Million dollar camaro....

[Charley Lillard]

Another train wreck in the making. Please keep it a civil discussion but do keep it interesting.

[Jeff H]

I think it would be awesome if Jim M actually has some GM paperwork showing what really happened with this car. It's kind of like the 69 ZL1 with JL8 brakes that was at the Tech Center back in 69. If that car turns out to be a legit documented car it would be just as cool as this Z28 convertible.

[Stefano]

So who owns a "factory" crossram Z which had the set up installed on the assembly line

[Kurt S]

[ QUOTE ]
So who owns a "factory" crossram Z which had the set up installed on the assembly line

[/ QUOTE ]
Those are pretty common. Lot of 1982 Z's had them, not a great setup though.

[MotownMadman]

Kurt,
Pete Estes Z convert went down then line with standard rear drum brakes and standard Z-28 induction. It went from the end of the line to Chevrolet engineering before being issued to Pete and the crossram set up and JL8 brakes were installed immediatly with the correct hood. The car was then issued to Pete in that configuration which is how it remained for the several years he drove it on occassion. When the car was "officially" sold to a GM employee through a Chevy dealership in Detroit as a demo, it was first returned to GM engineering for ther speciality parts to be replaced with the standard RPO optioned equipment that was line installed. However, GM engineering had documented the addition and removal of the speciality equipment, those documents exist to this day as I have personally read them in a 6" thick binder of documentation that comes with the car. Al was so precise in the restoration process that he purchased a perfect car with the same production date within days, he removed the speciality RPO JL8 and cross ram set up to be re-installed on the rag top, everything is a perfect date code match right down to the rear end U bolts. This fine example of Chevrolet history now has a new owner of which I brokered the sale, I will leave it up to the new owner to make the announcement when he feels the time is right. Dont ask who or how much as I guard that type of personal information. Sorry Charlie, No train wreck here. With the owners permission I will post the GM engineering order for the addition and removal of the speciality items in the near future.
Motown

[Jeff H]

Thanks Motown, that's what a lot of us would love to see, some of the GM paperwork. Does it say whether Estes ordered the car himself or if Vince had it built for him? It's such a late 68 car that it almost seems like they were using it as a prototype to show off the JL8 and crossram parts in anticipation of the 69 model year. Interesting to hear that it did sell and I imagine it will be the centerpiece of an impressive collection.

[MotownMadman]

Jeff,
As the story was relayed to me the cross ram and JL8 were not on the car to showcase it to the public, but rather to get Pete to approve those additions on the Camaro. The design and engineering team decided the best way to get Pete to approve the project was to build one for him to test through driving the car with those options, the only glitch was Pete would very rarely drive anything but a convertible so therefore the only Z convertible was built with the special options installed to get Pete to drive the car, of which he approved of the set up and the rest is history. Since those options were not part of a actual factory build but rather an engineering model, if the car had been sold to the public when it was no longer of use there would have been liability/warranty issues so the options were removed by engineering. However, from the standpoint that the options were ordered to be installed on the car before it saw use, one could argue that they were a "Factory" build through tech, in some ways a technical COPO.
Motown

[olredalert]

Matt,

--------Congratulations on the sale! Im sure both parties benefitted from your help. And, since I havent had a chance to say so; welcome back, you were missed...........Bill S

[67ss350Camaro]

[ QUOTE ]
Al was so precise in the restoration process that he purchased a perfect car with the same production date within days, he removed the speciality RPO JL8 and cross ram set up to be re-installed on the rag top

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
the only Z convertible was built with the special options installed to get Pete to drive the car, of which he approved of the set up and the rest is history.

[/ QUOTE ]

How do these two statements make sense together?

[MotownMadman]

The cross ram and rear disc were parts that could be bought over the counter at that time for racing purposes(such as Trans Am), but could not be ordered as a RPO for a street vehicle. Even over the counter parts are date coded. The car he bought to use date coded parts from had been outfitted with those over the counter parts by the owner at the same time he took delivery on the car new, so the date codes were correct on the parts even though they too were not an assembly line part. The concept that I find humorous about the over the counter high performance parts available at that time for TA racing were designed and sold for one purpose only, Racing......this from an automaker who had withdrawn from the racing programs. Pete's rag top Z was an experiment in the feaseability of these hi performance add ons having the ability to function with some degree of normal operation in traffic conditions. The package passed the test and was then introduced as a dealer available RPO.
Thanks,
Motown