COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I was at the Mecum auction yesterday and was very suprised at the COPO prices. The Canadian doc (Whitfield)Hugger orange car sold for $170 plus commision. The ALS give away car sold for $80 plus com...The E-bay hugger orange car bid to $125 no sale...The Yellow 1969 Chevelle Canadian COPO sold for $150 plus com... Looks like the market is changing???

Thanks Doug

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

It seemed to me like the market was very strong on no excuse, well documented, top restoration cars. If any of those elements were off, an approprite discount was reflected. The one COPO exception was the ALS give away car. Despite the fact that it was originally a green/green car, changed to black, and, needing to be redone to be a top shelf car, 85K with fees was still a bargain, IMO. That was one where several people were caught either napping, or, out of the building. I also think nobody thought it was going to be let go for that money. A friend of mine bought it, and, was offered 125, I believe, shortly after it left the ring. The seller told him that he expected a little more, but heck, he won it, so, it was all free money in his mind.

The Pontiac collection of Randy Williams brought extremely strong money. The six cars brought almost 1.9 million with fees, if my math is right. The Yankee Peddler sold for 750K, so, it seemed like the old drag cars are keeping their momentum. All in all, I thought it was a strong lead in to the January sales, so, doomsayers should look at the strong cars, not, those that may have fallen through the cracks. That happens at every auction.

The results for Sunday might show how the more "average" cars are trending, but, it seemed like they were going to do pretty well also. Hopefully, someone who was there today will post some results later.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I thought the buying crowd was much bigger and was more enthusiastic as compared to Mecum Spring..
We stayed for hours and saw many top notch restos.
Both sides are starting to step up,both with an attention to detail and with their wallets.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Sorry, Did not mean to sound like a "doomsayer". It was meant as question.I should of asked if the market was changing or just if it was the cars that were there. Only trying to figure out what the fair prices are on COPO's.

Thanks Doug

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I think that Mikes reponse is dead on! I personally watch the 67 Corvette and L88 market very closely and maybe to the casual observer the market might seem to be changing but in my estimation the market is getting more selective and cars with excuses will not bring the money that a no excuse papered car will bring.
Regards,

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Whats interesting is that when a car brings less than what people think it should,everyone jumps on the bandwagon and says the market is soft etc and believes that AUCTION price is gospel for those particular cars , yet when a car brings twice what it should everyone makes up excuses why the price wasnt a true indicator of market value and it was a once in a million sale. If you think a no sale price of 120K on a copo at Mecum is market value, you also have to go with the 1.3M ls6 convert and the 245K z28 prices as market value too.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Chuck, which Z28 brought a bid of $245K? The giveaway COPO shouldn't be looked at too closely regarding market value. The winner had nothing to lose no matter what it sold for.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I believe he is talking about the green Z28 at Barrett-Jackson with the 8% fee.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Yes, the green z28 at BJ last year with 11K? miles on it.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

The bottom line, like it or not, is that the muscle car market is off. IMO the market is off about ten percent on high priced/value cars and about thirty percent on lower priced/value cars.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

My opinion is the market is better right now. Before there was a frenzy with prices jumping 20% each time a car changed hands. Now it seems to have leveled off with the iffy edgy cars not bringing good money like they were . The top cars still seem to bring top money.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

The stock market is moving higher.
Speculator/Investors are off working other things.
This muscle car hobby is going to turn back to real "car guys".

The very rare, and desirable cars will stay high $$, but average stuff is going to fall dramatically.
1990 all over again, just watch....... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/scholar.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I agree. Just because the housing market is off, that doesnt mean waterfront in Malibu is down ,just because the price of a
condo in Detroit is.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Does this mean resto prices are coming down too???

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

[ QUOTE ]
I agree. Just because the housing market is off, that doesnt mean waterfront in Malibu is down ,just because the price of a
condo in Detroit is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dammit...time to sell the condo in Detroit https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/tongue.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Just a thought....the stock market was very strong in the 3rd quarter and usually collectables go the opposite direction or plateau in a strong equities market.

I think it's major different from 1990 when most transaction were between brokers, and when "the music stopped" the bottom fell out. That's a lot different from today where prices may be taking a breather after two or three years of strong appreciation.

I was also at Mecum, and felt that prices were pretty strong for great cars.... especially race cars as witnessed by the Super Duty Pontiacs that were exceptionally strong. Corvettes were definitely weak, and I just wish that I would have been a bidder on a few of the COPO's.... especially the Yellow Turbo 400 Chevelle. That is one impressive car, and $150k plus commission is awfully light! Is it still for sale?

