1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

I'm looking at buying a 70 L-78 Camaro from a friend who has had the car for 10 -20 years. It has been in his garage ever since he bought it and he calls it in rough condition. I've seen much worse in fact my 70 Z started in worse condition before the resto.

I've gone through all the numbers and date codes match (M-21 trans with vin, dist, alt, heads, rear, exhaust manifolds, intake, water pump, intake and starter. It even has the COPO 3 peice spoiler.

My question is the engine block has a CKO code. From what I've researched so far the L-78's with a manual trans were coded with a CJH. I see that CKO is for a 396 with mt but doesn't specify a L-78. Would they have used the CKO block for a L-78? I haven't been able to find the vin on the block yet.

He is pulling all the documentation that he has for the car and he states that he has the POP but no build sheet. I hope to see the documentation soon and see what is there.

Also, any recommendations on what esle I should look for?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

CKO is the correct code for the 402/375HP Man. Trans. L-78.
What's the Prefix & date stamp on the Pass. side Rearend axle tube?
Please share pix of every single possible piece of documentaion with us,as well as the Cowl tag info.
We are here to help.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Here are the pics I have so far. I don't have a pic of the cowl tag yet but here is the info.

ST 70 12487 NOR270003BDY
TR 723 45 G PNT
04C L78

Yes, it is triple green.

Thanks for the help.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Another pic

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

and the engine. The original exhaust manifolds come with the car.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Does he have the Dual Snorkle Air Cleaner for it?
Make sure the Ex.Manifolds have A.I.R. provisions.
What red Line is the Tach,if so equipped?
NICE CAR!

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

He didn't mention it and I didn't see it laying around. I do have an extra one that I got when I was buying parts for my 70 Z. Also it has the correct carb.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

The axle has a COX code and a date of 0410G1. It is a locking 3:55

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

That's the proper rear.
Can you find out the casting date & casting no. of that CKO block please.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

The block casting is 3969854 and the date is J-18-9. The date seems early so that was going to be my next question.

Thanks again.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

That is early,but not impossible as these cars were built very late,and most likely the blocks were just sitting waiting for the cars awhile.
What's the Tonawanda build date before the CKO code on the Pad behind the Alternator?
Is the VIN# stamped there,or is it down by the Oil filter?
Do you see an external Oil cooler provision above the Oil filter Mount to indicate a 4-bolt block?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/pad3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/Tach.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/Vin1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/Vin2.jpg

Chuck S

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Thanks. I'm going back and I'll get pictures.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Good luck!

Also a couple of quick questions of mine (great input guys):

I just hopped to 2gcog to double check my info on that block stamping and am now wondering if there were 2 possible stamps for the block? Are both CKO and CJK valid for the '70 Camaro?

Also, I was going to suggest that he look for the lack of a return fuel line to the tank (Holley VS Rochester). The Rochester equipped cars had return/vapor lines going back to the tank correct?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/Air1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...0Misc/aps3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...Carlisle2j.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...arlisle2jb.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...c/Cleaner2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...Misc/Clip1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...c/IM000122.jpg

My Current L-78 (NOT pictured, also Classic Copper) will be using above style air cleaner........

Chuck

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Man, I am wondering how that L-78 402 can breathe through those tiny snorkels. An open element air cleaner could free up a lot of power on these engines.

At least the LT-1 350 has larger openings to draw air from. Anyone have any performance specs or road test data from the 70 L-78 Camaro. With the low rise intake and restrictive air cleaner, I would think it would be slower than the LT-1 powered Z-28.

Paul
69 Camaro SS L-78 M-21
70 Camaro Z-28 M-40

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Looks like a super find and certainly rare being 1 of 600. I still own one of these and have owned three. Is the three piece rear spoiler original to the car?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Chuck, thanks for posting the info on the air cleaner. I didn't realize it was different than the Z28 air cleaner. I'll be sure to ask the current owner if he has it.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

From my understanding the 3 peice spoiler is original to the car. Again, I have not seen the docs yet. The history as I understand it is: This car was special ordered for a customer in triple green with the spoiler. When the car arrived the person who ordered thought it was to ugly and refused delivery. The car then sat on the lot until it was sold sometime in '71.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

I would do what you can to obtain it,within reason.
Don't balk or underestimate it.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Rick, Thanks for all of your help. I am planning on going to see it again this weekend and hopefully buy it. If the price is too high I will let everyone here know and see if someone else wants it.

Also, the car in the background of one of the pictures is a 70 Chevelle LS6 with original motor. I did not go through the numbers on it since I am only interested in the L-78 Camaro.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

You Have mail...

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Rear picture appears to show bumper guards W/O VF-3 Rubber Strips. If this is PLAIN chrome bumper with guards, that would be wrong, UNLESS we have uncovered another detail on COPO spoilers (Phil B please respond) I also see what appear to be RARE Original Chrome tip tailpipes, which were on all SS cars.
Can anybody else SEE what appears to be a quite SHINY Black Taillight panel.....which helps to demonstrate how most people have this detail TOO flat........

Chuck S

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...panelBlack.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...VF-3Bumper.jpg

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

I think that a better phrase would be 'tangs' or 'fangs' as the early VF-3 seem to me to be urethane "guards".

The post above the pics kind of lost me a bit.

I the initial pics posted (granted I didn't blow them up at all) of nrjulin, I didn't see any real tell-tale signs of the early VF-3 option. The "tangs", "fangs" are there but can you really see the tell-tale signs of the 'early' VF-3 guards there? I trust you 1st and foremost Chuck https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif but I'm not seeing it...so far from the pics.

Why would the VF-3 guards be wrong if it were after the rubber bumper guards were discontinued? I've been a 2nd gen "hound" since I was a kid but only recently has the VF-3 option caught my radar...weird.

