Honesty in auctions.

[Lynn]

What Stefano said.

This one still boils my blood.

https://www.yenko.net/forum/showthre...124851&page=11

124379N690139. Fake L-89 car that had all fake docs. They went so far as to create an ownership history under the name of Kenneth Wright in Florida. Kenneth had died a few years before they put it together. IIRC, the car was run through Georgia, where they don't title antiques, then paperwork presented in Florida. Then all the fake docs were created.

I gave all the evidence I had on that one to a law enforcement in CA, where the car may have been stolen. I never heard back. It included synopsis of my conversation with Kenneth Wright's executor who had known him since he was a kid. He never owned a Camaro, let alone a 10 10 L89 Camaro.

This was the worst case of car fraud I had ever seen. It sold at Mecum in 2014 for $200k.

No idea where it is now; but someone sure got screwed over.

[southernfriedcj]

Originally Posted by Lynn

IIRC, the car was run through Georgia, where they don't title antiques, then paperwork presented in Florida.

Just to set the record straight, Georgia does "title antiques".

If an old vehicle has a title it will be issued a new title if registered in Georgia.

If an old vehicle does not have a title, it will only be issued a registration slip when registered in Georgia.

If an old vehicle is on record as registered in Georgia without a title and then someone wants to register it in Georgia with a title(such as selling it to someone in Alabama, they title the vehicle there and then sell it to someone in Georgia with a title), it will not be issued a Georgia title.

I currently own a dozen or so titled and non titled vehicles in Georgia.

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by southernfriedcj

Just to set the record straight, Georgia does "title antiques".

If an old vehicle has a title it will be issued a new title if registered in Georgia.

If an old vehicle does not have a title, it will only be issued a registration slip when registered in Georgia.

If an old vehicle is on record as registered in Georgia without a title and then someone wants to register it in Georgia with a title(such as selling it to someone in Alabama, they title the vehicle there and then sell it to someone in Georgia with a title), it will not be issued a Georgia title.

I currently own a dozen or so titled and non titled vehicles in Georgia.

Thanks for setting me straight. Wasn't certain of the exact procedure, but do know there was some funny business in the title history.

[AnthonyS]

^ gah!

[the427king]

Uneducated buyers have no problem paying twice the market value of a real car for a FAKE car, yet uneducated AND educated buyers dont want to pay market value for a REAL car.

[SBR]

Originally Posted by the427king

Uneducated buyers have no problem paying twice the market value of a real car for a FAKE car, yet uneducated AND educated buyers dont want to pay market value for a REAL car.

Sad but oh so true!

[EZ Nova]

Originally Posted by the427king

Uneducated buyers have no problem paying twice the market value of a real car for a FAKE car, yet uneducated AND educated buyers dont want to pay market value for a REAL car.

But who's to actually say what market VALUE is? This happened a couple years ago when the '69 Z28's were starting to go for LESS then what most thought they should due to market value? Was it 2019 this happened. I personally don't think the value of a '69 Z is where it is either, so I don't think about buying for me. Just my thoughts and opinion.

I revert back to the Bullet Mustang. Sold for 3.74 Million, yet almost 1/2 of the guys here thought it would go more.

There is always the VERY deep pocket guys that will pay crazy just because then can. I personally know of a guy who has done that a number times, and not just with cars. He "gave" my friend $250K more for a quoted construction job. He said he likes to help good people out.

[CamaroNOS]

It is funny we are talking about a Canadian cars again. And yes because of all the GM of Canada documentation that is available, cars do get "made out of thin air" up here which is so sad. There was a time when people trusted Cdn. cars, not so much anymore.

And to boot, there are dirt bags up here that made a lot of $$$ recreating "dead, recycled" high dollar cars.

Fortunately, at least here in Ontario we can buy a Sellers Package from the provincial government and it clearly shows all the previous registered owners. And with a little bit of work (tougher now with cell phones), you can track down these previous owners and ask them all the pertinent questions needed to validate a vehicle. I do it all the time.

My point is, every car has to have a history. This applies to cars sold in the U.S., Canada and anywhere. And if there is zero history available, I would think VERY hard about running for the hills

So do your due diligence prior to an auction or wherever you may be looking at buying an expensive vehicle. Take Rick Nelsons very wise advice, protect yourself and hire an expert. If you are going to spend $75,000 - $????, try not to cut corners of an inspection fee which proportionally might only be 2% - 4% (I am guessing) of the total value. Think of what the value of your report would be to the next potential buyer when it comes time for you to sell it?


Paul

[Pusher_Man]

Originally Posted by CamaroNOS

It is funny we are talking about a Canadian cars again. And yes because of all the GM of Canada documentation that is available, cars do get "made out of thin air" up here which is so sad. There was a time when people trusted Cdn. cars, not so much anymore.

And to boot, there are dirt bags up here that made a lot of $$$ recreating "dead, recycled" high dollar cars.

Fortunately, at least here in Ontario we can buy a Sellers Package from the provincial government and it clearly shows all the previous registered owners. And with a little bit of work (tougher now with cell phones), you can track down these previous owners and ask them all the pertinent questions needed to validate a vehicle. I do it all the time.

My point is, every car has to have a history. This applies to cars sold in the U.S., Canada and anywhere. And if there is zero history available, I would think VERY hard about running for the hills

So do your due diligence prior to an auction or wherever you may be looking at buying an expensive vehicle. Take Rick Nelsons very wise advice, protect yourself and hire an expert. If you are going to spend $75,000 - $????, try not to cut corners of an inspection fee which proportionally might only be 2% - 4% (I am guessing) of the total value. Think of what the value of your report would be to the next potential buyer when it comes time for you to sell it?


Paul

I agree about the unfortunate reality of Canadian cars raising eyebrows of suspicion. I used to hear Canadian docs were the best but now see that isn’t the case and it can be a red flag. I nearly bought a super rare (if it had been real) 69 Chevelle at auction that I found out later was 100% made up from the Canadian docs. Praise Jesus I was outbid by a guy with deep pockets that later found out it was a sham. I won’t point the car out but it was talked about on this site as a fraud a few years ago.

But, we figured out through the grapevine that the seller was making up big money cars from the Canadian docs for years, which is terrible. I like having money but obviously not enough to lie, steal, and potentially burn in Hell forever for it for a few years.

[Wakepowell]

Originally Posted by Pusher_Man

I agree about the unfortunate reality of Canadian cars raising eyebrows of suspicion. I used to hear Canadian docs were the best but now see that isn’t the case and it can be a red flag. I nearly bought a super rare (if it had been real) 69 Chevelle at auction that I found out later was 100% made up from the Canadian docs. Praise Jesus I was outbid by a guy with deep pockets that later found out it was a sham. I won’t point the car out but it was talked about on this site as a fraud a few years ago.

But, we figured out through the grapevine that the seller was making up big money cars from the Canadian docs for years, which is terrible. I like having money but obviously not enough to lie, steal, and potentially burn in Hell forever for it for a few years.

So I can better understand and be informed. For a Canadian car to be created from available documentation, someone would have to create a VIN and Trim Tag correct. The VIN tag creation would be a criminal offense right?