427 Mystery Engine

[Dog427435]

For drag racing the 1963 Chevys came with the new RPO-Z-11, the hot 427 that looked like the 409.
But the NASCAR 409 was dumped for a new engine that was not an RPO item, it was dubbed the Mk II. It was an all new everything, staggered-valve competition engine. The splayed-valve heads soon became known as the "Porcupine Heads". The engine was unique and required all new castings poured at the engine plant in Tonawanda, NY. The Mark II displaced 396 cubic inches. But due to a rule change by NASCAR in November 1962 which increased to a new limit of 7 liters the engine was redesigned to a longer stroke producing 427 cubic inches. This engine became known as the Mark IIS. The Mark IIS later became the Mark V introduced in 1965 as the 396 big block.
My father was very into NASCAR and was friends with Louis Clements, who was partners with NASCAR driver Rex White. Rex was the only driver to have a super speedway win with the 409, the Dixie 400 at Atlanta. Rex was one of four drivers in the 1963 Daytona 500 with the 427. Rex finished 14th six laps down. He ran the 427 through the World 600 finishing second. Due to Chevrolet being in and out of racing and a total lack of parts he then switched to Mercury to finish the season.
On a trip to visit the Clements imagine this 15 year old car nuts thrill to be able to go to Rex and Louis's garage to look at his cars!! The Mercury did nothing for me, it was the beat up Chevy with the mystery engine that I fell in love with. I have always been into big blocks since, love the sound of a high revving small block - but sorry no comparison!
I hate to think what happened to this car, probably short tracked to oblivion.

[b] Rex White Garage

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img098.jpg

The Car - left out, just an old race car!!

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img100.jpg

Check out the high dollar for the time tow rig


http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img099.jpg

At the Track

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img102.jpg

David Pearson drove the #6 Hemi Dodge out of Cotton Owens Garage

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img097.jpg

[SS427]

You photo collection is amazing!!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif
Rick

[PeteLeathersac]

Unfrigginbelievable pics Dog!!!.
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/youguysrock.gif
~ Pete

[Tarrytown SS427s]

Nice pics Glen, did you happen to get a shot of the 427 in the 63?
Steve

[Mr70]

M
+
H.... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[njsteve]

Check out the altered wheelbase on the Dodge. The front wheels were moved forward a couple inches. Same result as moving the engine back. If you aint cheatin' you aint trying!

[Dog427435]

Nice pics Glen, did you happen to get a shot of the 427 in the 63?
Steve

--------------------
Steve

Thanks - I know I had some,unfortunately I have not run across any photos of the engine - if I do I'll definitely post it

Glenn

[Verne_Frantz]

Glenn,
Those are great shots. I'm glad that as a 15 year old you were so inclined to use your camera! I've been a student of the development of the MKII and MKIIs for some time, and your knowledge of that engine is impressive. Most people don't realize it began life as a 396 prior to the 7 liter rule. Mr. Dick Keinath, a senior engineer at Chevy, was responsible for the entirely new design. The engine shared the same pan rail as the MKI (409), but nothing else was interchangable with a MKI or the later MKIV.
I hope you find more photos to share. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gifVerne

[1967Z28]

Those are some incredible photos of Rex's shop and car, the kind you just never see. Thank you very much for sharing them. We all really appreciate it. I had a couple of '61 bubbletop cars earlier in my life and read all I could find on Rex White. He sure did a lot for Chevrolet back then.

-Jon

[Fhakya]

Yeah, that Dodge is interesting. Note: headlights, windshield wipers, hood scoop,no rollbar (?), what looks a little more like street/drag tires? I don't know much about NASCAR history but did any of the Dodge/Plymouth teams actually run w/ the 2% suspension mods on the speedways?

It looks a little more like a drag car/street car to me. Anyone know any more about it?

[Dog427435]

That Dodge is definitely not a NASCAR racer, unfortunately I do not remember anything about it. NASCAR was involved in Drag Racing and that may have been a drag car out of Owens garage. If you look closely into the garage door (past the chained NO ADMITTANCE sign) the car inside looks as it may have the NASCAR decal package on the front fender. The front wheel also sits properly in the wheel well.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/dec006.jpg

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/dec007.jpg

[b] SHOTS OF THE #6 IN 1966


http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/363018.jpg

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/363019.jpg


PIT LANE 1963

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/363021.jpg

PACE CARS

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/363020.jpg

[olredalert]

------How 'bout them Bonny convertables??? Very nice.........Bill S

[1967Z28]

Old color racing pics from the early to mid '60s. Wow, those are neat and rare! The race Hemi was banned for Nascar Grand National racing in '65 and so Chrysler boycotted and sat out '65. That is when the Chrysler teams went drag racing and Nascar sanctioned drag racing events for them. Ford obviously dominated the '65 Nascar Grand National season. There was basically no competition. The tables turned in '66 when Chrysler brought out the street Hemi which made the Hemi legal again in Nascar Grand National. If I remember correctly, Ford attempted to combat the Hemi with the SOHC engine and Nascar said no deal so Ford boycotted the '66 season. Well, I hope I got that right. This was a bad stretch for Chevy so I wasn't paying as close of attention. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Back to the 427 Mystery engine, a couple of years ago Chevy had one of these engines at the LA Auto Show so I had my picture taken with it. I'm not sure if it was owned by GM or if it was on loan from a private collector. Man, the exhaust manifolds on those engines are some of the neatest ever made.

-Jon

P.S. Got any pics from the '68 Daytona 24 hour or '67 Paul Revere 250?

[Dog427435]

The NASCAR races we went to were the Daytona 500 and the Southern 500 in Darlington. I have some shots from those years but they are probably up in NY. I'll be up there in a few weeks and look and see what I've got. Unfortunately most all of the shots are long range like the ones I posted. I was working with some pretty basic stuff back then, still do.
PM me if there is someone your looking for and I'll see what I can find.

[427TJ]

[ QUOTE ]
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/363018.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

The glory days when race cars looked just like the street version! I wonder if that red Coronet had a Hemi?

Great photos Dog.

[Dog427435]

One more NASCAR sticker!

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Copyofdec003.jpg

[Dog427435]

[b] Johnny Rutherford with Smokey Yunick's "Mystery Engine" Chevrolet.
In qualifying for the 500, Rutherford was the fastest qualifier and set an astounding new record of 165.183 MPH. That was 6 MPH faster then Fireball Roberts Pontiac record of the previous year!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img121.jpg
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Junior Johnson called his similar factory backed "mystery Engine" Chevy
"The most superior car the sport has ever seen."
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img126.jpg
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[SS427]

Scary to think of a 165 mph run in those cars with that helmet! They did not know any better back then but it is scary to think about it today.
Rick

[Dog427435]

[b] Smokey and Rex Whites "Mystery Engine" Chevrolets at Daytona
Check out the Sportsmen cars behind pit wall

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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/apr15034.jpg
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[Dog427435]

[b]Junior Johnson's factory backed "Mystery Engine" Chevy

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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69028.jpg

[Dog427435]

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/chevrolet-1963-mystery-moto1.jpg
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1963 CHEVROLET 427 Mark II “Mystery Motor” Engine
An official American Manufacturers Association (AMA) ban on all factory sponsored racing activities was brought on by negative public reaction to performance cars being driven irresponsibly on the street. Despite the ban, Chevrolet engineers continued to supply independent race teams with the equipment needed to win races and keep their cars in the public eye. In 1962, General Motors engineer Dick Keinath designed an all-new engine that generated over 500 horsepower. Because it was delivered secretly to a few race teams, it became known as the “mystery motor.” Junior Johnson and Mickey Thompson were among the select few given these motors. After a race at Daytona in 1963, General Motors recalled these engines in order to demonstrate their sincerity about complying with the racing ban. But not all the engines were returned to the factory and a small number remained in private hands. It was not until 1966 that a 427 V-8 was not available to the public in a production Chevrolet.

-
Thanks to The PETERSEN ARCHIVE

[Verne_Frantz]

Nice to see the photo DOG. Actually, Red Fox received most of the equipment, complete engines and parts. It's a shame that written history doesn't credit him more with being such a key player with Mr. Keinath's engine.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gifVerne

PS: notice the FORD cast iron T-10 transmission behind it! Care to venture how that happened??