Also..I've been thinking for the last few months about putting together a web based '70 Camaro L-78 registry (just because I have a passion for them, the server space and the time...and 600 cars can't be that much work right? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/wink.gif

-Mark H.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Mark, I think the only way to get rear bumper guards was to order a Z28 (standard equipment) or order the VF3 option on any camaro. The VF3 option included the rear guards.

Chuck, are the rear bumper pics shown above your car?
John

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

Fhakya,
rpo VF3 is the rubber strips AND the guards.
Regular guards only (rear)(with no rubber) are not VF3, and are apparently "only" a part of rpo Z-28, with no separate rpo.
So if you ordered rpo VF3 you got the guards along with the rubber strips.
If you ordered rpo Z-28 you got the guards but no strips.
If you ordered rpo Z-28 AND VF3 you got the guards and the strips.
The ONLY (apparently) other way a non Z-28 and non VF3 car could have these guards were as a dealer installed part.

A lot of people confuse VF3 with standard Z-28 guards.
standard Z-28 bumper guards are not rpo VF3.
Mark.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

I blew up the original picture (much higher resolution) that I have and I can see the urethane strip. I plan on going to pick the car up next weekend since the owner is out of town this weekend. If all goes well, I'll be the proud owner of this 70 L-78.

Again, thanks to everybody's (Rick and Chuick espacially) help and input in verifying this 70 L-78 Camaro. I know thier help will be incredilbly valuable when I start the restoration.

Once I have the car in my possesion, I will be happy to share any information gathered from it.

NRJ

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro CKO block
 

That's great news NRJ! I'm not going to jinx until you have it in your possession.

Great clarification Mark (70CitrusZ)....that was what I was kind of assuming but never had it backed up (no pun intended).

I've seen a few SS's w/ the tangs/fangs but just assumed that they were part a the later VF-3 (non Z) option or possible retrofit. I have not seen any 72,73's w/ them that I can recall and was wondering if that was still an option in those years. The strip wasn't as per my understanding...even in 71.

It's probably more of a topic for 2gcog but interesting nontheless and applicable here.

Great thread!

-Mark H.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Well it has been a while since I updated this post but the good news it I finally have the car in my possession.

It is remarkably complete. It only has 22,810 miles on it and has all the original and correctly date coded parts that one could ask for: CKO Engine with VIN, M-21 with VIN, 3:55 COX rear, L-78 Tach, dist, alt, heads, rear, exhaust manifolds, smog system, intake, water pump, intake and starter. Even the original exhaust is still there. Also, The interior looks very good other than being very dirty and a ripped drivers seat. All the sheet metal is very solid but there has been some surface rust in the usual areas that was preped and primed and original vinyl top was ripped off and primed.

To correct an earlier post, this was not a 3 piece spoiler car originally. That was added by the second owner but I was given the original one peice spoiler with the original dealer name plate still attached. It was sold out of John Smith Chevrolet in Atlanta GA.

To my surprise the POP, original sales invoice, warranty transfer paperwork and receipt to the second owner all came with the car. I will be the fourth owner. The First owner only owned the car for about 8 months, Second owner until 1988 when the last owner bought it and parked in in his garage. Also, I was given a ton of NOS parts the last owner collected in the 80's when he planned on restoring the car. I still have alot of boxes to go through but I did find the original L-78 air cleaner and a NOS L-78 air cleaner still in the original parts box.

Now for the fun of restoring the car.

Thanks again to everyone who helped me verify the info for this car.

One more thing, He still has a few more incredible cars that he is considering selling. 1970 Chevelle LS-6, 1970 Buick GS and 2 442 W-30's. He collected these in the 80's with the hope of restoring them but has not yet. He did collect alot of NOS parts to get ready for the restorations but...

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Nils, very cool. Congrats on the new purchase. PLease keep us updated as things progress https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Well done.
Can you grace us with pictures of the car itself,as well as everything you got with it on the side?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Here is a copy of the Sales Invoice and Warranty Transfer docs.

Note the original sale date of 7/14/71. It shows how long it sat on the lot. The story goes that it was special ordered for a cutomer (Green Mist, Green Vinyl top and Green interior as well as other options) and when it arrived the Customer thought it was ugly and refused delivery.

The warranty transfer was done on 4/11/72 so the original owner did not keep it long. Also, the funny thing is it says the original Protect O Plate is attached but I have it. I'm not sure how it worked back then or why it remained with the car.

I have some research to do in finding the 1st and 2nd owners and I will try to contact the Dealership (John Smith Chevrolet) and see if they still have anything on the car. It looks like they are still in business but may have moved locations.

I'll post some pics soon.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Here is a pic of the trim tag.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

That's a cool project, nice to see more 2nd gens getting attention.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Nils my L78 sat on the lot unsold until 8-71. Nobody could get or afford insurance on the Car; Well that and the
$5000 Price tag. The owner of the Dealership finally had to put a Stop to all of the “Test Pilots”… LV the original
Owner Finally had the Smarts to put the car in his Wife’s name so he could get the car insured. The salesman
still remembers my car well 35 years later and they sold a bunch Muscle Cars back in the day. I talked to the
original owner and salesman for hours listening to the stories about my L78. I wish I could have recorded it somehow.

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Pictures of Mark L's "Kentucky Gold" (Camaro Gold) 70 L-78 from several years ago, just prior to Mark buying car.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ics/AirCln.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...20pics/Int.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...pics/Right.jpg

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

OK, My pictures aren't posting. Anyone want to post them for me?

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Email them to me [email protected] and I'll post them for you

Re: 1970 L-78 Camaro
 

Congrats on the car purchase..


[ QUOTE ]
and a NOS L-78 air cleaner still in the original parts box.



[/ QUOTE ] https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif