the bucket and the backing plate. I soaked the stripped pieces in the derusting liquid to get rid of the underlying specks of rust and then I repainted the pieces in gloss black. I then reassembled the left side and put all the little clips and springs back in place. Once that was finished I tackled the right side. The adjustment points have four possible positions, only one of which is correct for the particular side of the car. The headlight bezels also have four possible mounting positions. So if you dont watch what you are doing you have 16 possible combinations, only one of which is correct (according to my 5th grader who is definitely smarter than me) It's like doing drum brakes: always leave one side untouched so you have a roadmap of where everything goes.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/drlightb4.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/drlightb42.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/lightsbf4.jpg

[njsteve]

Here is the finished pair with the bezels installed:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/lightsafter1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/lightsafter3.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/lightsafter2.jpg

[njsteve]

By the way, does anyone have a spare one of these screws? It is one of the three Phillips head mounting screws for the headlight bezels. I seem to be missing one and all of the nut/bolt/screw suppliers have absurd minimum purchase requirements. I dont feel like paying $30 for a $1 screw. (Wait a minute, did I just say what I think I just said??? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P4270005.jpg

[firstgenaddict]

Steve I have some extras, they are out at my parents house and it may be a few weeks before I get out there, if you can wait.
James

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
Steve I have some extras, they are out at my parents house and it may be a few weeks before I get out there, if you can wait.
James

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess the car's completion date will have to be delayed until you can find me that last missing screw. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Charley Lillard]

Reliable Pontiac is still in business I think.

[firstgenaddict]

[ QUOTE ]
I dont feel like paying $30 for a $1 screw. (Wait a minute, did I just say what I think I just said??? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif)

[/ QUOTE ]

I've paid much more for alot less... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
Reliable Pontiac is still in business I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes they are. They actually have a big GM car show there each year. I called them and they sent me a pair of license plate frames. One of the guys on the Performance Years website lives near them and stopped by and got me a key fob too. Unfortunately they moved the dealer location several years ago and trashed all their old records during the move. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[njsteve]

Here's another interesting item I picked up from the www.inlinetube.com (http://www.inlinetube.com) guys. They sell "rivet bolts" for the upper control arms. The tops look like the original factory installed rivets but they install with a nut and lock washer on the underside. They are a little tricky to get tightened since they tend to rotate a little and you have no way to hold the top part since it is round. Make sure you use a bunch of loctite on the bolts and tighten them to the 12 ft.lb. spec as listed in the directions.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5010002.jpg

[njsteve]

I broke down and bought a set of 5 F60x15 Goodyear Polyglas GTs for the honeycombs. Nothing looks better than the original equipment tires.

These cars came with either the Polyglas GT or the Firestone Wide Ovals. I like the Polyglas' better since the version of the Firestone Wide Oval that is currently reproduced is not accurate for the car.

Plus, there is a fellow enthusiast who hangs out over at the Performance Years website, who managed a package deal from Kelsey Tire, for a bunch of us. The end result was that the final price was reduced a good amount (about $10-$15 per tire). That savings adds up with 5 tires.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5100012.jpg

[njsteve]

In the never ending search for more metal things to soak in that www.safestrustremover.com (http://www.safestrustremover.com) liquid, I found the inner sill plates and the front headliner mount. Since they are all about 5 feet long and I only have a limited supply of the precious liquid, I had to create a five foot by 3 inch deep by 5 inch wide trough. I went to the local Home Depot and bought a section of plastic roof gutter for $3 and some 4 mil plastic sheet and created an plastic lined trough the exact size. I then filled it with the liquid and placed the parts in it for an overnight soaking.

Of course, I had to acquire the specialized tools to hold the contraption in place: Only an officially licensed, battery operated, mini-Bigfoot monster truck will do.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5090002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5090006.jpg


and the finshed product:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5100009.jpg

[Xplantdad]

Amazing...whoever caller you Mc Gyver was right on...in a good way, that is http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[kwhizz]

Steve.........Everything that get's touched is time, time, ...................time.......Fun isn't it.........LOL

Ken

[njsteve]

More amazing results from the amazing rust remover stuff. The guy that invented this should get the Nobel Prize in Automotive Chemical Engineering. After dipping overnight, you can even see the "W" stamps plain as day. After rinsing them off and letting them dry in the sun, I sprayed them with Boeshield to preserve the original metal finish. I love this stuff!
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

These were the completely rusted tail pipe and main muffler hangers for the T/A (totally unavailable for years. And the repros made by Gardner, while very close, have manufacturing differences that are visible to the trained eye)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5150003.jpg


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5150004.jpg


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5150006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5150005.jpg

I even threw in the interior door panel mounting plates which were surface rusted.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5150007.jpg

[Xplantdad]

Steve is so into this that he even used the AUTO section of the paper to lay his parts on! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[njsteve]

I just noticed that! Must be a subliminally subconscious thing. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[SS427]

[ QUOTE ]
The guy that invented this should get the Nobel Prize in Automotive Chemical Engineering.

[/ QUOTE ]

I talked to the guy who "invented" this stuff. It is embarrassingly simple. 98% water. Just a chemical added to get the PH to a 7 if I recall correctly. If it is as he explained it, I would rather pay for the chemical and mix it as needed instead of buying it in liquid form. One thing he stressed, ALWAYS clean the bucket you are using of any debris or rust as the chemical continues to work on it even when the part has been removed and in turn it breaks the chemical down more rapidly. Also, use ONLY enough liquid to derust the part you are doing so as to not contaminate the rest of the liquid. When the chemical breaks down and does not react with the rust anymore it is safe and legal to drain down the sewer as it is now simply dirty water. Neat stuff regardless.
Rick

[CamarosRus]

FYI, It is Jack Seymour,(a member here and fellow Carlisle LEGENDS Judge) who is the person reproducing the 70+ Camaro muffler and tailpipe hangars. Jack works for G.M. and was able to secure original drawings and then had new tooling made up to mfg the very rare muffler hangars. Honestly I dont know the "differences" between Jack's new hangars and originals, but the ACA judges at Carlisle accept them as we would N.O.S. vintage pieces.
Gardner Exhaust and other misc vendors and shops, ALL buy these hangars from Jack Seymour.
Jack Seymour was one of the 1st 70 Camaro owners to restore his exhaust system with a N.O.S. muffler and NOT use the aftermarket IMCO muffler, that GARDNER provides with there complete 1970 Camaro system.

Respectfully submitted,

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The guy that invented this should get the Nobel Prize in Automotive Chemical Engineering.

