Nice car, but so much wrong

Seems strange to me, after so many years of being in this hobby that, groups of people form clubs for the benefit of the hobby and to build relationships, then after a time, begin to start grinding away at each other, picking apart car restorarations, particularly non-professional budget-minded efforts. Case-in-point is a Nova currently on Ebay. Members, please, for the sake of this great hobby of ours, please consider that not every car that comes before your viewing pleasure is a 100,000 dollar plus car, such as those going across Barrett-Jackson's block. Some of us, myself, for sure, are reaching down deep, to pull at the least, a sub 50,000 dollar car, most likely a lot lower, out onto the show field. I love cars,I like relationships, but I do Not enjoy making someone feel like they haven't done their best on their project. Maybe there are a lot of pros on this board, I am not doubting this, I just get the impression the site is not at its best when people get caught up in kocking others. I knew Tom Clary before he had a Yenko. I was around when he began planning a club. I would like to think his intent for the site is and will continue to be as he originally intended. Too much negativity, even when phrased as, helpful criticism, just feels wrong to me. I welcome a reply from Tom Clary. Thanks.

[YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY]

I've learned a lot from the helpful criticism, both on my car and on others! I think the issue is when the owner who just dug deep to restore a sub-$50k car attempts to sell it on par with the 1000 point car. Also, it's hard to tell if the seller restored the car by pouring every effort and dime into it, or just tossed a pretty paint job on a bunch of ginsu stuff to make a quick buck. If a seller wants the big bucks for the car, then the car will go under the scope. Rarely does an accurately priced car get critiqued the same way, especially when it's also accurately described.

[Jeff H]

I agree with Marlin. The criticism is the only way you will know that you've got some details wrong. And when people try to sell a car for big money, it needs to be as close to 100% correct to deserve the big money. But a lot of times it's potential buyers that are asking for more knowledgable people to look at a car for them and let them know which items are incorrect. If you're referring to a car that you have that you know isn't 100% correct and you have no intention of selling, then yes, it can get annoying when people critique it when you aren't asking for help. But again, cars for sale should be represented correctly or else they are open to criticism from potential buyers.

[LVCamaro]

Resto Light, or Resto Right...either way, enjoy your car! How you like your car is what matters, until "sale day". On sale day, suit up with your best flack jacket cuz eBay invites scrutiny akin to nitpicking and bordering bashing. In thin skin situations, hire a broker to market your car...otherwise be ready to sack-it-up and take the rainbow of comments that will surely follow your "for sale" announcement.

Who's Tom Clary?

SS

[firstgenaddict]

I agree, If you want the top dollar for your car and have restored it using suspension parts from Autozone vs NOS parts then you have opened yourself up for all of the nitpicking from everyone out there. If you are willing to acknowledge that there is a diparity between the two and price accordingly then there will be much less nitpicking when you are up front with the presentation and marketing of the car in the beginning.

[Canucklehead]

I guess it all depends on who your target buyers are. If you want top dollor than be prepared to be put through the wringer. If your trying to sell a car thats not quite right and your not expecting top dollor than your going to target "it is what it is".

[MYSTERYCHEVELLE]

Put me down for one that Calls em like I sees em.. WHEN THEY ARE FOR SALE....I like to think that for everyone who replies to such a post, there are many more who just use the information as a SPONGE and are getting that Free Education. I don't think anyone wants to intentionally HURT somebody's feelings when they point out an incorrect restoration item.. but if not said, it perpetuates the problem and the next guy makes the same mistake b/c he saw that other car that had it... and FWIW.. I have seen many HIGH DOLLAR so called professional restorations with mistakes ... things that would not take much research to have been made right.

Of course it all depends on how the add is written.. if it is obviously a driver, no need to point out restoration correct items, but if Marketed as a Numbers Matching, Frame Off, Nut and Bolt, Yada Yada rare car... put on the Vest!

I have no problem with it, as long as said car is FOR SALE, be it on Ebay, here, at Team Chevelle, an auction or at a car show... I wouldn't expect anyone to critique anyone's car in an open forum if it was not for sale though.

Mike

[fpcopo]

I know I'm gonna get killed for this but it has bothered me for a long time so here goes. My opinion and maybe only mine is that Baldwin Motion cars are junk. They are nowhere near as rare or desirable as any COPO. They were a standard RPO Chevy that was delivered to a speed shop and make no mistake not a shop that had any special connection to Chevrolet or any other manufacturer but just a speed shop not unlike the one in your town. When I started my business restoring cars in 1991, the first car we restored was a "Phase III" '71 Camaro. This car was a 7,100 mile unmolested car when we got it. I was shocked at the way Motion hacked and cobbled the installation of any thing they did. This car had the Hone overdrive and when the owner previous to the one we were restoring the car for first put slicks on it and hammered it, the overdrive even though not engaged, suffered lathed gears. This unit was so under engineered it could have never held up to the LS6 engine in the car. There were many other things wrong. Even though the engine had never been worked on, when it was disassembled it had one open chamber and one closed chamber head. I wonder who the genius was that did that?When Motion installed the fibre glass hood there was no place to attach the windshield squirters so they just let them dangle down the firewall on the hoses. Also people like to say how fast Joel Rosen's cars went. Why did he only run AHRA and not NHRA? Because he could never go fast enough to meet the standard of performance in NHRA's classes. The only guys from Motion that really ran well to my knowledge were Dennis Ferrara and Bill Mitchell and Mitchell did it with Volkswagens! Also a car that was not delivered by Baldwin and sent to Motion as a new car should not be considered a Baldwin Motion car. If it was purchased at another dealer and sent to Motion for mods later it should be considered just another speed shop hacked car and priced accordingly. This should also go for cars sent to Yenko, Harrell or any other speed shop after they were used. I just do not think a car purchased at another dealer and sent to Yenko for mods is anything other than a plain old modified car. I know I will probably get death threats for this but it is MY OPINION and I will stand behind it. the reason I bring this up is, the value of these cars is getting so high that I feel we need to keep it honest and not assign high prices or Godlike status to non COPO cars. Frank

[fpcopo]

Andy, I don't know you and wasn't picking on your car. I am voicing my opinion because I want to make sure Supercars remain the elite group they are. I am not bashing any ones car in particular and everything I wrote pertained to what I had seen on two of the cars I personally worked on. I don't want any one to think I am trying to stir up trouble or trying upset the web masters. I enjoy this site and all who are on it. This is America and we are all free to voice our views good bad or otherwise. Thanks, Frank

[ANDY M]

Frank, no offense taken! I was addressing the Forum, and since I generally refer to my Camaro as a "beater", which in my opinion it is, I happen to agree with what you said.
I love cars, and hope that I never lose the passion, but if I do, I'll get over it and move on.
I may not take my love of these cars as seriously as some folks do, but I can still relate to their passion, even if I don't quite share it on the same level. I just hope they can do the same for everybody else.
Peace, Love and Freedom.
Andy