69 Z28 No Sale E-Bay....

[Astock]

I would be surprised if more than 30% of real 1969 Z's have their original motors from the factory.I'm saying there is nothing from looking at this auction that would lead me to believe the car it self is a real Z-28.

[70 copo]

You are correct if your guess is based upon the current assumption that LOS cars and Norwood cars had identical VIN's by date, which in this case would make the car a very early 69 car (August 68) and of course then most everything could be wrong -even the cowl hood. There is only one problem with this theory on VIN dating it is also currently believed that only 25% of total camaro production originated from Los Angeles, so using the Norwood template- concurrent VIN to date ratio could be skewed by up to 75% error using this assumption.

Assuming the car is August 69 build - then the engine is correctly cast. Has anyone/organization conclusively made heads or tails of Los Angeles month to Vin/production yet? I agree with JBB on at least a title search prior to purchace unless you happen to be a wizard with numbers, Broach marks, and identifying a restamped parts. The Re-stamps that I have looked at over the years are pretty obvious.

[70 copo]

I do not know Frank personally but lots of the old timers tell tales about him. Local Legend here.

[Astock]

The vins are not identical.

[Mark_C]

LA and Norwood VINs are not identical by date they are sequential by assembly plant. That is, there is (or could be) a 9L512345 and a 9N512345, of course one could be a 6 cylinder convertible and the other could be an L89 coupe. Also LA stopped building cars in April of 69 due to a GM strike at the Van Nuys plant. They came back on line in June to finish roughly 1000 cars that were actually on the line when the strike hit. There are no build dates later than 05A from LA in 1969.

This car is an early build, with a bunch of incorrect parts, at least the engine, rear axle and cowl induction hood which wasn't available until the first week of January of 69 (Yes the first ZL1 built during the last week of December 1968 has a cowl hood, but that isn't exactly a production car). Does this mean it is or isn't a Z28, I don't know but someone would have to prove it to me if they wanted my money.

[70 copo]

Mark,

The cuncurrent Vin Theory was first put forward by John Grinnnel in a book from 2003 titled "Standard Catalog of Camaro". Build sequence info is accepted from multiple sources and makes complete sence.

Great info you provided! Just a few questions: Can it be verified from GM Records? Who currently has this data? Is it from an official source? If not who compiled it?

Sorry - Just a couple more questions: (assuming that there were all 1000 cars on the line when the strike occurred) and lets say that the VIN's and trim Tags were all attached at the time of the strike- and there were 1000 cars left to finish in June (when the strike ended) - then there must be a build date later than 05A-Right?? Assuming all other non Camaro line production was shut down and all remaining Camaros were built one after another right after the strike ended- How long do you think this process would take would this take? 1 Week Perhaps?

Assembly dates and component dates must be all over the range for these final cars then - correct?

Thanks

Phil

[Charley Lillard]

Maybe Kurt will chime in. CRG should have a good database.

[70 copo]

Charlie,

He is the Man...



Phil

[ssl78]

That is definetly a early car I just looked at my Cal car the vin is 504585 with a build date of 10c. I know that even before the X code came on the trim tags the X code was on the back seat divider in Nor built cars. Did the Los cars have the X codes there.

[Stefano]

John,
It appears that X codes were not used at the Van Nuys Plant in any way. I have never seen an X code on an LA car behind the back seat.