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

IMO...Pontiac muscle is good at auction primarily due to the factory documentation provided for the cars by GM. People know what they are buying. I agree for documented cars current market is still good and strong.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Just got back from a three day Mecum extravaganza.Green 69 camaro copo auto ran too late in the day on saturday and stalled at 120000. Owner was fit to be tied! Had a 175000 reserve.
Hemi superbird with low miles sold for 400000.00!!!!!!!!!
69 ram iv judge was a no sale at 120000.69 trans am in driver cond. sold for 95000.I was there trying to buy a mid year vette for a friend and thought they were strong.Some of the documentation looked very suspicious! Too many cars available in one weekend....low 50% rate of sale on friday and saturday.Too many copo's,midyearBB a/c auto cars and too many 69 camaro's to choose from.Mustangs seemed very reasonable.....resto cost was more than the sale price on many.Good cars were not cheap.Actually,they were strong in a fall market with lots of availability.Nickey camaro was sooooo cool!!!!! sold at 150000? Did any hemi cudas get put together?

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Does this mean resto prices are coming down too???

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely not. They will continue to increase ( labor and parts ) unless there is a very unlikely major downturn in the economy and disposible income really dries up.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I sure hope not as it is tough to make it now. It always kills me when we (restorers) get beat up for our shop rates which in most cases are at least half what it costs to bring your car into a dealership to have a repair made. While that car is at the dealership it depreciated while at the same time a restored car actually appreciates while in the shop. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif Most dealer mechanics make (personally) as much or close to what restoration shops charge as a shop rate. I won't complain as I have been doing it for over 25 years and it hasn't changed but I does frustrate me on occassion.
Rick

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Bruno, Did you get any pictures of the Nickey Camaro? What year was it? No excuse cars will ALWAYS bring good money. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I was at Mecum all weekend and prices on lower end stuff seem extremely strong!! Every plain jane 1967 and 1968 Camaro there brought around 20k or more! These are cars you would see on ebay for 12k to 15k just average cars. 1966 and 1967 Chevelle SS's are EXTREMELY hot property all of those got bid way up even if it wasnt #s matching. Boss 302's were bringing good money for just average cars.

One thing I noticed was very very in experinced buyers people paying the moon for a nothing car or one that you could build for half the price of what they paid. Example 1969 Camaro half breed ZL1 clone. Nice looking car with a Alum. 427 but it had tri power 4 wheels disc and 17inch wheels, chrome hood hinges etc.. nothing like a real ZL1 and nothing like a Pro Touring car it was a 50k to 60k car tops! bidding got up to I believe 105k and the car sold! my jaw was on the ground and there were a few cars like this.. 69 Camaro Convert very nice car but a 350 car fancy wheels but again no expensive pro touring type of parts..was sold for around 75k.. 1970 LS6 said to be a real car with buildsheet and numbers matching.. so I went up to look at it, the build sheet was "some how missing the corner with the vin" it had one of the worst restamp job's Ive seen still had small block springs the front end was about dragging on the ground, poor quality definately needed a resto. and people still bid it up into the low 60's.

Now on the COPOs.. Im still kicking myself in the A** for letting my wife talk me into going out to dinner when the Black Copo went through. A friend later that night told me it sold for 84k well he had a few to many drinks so I figured he didnt know what he was talking about. Sunday comes and the black copo is leaving the auction so I stop the guy and ask hime what he paid..sure enough he says 84k my heart sank!!! I offered him 30k profit on the spot but he wasnt interested.. he got the winning loto ticket of the sale, everyone was sleeping or out to DINNER on that car.

As for the rest of the COPO Camaros the only one that really surprised me was the Canadian built Orange one that car looked very nice I thought forsure that car would bring over 200k easy.. I dont know the car so maybe Im missing something??

The other Orange car was also nice but it didnt have Ed's papers and it also wasnt in his registy. I think most people know or beleive it to be a real COPO but LIKE Ed or NOT his DOC's are what most buyers want including me "his name is what most guys think of when you hear the word copo just like mopar has Galen" . I think that will be a very hard car to get good money out of with out original paper work or Ed's stamp of approval unless it goes to a REAL collector that plans on keeping the car forever.

The green car from Legendary didnt do anything for me personally I didnt think the quality was there on that car and being an auto?? Just my opinion though..