[Xplantdad]

I dig the exhaust headers... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worship.gif

[1967Z28]

[ QUOTE ]
Actually, Red Fox received most of the equipment, complete engines and parts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Verne, I believe you mean Ray Fox or was Sanford & Son well connected in the Nascar game back in the day? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

-Jon

[Verne_Frantz]

YES>>>>>RAY Fox.....................DOOOH!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Dog427435]

[ QUOTE ]


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gifVerne

PS: notice the FORD cast iron T-10 transmission behind it! Care to venture how that happened??

[/ QUOTE ]

How??

[Verne_Frantz]

Dog,
The Ford transmissions were more popular back then because of their higher strength (high nickel gears, etc.) The Pontiacs even ran Ford Transmissions. Nascar's only rule was that it had to be a standard trans.
I don't know who owns that engine assembly that is in the Petersen Museum but my guess is that is came from one of Smokey's auctions along with the trans. The front case is probably a GM case so it will bolt up to the Chevy bell. (or they may have just modified the Chevy bell, but I doubt it).
I don't know who put that assembly together for display. It could even be a 3-spd. After all, they weren't drag racing... 3-spds were used a lot in those big cars.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gifVerne

[Dog427435]

Interesting Verne - Thanks

I found this Rex White decal & shipping label today while going through a box of some old Nascar stuff
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img246.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img247.jpg
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[Verne_Frantz]

That is VERY cool......... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Now I have to ask you, just how did you happen to come by that? Did you or someone you know order parts from him? You don't have to answer if you'd rather not. I'm just curious. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/drool.gif

Verne

[Dog427435]

Verne

I am not sure, but I would imagine I got it when I went to Louis & Rex's garage (see 1st post)

Glenn

[Dog427435]

[ QUOTE ]
Verne

I am not sure, but I would imagine I got it when I went to Louis & Rex's garage (see 1st post)





I've said it before - I never throw anything away!!!!!
Glenn

[/ QUOTE ]

[Verne_Frantz]

"I've said it before - I never throw anything away!!!!!
Glenn"

Yeah, I try to adhere to that too. I've thrown things away that I've had for 25 years, thinking there's no reason to save it anymore.......then 2 weeks later something comes up and I need it!!!

Oh well............. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[Paul D]

How many "Mystery Engines" were built and how many are still known to exist?

[Verne_Frantz]

Paul,
The total number I've heard from a "reliable" source was 44, but I don't know where he got that number so I can't verify that. Nor do I know if that number includes the first MKII which was 396cid plus the MKIIs (stroked) to 427cid. I've spoken directly to Dick Keinath, who was the head engineer who designed it, and even he does not know how many were made in total. The design of that engine never really stopped until GM pulled the plug and told everyone their job was at risk if they did any more with that engine. So, there were several blocks and other parts that were still in a design and test loop. It's possible some of them got out the door too, so it's very difficult to determine a real total. I'm sure some of them were probably left there then scrapped when they turned the lights out.

I know of 6 that exist today. In the heyday of '63 when they appeared on Nascar tracks, Ford complained and Nascar forced Chevy to give 2 of them to Ford, but I don't know who got them, or if they've ever turned up. Once the higher-ups in Chevy put a ban on racing activity, the engines were to be returned. I'm guessing that's what happened to most of them, but a few got squirreled away...

Dick Keinath was an engineer ahead of his time then. He had ideas to further test the combustion efficiency of each cylinder by analyzing the exhaust gas, but that technology wasn't invented yet. He had planned on compensating deficiencies by either changing individual port design or with variable cam timing for each cylinder or by variable spark timing (which also was not invented yet). He went on to head the team that developed the MKIV, which we all know turned out pretty good! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

Verne

[Dog427435]

Verne

From what I've read Holman Moody were the ones who filed a protest and made NASCAR stick to the no experimental engine rule. Engines had to be available to the public, and NASCAR made Chevrolet sell two of those engines to Ford. These two engines were picked up at Smokey's by Holman Moody.
Bubba Farr had a '63 with a 409 in it, and he said "If you're giving Holman Moody two of 'em, I ought to get one." They let him have an engine, but after the race, they took it back. Holman Moody never returned their engines.
There were four 427's in the Daytona 500 - Johnny Rutherford driving for Smokey, Junior Johnson driving for Ray Fox, Rex White and Bubba Farr.
Rex White had been testing the new engine at the Proving Grounds in Mesa since late '62 and had accumulated several blown engines and many parts which he brought to Daytona. Chevrolet didn't usually let their test cars out of the Proving Grounds, but the car that Smokey ran was actually the test car from Mesa that White had built. Smokey's relationship with Bunkie Knudsen got it out the back door.
Rex White continued to run his 427 through the Memorial Day World 600 at Charlotte, then abandoned it due to a lack of parts. They had to reuse everything, including head gaskets! I don't know how long Smokey or Ray Fox ran theirs.

