1970 gto judge ram air IV

[Steve_Hoog]

Jeff car X does not have any codes what so ever stamped on the engine, I'm not sure about the Tin Indian. The motor is partially disassembled in the bay, after some sort of failure during a pass. Best I recall, that is what I was told about it blowing. I have seen the motor myself, it has the passenger head pulled along with the header which are in the trunk.

It is my belief that the "memo" is an invoicing note reflecting or noting being pulled from the aisle and taken to engineering. I feel will all the SD coverage, some one could probably verify that.

I think Bill Knafel's statement on the car to be factual.

I think there was or still is an engineering log at GM, that may hold the pin point proof. Obtaining that information is my goal, and I am working on it.

I thought with the attention this board was drawing on the car, some one might step up to the plate and help in the search. Trying to get this information from GM is NOT easy. The emissions concern several have brought up I might understand why, but you would have to think a statute of limitations would have expired by now. GM does hold some of it's documentation from the public, it's been hard to decide if that is the case or we just haven't found a person that will put out the extra effort.

The reason I am so adamant about this.... I do believe the car is real, and I would like to correct the myth. Also, now I believe the Tin Indian is a significant counter part thanks to this board disscussion.

Because of this car I have become acquainted with some people that I hope to see at the Nats in Joplin next summer, and wouldn't that be something if both of the cars could be there too?

[Jeff H]

Regarding the emissions issue, if you search here on the site you will find a discussion about GM paperwork where they were trying to get the L72 certified in the Camaro for 68 to possibly be a COPO. I would imagine Pontiac would need to do the same thing. If GM certified the ZL1 for the Camaro and Corvette, I would think they tried to do it with the RA V as well. But proving a particular engine was put into a car at the factory, it would need documentation and accompanying codes or VIN. Even the dealer transplant cars(Motion, etc.) had the engines marked and documented. Like it was said earlier, it will be just as hard to prove it is a RA V as it will be to prove it isn't.

[JoeC]

Have the trim tags been thoroughly analyzed? Sometimes codes will emerge by comparing a library of trim tags.

[Steve_Hoog]

Alright lets do this.......... imagine yourself at the theatre for a movie, Fast n Furious type soundtrack and cinemaphotography....

Opens with a some loud music, thumping, and a blurry shot from the camera of the past, say 1973, maybe even in gray shades, from the rear a GTO running down the track, as the motor blows before the finish line the camera spins off to his garage as he tears down the motor, then shows him coughing and implies his death, now jump ahead almost 30 years, the widow decides to sell the car and you see Astock in 1999 on his cell phone describing the car to a potential buyer, flash ahead a couple of years to the current owner allowing me to be one of the few to ever see the car in recent time, then a shot of me later at my desk doing research and fighting with people over a car they say didn't exist as the camera the fades back in time to the early sixties when it all began, and the real focus of the movie begans as it tells the story of the efforts of all our heros who dreamed, engineered, and built what is our passion today, the muscle car, the story shows the rise to glory, and then the collapse of an era in the early 70's, and the last thing it shows is a behind closed doors assembly line removal of a few cars, a few GTO's, a last work of art from a team that knows the end is here, then you see this Judge being delivered to Knafel Pontiac on a dark dusty desolate day, the last shot is of the owner driving away from Knafel in the GTO just a short time before he dies.........

Would be a hell of a movie

[ssl78]

I was talking to a guy a couple of months ago who used to race SD Catalina's and probably raced one of the first pontiac funny cars back then. He said they had built 2 SD Grand Prix's one for him and one for his friend who was the general manager of a Pontiac dealer (He told me which one but I dont remember). He was saying they werent available back then but anything was possible if you had the right connections. He also said he still has all the original paperwork from when the car was new.

[Belair62]

Sixties I didn't say all the cars were aluminum...just that the SD was a package of stuff..to include aluminum too..I found it interesting that there was no difference in price whether you wanted aluminum or steel sheet metal...Steved put the RA V on a par with SD cars and I disagree with that..if indeed a couple came out the back door they would be in a whole different league...And if anyone could get them out the back door it would be Royal or Knafel ! BTW I was only in 2nd grade when the 63 SD came out.

[Belair62]

SS L78....was that Larry S ? Sixties and I owned that funny car ! I talked to him one time but never heard from him again ! His old partner is still in the north suburbs...I have a nice pic but file is too big

[ssl78]

Yes thats who I am talking about Larry. He is back in town and I run into him every once in a while. I told him you guys owned his funny car but he would really like to know if his super Duty Catalina is still around.

[Steve_Hoog]

Jeff
I talked to the owner earlier about the block codes, and didn't relay that right. There is no VIN stamped. He promptly corrected me, and watch the following.... sent some pics.

[Steve_Hoog]

The owner has taken the motor out of the car since I saw it last, here is a pic of the front of the block where wanted me to show the broach marks. Along with the engine code.