Silver RS Auto COPO EX. Silva car. I think that car has been discussed here before. bid to 150k seller should have taken the money and ran enough said.

both Chevelles were bid to around 150k. Georges car was bought back buy the owner and the Orange 4 speed car didnt sell.

I thought that was pretty good money for the Chevelles consider the Orange car has been on Ebay more time than it is years old!! and Georges car although that car is KILLER nice I think the Auto hurts it and Mecum definately doesnt have the crazy crazy bidders like Barrett.

One think I did notice is high end Mopars are SOFT!!

Just my general over view of the auction.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

1969 Nickey did 150k very very cool car.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

The '69 Z28 was sold at Nickey, but, that DOES NOT make it a "Nickey Camaro", IMO. It is, no doubt, a very cool car, but, unless it was converted at Nickey, it is just that, a very cool Z28 sold at Nickey. The premium that it brought over an equal quality Z sold elsewhere seemed just about right to me.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Before you lament too much about missing the 84K Copo you have to remember that if you and the winning bidder were bidding on it you have no idea where the other bidder would have stopped.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

anybody see what the blue 70 w30 ragtop and green cutlass w31 sold for?

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

1 other car that I thought sold cheap was the Dark Blue 67' Z that was suppose to be all original and had real low miles.. To me that car was very very cool I love untouched cars and this looked the part. It sold for 85k I almost threw in a bid at the last second but didnt know the car.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

P.S. I didnt see the blue w30 rag top go across the block but I talked to someone that said the guy wanted $450k for it??

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I want to correct myself from a post a few up.. There were some record sales on a few Mopars at the sale and on average most were strong. I just thought a few 1970 and 1971 Cuda's would have brought alittle more money.

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

[ QUOTE ]
P.S. I didnt see the blue w30 rag top go across the block but I talked to someone that said the guy wanted $450k for it??

[/ QUOTE ] He said that he was offered 360K for it a few weeks ago but was only bid to 175K

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

recently there was a 1968 "corvette bronze" Yenko camaro on the Legendary Motorcars website for sale....
.....SOLD
and also a Yellow 1969 Yenko Chevelle for sale
.....SOLD
......I think there are serveral cars that sell "under the radar" that not everyone hears about....especially if they are "low mile originals"
......or the more sought after colors.
.....I think the documented cars will keep climbing.
...the "clones" on the other hand...are just nice "drivers"
.. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/flag.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

That guy is CRAZY for not taking $360K with NO W-30 Paperwork.Notebook was cool with NO W-30 written anywhere.
Possible real car but without that on the buildsheet.No Thanks not enough pedigree for that kind of coin.
Even the invoice didnt have the breakdown of options https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif

I called this auction: The Good,The Bad and The ugly !!

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I also think the time of year, and elections around the corner, play a role in the prices, I worked on the gice away copo, and it needed to be restored, the car was black emron when we started and to make things quick we left it black, it was a green car in and out, but numbers did match,I would have bought it for the 85.000 with no worries of the market,

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Wasn't there a '70 silver LS6 El Camino there? If so, does anybody know if it was real and how much it sold for?

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

anyone see the light blue 1970 chevelle CONVERTIBLE
go thru?
...what did it bring?
....I think that was Ed & Carolyn Bellflower's old car
.... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

That's a nice car.
That Astro Blue 70 L-34 Chevelle cnvt. was my Friend Georges old car.Meaning he found it a U-store it here in the burbs 4 years ago.It came from the factory code 45 Mist Green,with no stripes and no Flapper hood,but with nearly every conceiveable creature comfort.
It was ordered new here by a man in late 1969 for his daughter to drive to college.She grew up and away,and left it here.The father drove it awhile,then stored it.I remember the sub zero day George found it and called me.I had to see it.He found two buildsheets for it and did a complete meticulous resto on it in his garage.
George restores camaros here and taylors to Midwest Car Exchange,among others.This was his first chevelle.He repainted it code 25 Astro blue,and striped the hood and deck added working Cowl Induction.
He had a new trim tag made to reflect the Astro blue paint code,yet the buildsheet clearly shows different.I know..I know..
He won Gold spinner at VetteFest with us in November 2004.
It sold for 130K,which is very near what he sold it to Fred in Pa. about 12 months ago.
Wait till you see the Black 1969 Camaro L-78 SS Convert. he is restoring right now..

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

I think you mean L89...

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Oh Boy..Here we go the other way now.
(in light of the other thread)
You're right. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

Can I have it ?

Re: COPO prices down at Mecum???
 

After me ya hump!