The last Camaro....what's it worth???

[Zedder]

A friend of mine owns the last 2002 Camaro built for the public (GM kept the very last car produced for their collection) and he is thinking about selling it. He has a letter from GM stating that it is the last Camaro sold to the public. Any ideas on what it might be worth??? It's a black on black Z-28 Convertible, 1SA, polished wheels, leather, multi-disc CD, 6 speed. It's brand new and still in the wrapper...list price was $43,465 Canadian. Any help would be appreciated.

[camarojoe]

Seems to me i remember this car being sold new at auction and went for silly money back in 2002... is this correct?

[zmanrc]

I'd like to see documentation on that.
The last camaro sold to the public was a red Z28 that GM put on Ebay with the proceeds going to charity. It is very well documented. Ebay price was a little over $70K.
Member of our club bought and owns the car and it is currently on display at the Gilmore Car museum.

[70 copo]

In a few years it will be the last of the 4th generation!

Phil

[Zedder]

No, this car was not sold at auction. My friend is a GM dealer here in Ontario and got the car directly from GM. The letter from GM Vintage Services dated Feb 5, 2003 states:

"...the final Camaro/Firebird produced at Ste. Therese was a Camaro convertible , VIN XXXXXXXXXXXXXX467 on August 27, 2002, at approx. 8:49 am. This vehicle has apparantly been retained by Chevrolet Division, and has not been offered for sale to the public.

Your vehicle was the second last Camaro, and the third last convertible produced at Ste. Therese.

The second last Convertible, and the last Firebird, carries VIN XXXXXXXXXXXXXX466.

We trust this is the info you require...."

Does anyone know the VIN of the ebay Camaro? Thanks for the responses so far!

[camarojoe]

I specifically remember the car to be red too... It was highly publicized, i even remember hearing about it selling for 70k+ on the radio one morning on my way to work... I wonder how the car your buddy has could also be the last camaro? Unless maybe they later decided to sell the very last one they claimed was going to be "retained by Chevrolet and not offered for sale", which was the red car that brought 70+k. If thats the case, it makes the black one alot less collectible IMO.

[zmanrc]

I don't have the VIN but will email the owner when I get home. Below is the news release from the Associated Press after the Ebay auction.

Last new Camaro sells for $71,500 at auction

Published Tuesday, September 3, 2002
AUBURN, Ind. (AP) - The last new Camaro to be sold by Chevrolet - a red, T-topped Z-28 - brought a tidy $71,500 at a charity auction.

"I got a little crazy," said the buyer, Mark Gembinski, 32, a business manager from Mayville, Mich. "I paid a lot more than I wanted to, but I wanted it bad."

When Gembinski was born, his father took him home from the hospital in a 1969 Camaro.

His Z-28 wasn’t the last Camaro to roll off the assembly line - that car is headed for Chevrolet’s museum. Gembinski’s car was second-to-last, produced last week at a General Motors plant in Canada.

More than 4 million Camaros were sold since the muscle car debuted in fall 1966 with the 1967 model. It reached its heyday in the 1970s but sold poorly in the era of sport utility vehicles and imports, and last September, General Motors announced it would stop making the Camaro.

[Zedder]

I did a little searching on-line and found the ad for the Kruse auction that sold the red car. It clearly states that the red car is the "last Camaro saleable in the United States"...hmmmmm...so maybe it isn't THEE last Camaro after all??? I also found a number of sites stating that the "very last" Camaro was retained by GM and they still have it. This could get interesting! Anyone know the VIN of the red car?

[zmanrc]

Any chance your buddies was the last CONVERTIBLE sold to the public?

[Zedder]

Yes,according to this letter it is the last convertible, and maybe the last Camaro period. The Kruse auction description for the red car is VERY specific that it was the last Camaro offered in the UNITED STATES. I've located the owner of the car and asked him what the VIN is. My guess is my buddies car has a later VIN as I doubt GM would sell off the car they retained.

[MosportGreen66]

Zedder... Maybe your buddy's car is the last Canadian sold Camaro?

[Zedder]

Can anyone resize the scan I have of the letter and post if for me please? My guess is that this is THEE last Camaro sold to the public...anywhere... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Zedder]

Here is one copy of the Kruse ad that I found...

http://www.autogeek.com/ag_News.asp?NewsID=12

[camarojoe]

I'll bet they sold about 50 "last" camaros... Last convertible, Last USA sold car, Last canadian sold car, last red car with T tops, Last black V6 car with cloth interior, etc etc...

[Rat_Pack]

Zedder, email it to me and I will take care of it for you.........RatPack...............

[zmanrc]

You may be right. Kruse does say "last in the United States". Which ever one isn't the car they were led to believe is going to be PISSED!

So from what you said ... you already emailed Marc???
I am at work and don't have his email address here.

[Zedder]

Yeah, I found a post he made on another site and emailed him via the site. You may want to follow-up with him though, as I am sure he'll want to get to the bottom of this just like we do.

Thanks Troy...I sent it to you. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[zmanrc]

Cool, I did find his address through another email I had and asked him to chime in or let me know something.

This will either become REALLY interesting or one of them will say "yeah, I knew that".

[Zedder]

Hey, maybe your friend would like to own "both" of the last Camaros http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

I guess we'll know the story soon...

[Rat_Pack]

Zedder, here you go. I blanked out the owners name and address but left the vins intact..........RatPack...........

[ QUOTE ]
You may be right. Kruse does say "last in the United States". Which ever one isn't the car they were led to believe is going to be PISSED!


[/ QUOTE ] ..............I do believe you are right, somebody is going to be pissed. However at least all of the money went to charity...................

[zmanrc]

Hmmm.... Interesting.
I'm sure my friend with the red car in at the Woodward Cruise today as he lives in the area. I'm guessing he has not seen any of this as yet.

[Zedder]

Thanks Rat Pack http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[RichSchmidt]

Well are we talking about the last one made or the last one sold.I know I went to the Chevy dealership where I buy all my new Chevys,and in 2004,they had a brand new never titled 2002 convertable V6 car on the floor that"wasnt for sale".This one could have been thousands from the last one made,but it might be the last one sold.I think they still have it.Another Chevy dealer in my area closed a few years back,and sold off the last of their cars.I had a job fixing the phones in there a few times,and I got to walk around in their "museum" .The owner had aquired a few cars over the years that he never titled,they just sat there in his loft.One was a 65 or 66 Impala,while the other was a GNX Buick that he swapped his way into thru the network of deaers.Neither car was every titled in any state.Of course in 2004 my friend also got the first ever title for his 1968 camaro race car which was sold new with nothing other thn a cirtificate of origin back in 1968,and never titled and raced until 1971 where it was abandoned in a local engine shop.My friend bought it in 1993 with 425 original miles on it,and could figure out how to title it until last year.Maybe that is the last Camaro titled by the public Who knows.

[Zedder]

Second to last built and last released for public sale.

[RareSS]

There is a loaded out black 2002 Camaro SS in Dallas that has never been registered and it is not for sale either! Dealership still has it! I wanted it! Looks like a lot of "last Camaros sold" showing up!

[zmanrc]

I don't own the car nor have I seen the documentation presented with the car so you can take everything I say with a grain of salt. Thanks to the several people that emailed me last night.

Last year at the bowling green show both GM's red vert and the red Ebay Z were displayed together and GM billed them as "the last 2 camaro's ever built". Not last one built and last US sale.

I was reminded by someone else that cars are taken out of sequence on the line all the time. Which number and which CAR actually came off the line last could be 2 different things
As I said I have no direct knowledge of any of this and have not heard from the owner of the red car as yet.

But to answer your buddy's original question as to worth. I agree with what was suggested on another board. Put it on Ebay with a high reserve and he will get an idea of what the market will bear or take it to Barrett Jackson where you will likely have to put it up with no reserve.

[Zedder]

It gets more interesting all the time..I spoke with Marc who owns the red car this morning (very nice guy) and he told me about the pics he has etc. of his car on the line with the GM retained Camaro and Firebird verts. However, as the letter that I posted states, the GM Camaro vert is vin 467, the GM Firebird vert is 466, my friend's vert is 465, and Marc's coupe is 461???? I guess the next step is to contact GM and get the times that each car was produced to see if the red coupe was produced in sequence and then placed in line for the photos or whether it was held back during production. It's funny though that the last 3 consecutive VINS are all verts http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

[Zedder]

Here is a pic I found of the last Camaro retained by GM...I wonder if that is 461 over on the side???

[zmanrc]

I guess I would persue it as well if I were you. But "officially" GM says the last cars off the line were the red vert and the red Z.
I guess my question would be; Why would GM make such a big deal about the last US car and have no fanfare at all about your black vert if it were the last car for sale period, just sending it off to a dealer. Really looks like the red Z was pulled out of out of line and put back in to be finished last. But I would love to hear what GM has to say about all this and if the gentleman that sent your letter gets his hand smacked for speaking out of turn (if that was the case). Please let us know what you find out.

[Zedder]

I can appreciate your position given that your friend is involved, but I have yet to see anything from "GM" that says anything more than that the red car is the last for sale in the US. Anyone who knows how VINs are sequenced can tell which car was built last. The info in the letter I posted is from GM and came from their production records. However, if putting the red car aside after it is built and bringing it back on-line after the black car for the photos makes it the last one "officially", so be it. The GM records showing the time the cars were produced will probably be the only thing that will prove to me which is really the last Camaro. Hopefully, we can get that info tomorrow. I don't think the red car's value will be hurt by this given the fanfare it received, but it does make you think a little doesn't it http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif If I was a rich man, I'd probably want to own both for my collection http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[WMCC Gary]

I emailed the Fbodfather about 2 People claiming to own the last Camaro Built for the public!!!


Here's a brief story from the Fbodfather................

Waaaaaaaaayyy back in, I believe, early 2001, I put in a request to have
the last Camaro and Firebird built for the GM Collection.........and one
for sale. The two going into the GM Collection would be 'non-saleables'
and the third car from the end would be the 'last saleable
Camaro'......(period!)

I know that GM of Canada was concerned when they asked for the cars and lo
and behold, I'd already tied them up .....perhaps a year or so beforehand.

Now......it's important to understand that you could not build two
Convertibles in a row........simply because of the build process. In fact,
to my knowledge, the only time it happened was the LAST TWO CARS coming
down the line.............(see below)

I can assure you that the last three cars off the line........on the
conveyor..........final assembly......were:

172461...........Red Z28 Coupe.........LAST SALEABLE 4th Gen CAMARO. was
third from end -auctioned off at Kruse Auburn Auction over Labor Day, 2002.
172466 ........Red Trans Am Convert............LAST 4th Gen FIREBIRD
BUILT.....NON SALEABLE......second from end........resides in GM Collection
172467.......,,Red Z28 convertible..........LAST 4th Gen CAMARO
BUILT....NON SALEABLE

Is there a 172465.......172464............172463........and 172461?

Yes.........those are the VIN sequences.....but that is not how they came
down the line. Our Friend who won the auction at Kruse bought the LAST
SALEABLE 4th Gen Camaro .........it was the third car from the end.......

While I do not know what GM of Canada did with the last Camaro and FIrebird
built for GM of Canada, I suspect that the Black Convertible in question
was the last Saleable Camaro Convertible........or the last Saleable Camaro
for GM of Canada.........but it was not one of the last three cars off the
line.

[Zedder]

We spoke with GM Canada this morning and their records do not show the time of manufacture for all cars produced. They had the time of the last one because it ended the production process. Accordingly, my friend decided to list the car on ebay next week as the "Last Convertible Camaro" and I emailed this to Marc this morning prior to him forwarding your email message to Scott. So everyone is happy I believe http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[zmanrc]

Gary, thanks for emailing Scott. That never occured to me. Mark G. had sent me Scotts response as well.

Discussions like this are what makes this such a great site.

Zedder, I truely hope your friend does well with his sale. Please post the link when he puts it up. It will be fun to watch. Wish I was in the market for another one.

[Charley Lillard]

Last ones until they build new ones again..Then they will be know as the last 4th gens..

[Rick H]

[ QUOTE ]
Last ones until they build new ones again..Then they will be know as the last 4th gens..

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point and then what do they become, just another used 2002 vehicle? Wonder what the value will do to the one of a kind last vehicles? Does a $70,000 Camaro become a $30,000 used vehicle???

Yicks, I am not sure I would want to pay a lot of money for one if I knew the Camaro was going to return.

Interesting.

Rick H.

[fbodfather]

Glad to be of help. (thank God I remember this stuff...can't remember what I had for dinner tonite, but I remember August 27, 2002.......very sad day indeed.

As to what the cars will be worth?

Welp......seems the last car off the Van Nuys plant was on Ebay not three weeks ago.........and as I recall, the bid price was north of $60k when I last looked.

Just glad we got this all straightened out. I just felt it was important to preserve the last few cars.......and I have to tell you that I was approached by several individuals within hours after we announced the 'hiatus'

By the way........you DO want to be in Detroit this January.....that's all I'm gonna say...........

<evilgrin>

[Charley Lillard]

Ha !!!!

[Belair62]

Is there a big snowball fight or something ! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Lynn]

[ QUOTE ]
Last ones until they build new ones again..Then they will be know as the last 4th gens..

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, Charley, why would you be such a cynic? Didn't happen to buy the "last American Convertible" back in 1976 or 1977 did you? Remember all those Eldos going for "double sticker"? What a boat, and now you can't give one away.
check it out;

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1976-Cadi...1QQcmdZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1976-Cadillac-Eldorado-Convertible-Low-Mileage_W0QQitemZ4569850023QQcategoryZ6147QQrdZ1QQ cmdZViewItem)

Lynn

[Xplantdad]

[ QUOTE ]
By the way........you DO want to be in Detroit this January.....that's all I'm gonna say...........

[/ QUOTE ]


Hey Scott,

Welcome to the best musclecar site on the net! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Charley Lillard]

I'm not a cynic... I just think that Scott has given everyone a big hint about the auto show in January....

[camarojoe]

OK, I'll admit I'm a cynic...but I'll believe it when i see it.

[zmanrc]

Thanks Scott! We are already making plans to be in Detroit http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ANDY M]

Isn't the Superbowl in Detroit this January?
Go Lions! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[Zedder]

Let's just hope it looks better than most everything else that has been coming out of GM's design studio lately...