[/ QUOTE ]

I talked to the guy who "invented" this stuff. It is embarrassingly simple. 98% water. Just a chemical added to get the PH to a 7 if I recall correctly. If it is as he explained it, I would rather pay for the chemical and mix it as needed instead of buying it in liquid form. One thing he stressed, ALWAYS clean the bucket you are using of any debris or rust as the chemical continues to work on it even when the part has been removed and in turn it breaks the chemical down more rapidly. Also, use ONLY enough liquid to derust the part you are doing so as to not contaminate the rest of the liquid. When the chemical breaks down and does not react with the rust anymore it is safe and legal to drain down the sewer as it is now simply dirty water. Neat stuff regardless.
Rick

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, in that vein, I guess a diamond is just 100% carbon with a little pressure added over time. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I have been pouring all but the last bit of the liquid with the bottom debris, back into the container. Eventually I will buy some more but it is still working well after all these months.

[njsteve]

Here is a photo comparison of my original hangers and the Gardner ones. I don't mean any disparagement concerning the quality of the repros. They look awesome but maybe there was a running assembly line change by 1972???

The muffler hanger definitely uses a different rubber bushing and method of containment for it. Smaller bushing with bent retaining tabs on the repro vs. extended shoulders on the original bushing. As for the rear pipe hanger, the triangular support bracing is shorter on the repro but interestingly enough it uses the same type of bushing as the reproduction muffler hanger (with tabs.)

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150005.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150008.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150001.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150011.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150009.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150010.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P5150012.jpg

[njsteve]

Some more body shop progress from ENOCH. I guess he is also working on a 69 Z/28 at the same time. Don't know which one though. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif Anyone care to fess up as to who is delaying my car's finishing date?

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/CAGDW9OV.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/CAOXOP4Z.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/CAXO2LDZ.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/CAXOQDDN.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/CA414H87.jpg

[Xplantdad]

Isn't the 69 Z SamLBinJ's?
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hmmm.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[kwhizz]

Look'in "Good" Steve......... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

Ken http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

[njsteve]

Look what I just found on ebay! A buddy from the Performance Years website gave me a heads up. A good buy at $15. Looks like vintage 1970's from my car's original dealership (which is still in business today!)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/reliabletag.jpg

[Turbo Regal]

Steve,

I just got a gallon of the Safe Rust Remover after seeing your results. Boy, this stuff is amazing! I put the "hamster wheel" out of the heater box of my 65 Chevy II and soaked it overnight. Looks like new! I do have one question: Have you had any paint adhesion problems with parts washed in it and then washed under water after the process is over?

[njsteve]

No problems at all. Just wash in soapy water til squeeky clean and then let them dry out in the sun and you're ready. If it is going to stay bare metal then use some kind of preservative, like Boeshield.

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
Look what I just found on ebay! A buddy from the Performance Years website gave me a heads up. A good buy at $15. Looks like vintage 1970's from my car's original Roseville, California dealership (which is still in business today!)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/reliabletag.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Here is the major restoration on the license plate frame: I cleaned it in the kitchen sink when the wife wasn't looking. I used 0000 steel wool which brought the chrome back very nicely.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P6090006.jpg

I then sprayed a bunch of gloss black enamel into a cup and used a Q-tip to soak up the paint. I then applied the paint liberally to the background area, letting it run and moving the frame around so the paint would flow into the letters. (It's a lot easier to use the "sprayed out" spray paint than trying to thin out regular paint from a can).

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P6090009.jpg

For the letters, I then used white touch-up paint from the wife's old mini-van. Those little self-contained bottles with the built-in brushes sure come in handy after you sell the car.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P6090012.jpg

After all the paint was applied I put it in the oven at 250 degrees for 10 minutes to cure it. (Wife still out shopping, of course)

And voila! All ready for the car...and this vintage California license plate I picked up, which still has the 1972/73 registration sticker on it!

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/QL5546.jpg

[427TJ]

Nice work Steve. YOM plates and dealer frames are one of my favorite details.

[njsteve]

I have been cleaning up the remaining set of fuel/vent lines and have noticed that there has to be at least 10 different sizes of retaining clamps used on the car, in all different finshes and paint colors for the various brake/fuel/emission vent lines, which all come with or without the coil spring sheathing. I have found bright yellow, zinc chromate green, black painted, black phosphated, natural metal, silver cad (or zinc) coated of the various sizes both with and without alignment hole locating tabs.

Most of the retainers have a size number stamped on them in inch measurement like 24/64". Here are a few photos of the before and after clean-up shots. I wirebrushed the lines and the coil springs and just gently hand cleaned the retainers with a tooth brush and extremely diluted "purple stuff" degreaser, as I am trying to retain all the original finishes and not repaint/recoat them.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5050008.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5050012.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P5050006.jpg

After the cleanup, here is the last set of lines, the rear fuel/vent to subframe lines:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010016.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010015.jpg

[njsteve]

And yes, that is the original trunk mat sitting on top of the Viper (pronounced work bench). I had to lay it flat because I didn't want to risk it cracking from being stored in a folded up position.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010008.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010002c.jpg

It even has the factory stencilled part number still visible on the back. It's a shame they dont reproduce these in the correct material: this mat is about 1/8" thick, heavy rubber.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010017.jpg

[njsteve]

This is the current state of the rest of the car. She starts, runs, idles, etc, just waiting for the body man to finish the front clip and away she goes.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010007.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010011.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010001aa.jpg


With careful cleaning, I was even able to save the original stamp dates on the a/c POA valve. September 29 1971, for a 12A (first week December 1971) build date car.


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010019.jpg

[William]

Steve I have enjoyed this thread so much I have mixed emotions as the car nears completion. And I doubt it looked that good new.

I think you need another one.

[njsteve]

I have the same feeling: I guess for everyone following this saga, it's like being an expectant father waiting for the birth of his first child. Boy, these damn labor pains are killin' me! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I looked at the number of hits on this post and it's at 42,000 today. Is that a new record or something?

[Xplantdad]

If not it's damn close! I, too Steve...have enjoyed every minute of your McGyver like approach to the restoration. Amazing what human ingenuity can do! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

I am new at this technology stuff, so here goes. This is 15 seconds of video from a phone, of the 455HO running (it's all stock, I promise http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywG29qPDe-U

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3rv-KjgZO8

[68 Vert]

[ QUOTE ]
I am new at this technology stuff, so here goes. This is 15 seconds of video from a phone, of the 455HO running (it's all stock, I promise http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywG29qPDe-U

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3rv-KjgZO8

[/ QUOTE ]

The car sounds great, these HO's have a definate 'bark' to them when you goose the throttle. Steve, which cam did you use?

Mike

[njsteve]

Surprisingly, that is the stock 068 camshaft.

