Barrett Jackson Las Vegas

[704EVER]

I hear all your points Les, however there are a lot of "IFs" that I'm sure a lot of people don't want known. A lot of people use other identities when buying on Ebay for one, the paper trail itself may be hard to follow. Are they really going to dig up a land fill or junkyard looking for the original shell? What if the builder was smart enough to remove any other hidden vin from the car in question? Where does that leave NICB? As far as Garys' story goes, I don't doubt it for one second, but proving who took it another step may be very hard. As I stated earlier, I think all the parties involved just want it to go away as fast as possible. Just my .02 on it

[Xplantdad]

[ QUOTE ]
Point taken, but has BJ ever done an unwind? Especially in a high profile case like this? I have no doubt they have the lawyers in place to do it, but has it ever happened? And what about the seller, Gary has "Officially retracted" his statement, so where does that place the seller in litigation wanting his due from BJ? I don't think law enforcement even comes into play now. He presented it, BJ promoted it, someone bought it, who pays? The way I see it is, after Gary retracted, it becomes a viable deal, someone bought the car and someone has to pay for it. I can't see the seller taking the car back and even remotely thinking about paying BJ 18% with Gary retracting, so where does it go from here? I know it's a mess and not right, but I also think that someone's coughing up the money to make it go away. Who has the most to lose here? My guess is BJ, that's all.

[/ QUOTE ]


BJ is just the vehicle to sell the car...that's all. They are in business to offer a place to sell a car...that's it...end of story.

The seller bears the responsibility for the claims made and the representations that he made about the car...whether true or not.

With the amount of pictures that are out on the internet on this particular car...or pieces of it...it makes no difference as to whether "Gary" retracted or not.

Buyers and sellers have to sign a contract with BJ and all of this stuff is outlined in the contract. So if they take the time to read the contract (which they should) they will realize thar BJ is free and clear. Should BJ act to rectify the situation? I think so...but it's their choice as to what to do. They know WAY more about this type of stuff than I do!

From what I know...deals have been unwound at quite a few auctions...including BJ.

Like a really wise man once told me....

"It is what it is".

[quick-bowtie]

Didnt the White ZL1 Reggie owned that sold for around 800k a couple years ago get un-done after they found out it wasnt the original motor? Pretty sure Ron bought that car too. Barrett can undo a deal if its not represented true and the seller pays both commisions.

[Mr70]

..as well as the Futureliner bus.
Ron was bidding on that too when that lady got head over heals with her significant others money awhile back.Only to go to commercial while Bj reset the hammer once they returned.
My point is,this is not unchartered water with the two of them & I'll bet Bj makes this right with Ron again.If he's smart he'll have them enforce a rule that makes Steve take off those ridiculous glasses during air time.

[Mark_C]

Theres at least 4 parties involved here. No. 1 - the buyer who really is only an interested party and had no part in how this problem came about, No. 2 - the restorer/rebuilder, No. 3 - the guy he bought the shell from with the VIN and tags already attached, and of course No. 4 - "Gary" who sold the tags and paper work in the first place. There may be others between people 3 and 4 as well. The tags were originally going to be sold in April of 2004 (don't actually know if they were or not, but I do know they were removed from the car along with a chunk of the cowl - the pictures verify this), and the (a) shell with those tags reappeared on Ebay in October of 2007, and the "most original ever" Z28 reappeared around June or July of this year at Carlise, and then at this auction. Obviously person number 3 (or maybe someone between him and "Gary") is the one who affixed the tags to the new shell.

The seller/restorer of this car might get off the hook because of that sequence of events, but he's going to be out a ton of money if law enforcement seizes the car.

You don't have to dig up anything to determine if the car has its original shell or not. Every stamped peice of sheetmetal on a camaro contains a plant code and a date code on it. For example the firewall body mount cage has at least 3 stamps on them consisting of a letter and 2 digit number indicating the week of the year it was stamped out. All you need to do is find a few and compare it to the build time of the car. If theres a big difference in dates then the parts of the shell don't belong with the tags.

[704EVER]

Again, I agree with what BJ is, just a platform for sellers and buyers. I would also agree that many a car has crossed the block at BJ, as less than advertised. What makes this case/car so special is who the buyer is. If anyone doesn't think special treatment won't be paid here by the house is probably where we disagree. I'm not condoning what happened here by any means, I'm just saying, I think this will all go away with everyone happy in a convenient way and we'll hear very little about it in the future. Bad press in these difficult economic times are not good for any business. Scottsdale is right around the corner. With the other auction houses gaining ground with a reserve auction venue and consignments on top notch cars being paramount, I can see BJ wanting this to go away. All I'm saying is that they are in a bad position here, and have a lot to lose, as far as the credibility of their consignments and reputation. This isn't about a 125K, this is about millions.

[camarojoe]

Just a guess, but I'd bet that a BUNCH of the street rods and custom cars that pass through BJ have VINs that aren't original to the actual car rolling across the block if anyone were actually to look into it.

[chevelleheart]

Not to change the topic but is there any more discussion's on the red LS6 Chevelle Convertible that went across the block on Sat night that Ron also purchased? Just curious?

[Bill Pritchard]

I have seen no other substantial discussion either here or on the Chevelle website. The Chevelle's issues pale in comparison to the Camaro, so it's probably nothing but an afterthought at this point.

[PeteLeathersac]

Regardless of who's going to take a fall here, BJ may not be all innocent even if they have written provisions in their auction agreements to escape legal problems?.
If failing to do their utmost to protect both buyers and sellers of cars that may have a shady history has been their choice, poor attendance and sales at future BJ auctions could result in a worse penalty...a financial one?.

Any auction house who has true concerns for their buyers and sellers should post Vins of upcoming cars w/ ample time ahead of the auction date to allow the collector car community to gather any relevant facts together and present them before the car crosses the block..
If any auction house chooses not to do this and/or heed any serious concerns raised before sale, that's their choice and they may have to live w/ the long term resulting financial losses if the facts come out after the sale?.

Obviously no one should condemn Jerry M. without his report being displayed..
He's not a stupid man and his concerns for this specific car also disclaimer for circumstances such as this on any car he inspects is most likey included in his report?.

If this case is as clear cut as Les Q. above seems to feel, it could be the beginning of many more to come?.
With plenty of similar situations sitting in garages all over the world there's no doubt lots of people sitting on the edge of their seats watching what unfolds here?.
Best of luck to any true innocents that get caught up in the crossfire!.


~ Pete