Fred Gibb Paper work

[sYc]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Xplantdad</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glenn...it must have been cool working around those two guys [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/cool.gif[/img]

It would have been neat to meet them.... [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif[/img] </div></div>


No doubt... [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[Kim_Howie]

William I am confused explain to how I am CHRONOLOGY wrong
and how and what NUMBERS are wrong.

I noticed you stated I quote BP &quot; left plenty of money on the table&quot; when BP sold # 3. Correct me if I am wrong, he sold the car for 250,00 and at that time the avg. ZL-1 was around 150,000.00. I about crapped that price it brought that much.
I thought Mr. L. was nuts , I guess he wasn't.

[Charley Lillard]

Howie you are wrong. I think I paid 150K for # 3. Maybe you are equally wrong about other facts ?

Glenn... I didn't know anyone was fighting. You are obviously a part of ZL1 history but once again I will state that Porterfield is who is the most recent guy to put ZL1's, Gibb and Harrell in the spotlight. You can call people opportunist's but it really doesn't change the part of history Porterfield has had in the ZL1 world.

[Kim_Howie]

Charley ,as I stated I heard that was the price. looks like I was wrong.


We all have our Heros.
Fred Gibb was and still is mine.
Bill is not.


I have made my point and I am done.

Thank You SYC

[William]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glenn Powell</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Mr. William: &quot;THERE IN THE BEGINNING&quot; Where were you in the beginning? Show me! Don't run your mouth talking about it, that's the easy way.
</div></div>

The '69 ZL-1 Camaro was not marketed by Chevrolet like the rest of their models. The cars were secret deals between Vince Piggins and a handful of special dealers. It was barely marketed by Fred Gibb; a few tiny ads in some of the pulp car mags back in the day. Few people knew about the cars; most of those who did couldn’t afford one. Gibb could not sell them and likely could not pay GMAC for them. Chevy had to take 37 of them back and force them on other performance dealerships. They could not sell them either, several were stolen. Dealers swapped out the engines to get rid of them. They never really dominated drag racing; Bill Jenkins ’69 PRO Camaro wasn’t one of the production run and ran a 430” Reynolds Can-Am block for much of the season. Early ZL-1 cylinder blocks and heads had structural weaknesses that led to problems in racing. The ’69 ZL-1 Camaro was largely a failure and was soon forgotten by the few people who knew about it.

Perhaps you didn’t see the other thread. As I stated had BP not bought #3 in 1981 and started digging for info, the story of the ZL-1 Camaro could have been lost forever. Vince Piggins notebooks would have probably gone into the trash when he retired. BP would not have contacted Fred Gibb and got his juices flowing. Fred may have eventually tossed the paperwork because there would have been no reason to keep any of it. Most of the cars would be unknown-just like ’69 ZL-1 Corvettes.

“In the beginning” is defined as August 1981 Super Chevy magazine; all 69 VINs were published. I was on the ground floor of the research with BP and Mr. C, who relentlessly chased the cars and rescued many. I had sources and also chased them. When I located one of them I asked BP for assistance. We spoke regularly, swapped info and helped each other. When BP completed the #1 restoration he thanked us by placing our names on the car. He repeated the gesture when Car Craft featured #1 in the Dec ’89 issue and again in John Hoopers’ 1969 Camaro Reference book. He mentioned our business in the excellent February ’95 Chevy Hi-Performance feature of a ZL-1 dyno test. #1 &amp; #3 have been featured numerous times in top automotive publications starting with Hot Rod March ’83 “Endangered Species: Stalking the Wild ZL-1 Camaro.” Automobile Quarterly recently did a ZL-1 feature and ran a large photo of BP launching #1 on the strip.

Sorry, I don’t have anything to “show” you. I have never owned one. All I did was experience the ZL-1 renaissance unfolding and develop from a forgotten part of Chevrolet history to where it is today, a muscle car legend. All I can do is “run my mouth” about who did what and virtually all of the credit goes to BP.

For the record Vince Piggins and Fred Gibb will always be rightly known as the progenitors of the ZL-1 Camaro. But in my opinion without BP doing what he did there would be not be a 2012 ZL1 Camaro.

Nothing you can say or do will change my opinion because as I stated, I was there in the beginning.

[sYc]

William, I doubt if Fred would have tossed the paperwork, that generation, who experienced the depression, does not throw anything away, and the like the Yenko family, and others, the Gibbs are no exception.

Except for the paperwork they loaned to a couple folks, and what mysterious disappeared, they pretty much have everything. I have seen some of the paperwork, so I know that exists, and have heard that their basement has a lot of really cool stuff from back in the day, both dealership and racing.

[William]

What might have happened is of no consequence. Who made it happen is.

[Xplantdad]

Just one question...who is Mr. C (Apparently, he is &quot;He should not be named&quot;...LOL) [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img] [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif[/img]

[sYc]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: William</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What might have happened is of no consequence. Who made it happen is. </div></div>

Exactly!!! Fred Gibb, who had the foresight to order the cars.

[sYc]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Xplantdad</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just one question...who is Mr. C (Apparently, he is &quot;He should not be named&quot;...LOL) [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img] [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif[/img] </div></div>

Ed Cunneen, who wrote a book about COPOS (ZL-1s, Yenkos, etc)the first edition with several VIN numbers, doucmented COPOs for many years, and now I think into Yenko Stinger Corvairs, including road racing.