[njsteve]

Progress on the driver's side fender. While it was completely rust-free, it had a bizarre series of dents and stretches in the metal that were pretty darn near impossible to massage out without a great deal of body filler. ENOCH ended up cutting out the stretched, damaged metal and welding in a patch panel for that square section. Here is some of the initial work:

Before:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1140003.jpg

Cutting the patch panel:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN2134.jpg

Cutting out the mangled fender section:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN2154.jpg

The incredible visible fender. Note the condition of the internal bracing behind the cut. You'll never find that on an East Coast car! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN2151.jpg

Test fitting the patch panel:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/DSCN2153.jpg

Hey, maybe we can replace the patch panel area with one of those Motion Performance reverse Corvette fender gill setups. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

Just got the rear bumper back from TriCity Plating. They did a really nice job on the rechroming. The finish on the outer surface is flawless: no scratches, dings, waves, peels, etc. I used them before for my Charger and was very pleased - I bought a Charger rear bumper from them at Carlisle back in 2004 that they had in stock. This time they didn't have any 70-73 Firebird bumpers so I brought them my core at Spring Carlisle and they did it in 8 weeks as promised. Price was reasonable at $300 including return shipping.

Here is the before shot. The inside of the bumper had been the victim of a very poor replating which had delaminated/peeled and the rusted. I removed all the brackets and stripped and repainted them while TriCity had the bumper.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/rbumper1.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/rbumper8.jpg

Here's the finished piece. The black smudges on the back are actually black RTV silcone sealer. I make it a habit of smearing a line of it around the perimeter of the back of the bumper. It really helps to prevent any future problems with the plating lifting on formerly rusted surfaces, especially the sharp edges, if you keep all moisture away from the area. Since the backside was heavily pitted from the previous bad prep and rust, this should hold it for the next 20 years or so.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P6280001.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P6280002.jpg

Here's the outer surface. I dug through my old collection of bumper bolts and found 10 original flat capped bolts. I polished them up nicely and installed them on the bumper The bolts they sell today just aren't the same in terms of the way the caps "dome out". They should be nearly flat to be correct. (sorry about the glare and smudges -its nearly impossible to get a good photo of chrome)

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P6280003.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P6280005.jpg

[njsteve]

I've been playing with the original console in the car. The four speed consoles are extremely rare. To add to that they were all made of this extremely fragile vinyl covered plastic that cracked in a million pieces the first time your girlfriend tried to sidle up to you in a romantic ferver. The one in this car seems to have been from a den of inequity judging by the dozens of fractures in it. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

While it looks like hell from underneath, from the top it looks pretty good once I dyed it with the correct flat black vinyl dye. The secret to glueing these things is to use a 2-part plastic welding epoxy and a bracing material: either flat plastic stock or wooden paint stirrers. Actually, the paint stirrers worked great for the areas needing more structural intergrity. I just coated the area with the 2-part plastic epoxy and then clamped the wood in place and covered the repair in more of the epoxy.

It's sturdy enough now to hold handle a Brittney and K-Fed, Smokey and The Bandit drive-in reunion date. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060005.jpg

The repairs:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060006.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060007.jpg

[njsteve]

After getting the console finished, I cleaned up the factory 8-track player. I disassembled the front of the deck and soaked the brackets and the 8-track door in the www.safestrustremover.com (http://www.safestrustremover.com) stuff. As usual, it came out amazing considering what they looked like to begin with. I also repainted the upper mounting face plate and reinstalled the entire unit in the console. The 2 pound console now weighs about 12 pounds with that giant stereo unit bolted in.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060008.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060009.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060010.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P7060011.jpg

[njsteve]

And looky what I just found to put into that tape player:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape3.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape1.jpg


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape2.jpg

[njsteve]

I took on the seatbelt project over the weekend. This car has the deluxe seatbelts with the satin chrome covers on it. Since it is an early (12A built) 1972, it has the 1971 style shoulder belts that have the bizarre little plastic retainer that screws into the headliner. They employed a 7" section of black elastic that, over the years stretches out to 20" and no longer holds the shoulder belts above your head. Only recently have the unique plastic retainers been reproduced. (Though some guy on ebay has been selling them as "NOS" for $90 for 2 years now http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif)

I spent a day cleaning the belts after removing the covers and push buttons. I soaked the whole set in a solution of 10% Purple Stuff and 90% hot water. I let them soak for about a half hour and then gently scrubbed with a plastic bristle brush and rinsed them in hot water. I then hung them out to dry in the 95 degree sun. They came out squeeky clean and even the labels looked a whole lot better (I was extra careful using the brush on those).

Here's the unique seatbelt drying rack I have patented:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7070001.jpg

And here is the full set after drying. As you can see the shoulder harnesses have a whole bunch of stretched out elastic that needs to be replaced:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/beltset1-1.jpg

Here's the labels:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7060009a.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7080012.jpg

[njsteve]

Here is the strange shoulder harness mounting system used on the 71's and early 72's:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7090002.jpg


The male buckle end clips onto an extremely fragile, clear plastic, do-hicky. This one actually survived 35 years in one piece. Normally you only find the screw left and no plastic do-hicky. This piece is now reproduced for about $32 a pair.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7090006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7090007.jpg

Here is the extremely stretched out elastic that once was 7" in length and is now 20" with a shortening knot halfway through it:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7090004.jpg

[njsteve]

All of the release buttons were missing their paint from years of pressing. There were relatively easy to redo. I just sprayed the entire button with flat black paint, let it dry and then flipped them over and gently sanded them on 600 grit sand paper. It took the paint right off the high spots on the logo and looked brand new.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7070011.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7080017.jpg

[njsteve]

I then tackled the elastic issue. I went to my local Michaels Craft Store and bought a 48" package of 1/2" elastic from the sewing aisle. It only comes in white, so I had to also buy a small bottle of black fabric paint. Cost: about $7 total. I then soaked the whole strip of elastic in the fabric paint and let it dry on the rack outside in the sun.

Here is the shoulder belt in it's original state. As you can see the 7" long section of 1/2" elastic stretched out to 20" of 1/4" elastic over 35 years:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7060015.jpg

I gently trimmed the factory stitching from the elastic and removed it after marking the area with some chalk. (There is a left and right belt and the elastics go on opposite sides). I then cut a section slightly longer than the original distance between the two mounting points, folded the ends and hand sewed them onto the belts. Here is the finished product:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P70900072.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7090009.jpg

The whole set is now all finished and ready to go. Though I could use a couple nicer satin finish covers in case anyone has an extra few just lieing around the garage somewhere taking up space.

[BARN FIND]

These are the same kind of belts that I had in my 72 SS when I bought it. I took them out and put in belts from a 73 because they were easier to use. The originals have followed me everywhere I have lived the last 20 years. Now I am kinda glad I kept them. After seeing what you did with yours I may just have to to put them back in one of these days!

[BARN FIND]

After looking at your console I have a question. The 72 Camaros had a place in the console to put the 2 buckles for each seat, did the Firebird have anything like that?

