70 l89 NOVA?
 

I found a 70 402 4 bolt today and the engine code is CKP when i reserched it it said 396 L89 400 turbo an the VIN is 10Wxxxxx..W being willow run..i thought only Novas where built there...is that right?..so i assumed it was from a 70 Nova..or could it be something else?

looking around, they say there are no documented L89 Novas known to exist..yes i saw the one that just sold..but there seems to be a lot of doubt its real...so..whatta i do with it?..the car is gone, so are the heads and the carb...i know where the heads are..i saw them on another car the guy owns...and arent for sale..ever he said..and i shrugged it off as no big deal, but with the car gone..and the heads unavail..its just a L78..whats opinions...or..is it so much more than just an L78???..

i really looked tyhe VIN and stamp over and looks authentic..large engine code..small font VIN..i believe its an authentic stamp..

please dont pound me with PMs on it..i dont own it yet..if i cant use it i will pass the lead on...i'm not to that point..and dont want to deal with all that right now..

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

pics please

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

i will, but i have to close the deal first..it aint cheap...i will see the cat tomorrow and see what i can do..its been rebuilt and luckily, they never decked it...

i originally wanted it for my chevelle project, but had no idea what it was

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Interesting to say the least.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

If the deck stamp is legit, the heads don't matter. You can always buy a date correct set of aluminum heads for the engine. We have seen a couple of supposed real L89 1970 Novas...can't recall ever hearing of just the engine block.

Good luck.

-wilma

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

I'd like to see this to put to rest never made em claim

70 l89 NOVA?
 

'

Cool news and if stamping genuine, hope it leads to more conclusive info.
Does 'car is gone' mean MIA or known as absolutely destroyed?
And did the current block owner have the whole car at one time too?
Do you know what head #'s they are or can you find out?

Best may be run the Vin through NCRS and try to backtrack the car and/or more info on it.
Long shot but an NCRS result w/ Canadian dealer would be awesome and build info available would sure put an end to the built or not mystery!
Looking forward to seeing the stamping pics also where this thread goes from here!
[img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif[/img]
~ Pete

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

What ever happened to this &quot;documented&quot; L89 from Legendary Motorcar?
http://www.legendarymotorcar.com/inv...va-ss-847.aspx

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Sold at Russo-Steele following 'tent damage' to a collector in AZ...then I believe it went to Florida. Haven't seen anything on it lately...But, I'm sure it will surface for air again at some point [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif[/img]

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

first thing..i dont want a circus or mess here..i just found a block with a curious stamp that i want to find out what it is and if its real...it was a fluke i got to see it, and found out its for sale......most of the time these take a bad turn, and i dont want that..i dont need the grief...

i am working on it today...guy that has it is a buddy..and could care less about codes etc...just wants to sell..i had already made the decision to buy..just need to work on a price we both can live with..to him, its just a L78 he bought for the heads..now, after sleeping on it...its a mission..lol

car is gone is all he said, i felt like he was saying scrapped decades ago..i will ask more...but i am just playing by ear...and not pushing...

the heads are on the property on another engine that needed them..i can see them. touch them etc...i will have him pull the covers so i can get dates and numbers if i buy..he may already have pics...because he showed me dozens with the pan off etc......

i will post some pics etc when i can, and get the story on the car..i want to get back there and look at the stamp again..and bringing a broach buster...but i really gotta say, i think its a legit stamp...like i said..even if i cant make the deal..i will pass it along to someone that needs it...or at least bring it to light..

crazy..its not the first rare block i found here in KC..icluding an MQ block and 2 MOs..that will never move from their spots till the owner passes...i guess i found at 6 high horse 427s too, trying to go by memory...all un-buyable...lol

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Cool find Mark,

The dates on the heads are on the undersides of the intake runners so they can be seen simply by removing the valve covers. The heads would be cool to have but are available. The block is the truely rare piece.

Jason

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Keep us updated &amp; share pictures..And for the sake of the obvious,make sure it isn't really CKO,CKQ or CKR.
casting dates can be in various places,but as Jason said,easily seen.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

i called him and he told me they where close chambered heads and where 11.7 to 1 on the motor they came off of, i asked a few more questions about head numbers etc..and he said he would pull a cover etc if i was truly interested..i told him i wanted to know the dates etc to find another set..and he laffed and said ok, and couldnt remember the casting, but did say they where late 69 date, but couldnt remember the exact month.......he knows its an L89 coded motor..he volunteered that..but has no idea the VIN diriv is Nova and honestly could care less he wanted the heads and a few other pieces and had plans to turn it the whole time......

i will be there this evening..i'm pretty sure its CPK..because i used the acronym KCP as in Kansas City Police...to remember the code....my memory is soo bad the older i get....i was curioius because ive never heard of it.....i didnt take pics etc, because it was &quot;just an L78&quot;and wasnt real thrilled about it, but that code is what led me to research it further...., now the rest is just waiting it out

its an L78 i know that for sure...we will see on the rest..i'm so excited i cant really work today..lol

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Oooops, I meant to say can't be seen by simply removing the valve covers. Dates are on the underside of aluminum heads.

Jason

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

thanks Jason..that means i'll never see the dates..they are bolted on a 427 and i will never see them..this week he will pull the valve covers and shoot a pic of the part numbers *edit* HE SENT ME A PIC AND THEY ARE 842s

well i got pics of everything..i have questions..

its an early motor or at least i think it is..i'm no BBC guy..it has a 163 intake...and i thought all 70s had the flat 3963569 intake...or was there a change over period?? ..i just dont i know..the intake is in the date range to be &quot;date correct&quot; and thats confusing to me..anyway..i want to look around and digest what i found out today.....but good or bad..real or not i will post some pics...

theres no definitive proof the original car it came from still survives..its been in a 70 SS car for a long time..was freshened and was removed for a wicked 572 crate motor..the deal all came together because my buddy wanted the alum heads....and the deal just worked out for both guys...more tomorrow

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

No change over period.All 1970 BB solids did have the #569 intake..Someone removed it and installed a #163 later on.
I would STRONGLY suggest you trying to obtain those early 1970 dated #842 heads if this engine block is indeed from that block &amp; from a 1970 L89 Nova.
Their dates are key.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

will never happen..i will never get the heads..ever

here we go..until i figure out if the car is still in existence i wiped out the last of VIN and water marked them...and i do have a a line of ownership on the motor 3 people back now, so i will start working on it...but i fear its going to be a dead end..

SO WHAT DO THE EXPERTS THINK..AUTHENTIC STAMPS?..
http://i396.photobucket.com/albums/p...psb5t3hfnz.jpg
http://i396.photobucket.com/albums/p...psyklter0f.jpg
http://i396.photobucket.com/albums/p...psfnrndzch.jpg
http://i396.photobucket.com/albums/p...psjzhzkpzy.jpg
http://i396.photobucket.com/albums/p...pswspyx0co.jpg

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Wow. Pretty cool. The W in the VIN stamp looks a little off to me, but I'm not a Nova expert by any means.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Wow, Looks good. Never say never on the heads.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

I'm not an expert but I don't like it.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

the W matches all Willow Run BB Nova VINs that i can find that are posted online..

august 1st cast date...thats early...lol..if the stamp is right..it was machined 7 days later...

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

I believe you on the W...like I said I'm no expert.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

i'm with ya..the W was weird to me too..ya aint no spring chicken ya been around, i value your opinion

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

FWIW, It's not the &quot;W&quot; that bothers me.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Black, whats the concern? id like to hear all opinions...open communication here..if its not legit..i want to know...i value your opinion

if you dont want to be specific..is it the engine code or VIN? i am by no means an expert..i am an observer...or PM me..i get it

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Would a real early car have a VIN derivative of 10W181xxx?
I am more versed in Camaro engine stampings but I dont like the &quot;broach marks&quot;.
Looks like they were made up by someone using coarse grit sandpaper.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scuncio</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Wow. Pretty cool. The W in the VIN stamp looks a little off to me, but I'm not a Nova expert by any means. </div></div>

The &quot;peak&quot; on the W looks a bit low compared to others I have seen including my 69 L78.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Is it me or do the broach marks look a little funny? I can't decide if they are original or not. See the original L78 Nova block stamp I had about 10 years ago.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y86...6/DSCN4491.jpg

Paul

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jonesy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would a real early car have a VIN derivative of 10W181xxx?
I am more versed in Camaro engine stampings but I dont like the &quot;broach marks&quot;.
Looks like they were made up by someone using coarse grit sandpaper. </div></div>
Great question Jonesy, but I became aware of these type oddities/ discrepancies when this similar engine came up for sale on eBay. http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=14633.0
This may explain how a late vin can be assigned to and early assembled engine

Not real crazy about broach lines either.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1969L78Nova</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The &quot;peak&quot; on the W looks a bit low compared to others I have seen including my 69 L78. </div></div>

I agree. The peak in the W is too low.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

The 1970 production of the Nova started with VIN 100001...so this VIN would represent the number 81,000 car in the production sequence. The assembly date on the engine is 'early'...based on my assessment. Eg; our 1970 4 spd L78 has a cowl tag date of 12C...engine assembled 11/25...about a month prior to the build. Our VIN is 210xxx, so it is later than this unit by approx. 30,000 cars. We would need some other reference points from fall of 69 Novas to narrow down an exact time frame, but it could be done with fairly good accuracy.

It would be reasonable to expect that the 854 blocks were cast and the initial supply of engines assembled prior to the 70 model year really taking off. Also, the early date of the block could be perceived to support the idea that there were some early production aluminum head motors [like the Chevelle] and then the option was cancelled [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img]

Someone suggested running an NCRS or Canadian docs on the VIN...that would really help narrow down the ship date and see how that ties into the other facts...provided the data is a available.

The L89 Nova may be the 'Bigfoot' of the car hobby...clues occasionally surface and folks get excited. Having an actual block to examine is certainly a plus...I'm sure there are enough experts here that can confirm if the broach marks/stampings are legit. I have additional L78 examples that can be used for comparison if needed.

Stay tuned..

-wilma

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Logically, what would be the chances that someone would restamp a block and then let it sit around a machine shop for years without it going into a car?

Verne [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img]

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

I had a Red '70 SS advertised here last year with a vin of W149859 and a build date on the cowl tag of 10A.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

For it to be a True 70 L89 it would have to be a very early assembly which it is. It probably sat around until someone ordered it hence the later VIN.
Would be nice if it turned out to be real.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

If we take my 10A 149859 vin and Toms 12C 210xxx vin I'm guessing it would be from a 11B or 11C car by doing the math. I don't want to be a downer but I'm still skeptical on the pad stamp being original. Maybe that would explain the car being gone. It never existed, at least in L89 form.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Does the assembly date and stamp match any of the Chevelle L89 info that may be available...?? That might help dial it in a little better since these motors were probably made in one batch with the CKP in Tonowanda and then ended up at the assembly plant for the final install.

-wilma

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

Never mind.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

c'mon Lynn....whats on your mind..i want to hear everyones opinion...good or bad..

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does the assembly date and stamp match any of the Chevelle L89 info that may be available...??</div></div>

The only real 70 L89 Chevelle that I know of was assembled 11/13/69 and is coded CKT. The Tonawanda stamp is different than the one shown here as far as some of the fonts. I do not have the engine assembly date handy at the moment.

Re: 70 l89 NOVA?
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Verne_Frantz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Logically, what would be the chances that someone would restamp a block and then let it sit around a machine shop for years without it going into a car?

Verne [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img] </div></div>

My thoughts as well. It's not like there's a fresh resto 70 nova this is going into, and it seems the heads from it are on some other car and aren't even for sale... I take it the guy who owns this block has no idea the numbers on it are even anything special or the only one anyone's ever seen. I don't know what to look for, but this sure doesn't sound like a scenario for a block to have been restamped. Heck, there isn't even a car for it to go into.