Could this be a COPO ???? - Page 2

supercomp 8.90 · #11 06-15-2008, 06:22 PM

yes

**William** · #12 06-15-2008, 07:09 PM

There is another aspect to this no one has considered.

I have been to hundreds of cars shows over the 33 years I have messed with these things, usually with a notebook in hand recording data off '69s. At SC-Indy years ago I acquired data from a "restored" '69 Z/28. The car has a repro tag and a non-OE DZ motor; date way off. However the body number on the repro tag is in sequence with two other known Glockner Chev COPOs. It is possible this car [and others...] was purchased as a rolling shell with no engine/trans in the early '80s before much was known about COPOs. Since it had discs and a 12 bolt it was done up as a Z/28; the X11 or X44 tag went away. Other COPOs may have been restored as 396 Super Sports.

I will not reveal the VIN of the car in question. Hope the OE tag was retained.

Hylton · #13 06-15-2008, 10:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
There is another aspect to this no one has considered.

I have been to hundreds of cars shows over the 33 years I have messed with these things, usually with a notebook in hand recording data off '69s. At SC-Indy years ago I acquired data from a "restored" '69 Z/28. The car has a repro tag and a non-OE DZ motor; date way off. However the body number on the repro tag is in sequence with two other known Glockner Chev COPOs. It is possible this car [and others...] was purchased as a rolling shell with no engine/trans in the early '80s before much was known about COPOs. Since it had discs and a 12 bolt it was done up as a Z/28; the X11 or X44 tag went away. Other COPOs may have been restored as 396 Super Sports.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you imagine!

What a shame.

*hotrods* · #14 06-16-2008, 12:25 AM

That's crazy! Glockner Chevrolet is only 1 hour from me and used to be a customer of mine back in my 5/3 Bank days. I know Andy Glockner pretty well but I'm sure that he would laugh if I ask if he had information on a 1969 Camaro. He is all about selling and making money and not a collector.

Any way I will be posting the sequece number later today.

HiHorse · #15 06-16-2008, 01:56 AM

[ QUOTE ]
The car has a repro tag and a non-OE DZ motor; date way off. However the body number on the repro tag is in sequence with two other known Glockner Chev COPOs. It is possible this car [and others...] was purchased as a rolling shell with no engine/trans in the early '80s before much was known about COPOs. Since it had discs and a 12 bolt it was done up as a Z/28; the X11 or X44 tag went away. Other COPOs may have been restored as 396 Super Sports.

I will not reveal the VIN of the car in question. Hope the OE tag was retained.

[/ QUOTE ]
Were body tags being reproduced in the early eighties?

*hotrods* · #16 06-16-2008, 02:35 AM

Here is the body number NOR284254

**Kurt S** · #17 06-16-2008, 10:27 AM

99.9% sure it's not a COPO.

supercomp 8.90 · #18 06-18-2008, 07:14 AM

i dont have anything close to that area in my notes, kurt may be right.

*hotrods* · #19 06-21-2008, 01:53 PM

Why do you think that it isn't? I not doubting you but according to some research there were some cars built around this time.

**William** · #20 06-21-2008, 08:19 PM

For most 69s there is a rough correlation between the body number and the VIN. Cars were built in VIN sequence and body numbers sort of follow along.

This was not always true of COPOs, possibly due to batch assembly of BE axles. COPO body numbers nearly always lag 'normal' production by quite a bit. In addition L72 COPOs were typically ordered in quantity; 10, 20 at a time and their body numbers are frequently but not always in sequence. The first batch of Yenkos COPOs are in the VIN range N578xxx-N579xxx; body numbers seem to all be 202450-202550. Most other 69s in that VIN range have body numbers 219000-222000.

Your car is out of the COPO norm in that that there were very few non-Yenko COPOs produced at that time and the body number is in line with normal production.

Although I understand the logic behind the COPO body number theory there is enough data to prove it does not always apply. And, once again, the theory is based on less than half of the COPOs produced. The 50 Gibb ZL-1s were ordered at the same time in groups of 10 by color: 6 4-speeds and 4 automatics in Dusk Blue, Fathom Green, Cortez Silver, Le Mans Blue, Hugger Orange. One would think that is how they were built; not quite. The first two N568358 and N568359 Dusk Blue autos were moved up the production schedule [12E] and delivered 12/31/68 with body numbers 222002 and 222003. 222001 was the 14th car built [02D] but the first one ordered [NCJ016], a Le Mans blue 4-speed. The last Gibb ZL-1 ordered [NCJ065] has body number 240022 - go figure. Applying the COPO body number theory would rule this car out as a Gibb ZL-1 but it is real and well documented.

It gets better - the #3 ZL-1 from Berger Chev was the first ZL-1 ordered: 21175 [N608193], well before the Gibb cars. Also of all the known Berger COPOs none have a body number near #3 even though some are in the same N608xxx VIN range - another car the theory would rule out. Many of the non-Gibb ZL-1s also have random body numbers not close to other known COPOs.

So much for the theory.