Glenn

[Verne_Frantz]

Yes, now that you remind me, all that is in Smokey's 3 volume book set. Interesting reading... http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif He was pretty Pi--ed that he had to let 2 of them go to F--D!!!

Verne
PS: J. Johnson was the last to run one until the spares ran out. Water pumps were a big reason for a lot of DNFs. And valve train breakage was also a big problem. It's funny when you look back.....the valve train was also the main weak link on all the early MKIVs. Those push rods just didn't like going sideways! (not to mention weak rockers)

[ORIGLS6]

[ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I try to adhere to that too. I've thrown things away that I've had for 25 years, thinking there's no reason to save it anymore.......then 2 weeks later something comes up and I need it!!!

Oh well............. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif So what did we learn? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[SS427]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I try to adhere to that too. I've thrown things away that I've had for 25 years, thinking there's no reason to save it anymore.......then 2 weeks later something comes up and I need it!!!

Oh well............. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif So what did we learn? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[/ QUOTE ]



I know that I learned that when I get to help Cumby clean his garage and basement only God knows what kinds of neat things we are going to find because he has practiced this all his life. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Rick

[PeteLeathersac]

Your pics are always truly amazing dog!.

I seem to recall somewhere in the past reading that Ford or HM sold one or both the engines back when spares where so hard to get...anyone else remember this and is it BS maybe even started by Ford?.

I was looking earlier today on eBay at a supposed Mystery motor intake..type 'O' casting and all.. Cool piece if real and he notes he has induction system parts too...can't say I care for some of the other stuff he deals in though!.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/63-chevy-...sspagenameZWDVW (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/63-chevy-427-Z11-mystery-motor-intake-manifold-KEINATH_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ36474QQihZ015QQ itemZ250112772079QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW)

~ Pete
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[1967Z28]

[ QUOTE ]
[b]Junior Johnson's factory backed "Mystery Engine" Chevy

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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69028.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

That's G.C. Spencer in the second Ray Fox prepared Impala behind Junior Johnson. In all, there were five Mystery Motor Impalas in the '63 Daytona 500. Thanks again for posting these pics, Dog. They are awesome.

-Jon

[Verne_Frantz]

Pete, I have one of those intakes too, but in better condition, and with the oil splash shield. I tried to sell mine some time ago with no luck. Very, very limited market.... The casting date on mine is 1-15-63, just before Daytona http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j320/VerneFrantz/bottomw.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j320/VerneFrantz/tOPVIEW.jpg

Note: This is not an ad!!

Verne

[Paul D]

A friend of mine who owns a complete Mystery Motor told me that the exhaust port configuration (geometry) is close to identicle to the current Z06 engine. Pretty amazing.
Paul

[Dog427435]

[b] Found a bunch of stuff
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Daytona - 1963 - don't you just love the parking lots!!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69046.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69044.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69045.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69043.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69048.jpg
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THE MYSTERY MOTOR
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69049.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69050.jpg
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[Dog427435]

[b] Smokey's new driver Johnny Rutherford
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img253.jpg

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[Dog427435]

[b] Ray Fox / Junior Johnson move on from Chevrolet
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img250.jpg

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[Dog427435]

[b] Rex White's 409 car
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/img254.jpg

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[Dog427435]

The Clements
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69047.jpg
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What's wrong with this picture??

[PeteLeathersac]

Great pics as usual Dog...is the what's wrong picture the fact that it's the '64 Mercury in the photo and not one of our beloved Chevys?.

Love the six lug hubs/wheels on the '62!.

Nice gas price...30.9 a gallon!.

And very cool the 'Mystery' intake Verne...is it a used piece? http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif.

~ Pete
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

[Dog427435]

[ QUOTE ]
Great pics as usual Dog...is the what's wrong picture the fact that it's the '64 Mercury in the photo and not one of our beloved Chevys?.



