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As far as the shill bidding, I'm a car dealer by trade. I go to wholesale auctions weekly. Shill bidding is as common as a cup of bad coffee.It happens on , I'd bet 70% of all cars thru a wholesale auction. If the seller won't sell the car under, say, $10,000 , the auctioneer runs the car there [$9900] with or without a 'real' bidder. Next 'real' bid buys the car. [these are NOT 'no reserve' auctions..]
Yeah if I was the buyer I'd be pissed off Reggie was a seemingly obvious shill for the owner...but that's the way auctions are. It can be a really lousy place to buy a car...wholesale or retail.
I personally wouldn't get NEAR a collector car at an auction without superior knowledge about a car...
Maybe the buyer knew exactly what he was doing...he paid the premium to be on TV.
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Shill bidding is part of the sellers agreement at Russo Steele Reserve Auction as explained by Drew last Feb:
"Advancement of Bidding: RS retains the right to advance the bidding up to, but not in excess of, the Reserve, as agent for the Seller. RS further reserves the right, at its sole discretion, to Sell the Vehicle at a high bid price less than that price identified as the “Reserve Price,” provided that RS nets the Seller the specified reserve amount less all-applicable sales commissions and fees.
This clause is clearly stated in Russo and Steele’s Consignment Agreement under section 8, d.
Drew Alcazar"
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Mecum and others have the same type of language in their contracts, allowing the owner of a car bid on their own vehicle up to the reserve.
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I don't see the harm in this, it's not going to sell if it fails to meet reserve, and it takes a real buyer (willing to pay what he bids) to get it past reserve. You might have a willing buyer sitting at $25,000 below reserve, nobody to bid against him, who is also willing to pay the reserve price? You wouldn't have a sale if they didn't push the bid to the reserve. If the guy at $25K below is not willing to pay the reserve price then it doesn't sell. Tell me who gets hurt?
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To me it artificially inflates the price a real bidder is willing to spend and what the real market price of the car(not what the seller wants). If I'm at an auction I don't want to bid against myself. If a car doesn't legitimately meet reserve then possibly something could be negotiated by both buyer& seller once it is off the block.
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I see your point and yes, a deal may occur after the auction but the way I see it, you bid on a car with a cieling number in your head regarding how much you are willing to pay. If someone does that, it really doesn't matter if it was shilled up or not.
Besides, do we really believe that these auctions are what truly determines the value of these cars?
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I think BJ has zero to do with setting the prices of cars. People may think that but it's only about bringing in more than you spend, same for all us. It's fun to get together, see all the cars, shoot the breeze, do some charity work - that work's really well for the seller - talk about a super inflated tax deduction. It's a business that has to be about selling other owners cars to other people, period. We can bash, talk, whatever, at the end of the day it is what it is.
This is the most knowledgable place to be, seriously.