RAY

[SS427]

As usual, very nice work Steve. I think I may be sending you a box of seat belts to do....... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[mockingbird812]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif I'm gonna have to cry foul here. Have you guys noticed that when you check "who's on line" that every other anonymous viewer is checking out "RE: 72 T/A progress". I think this MacGyver fellow is paying friends and associates to check out his thread in order to secure the highest visit count ever for an sYc thread http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif .

Come clean MacGyver! You'll sleep better.


Oh and by the way, thanks for the awesome tutorial on restoring a muscle car with just a swiss army knife, a ball of string, and some chewing gum (and that de-rusting stuff) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif !!!!!!

[njsteve]

I realized that the other day when my wife asked me: "Isn't that Yenko site for Chevy guys?" I said, "Well, actually Honey, It's for all of us good Americans who enjoy musclecars of all types regardless of (lost) races, greed, or financial origins."
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
After looking at your console I have a question. The 72 Camaros had a place in the console to put the 2 buckles for each seat, did the Firebird have anything like that?

RAY

[/ QUOTE ]

There was a plastic two tab retainer that bolted on to the side of the console. For some reason mine did not have it installed at the factory, though I may add it if I can frind a set, just because I like the cleaner look instead of the seatbelts just lieing around willy-nilly. Here is the factory diagram . #15 is the belt retainer.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/console1.jpg

[DarrenX33]

Great stuff Steve. I am going to use your seat belt resto as a reference... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif Come clean MacGyver! You'll sleep better.

Oh and by the way, thanks for the awesome tutorial on restoring a muscle car with just a swiss army knife, a ball of string, and some chewing gum (and that de-rusting stuff) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif !!!!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh, by the way, you should have seen the look on the old lady's face in the sewing section as I was struggling, trying to pick out the right type of elastic for the belts (which, coincidentally is also used for making intimate female undergarments). She quickly looked at my chest and then says: "I think you should get the 48" length, it might fit better." http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Oh the stuff I have to go through just to get this car back on the road...Maybe I should have left the high heals at home. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[kwhizz]

[ QUOTE ]
I realized that the other day when my wife asked me: "Isn't that Yenko site for Chevy guys?" I said, "Well, actually Honey, It's for all of us good Americans who enjoy musclecars of all types regardless of (lost) races, greed, or financial origins."
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Bingo.......... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif

Ken http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

[Xplantdad]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I realized that the other day when my wife asked me: "Isn't that Yenko site for Chevy guys?" I said, "Well, actually Honey, It's for all of us good Americans who enjoy musclecars of all types regardless of (lost) races, greed, or financial origins."
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Bingo.......... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif

Ken http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Yep!...Couldn't have said it better myself!

[akcamaro]

I have a question about the console with the 8 track player. Is the console the same as one without 8 track, just with added parts that come out (like the face plate), or is the face plate an actual fixed piece to the console?

[njsteve]

There are 2 consoles for all the 2nd gen Firebirds: a four speed model and an automatic model based on where the shifter hole is. They are different than Camaro 2nd gen consoles. Normally a plastic "map pocket" insert covers the area where the 8-track player goes. If you check out the diagram a couple posts above this, the map pocket insert is shown as item #11.

[mockingbird812]

All in favor of mandatory reassignment of handle from <font color="red"> njsteve </font> to <font color="red"> MacGyver </font> raise your hand (thumb)!

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

Only if I get one of them "MacGyver Sucks" banners.

[njsteve]

Here are some more of the latest bady shop photos. Enoch is spending a lot of time sanding, priming, resanding, repriming...He's not gonna stop til it's to his satisfaction, despite all my harassment about getting the car done quickly. (which I do appreciate. Though I want to get this car on the road before 2008, which is 173 days away).

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/trunk071207.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/fender071207.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/hood1-1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/hood3.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/hood3.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/hood6.jpg

[njsteve]

Okay, so I was posting to the companion novel I have of my progress on the T/A, at the Performance Years website and this guy jokingly asks me how I am going to "restore" that grungy old 8-track tape of the "Pontiac Stereo 8-track Sounds for 1972".

Having laid down the gauntlet I decided to go ahead and do just that, just to bust his balz.

Here is the before tape:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape2.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape3.jpg


I took the tape and scanned all three surfaces of the label into my computer, and converted it into a jpeg. I then spent about 12 hours on the Microsoft Paint program at 800% magnification, erasing all the yellow from the background and from between every single letter, pixel by pixel. It was like Pac-Man on a massive scale. (I should have let my kids do it, it would have went much faster). Carpal Tunnel Syndrome is a wonderful thing. Once that was done, I cut and pasted the three images together into one image file. The next fun was the 2 hours of adjusting the size so it printed out in the exact same size as the original decal. I had to keep adding to the length of the image to get it to center properly on paper with the right width and length.

Here is the final version. I printed it out on adhesive backed label paper that I had at the house. A glossier paper would be better but this gives you an idea of how it looks. Now all I need is a nice clean blank 8-track to put it on. Anybody have one?

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P71600031a.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7160001.jpg

[SS427]

Wow Steve, the lengths you go to. Unbelievable! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[njsteve]

Nobody tells me I can't do something! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif

(except for my wife...and my banker...and the IRS....)

[DarrenX33]

Weirdo! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Man, Steve you really are an inspiration. You never fail to impress. Great work as usual. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif

[Xplantdad]

Someone get Steve an 8 track...quick! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[KevinW]

Steve, I checked my stash and could not find a white one that I can part with. Found an off-white one of Spyro gyro that I won't be using http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Dave Rifkin]

[ QUOTE ]
Nobody tells me I can't do something! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif

(except for my wife...and my banker...and the IRS....)

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't restore my 1969 Corvette... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[njsteve]

Oh, that's easy enough...send me the title so I can restore that first. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[Mr70]

What's your address Steve.

[mockingbird812]

Nice job "Mac"! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[DarrenX33]

Nice one Rick. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[ QUOTE ]
What's your address Steve.

[/ QUOTE ]

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
What's your address Steve.

[/ QUOTE ]

I PM'd you the info.
I appreciate any help you can provide, Sir.

Now if we can just figure out how to hollow out the 8-track to house an MP3 player and then transfer the 8 track music files to a modern format...

Stay tuned for next week's episode of "As the Bird Flips." http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[mockingbird812]

[ QUOTE ]
Stay tuned for next week's episode of "As the Bird Flips."

[/ QUOTE ]

aka... flip the tape, not the bird http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[njsteve]

Enoch came over on Sunday to pull the rear window out so I could clean out the butyl weatherstripping in preparation for bringing the body to him. We used the old, 2-man welding wire method to saw through the rubber seal and then lift out the window.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/S7000445.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/S7000446.jpg


Here are the latest photos of the body work.

Here's the doors looking very smooth:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607b.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607a.jpg

And the front bumper/bird beak:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607h.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607f.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607d.jpg

The painted surface of the shaker getting wet sanded away by hand:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607c.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607e.jpg

Mirror hardware:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/71607g.jpg

[mockingbird812]

Dang Mac, given your current progress, when do you expect to have her completed?

[PeteLeathersac]

"...We used the old, 2-man welding wire method to saw
through the rubber seal and then lift out the window..."

No matter what some good intentioned 'magic tool' bearing experts/friends/helpers may say, this old two man wire method is always the best way to extract original glass in one piece!.
Your pic of the wire wrapped around the screwdrivers looks so familiar and reminds me of all the good times working at the boneyard where in the days before cheap aftermarket glass was available I pulled tons of used w'shlds sucessfully using this method.. Just make sure you or your helper doesn't get rammy and push the glass away from the seal too quickly after cutting it as constant steady pressure will allow it to slowly move away from cut, sticky seals, even in a hot day's sunlight.. It's like removing an old decal as pulling it too quickly and it'll break but constant pressure and it'll slowly come off..

The car is looking great!!!.

~ Pete
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[kwhizz]

[ QUOTE ]
Enoch came over on Sunday to pull the rear window out so I could clean out the butyl weatherstripping in preparation for bringing the body to him. We used the old, 2-man welding wire method to saw through the rubber seal and then lift out the window.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/S7000445.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/S7000446.jpg


Make sure you save the "OLD" Trim Clips........LOL

Ken

[njsteve]

Cleaned up the window channel area this afternoon. All the orginal yellow clips came out unscathed. It didn't take much time, I used a metal gasket scraper and slid it under the butyl bead and it came up in one piece - and this was the original 1972 material, too. No rust underneath, just some flakey red oxide primer and original blackout paint. I then used a rotary wire brush to get any rubber residue out. Just trying to save a few bucks (and hours of Enoch's time) off my bill. I'll see about removing the trunk weatherstripping next. I have to hit the auto parts store tomorrow to see if they have some weatherstrip remover spray to loosen it up.

BTW, gotta love the typical 1970's hacksaw job on the speaker holes. Why the heck didnt people just mount the damn speakers under the panel instead of sawing a gigantic hole through the rear deck to bolt them on the top of the package tray. What were we thinking back then??? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7170006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7170001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7170015.jpg

[njsteve]

While I was at it, I cleaned the front window channel too...

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7170011.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7170013.jpg

[njsteve]

Found some of the 3M "Adhesive Cleaner" at the local auto parts store. 3M doesn't make the Weatherstrip Adhesive Remover anymore, and it superceded to this stuff. I guess it was just too effective so they had to take it off the market. This stuff didn't do a whole lot to existing trunk weatherstripping because it can't really get down under the rubber and into the channel, so you still have to rip, peel and scrape your way down to the channel. Once you get the majority of the old weatherstripping out you can then spray this stuff on and let it soak in. I then used a wire wheel on a hand drill and the rest of the adhesive and weatherstripping residue came out.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7190002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7190001.jpg

[StriperSS]

I've been using 3M products for 31 years now, and if there's one thing I've learned, it's that they never leave well enough alone. You find a product that works well and get used to using it. The next time you buy a can of it, you find that it doesn't work as well as the previous batch, because they've re-formulated it. I've had that problem with their Wax and Grease remover a few times, and now just lately their automotive grade green masking tape. It's pretty frustrating, because they'll never admit there's any problems with their products, but eventually it'll go back to the way it was.
John

[njsteve]

Many, many thanks to Mr70 who sent me a pristine white 8-track housing along with the original cardboard wrapper.

Here is the finished product. I ended up printing the label on a large piece of 8-1/2 by 11 photo paper. I then cut it out and used spray adhesive (the kind designed for mounting photos in scrap books) on the back of the photo and the sides of the tape. It stuck perfectly and the photo paper gloss matches the original label perfectly. Thanks to all who helped during this chapter of the ongoing novel, especially Mr70!
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

P.S. I am still trying to figure out why the lady in the photo is sitting on a green bench seat in the middle of a tropical rain forest. Where the heck is the rest of the car? or is this some clue to the next episode of "Lost?"

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7200003.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7200001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7200004.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7200005.jpg

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
Dang Mac, given your current progress, when do you expect to have her completed?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's all going exactly according to plan: Sometime in Spring of 2005.

[mockingbird812]

Mac,

Most excellent! Sounds like your projects "progress" like mine http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif !

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[VintageMusclecar]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Dang Mac, given your current progress, when do you expect to have her completed?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's all going exactly according to plan: Sometime in Spring of 2005.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you're gonna need this then:

http://www.sanjuan.edu/schools/sanjuan/images/car06.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Eric

[70-SS/RS-L78]

[ QUOTE ]
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010015.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
Looks Great
Steve it "Looks Great",did you clean or replace the lines?

[70-SS/RS-L78]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P1010015.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Steve Nice Job! Did you clean or replace the lines?

[/ QUOTE ]

[njsteve]

Those are the originals. I just cleaned them with the fine grade wire brush on a bench grinder. Just make sure you have lots of room to twist and turn the lines as you go along.

[njsteve]

More bodyshop progress. Discovered some interesting discrepencies in how the underside of the shaker is supposed to be painted. Here is a shot of an original one with the natural finish showing on the fiberglass:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/shakerbottom5.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/shakerbottom.jpg

And now the one from my car. As you can see the underside was fully blacked out prior to the metal mounting base being riveted on at the factory. (The underside was lightly glassbeaded prior to these photos so that is why the white base material is showing)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/scoop1072507.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/scoop2072507.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/scoop3072507.jpg

[mockingbird812]

Let me get this straight Mac, are you saying that there MAY have been discrepancies on processes coming out of the GM factories. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif HOLY COW!

Seriously, good stuff. Love to hear of the differing processes among and within plants.

[njsteve]

I am just so disheartened to learn that the only plant that was making Camaros and Firebirds (Norwood) in 1972 did not follow the proper shaker assembly procedures as dictated by GM. Just astonishing. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif
No wonder they went on strike and shut the whole plant down for the rest of the model year. They were just too ashamed at how they built my car.

[southernfriedcj]

[ QUOTE ]
Okay, so I was posting to the companion novel I have of my progress on the T/A, at the Performance Years website and this guy jokingly asks me how I am going to "restore" that grungy old 8-track tape of the "Pontiac Stereo 8-track Sounds for 1972".

Having laid down the gauntlet I decided to go ahead and do just that, just to bust his balz.

Here is the before tape:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape2.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/tape3.jpg


I took the tape and scanned all three surfaces of the label into my computer, and converted it into a jpeg. I then spent about 12 hours on the Microsoft Paint program at 800% magnification, erasing all the yellow from the background and from between every single letter, pixel by pixel. It was like Pac-Man on a massive scale. (I should have let my kids do it, it would have went much faster). Carpal Tunnel Syndrome is a wonderful thing. Once that was done, I cut and pasted the three images together into one image file. The next fun was the 2 hours of adjusting the size so it printed out in the exact same size as the original decal. I had to keep adding to the length of the image to get it to center properly on paper with the right width and length.

Here is the final version. I printed it out on adhesive backed label paper that I had at the house. A glossier paper would be better but this gives you an idea of how it looks. Now all I need is a nice clean blank 8-track to put it on. Anybody have one?

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P71600031a.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P7160001.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Steve, you are unbelievable! Your T/A is going to be awesome when done. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif

[njsteve]

I just got my AM/FM Stereo radio and 8 track player back from Wards Classic Car Radio Repair www.wardsclassiccarradiorepair.com (http://www.wardsclassiccarradiorepair.com) They did a very nice job on the whole set up. It cost $175 total, including return shipping. It took about 2 weeks, which included an entire weekend that he let the 8 track player run just to make sure it checked out after they finished cleaning and refurbishing everything. I asked him what he was using to play for 48 hours straight. He said they have quite a collection of old 8 track tapes just laying around for that purpose. Knowing how bad these things sounded back then compared to today's sound systems, I cant imagine how they deal with it, but hey, they are the experts! I guess you have to scarifice for the sake of your art.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8090001-1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8090002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8090003.jpg

[Mr70]

I prefer the original sound of 8tk tapes over <u>ANY</u> other music media today.. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

http://www.pimpcostumes.com/images/products/70sPimpDiscoStuLg.jpg

[TC]

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x204/tcl71/8tracks.jpg


So, 8 tracks are not making a come back, And I should finely through these away? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

BTW...the T/A in loking AWESOME
Tom

[budnate]

Dang Rick, where did you find the picture of Bruce??

[SSJunkie68-69]

HA HA....that's his OTHER job after taking pics at Pavillions. He sure does have a strong pimp hand.... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif just kidding Bruce~

[njsteve]

You're in for a treat cuz Disco Stu's diggin that 8-track beat.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/361px-The_Simpsons-Disco_Stu.png

[Xplantdad]

[ QUOTE ]
Dang Rick, where did you find the picture of Bruce??

[/ QUOTE ]

Too funny Bud. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


I thought I told you not to tell...now I'll have to let everyone know about you and the Zebra...in that hotel room in Collinsville...LOL http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

Now here's what I'll be listening to...Brings back memories of lounging around the pool when I was about 7 or 8 years old.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8090006.jpg

[njsteve]

The latest chapter was trying to restore the original artificial leather-like-substitute, foam padded, Formula "Fat" steering wheel.

I decided to do it myself since the repro wheels are close to correct, but the makers chose to use a very hard urethane instead of a soft one (don't get me started on why companies get that close with a repro part and then don't go all the way when it would be so easy to substitute a softer durometer padding...) and the fact that the so called "restoration" services for these wheels involve them dipping it in a hard plastic outer coating like a Carvel chocolate dipped, ice cream cone (Here comes Willy the Wheel...in my best Frank Carvel/Abe Simpson voice) that cracks the first time your turn the wheel hard left or right.

I decided to try my hand at redoing the original wheel because you can't nice originals for less than $750 on ebay and an NOS 1970 to 73 Fat Wheel will run you about $2000, and I had nothing to lose as my wheel was so badly damaged it was only useable as a core. (Don't confuse the "Fat" wheel with the later model thinner ones that came on 75 to 81 Trans Ams -humungous price difference)

These wheels originaly had a smooth outer coating that eventually wore away after years of use and exposure to the sun, leaving the underlying rough, cracked, crumbly foam material exposed. Here is a close up of what they end up turning into:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/a.jpg

[njsteve]

One of the main problems with my wheel (and most older wheels) was that the foam had seperated from the internal steel core at the 10:00 position and could be rotated on the core like a motorcycle throttle. If left unaddressed, this defect would prove fatal to any attempt at a cosmetic restoration as the foam would turn and crack the outer surface.

What I ended up doing was performing surgury on the wheel. I used a razor and sliced through the foam on theback side, down to the metal core, and then filled the area with black weatherstrip adhesive. Once filled, I wrapped the repaired area tightly in masking tape and left it overnight to cure. The repair worked perfectly: no more turning foam.

(The in-progress photo didn't come out so here is a later photo with the incision marked in red)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8250007a.jpg

[njsteve]

The biggest problem with these wheels is the lack of a similar material for repair. Some people use bondo (too rigid) or silicone (too soft), but until now there was no real alternative.

Scratching me head, I was digging around in the lab and found two 10 year old tubes of 3M rubber bumper repair epoxy. This is the stuff used for filling and repairing the elastomeric/endura bumpers on Camaros, GTOs, Trans Ams, Cudas and the like. Mixed in equal parts, it cures fast, is extremely flexible, sands easy and can be painted. Since I had nothing to lose, I used it: I ended up stumbling onto the perfect repair material.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8250002.jpg

[njsteve]

I mixed small amounts as it cures quicky and you dont want to waste the stuff. I applied it to the entire wheel with a tongue depressor. During the process, my wife (Mrs. McGyver) accidentally wandered down into the work shop and saw the mess and just shook her head telling me that I ruined that poor wheel...Yee of little faith.

Once it cured I sanded it to a rough round shape, looked for low spots, and reapplied it about five or six times. Here are a couple of in-progress shots:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8250001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8250009.jpg

[njsteve]

This is after about three days of reapplication, and resanding with 120 grit. I then sprayed it with several coats of flexible urethane primer and sanded some more with a mini-orbital sander and primed it some more. I also sanded the incorrect black paint off the spokes. This area should be anodized a gunmetal color, not painted (more on that later).

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8260010.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8260005.jpg

[njsteve]

After I was satisfied with the smoothness and lack of flaws I used Duplicolor flat black vinyl paint and sprayed a bunch of coats on the wheel, hand wetsanding with 400 grit after each one to get the wheel perfectly round.


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8270014.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8270018.jpg

[njsteve]

The big trick was trying to duplicate the original gunmetal anodized finish on the spokes. Since there is no way to reanodize the metal on the wheel I harkened back to my military modeling days as a kid when I used to build WWII armor dioramas for a local hobby shop and would "weather" the tanks and gear to make them look realistically "battle weary."

I used one of the old tricks of the trade, which is to do a light paint wash of the area. I sprayed a two second burst of flat black into a cup and then added a little enamel reducer. (Be very careful: as this stuff dripped on the foam wheel will ruin the finish). I used a foam brush and lightly washed the blackened reducer over the metal areas. As it dried I would daub it with a crumpled paper towel to get rid of any brush marks. I did this about 20 times. You have to be patient as each application removes about half of the previous application as the enamel reducer dissolves the earlier paint. This process worked very well as it brought out the original brushed finish in the metal.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8290003.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8290006.jpg

[njsteve]

Here are the "McGyver-dized" spokes next to another original wheel for color comparison purposes. Perfect match:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/aP8290003.jpg

[njsteve]

Here is the finished product. The wheel looks just like the original piece and is just as flexible and soft as when it came from the factory 35 years ago.

So here it is, after about a week of work and approximately $40 in materials, sitting on top of my wife's prized antique, ceramic sugar bowl: http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

With a little leather preservative applied (after this photo was taken), it brought the sheen up to what the original was supposed to look like. I'd rather have it too flat than too glossy, as the wheel surface will shine up with age and use. (That's another old modeler's trick: if you want to duplicate black leather upholstery on a model car, paint it flat black and then once dried, buff the area with your fingers to bring up the shine http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif)

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8290008.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8290015.jpg

[Xplantdad]

Awesome stuff Steve...er, McGyver! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[kwhizz]

Steve...........Great Job........ http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

Ken http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

[MosportGreen66]

That is awesome stuff Steve! A true inspiration for the do-it-yourself-er... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[mockingbird812]

Holy Cow Mac http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif !!!! You've done it again. Thanks for the inspiration. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Ngtflyr]

All I can say is "WOW" http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif

[njsteve]

Since the guys over at the Performance Years website thought the spokes were a little too light when compared to some low mileage reference photos, I modified the washing technique a little, once again resorting to my old military modeler days. I employed another wash technique using my wife's black acrylic stenciling paint and water and the same foam brush over the prior enamel washing. I applied about 15 coats over the course of the afternoon and then, once it dried, sprayed some clear Rustoleum spray paint over it from about 3 feet away so it was almost dry when it hit the wheel rims.

The comparson photo used for color reference purposes was from a late 71 Formula.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8300001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/61209910208_0_BG.jpg

[njsteve]

Being the tinkerer that I am, I decided that the finish on the rubber rim was a little too flat so I used a can of the black Plasti-Dip Rubber Coating Spray and sprayed several coats on the rim. That stuff is amazing. It leaves a nice rubbery semi-shiny finish on the surface that duplicates the original foam rubber finish perfectly, and I had no problems with spraying the coats immediately after one another even though the can says wait 30 minutes between coats. I think they mean if you stop spraying, and let it sit for more than a minute, it may craze the previous layer. So, I ended up just spraying continuously to fully cover all surfaces of the rim. I then just left it to sit overnight. Here is the result from this morning.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8310006.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8310001.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P8310003.jpg

[Mr70]

Quit your day Job.http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[mockingbird812]

That's so beautiful, I'd wear it as a hat. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

[ QUOTE ]
That's so beautiful, I'd wear it as a hat. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I was thinking more along the lines of a broach, or maybe get another wheel and try them on as two "pasties" for the more daring ladies out there! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[mockingbird812]

Better not be T3's then!!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Or those bad boys will be training wheels down around the ankles! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

Just for giggles I tried a little experiment on the Parts Place reproduction fat wheel I bought last year off of ebay. While it is dimensionally correct version of the early "fat wheel," the makers used a hard plastic-like, urethane with an incorrect heavy grain and fake mold seams on it.

I used the orbital sandle with 220 grit and sanded the edges more round where they meet the spokes and partially sanded down/smoothed the entire rim and especially the fake seam they had molded into the outer circumference of the wheel. I then sprayed it with several layers of the Plasti Dip spray. I think that is the trick for the repro wheel if you wanted to use one of these for your GTO or T/A. It really got rid of the plastic repro look and now looks like the original black foam.

I might install this wheel as my primary wheel and use the original one for shows (in the event I ever finish this confounded, eternal project) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/zP8310001.jpg

[southernfriedcj]

Steve, your skill and imagination on this restoration continues to impress and amaze me!

[njsteve]

Southernfriedcj, how's your old NJ T/A doin? any photos? I could use the incentive/moral support. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[BARN FIND]

Steve I was reading "Fabulous Firebirds" last night and it says in there that all 70 Firebirds came with a 12 bolt rear end no matter what model. Is that true?

[njsteve]

Dont know about 1970. (71 and up had the 10 bolt) Here is the place for all Pontiac questions to be answered: www.performanceyears.com (http://www.performanceyears.com) and then go to the 70 to 73 Firebird/Trans Am section. I know they will have the answer.

[68 Vert]

[ QUOTE ]
Steve I was reading "Fabulous Firebirds" last night and it says in there that all 70 Firebirds came with a 12 bolt rear end no matter what model. Is that true?

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe only the Trans Am and Formula's received the 12 bolt rears in '70. The 'regular' Firebird came with the 10 bolt.

Mike

[njsteve]

More helpful hints from the toolbox: I was deciding whether to replace the carpet in the car due to it's overabundance of fuzz and pilz sticking up, when an idea lightbulb went off over my head. We have had this dog trimmer sitting in the cabinet for about 15 years now and no more long haired dogs to use it on.

I just spread the carpet out and gave it a crew cut! The trimmer worked amazingly well. No snags or pulls, it just buzzed all the extraneous fuzz that accumulated from years of using those floormats with the little rubber nubs and from normal foot wear. After that I used what remained of the vinyl spray dye and misted both the front and rear sections to blacken the sunfaded spots. So now I guess I'll keep this carpet set.

The next episode will be "1001 Uses for a Flowbee."


http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P9060010.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P9060002.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/P9060001.jpg

[mockingbird812]

Ah yes, the crew cut is back. But wait a minute....didn't MacGyver have a mullet?! Not sure he would approve. Surprised "he" got so close to the shears with all of those posteriorly positioned locks of hair. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v697/mockingbird812/macgyver.jpg

[njsteve]

I made sure I had all of my protective gear on at the time: gold chains and a lot of duct tape!

[njsteve]

OK, being the perfectionist I am I wasn't satisfied with the way the reproduction wheel came out. Since it is a harder urethane material, the Plasti-Dip spray nicked rather easily and didn't adhere as well as I would have hoped. When I picked at it a little, the entire coating peeled off in one piece. That, of course, meant that I did not prep the repro wheel well enough.

I also wasn't satisfied with the fact that it still had a bunch of grain along with a fake outer seam that marred the surface. So I ended up hand-sanding it with 80 grit, then 200, then 400 then 600 until it became as smooth as the factory wheel. I was very careful to keep away from the fake threads along the inner seams. I then sprayed it with a flexible plastic primer and sanded that with 600, reprimed and resanded by hand until it was shiny and smooth. I also reshaped the edges where the urethane meets the spokes as the repro was a bit too angular in that area. Once I was satisfied, (I know, I've said that before) I sprayed the wheel in numerous heavy coats of the SEM Landau Black and the result was beautiful. SEM is the coating to use and it is great stuff, much better than Duplicolor or VHT or any of the other brands. Other than the black anodizing looking way too new, the wheel looks like an NOS wheel now. And it feels a lot better as well. I will be installing this one in the car and saving the original wheel for posterity.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/repro1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i30/nk15268a/repro2.jpg

[mockingbird812]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif Freakin' unbelievable Mac! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

[njsteve]

In my spare time I'm working on creating an NOS ZL1 engine out of Wrigley's chewing gum wrappers, maple syrup and Dr. Pepper cans. (You have to use Dr.Ppper because it has more caffeine than other sodas and we all know the ZL1 was a more highly caffeinated engine than it's iron counterparts.) http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[Judgeinator]

any progress since the last update?

[njsteve]

No, still waiting for the body man to finish prepping the front sheetmetal before I bring him the rest of the body. I will be making a decision either way in the next few weeks as to where the car will be finished because I am getting old and don't have the patience for these delays after 21 months of him having the panels. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[southernfriedcj]

[ QUOTE ]
No, still waiting for the body man to finish prepping the front sheetmetal before I bring him the rest of the body. I will be making a decision either way in the next few weeks as to where the car will be finished because I am getting old and don't have the patience for these delays after 21 months of him having the panels. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Get a rope! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif 21 months! Christsakes!

[njsteve]

Future rapid progress kinda depends on whether Santa brings me the welding equipment I asked for. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[Norwood]

[ QUOTE ]
No, still waiting for the body man to finish prepping the front sheetmetal before I bring him the rest of the body. I will be making a decision either way in the next few weeks as to where the car will be finished because I am getting old and don't have the patience for these delays after 21 months of him having the panels. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

And I thought that I was SLOW. It's white Steve, DO IT YOURSELF.. You have done everything else..


http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n250/crabs24/transamphotos2059.jpg

[70-SS/RS-L78]

21 Months is entirely too long, I see that they did some metal work and blocked a lot of filler which is a time consuming process. Looks like they are
using Rage Gold in that shop. That stuff gets “Real Hard”. All that is left are the Quarters, Roof and then final sheet metal alignment, You are using the
original sheet metal so your car should come together real nice.
I do this for a living so I know how you can be easily side tracked. You have to have a time frame and game plan and try to “Stay on the car till it is finished”. The problems begin when you have a delay where you are at a stand still for whatever reason and get involved in another project...........
Steve You are doing a Great Job, I have learned a few things.

[njsteve]

I stopped up at the body shop last week and talked to my body man. We will see what happens. I am scheduled to bring the body up there in 2 weeks to get the trunk floor done and windshield channel, hopefully in a 7 to 10 day time span. Then I will take it back home to reinstall the windshield and the rest of the underside stuff: exhaust, gas tank, fuel lines, etc. while he works on other projects in the shop. We will see how this works out.

[njsteve]

While I was at the shop I grabbed one of the rear wheel flairs to see if there was a better way to strip them than media blasting. Since they are ABS plastic I ended up using the old purple stuff in a tub. There was a ton of paint on the flair so it took about 5 days of soaking and scrubbing with a bristle brush to get the majority of the paint layers off. It worked rather well. Some fine sanding will get the remainder of the yellow primer/filler off. The plastic is actually a white color that is very close to Cameo White. I don't really know, but these may have come unpainted from the factory since the color is so close. Anyone know?

Heres the before shot with the white rubber welting covered in paint and cracking:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190014.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190013.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190011.jpg

It is interesting to see that the factory used a big staple to hold on the upper end of the welting onto the plastic flair due to the severe angle it has to maintain.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190009.jpg

[njsteve]

I started out with a small bucket:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190017.jpg

And then graduated to one of the tubs that my wife uses to store the Christmas decorations:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220005.jpg

Here is the removed welting next to the NOS piece that I took off of the NOS front spoiler. Big difference after all these years. The NOS stuff is very flexible. Unfortunately the repro stuff is made only in grey and you have to paint it or dye it.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190025.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC190022.jpg
Here's how it looks after 5 days:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220008.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220006.jpg

[njsteve]

Once I got it all cleaned I found a couple stress cracks in the plastic:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220010.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220011.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220013.jpg

I pulled out the trusty plastic welder and used that to heat up and massage/melt the original material into the cracks thereby repairing the areas.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC2201004.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC2201005.jpg


Of course things look uglier before they get prettier...

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC2201010.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC2201013.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC2201015.jpg

[njsteve]

After a few minutes cooling down I sanded the area with a mini-orbital sander and 180 grit. Once that was finished, the area is just as strong as the rest of the flair:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220022.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220017.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC220028.jpg

[Norwood]

Yes back in the day, they were molded in body color. That plastic welder looks like the trick to fixxing these. NICE
The welting takes paint with flex very well.

[Johnny Horsepower]

I love this thread! and I wanna buy Steve's car when he sells it http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[njsteve]

Note to self: when you borrow one of the wife's storage tubs make sure there is not a hairline crack in the bottom that drains out 5 gallons of very expensive cleaning solvent onto work bench/old pool table which then leaks onto rug under said work bench/pool table. Because you will have to clean up the entire mess and then discover that rugs soaked in Purple Stuff overnight do an amazing job at completely sanitizing one 6'x12' area of all dirt, grease, oil, paint, etc. Now wife wants the rest of basement floor cleaned to match the bright grey rectangle. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Before:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/P6130005.jpg

After:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC270002.jpg

[Xplantdad]

Leave it up to you, Steve...to find yet another use for the cleaning solvent! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

Yeah, I think that's a record or something: that is the first time I have actually used something for it's intended purpose, unintentionally of course. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[njsteve]

It took several days of soaking to get all of the white paint off of the other flares. The purple stuff doesn't seem to touch primer-surfacer layers so that took a lot of 80 grit sandpaper and a Black&amp;Decker Mouse sounder. That stuff is hard as rock. That is the reason the flares still have a yellowish tint to the white plastic. I had to get most of that layer off to see where the stress cracks were. I also found some more serious cracks from impact damage on one of the flares.

Here is a close up of one of the stress cracks in the lower front spoiler:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC280014.jpg

I ended up fixing these by using the plastic welder and smearing at across the cracks perpendicular to the direction of the crack. This melted the plastic back together. It took a while to get all the cracks welded up.

The marks in the lower portion of the flare are from the stress crack remelting process.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/PC280012.jpg

The black spots are where I used black ABS plastic rod to weld the majpr impact damage cracks back to gether. Once it cools it is sanded down with 80 grit.