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That's it!!

[Verne_Frantz]

Pete,
The intake I have shows signs of being bolted to an engine, but I can find no evidence that it ever had water in it.

Verne

[Dog427435]

[b] Shot of Ray Fox's shop


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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day62002.jpg
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[427TJ]

[ QUOTE ]
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Day69045.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Note that the black '63 box-top Galaxie has 427 wheel covers! FE birds on the front fenders too.

[427TJ]

Check the price of gas at far right: 30.9 cents!

[Xplantdad]

Bill...they misplaced the decimal! It's supposed to be 3.09! LOL http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Dog427435]

[b] Couple more Race Shops
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Holman Moody
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/nf002.jpg
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Bud Moore Engineering
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/nf003.jpg
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[C1SS396]

Here's a few shot's of a Mystery Engine i took at Smokey's Garage Sale just after he passed away..The BellHousing read (Adios Chevelle Curtiss Turner Feb 1967 BeachRace and Atlanata 67 ).Check out the lower part of the housing ..It had a tri power intake and a TI tach drive Dist and Alum heads ...

This one thing i should have bought ..DOH !!!!

But JIM and i did buy a ton i mean a ton of good stuff ..

[C1SS396]

one more

[Dog427435]

WOW!!!! Do you remember what it went for?

What was that other gold engine to the right?

[Verne_Frantz]

C1SS,
I don't think those photos are of a "Mystery Motor". First of all, those motors were not sanctioned to race in anything in '67. Chevy never made a 3x2 intake for one (although Smokey could have made anything). There were no aluminum heads or water pump ever noted for that engine. I've never heard of a set of 4-tube headers made for that engine. Nascar required factory exhaust manifolds in '63. IF you look closely at the front of the intake, it doesn't have the same shape as the mystery motor. (scroll up and look at the shape of the intake I posted and compare) It all looks like a MK-IV to me.
Just my opinion.
http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gifVerne

[C1SS396]

The big sheet of paper attached to the front of the motor "claimed" it to be a Mystery Motor. Take it up with Smokey when you get to the other side .... These are just some cool shots of real race history.

[Verne_Frantz]

Yes, anything that was in Smokey's shop is and was a treat in racing history. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j320/VerneFrantz/63Mystery427.jpg

[Dog427435]

[b] Back in the early sixties when NASCAR was still in its infancy there were no big promoters
except for the France family. The race results were not published in any of our local papers
and forget about television or radio coverage.
But it was different back then - if you wrote away to your favorite driver, or garage,
or even NASCAR - someone would almost always respond.
My Mom and I had a scrapbook, and we wrote away to everyone.
Hell, even
"THE BEST DAMN GARAGE IN TOWN" took the time to reply and gave us a new lead to boot!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa012.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa018.jpg
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NASCAR would send you shots of your favorite drivers
Joe Weatherly & Fireball Roberts were my favorites!
How could you not cheer for a driver named Fireball?
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa017.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa016.jpg
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[Dog427435]

[b] If you wrote to the tracks they would send you anything from flyers to bumper stickers
to rule books!
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That's a bright yellow bumper sticker - sorry it would not scan well.
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa019.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa023.jpg
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(The bumper sticker was too large for the scanner!)
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[Dog427435]

[b] Drivers took the time to personally respond to cards and picture requests -
Note Lee & Richard's autographs on the front!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa020.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa028.jpg
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Buck & a young Buddy Baker
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa025.jpg
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Fred Lorenzen responding to a get well card after a bad accident
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa029-1.jpg
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[Dog427435]

[b] Newsprint coverage was very limited in NY, we had The Illustrated Speedway News but it was mostly local stuff. (Though I did see a NASCAR GN race at Islip in '64- All the cars barely fit on the track - Richard Petty won)
You had to subscribe to the NASCAR Newsletter to get all the scoop!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa014.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa026.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa027.jpg
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Check it out - Ned Jarrett won $1100 for winning the race at Old Dominion Speedway - A lap ahead of everyone else!!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa015.jpg
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[Verne_Frantz]

DAMN Glenn..........You're blowing me away!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif
You saved EVERYTHING!!!!! http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif

Verne

[427TJ]

Great stuff!

Ironically, Fireball Roberts was badly burned in a 1964 crash and died of pneumonia in the hospital several weeks later.

Joe Weatherly died at Riverside in 1964 when his Merc slid hard into the wall and his head actually hit the wall. From this crash came the window nets we see today.

[Dog427435]

Earnhart was my all time favorite - see what happens when I root for you!

[Dog427435]

[b] Couple old articles relating to the 500
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa047.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa045.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa046.jpg
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[Vettefinderjim]

On June 1-3, at the WINE COUNTRY CLASSIC at Infinion Raceway, Vic Edelbrock showed off his new HOLLY FARM POLTRY 63 CHEVROLET. Do you suppose it is the old Fireball car??

[Verne_Frantz]

Up until a year ago there were 2 clones known to exist. Junior himself owns one. I think it's been established that the original car no longer exists. I'm not sure where the car you saw came from. It could be Junior's or Floyd's or a new one.

Verne

[Racefan]

Off topic, but there are two of the NASCAR Superbirds left in existance. One is in the Petty museum, the other belonged to a relative of mine (and driver), Ramo Stott, until a few years ago. A collector in Ohio (I believe) now owns the car. Original engine-- VERY complete car. I have some video of it running that I can send someone if interested. Send me a PM.

[Dog427435]

The one in the Petty Museum -
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa053.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa052.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/aa054.jpg
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[mopar_steve]

The Petty Museum Superbird is not an original Nascar Superbird. It was never even used in competition. It's a clone that was put together by the Petty's in the very late 70's out of spare parts they had lying around because Richard thought he should have one since he thought then that they were a piece of history.

There is a real Petty Superbird that is the only survivor out of the 2 he had that year in the hands of a collector in Virginia. It's supposedly unrestored and the guy built a special room in his house especially for the car. The same guy also has the 1984 Pontiac "200th Win" car.

[Dog427435]

[b] Starting line up for the "500" and a couple articles on those bad Chevy's!
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/a028-1.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/a024-1.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/a027-1.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/a026-1.jpg
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[YenkoYS-199Stinger]

Mopar Steve,

I thought the Petty "200th win" car is in The Smithsonian. At least when I was there in the late 80's it was shown as the real thing and not a clone for display purposes.

http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/object.cfm?key=35&objkey=127

------------------------
Chris
1966 Yenko Stinger YS-070
1967 Yenko Stinger YS-199
Southeast of Disorder

[Z-11GUY]

Great photos, just amazing history on these cars. Did you ever see the Bubba (Marion) Farr 1963 car as well? I know out of the 5 1963 mystery motor cars that qualified his was by far the slowest due to 427 reliablity issues. As I recollect the only 1963 427 Chevrolet that finished had been Smokey Yunick/Johnny Rutherford who placed 9th place at Daytona. I'm sure he would of won had it not been for that back stretch wipe out on turn #2. I think AJ Foyt ran the car afterwards briefly for Smokey. I recollect Rex White having head gasket/cooling issues with his '63 as well, and Junior's waterpump went out as well. I'm not sure what happened to teammate GC Spencer's car nor Bubba Farr's either during the 1963 Daytona 500, great photos again, thanks.

[Verne_Frantz]

Raj,
This is from a friend of mine who is a NASCAR historian:

Rex White is shown as finishing 14th at Daytona and still running. Smokey's car is shown: 3/17 driven by AJ on at Atlanta--- not finishing (Trans)......6/2 driven by Banjo Matthews at Charlotte---not finishing (diff.).....7/4 driven by A.J at Daytona firecracker 400---not finishing (engine).......9/2 driven by Buck Baker at Darlington--- finishing 10th........ 10/3 driven by Bobby Isaac at Charlotte not finishing (crash). There may be others I missed. Rex White switched to Mercury at least by 7/4.
The G.C Spencer/Ray Fox car is listed as out (engine) and the Bubba Farr/W M Harrison out (fuel pump).

Verne http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

[Dog427435]

[b] Came across this article in the May 1963 issue of Hot Rod
Check out the Prestolite battery

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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp519.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp520.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp521.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp522.jpg
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[Dog427435]

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp523.jpg
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http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t114/dog427435/Super%20Chevy/photos/Imp524.jpg
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[Verne_Frantz]

One of my favorite issues Dog! Thanks for posting. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif

Verne http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif