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njsteve
04-21-2011, 02:47 AM
It's been slow around here so we decided to do a little engine work on the 1975 Firebird that my grandmother bought new from Ruckles Pontiac in Yonkers, New York back in September 1975. My grandfather traded in a 1969 Thunderbird plus cash for the Firebird and drove it off the lot. Gramma Rose drove the car for several years and then ended up giving us the car in the early 1980's when the door just got way too heavy to pull shut. (Anyone with a second gen F-body will know exactly what I mean).

We got the car with 38,000 miles and my brother drove it for a few years til it ran up 70,000 miles. At that point it just sat around and I ended up taking it and repainting the car and giving it back to my father as a gift. He proceeded to park it in the garage and throw all sorts of things on top of it and drag garden hoses across it. So I reposessed it in 2004 and brought it back to my house.

Anyway, Since my daughter helped rebuild the engine in the 72 T/A back when she was 8, I figured it was time to let my son try his hand.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/firebird75001b.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/75%20Firebird/SDC10215.jpg

njsteve
04-21-2011, 02:55 AM
First thing we did was a compression test on the engine. Here's the results:

cyl 1: 125 psi
cyl 2: 120 psi
cyl 3: 125 psi
cyl 4: 115 psi
cyl 5: 115 psi
cyl 6: 120 psi
cyl 7: 115 psi
cyl 8: 125 psi

I then sprayed some oil in the low psi cylinders and retested with negligible improvement. (So that means it's the rings, not the valves - more on this later).

Since there was more than 10% variation between the highest and lowest pressures, it was time for a freshening.

I unplugged everything rather uneventfully in a day and got it out of the engine bay with the help of the wife and the kids.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10277.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10317.jpg

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:04 AM
Other than a change to a 1972 cast iron four barrel intake and a camshaft/valvespring/timing chain swap in 1994, nothing has ever been done to the internals of this 350 engine.

With the boy by my side we pulled the engine apart and did some forensic examination of the parts. I'm a firm believer in actually examining what you have as you take it apart and not just throwing everything in a pile in the center of the garage. We found some interesting things.

The lifter valley was reasonably clean with a little tarnish on everything. Cam looked fine.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10305.jpg

The double roller timing chain was stretched quite a bit. When you set it at "0" on the timing mark and then tried to rotate the crank, you get the mark on the balancer to line up with the "4" dgeree mark before the distributor rotor would move. Thats a bit much slack.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10346.jpg

Pulled the heads and it looked like a bit of oil was burning in some of the cylinders. If you looked into the exhaust ports you could see the oil sludge seeping though the guides.


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10328.jpg

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:07 AM
A bit of carbon on the pistons but the bores looked beautiful - a mirror finish with no scratches anywhere.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10335.jpg

The bottom end showed quite a bit of tarnish on everything, the results of years of sitting with old oil, I imagine.


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10340.jpg

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:15 AM
Take a look at the piston and tell me what is wrong with this picture....

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10362.jpg

Yeah, nice factory alignment of the ring gaps. All eight pistons had the gaps on every compression ring and every oil ring lined up with each other. It defies logic. Every kid learns in high school shop class that you have to stagger the ring gaps in different locations to avoid loss of compression and high oil consumption.

All I can think is this was some type of job action or purposeful sabotage by the guy at the engine assembly plant back in 1975. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif

No wonder the car never had any ooomph when you hit the gas.

(Original machine marks on the piston skirts look nice, though) <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

We removed the compression rings and checked the ring gaps:

Cyl 1: .032, .030
Cyl 2: .032, .032
Cyl 3: .030, .032
Cyl 4: .032, .035
Cyl 5: .035, .032
Cyl 6: .030. .035
Cyl 7: .028, .028
Cyl 8: .025, .030


I believe the spec is supposed to be .019 plus/minus .010.

MosportGreen66
04-21-2011, 03:19 AM
10-1 odds you end up doing a 4 year frame off...

x Baldwin Motion
04-21-2011, 03:20 AM
Steve is that a Formula, or was there a hood swap?

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:26 AM
It was an Esprit and I added the ram air hood and the correct ram air air cleaner back when I painted it in 1994.

Hopefully we'll have the engine back in in the next month or so. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif (Haven't heard that one before, now have we?)

I'm dropping the heavy parts off at the machinist on Friday.

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:30 AM
Main bearings/journals looked beautiful:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10342.jpg

The rod bearings/journals looked just as nice. Oil clearance was still within spec. And yes, I stamped each rod with the numbers. They were all unnumbered when we popped the pan off.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10357.jpg

It still had the original asbestos rear main seal which was leaking badly along with the timing cover seal, oil pan gasket, torque converter seal, tailshaft seal, rear pinion seal.....

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/SDC10370.jpg

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:35 AM
Here's the empty block awaiting a trip to the shop:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006287.jpg

and all the parts:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006286.jpg


And of course the typical monkey wrench in the ointment...cracked exhaust manifold.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006283.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006285.jpg

If I can't find a replacement I might upgrade to the repro ram air manifolds.

WILMASBOYL78
04-21-2011, 03:37 AM
Steve...this is a cool thread...love engine rebuild stories...they take me back to my younger days <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

Keep us posted with info and more photos...good luck!!

wilma

njsteve
04-21-2011, 03:56 AM
It gives the boy something to do that doesn't involve a video game. He was rather amazed at how the internal parts all connected with each other. Hopefully that will grow into something. The daughter wants to be an engineer, so maybe her third grade engine building experience, years ago, helped spur the interest.

mockingbird812
04-21-2011, 04:13 AM
Good stuff Steve. Keep it coming.


BTW, <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/scholar.gif I came up with a 9.2% diff between your high and lo pressures. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

njsteve
04-21-2011, 04:22 AM
DOH!

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/HomerSimpson2Thumb.gif


If I could do math, I woulda been a doctor, dagnabbit!

GTO_DON
04-21-2011, 04:24 AM
Thats a cool car...I have a metal dealer emblem from Ruckles in yonkers...I didnt know they were a Pontiac dealer

njsteve
04-21-2011, 04:28 AM
I have all the original paperwork on the car, even the broadcast sheet that was under the rear seat. It was a leftover sitting on the lot at the end of the model year, when they bought it. Ruckles also had a leftover Trans Am but Gramma Rose didn't like the &quot;bump in the hood.&quot; (She was kind of short and it blocked her view of the road). <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

Xplantdad
04-21-2011, 04:43 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MosportGreen66</div><div class="ubbcode-body">10-1 odds you end up doing a 4 year frame off... </div></div>

Dan...LOL

Steve wouldn't do that...would he? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

StriperSS
04-21-2011, 07:14 AM
And so it begins..........................
another epic thread, and I was in at the start of this one! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/laugh.gif

Alss
04-21-2011, 02:19 PM
love those cars..cool thread Steve .... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif ..again

John
04-21-2011, 03:05 PM
You want to check with these people.... they seem to have the exhaust manifold you need... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif


http://home.earthlink.net/~jnjvette/Non-Vette.htm

email is ....

[email protected]

.......................................


FL1-02914
Exhaust Manifold
Date Code, L165 1 G 4996240 $75.00 Contact Us

MrsBillyBobcat
04-21-2011, 05:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: njsteve</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The daughter wants to be an engineer, so maybe her third grade engine building experience, years ago, helped spur the interest. </div></div>

That's awesome Steve! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Your grandma sure had a COOL car! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/headbang.gif

njsteve
04-21-2011, 06:07 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MrsBillyBobcat</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> That's awesome Steve! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Your grandma sure had a COOL car! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/headbang.gif </div></div>

She was a cool lady. Here's a shot of her hangin' with Mr. Mojo himself, Tom Jones at a dinner party back in the day:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/gramatomjones2.jpg

<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/blush.gif

427TJ
04-21-2011, 06:33 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MosportGreen66</div><div class="ubbcode-body">10-1 odds you end up doing a 4 year frame off... </div></div>

LOL! Yeah, but it would be the nicest '75 Firebird anyone ever saw!

MrsBillyBobcat
04-21-2011, 06:40 PM
<span style="font-size: 14pt">WOW! Very C <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/cool.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/cool.gif L Steve! </span> <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/worship.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/headbang.gif

MrsBillyBobcat
04-21-2011, 06:44 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427TJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

LOL! Yeah, but it would be the nicest '75 Firebird anyone ever saw! </div></div>

<span style="font-size: 11pt">So TRUE! </span> <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

njsteve
04-21-2011, 08:38 PM
Loaded up all the engine parts in the truck. Ready to get dropped off tomorrow. Here's a couple shots of the interior. The only things that I replaced over the years were the sagging headliner and the carpet. Everything else is as it was in 75. Including the vintage (and muddy) J.C. Whitney floormats.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006288.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006291.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006292.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006295.jpg

njsteve
04-22-2011, 02:46 AM
Thanks to one of the guys (Jim, a.k.a. x-bird2) over at Performanceyears.com, I have a replacement set of exhaust manifolds in my hands now. He's a local Pennsylvania boy (with a 73 SD455 Formula) and he just gave them to me. He said the reason he hadn't thrown them in the scrap pile before, was that they were down in the basement and it was too much effort to drag them up to throw away. (They still had the head pipes attached).

<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

Jonesy
04-22-2011, 04:20 PM
How did you fix the headliner??

njsteve
04-22-2011, 08:22 PM
The 75's used a cardboard backed headliner with the fabric glued to it. (Not a full fabric headliner with steel bows like the earlier cars). I think they started that in 1973?

Like modern car headliners, the foam layer that's bonded to the fabric eventually deteriorates and one day you get in the car and the darn thing is touching your head. So I just bought new material and some spray headliner glue, pulled the cardboard backing out, attached the new headliner and reinstalled. It was very simple - about a hundred times easier than the old style fabric and bow headliners.

KevinW
04-22-2011, 08:52 PM
Congrats to another looong build thread! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/laugh.gif

njsteve
04-22-2011, 08:59 PM
Just dropped off the engine parts. He agreed the bores looked great...and then laughed and said &quot;But the ridge (and the bore measurement) indicates it's time for bigger pistons.&quot; He said to blame Gramma for that: all those two mile trips to the beauty salon with the engine never fully warming up and the choke flushing all that extra gas down in the engine ends up washing the cylinder walls of oil.

So now I have to start shopping for some replacement pistons once he tells me what size we need.

Anyone have a Summit Racing coupon out there???

x Baldwin Motion
04-22-2011, 09:46 PM
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006288.jpg

Steve, are those idiots lights on the left side of dash cluster?
What is under the ashtray ?


I am REALLY impressed with the Tom Jones pic. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/headbang.gif

njsteve
04-23-2011, 12:48 AM
Yup, those are the factory idiot lights in the large circular gauge on the left. You had to pay extra for the gauge package back then. I installed an autometer mini gauge cluster in the map pocket of the console back in the 90's just to keep an eye on things.

RAIIIT/A
04-24-2011, 01:50 AM
Looks like that old Firebird has been well preserved and well maintained. Those cars really show the wear and tear if they aren't. Nice car!

njsteve
04-24-2011, 10:43 PM
Spent the day cleaning the turbo 350 tranny. Since the car sat for most of its life, all the seals needed attention. I replaced the torque converter seal, the tailshaft seal and the pan gasket and filter.

Here is the rather dirty trans wheeled out the driveway after I swapped the converter and driveshaft yoke seals. The old furniture moving cart came in handy, along with some old railroad tie sections.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006296.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006297.jpg

njsteve
04-24-2011, 10:48 PM
I then used a spray bottle full of Purple Stuff degreaser and some wooden sticks and vinyl/brass brushes to clean all the oil, tar, mud and sand that was encrusted on the sides. Took several &quot;lather, rinse, repeat&quot; iterations to get it comepletely clean. I stayed away from steel wire brushes as they tend to scratch the aluminum.

Sure is handy having the cherry picker to hang the thing on.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006304.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006309.jpg

After hoisting the tranny up I was able to pull the pan and replace the filter. The pan looked great, no metal in there. I guess someone back in the 70's replaced the filter as there was some gasket goo on the pan gasket. The underside of the pan was pefect, flat, and scratch free, further evidence that the tranny had never been out of the car. (They usually get dragged across the floor when removed.) I was careful to not place it on the ground, in order to further preserve the pan's finish.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006310.jpg

Here is the VIN stamp location on the turbo 350. Happily, this one matches the car and the engine.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006307.jpg

njsteve
04-24-2011, 10:49 PM
All done and headed back into the garage. Last thing left to do is the filler tube O-ring which doesn't arrive til tomorrow.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006303.jpg

Jonesy
04-25-2011, 12:53 AM
Steve, do you recall where you got your material for the headliner from?? I need to do my 74 z/28.
Thanks

njsteve
04-25-2011, 01:34 AM
These are the guys that have most fabrics for our era cars.

http://www.smsautofabrics.com/

Jonesy
04-25-2011, 04:08 PM
Thanks Steve. I will give them a call.

njsteve
05-02-2011, 02:17 AM
Cleaning time. Used a spray bottle of the purple stuff degreaser and cleaned the engine compartment. Thirty six years of oil and dirt everywhere. Got most of it washed away with the garden hose.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006350.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006357.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006355.jpg

Notice where the exhaust head pipes are sitting? Gee, what do you think the odds are that when I went to remove the brake master cylinder, that the flare nut wrench would slip out of my hand and fly through the air and land right in the driver's side head pipe...and then slide a foot or two down the pipe...laughing at me the whole way. Nothing but net.

I had to find a flexible wire and fasten a magnet to the end and fish it down the pipe. It was like a carnival game from Hell. I finally won the game and got my wrench back after about an hour of fishing. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif

njsteve
05-02-2011, 02:25 AM
I pulled the front steering linkage and the steering box, just to clean the encrusted gunk off. The steering box was natural cast finish with an aluminum cover and a pink paint daub on the spline where the steering shaft mounts up.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006366-1.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006364.jpg

Dodged a bullet here! Check out the steering box bolt in the center. I used PB Blaster to loosen the bolt but it still took an impact gun to get them loosened. I would loosen, then tighten, then loosen repeatedly, to rock them free. Looks like the center bolt came out just in time. I was surprised it didn't break after seeing how much was rusted away.

njsteve
05-02-2011, 02:33 AM
The steering linkage was gunk covered and took a lot of brushing and degreaser to get it clean. You can see the original green paint mark on the driver's side, inner tie rod. (Just like my 72 T/A had). The weird black plastic ball thingy that looks like a toilet bowl float is actually the plastic cover (two piece) that goes over the steering box rag joint and the lower six inches of the steering column shaft. I think this was some kind of safety item to prevent debris, rocks and stuff from jamming the steering if it got caught between the rag joint and the subframe.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006369.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006371.jpg

njsteve
05-02-2011, 02:39 AM
I pulled the brake booster out to clean it up. It had quite a bit of surface rust on it. Soaking it, face down in the safestrustremover.com stuff. Working very well taking the rustiness away.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006372.jpg

You can see the light blue inspection mark on the &quot;Delco Moraine&quot; stamp in the 2:00 position on the face.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006360.jpg

And on the top was a light blue mark that ran across from the front side to the back side at the 12:00 position, as well as an orange daub right at the top.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006359.jpg

njsteve
05-02-2011, 03:02 AM
Here's the engine compartment at the moment. I ended up using a little daub of diesel fuel on a rag to clean the firewall and the inner fenders. It worked out very nicely. The dry areas you see on the driver's side of the firewall and alongside the A/C box are the sloppily-applied, factory body schutz undercoating, which I am leaving in place.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006378.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006379.jpg

And, yes that is a rag covering that cursed open exhaust down pipe. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006380.jpg

Some of the cleaned up parts at the moment: the steering box, wiper motor, the steering shaft, the 7042264 1972 400 carb (matches the intake I have on the car), and an extra brand new master cylinder that I had sitting around waiting to go on something.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006376.jpg

My parts order from Summit Racing should arrive tomorrow so I can bring the pistons, cam bearings and block assembly hardware over to the machine shop. I ended up getting the entire rebuild kit, which includes .030 pistons, rings, cam, main, and rod bearings in one package. (The crank polished up nicely so I can stick with standard size main and rod bearings.) Since I already had bought a new Melling oil pump and a Felpro gasket kit, they were able to deduct those items from the kit and save me about 80 bucks.

WILMASBOYL78
05-02-2011, 01:13 PM
Are you going to paint and detail under the hood...??

Looks like you are doing a good job....wilma

njsteve
05-02-2011, 01:52 PM
Yeah, I'll be painting the frame rails as best as i can. The rest of the suspension, upper and lower control arms, etc, can be done after the drivetrain is back in.

njsteve
05-03-2011, 03:26 AM
Got the engine parts from Summit this morning. For some crazy reason they sent me 6 pistons from one warehouse and 2 from another. I brought them to the machinist and he didn't have a good feeling about them since they looked markedly different: an old version and a new version of the same part number. He weighed them and the weight difference was off the scale, literally.

I called Summit and they agreed that was not right - you never mix and match pistons from different sets, let alone different years of manufacture. All I can assume is that it must have been the computerized inventory system selecting the locations from which to ship. They issued a call tag for the 6+2 pistons and they are drop shipping me a new, matched set directly from Sealed Power.

On a positive note, they do have excellent customer service people, who realized the problem and took care of it immediately.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006391.jpg

njsteve
05-03-2011, 03:35 AM
The born-with block was bored .030 and is ready for the cam bearings, galley plugs, freeze plugs, etc.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006381.jpg

The original 6X heads are in process at the moment. Original valves were in nice shape, so we are reusing them. The heads will be resurfaced after the valve job is finished.

Gee, maybe I'll get up to an actual 8.5 compression ratio with the head shaving. I don't know if today's gas can handle all that power! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006382.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006385.jpg

njsteve
05-03-2011, 03:43 AM
BTW, here's the brake booster after a couple of days of soaking in the safestrustremover.com stuff. It took most of the rust away. It did also remove what was left of the original zinc dichromate plating.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006393.jpg

firstgenaddict
05-05-2011, 02:57 AM
The ring alignment... lol
My father-in-law took it upon himself to rebuild the engine in his 1905 Cadillac.
He honed the cylinder, had new rings made and assembled the engine.
Fired it up and it ran but had no power, the car wouldn't pull itself up a 5% grade out of the garage.
He pulls it all back down and checks everything, laps and hones the valves etc.
He asks if I will come over and help him assemble the engine... we are putting the jug over the piston and he has the ring gaps in a direct line...
I said hey you forgot to stagger the rings...
It doesn't matter he replies they will all settle with the gaps to the TOP (Horizontal 1 cylinder)... his reasoning was the heavy side would work it's way down.
I said did you assemble the engine like that last time?
YES!!!!
He has no problems running 25-30mph now...
http://inlinethumb25.webshots.com/47832/1187289721059464720S500x500Q85.jpg

njsteve
05-05-2011, 05:01 AM
So it runs better after you staggered the rings?

firstgenaddict
05-05-2011, 01:33 PM
touche' my good friend, I should have seen it coming considering the stable you have been fortunate enough to look after over the years.

njsteve
05-05-2011, 09:21 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: firstgenaddict</div><div class="ubbcode-body">touche' my good friend, I should have seen it coming considering the stable you have been fortunate enough to look after over the years. </div></div>

No, I was serious - did your father in law stagger the ring gaps when he put it back together the second time, or reassemble it with them all in a line? I am rather curious whether it really does matter since they do rotate around as the engine runs. I imagine a horizontal or boxer style engine would be a bit different than the conventional vertical moving pistons in a V8.

firstgenaddict
05-05-2011, 10:17 PM
LOL... 25 or 30 in one of our cars and we would be looking for the E-brake down or sounding like a Hit-n-Miss...

Yes we staggered the rings, I have worked in machine shops and we did boxer engines, they were all staggered...during our assembly and were staggered upon disassembly, they still rotate around the piston.

njsteve
05-10-2011, 02:27 AM
Got the new pistons from Summit on Friday...a sealed box with the label &quot;matched weight set.&quot; They are at the machine shop now. When I dropped them off, the block was finished but I was in the wife's car and she doesn't take too kindly to transporting engine blocks in her trunk.

Over the weekend I spent some time painting the frame, cleaning all the brake and fuel lines and then reinstalling the lines, brackets, wiper motor, steering box, intermediate column, new motor mounts, etc. I also cleaned and rewrapped the wiring harnesses, too. (And yes, the factory did use bright white, corrugated plastic tubing to contain the firewall engine harness on the 75 Firebirds - not too esthetically pleasing, I'd say, but it is original!)

Waiting for a couple new brake hoses to arrive tomorrow. I had to replace the calipers after snapping the bleeder off one in an attempt to get it ready for bleeding the brakes. Figured I should replace the hoses as well, just to be safe.

Here's the engine compartment at the moment:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006451.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006449.jpg

Plowman
05-11-2011, 04:42 AM
Note;Leave the little rubber cap or hat on the bleeder and it will be good for ever. Paul

njsteve
05-12-2011, 11:34 PM
Absolutely right on that rubber cap advice.

Installed the new calipers and hoses yesterday. Had quite a time getting the hoses to not leak at the calipers after bleeding the brakes. Every time I'd tighten down the banjo fittings with the supplied &quot;allegedly&quot; copper, crush washers, the damn things would seep brake fluid. I removed them and they had no crush marks like the originals, even though I was using a 1/2 drive ratchet to tighten the fittings to a &quot;Jersey strength&quot; rating. I finally reinstalled old crush washers and no leaks occurred.

This lead me to the obvious conclusion that the new copper crush washers that are manufactured today (no doubt, in China) are not the same as the originals. I have a funny feeling that they are either copper-plated steel or some type of alloy that is not crushable. A buddy of mine had the exact same problem trying to get a turbocharger coolant line to not leak...he solved it by reusing the old washers, also.

Does anybody have a way to test my theory? Don't they have some type of metal hardness test?

mockingbird812
05-13-2011, 12:49 AM
a magnet would be attracted to the supposed copper-plated (steel) washer.

Plowman
05-13-2011, 03:32 PM
G.M. still has the copper brake line washers,if you wan't new ones. Paul

SS427
05-13-2011, 04:11 PM
I have had the same problems as well and just cut one open. The ones I buy are solid copper but are also less then half the thickness of the OEM ones. I have not been able to find a suitable replacement that resembles the originals in thickness.

VintageMusclecar
05-13-2011, 07:18 PM
What are the 3 dimensions of the OEM washer?

njsteve
05-14-2011, 03:28 AM
Started the assembly process with the boy yesterday. Had him insert the main bearings, apply the Lubriplate and then we installed the crankshaft. Most entertaining to see a 50-pound kid try to pull 100 pounds on a torque wrench. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif (I helped eventually).

He actually figured out that the decimal math he recently learned in school is actually useful in everyday life! I had him measure the main bearing oil clearence with Plastigage and compare it to the little paper chart. I then had him check the ring end gaps in the bores and crankshaft endplay with the feeler gauges. I had him compare the numbers to the specs in the book. He was quite impressed with his application of school math to engine building. He can't wait to tell his friends at school that decimals aren't a totally dumb thing.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006482.jpg

We started with the piston/rods tonight, hopefully we'll get them all in tomorrow.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006470.jpg

mockingbird812
05-14-2011, 08:01 PM
Nice job Steve. Love the progress reports. Great father/son project! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

SS427
05-14-2011, 10:48 PM
Very nice of you to include your son on this project as well as teach him at the same time Steve. I can assure you that what he learns helping you in this was will stay with him a lot longer than had he learned it elsewhere and also due to the fact that you made it fun for him. What I would give to be able to have a son and teach him things like that! Hats off to you sir! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/worship.gif

Norwood
05-15-2011, 12:05 AM
Steve, if you start on a project for your son now, you just might finish it by the time he gets his license. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif I think a Formula SD would make a perfect first car.

olredalert
05-15-2011, 02:38 AM
-----Craig,,,Why should Steve finish it??? Train the kid right and then let him loose (with a bit of supervision). From everything I have seen, Steves son could probably make us all proud without much prodding.......Bill S

njsteve
05-16-2011, 02:48 AM
Yesterday, both the daughter and the son got involved in installing the rest of the pistons. They argued over who got to do more, <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif so I let each one of them install two pistons, and torque the rod bolts.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006499.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006497.jpg

njsteve
05-16-2011, 03:04 AM
We then spent the rest of the weekend buttoning up the engine. Installed the pan and timing cover to catch all the oil and assembly lube that was soon to be dripping down. I manhandled the cylinder heads onto the block and the boy did all the torqueing. He was definitely tired by the time he was done!

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006539.jpg

I think the part he enjoyed the most was gooping all the black moly and red assembly lube onto the lifters, rocker arms and pushrods. He then torqued all the rocker nuts into place and we added the oil. I had him rotate the engine while we ran the oil pump primer and pressured up the engine.

I also showed him how the cam/lifters and rocker arms activate the intake and exhaust valves in relation to the piston movement, building on what I showed him yesterday with the timing chain connecting the cam to the movement of the crankshaft. You could actually see the lightbulb go off over his head when he realized how everything was interconnected. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/shocked.gif

Of course we ran into an interesting problem while priming the engine. All the lifters/pushrods/rockers oiled up fine except for one. Nothing was coming out. They were new Sealed Power rockers, too. I thought maybe something was wrong with that lifter so I swapped it with one from another lifter position. The previously non-oiling lifter worked fine in the new lifter bore and the previously functioning lifter didn't oil in the suspect bore. So that ruled out the lifters. Checked the pushrod and it was clean with no blockage. I finally swapped the rocker with an original one and it oiled up fine. Here's what I found:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006555.jpg

New rocker on the left, original on the right. The new rockers have the oil holes in a different position than the original ones, which, depending upon the pushrod, can restrict the oil supply to the oiling hole. The original rockers have the oil holes directly over the pushrod oil hole opening, the new ones have them in a spot that barely connects with the pushrod oil hole.

Glad we caught that now.

njsteve
05-16-2011, 03:18 AM
Here's how the engine looked by this afternoon:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006542.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006543.jpg

njsteve
05-16-2011, 03:27 AM
Since it has been raining since saturday morning and it's supposed to rain all week, I figured I wouldn't be able to paint the engine until at least next week. Around 5:00 PM the sun came out for about an hour and I quickly rolled the engine out in the driveway to get her painted up.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006545.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006547.jpg

I used the Bill Hirsch Engine Enamel. The stuff is amazing. The color match was exact. 1975-77 Pontiac engines have this weird, heavy metallic, royal blue color that is similar to the Oldsmobile blue and not available anywhere in spray can form. I used one of those Preval, do-it-yourself aerosol spray bottles, diluted the canned paint by 1/2 with lacquer thinner and sprayed away. I used about 1/3 of the quart can.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006549.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006551.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006552.jpg

Norwood
05-16-2011, 03:37 AM
steve are all the rockers like that? did you replace all of them?

njsteve
05-16-2011, 03:41 AM
That rocker had the hole a fraction of an inch lower than the rest. So I just swapped out that one with the best original rocker I could find. (My machinist had examined the original rockers and noticed that most of them were a bit too scuffed up in the pocket area, so he recommended getting a new set.)

(Oh, and by the way Craig, if you know anyone with a nice 73 SD, my son would be happy to consider trading the '72 T/A for his future project <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif)

Norwood
05-16-2011, 04:01 AM
I will forward this message. I know a few....but those SD guys think thier cars are worth way more than our &quot;striped cars&quot; <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

njsteve
05-18-2011, 02:56 AM
Everything is bolted up and, remarkably, there were no nuts, bolts or parts left over!

I need to get my hoist back so I can join the engine and tranny together and throw the drivetrain back in the car. Hopefully it will finally stop raining this weekend.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006565.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006567.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006564.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006561.jpg

SuperNovaSS
05-18-2011, 03:49 AM
Steve,


What's with the piece of wood under the front of the engine? Didn't trust the bolts?


Jason

njsteve
05-18-2011, 04:12 AM
It's a speciially designed device that took years of testing and innovation to create. It supports the front of the engine under the pan flange and mounts against the front brace of the engine stand. It takes some of the stress of all that weight off the four mounting bolts in the rear of the block.

It only remotely resembles a long 2X4. It's actually a bioengineered, organic laminate support fixture, (a.k.a. wood)
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

Xplantdad
05-18-2011, 04:24 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: njsteve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's a speciially designed device that took years of testing and innovation to create. It supports the front of the engine under the pan flange, and takes some of the stress off the mounting bolts in the rear of the block.

It only resembles a 2x4 piece of wood. It's actually a bioengineered, organic laminate. (a.k.a. wood)
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif </div></div>

Steve...you crack me up... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

Verne_Frantz
05-19-2011, 02:24 AM
Steve, You are a very fortunate man to have your kids involved like this. That makes it more than a project; it makes it a really good memory.

Verne <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
05-23-2011, 04:27 AM
Thanks for the kind thoughts, Verne! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

njsteve
05-23-2011, 04:33 AM
Tried mowing the lawn today but the mower belt ripped halfway through the backyard from the weight of the still-wet grass from the full week of rain we had. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

So I went ahead with installing the engine. Connected the tranny to the motor. Here's a shot of the original overspray on the flexplate as compared to the Bill Hirsch paint mix. Very good match for this hard-to-find paint color.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006643.jpg

Everything hooked togather and ready for lifting:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006653.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006655.jpg

njsteve
05-23-2011, 04:43 AM
We have liftoff!

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/motorin-1.jpg

Had the wife and kids assisting with the maneauvering. Quite an entertaining time had by all. Much yelling - mostly on safety issues like keeping hands out from underneath the whole contraption just in case the chain breaks, etc...

Got the engine in place rather quickly. The biggest P.I.T.A. were the damn motor mount bolts. They were new motor mounts, that I prefit and made sure the bolt ran through the bracketry beforehand. The '75 Firebirds used a weird mounting system where bracket attaches to the block but the actual rubber mount is bolted to the subframe. Very hard to get the exact angle right to get the bolt to find the threaded end on the other side. That part took two hours!

Touchdown!

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006728.jpg

njsteve
05-23-2011, 04:45 AM
Done for the night.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006730.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006732.jpg

njsteve
05-25-2011, 04:31 AM
Got the car all together today, added the last of the fluids, rechecked everything and got ready for the longwinded start up process...You know the drill, crank it over, stand back for the inevitable backfing and loss of eyebrows...pull the distributor and reinstall it 180 degrees out from where it was, find out where the leaking oil/gas/water/beer is coming from...try again...yada, yada, yada. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006739.jpg

I can tell you that in 35 years of playing with cars and building engines I have never run into something like this:

I had the boy outside with me holding the fire extinguisher (from prior experience, just in case). All I was trying to do was bump the starter in order to move the timing mark on the balancer to the &quot;0&quot; spot on the timing mark. I turn the key for half a second and the car is running. No cranking, no backfiring, I mean running like I had just shut it off a minute ago. Instant 60 pounds of oil pressure, no weird noises, no leaks, no running out of gas.

So I end up sitting there with a stop watch and running the rpms up and down around 1500 to 2000 pm for 15 minutes. After that, I shut her off and drained the oil - looked clean, the magnetic drain plug was perfectly clean - not even a speck of metal anywhere. Refilled the oil and added another can of break-in additive and turned the key again, and she starts up on the first crank again. Set the timing and we both hopped in.

So we took Grammas Rose's car out for a victory lap and went to Rita's Ice for some Italian ice to celebrate. Got home and here's how she sounds after our victory ride: (click on the photo)

http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll140/njstevecars/th_S7006742.jpg (http://s287.photobucket.com/albums/ll140/njstevecars/?action=view&amp;current=S7006742.mp4)


So, between the 455HO my daughter built in 3rd grade and this 350 my son built in 4th grade, the moral of the story is that from now on I will only have my kids build my engines for me.

Sounds like an idea for a new TV show:

Can You Build An Engine Better Than a 4th Grader? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

mockingbird812
05-25-2011, 06:49 AM
Boy Steve, she spins like a top! Nice project - you and your son did good! Betcha he's proud as a peacock. I can here him on the playground at school with his buds,&quot;so there I was walkin' my old man through the rebuild procedure for a small block poncho....&quot;

SS427
05-25-2011, 06:51 PM
That is SO cool!

njsteve
05-26-2011, 02:55 AM
Had to wait for the wife and daughter to get home this evening to put the hood back on. Then I washed all the dust off and fixed a broken A/C compressor wire. Now everything works at the moment but the high speed on the blower fan, which didn't work before the rebuild, anyway. I think the relay has gone bad.

Here's some shots after the bath.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006749.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006748.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b216/nk15268/S7006746.jpg

MrsBillyBobcat
05-26-2011, 03:30 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Verne_Frantz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Steve, You are a very fortunate man to have your kids involved like this. That makes it more than a project; it makes it a really good memory.

Verne <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif </div></div>

I agree Verne! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

Gramma's car looks great! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/worship.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/worship.gif

BTW Steve... While I was reading your last couple posts, I heard &quot;It's Not Unusual&quot; <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/shocked.gif ...Tom Jones was on American Idol! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/wink.gif

njsteve
05-26-2011, 03:34 AM
You know the old saying: Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

MrsBillyBobcat
05-26-2011, 03:37 AM
Yep! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/wink.gif

njsteve
05-27-2011, 03:04 AM
Figured out the high speed fan problem.

I checked the relay connection and it is the melted wire syndrome. 20 years ago I put an inline fuse in the power feed for the high speed circuit, where it enters the relay. You can actually see the orange wired, white plastic inline fuse holder in the upper left corner by the passenger side hood hinge, in the first photo above. I think I did this because the original wire melted, so I thought a fuse would protect the wire in the future.

In actuality, all it does is heat up the inline fuse carrier enough that it softens the plastic and then the metal connectors no longer contact the inline fuse, cutting off the 12 volts feed.

I jumped the two ends of the melted fuse holder and high speed then functioned perfectly.

I guess I forgot that the relay is the thing that is supposed to be protecting the circuit from heat damage but it doesn't do too good of a job at it.

I guess I will go back to the original 12 gauge wire and forget the fuse.

This seems to be a common problem on the F-bodies.

njsteve
05-28-2011, 12:48 AM
I rechecked the wiring diagram and it is supposed to have the fuse up there. Most other F-bodies have the fuse right behind the alternator. Since this car has the optional 80-amp alternator, the fuse is in a different location. I bought a modern fuse holder and replaced the inline fuse holder with it. The wires are long enough to allow the non-stock looking fuse holder to be hidden. It worked great - I have high speed back again and the fuse holder no longer heats up and loses contact.

njsteve
06-03-2011, 12:23 AM
I was going throught the pile of original paperwork the other day and found the old Midas Muffler paperwork. Gramma bought the lifetime warranty shocks way back when. My brother got them replaced under the lifetime warranty back in 1984 and again in 1991. I figured after 20 years it was time again so I paid a little visit to the local Midas shop that is run by a friend of my mechanic buddy. The owner had a good laugh and ordered the shocks up for me.

The kids working there (who were not born when the original set...or the second...or third set was put on) could not figure out how to read the original paper warranty certficate and do the paperwork. All they kept saying was, &quot;It's not on my computer. I don't know how to do this?&quot;

The kid tried to convince me that I owed $198 for installation, and I referred him back to the certificate that states, &quot;free parts and free labor.&quot; He couldn't believe they used to have that deal (it's only free parts nowadays).

The owner got a kick out of watching the young'ens squirm under this incrediblely arduous paperwork task, so he assigned his &quot;old timer&quot; to put the shocks on. (He had a 73 T/A way back when and enjoyed working on Gramma's car).

Lucky for them I replaced the original Midas single exhaust and transverse muffler years ago with my own dual setup, otherwise I would have gone the full exhaust route, too.

I didn't even start on the lifetime brake warranty, - as she only has 5000 miles since the work was done in '91. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

Xplantdad
06-03-2011, 04:22 AM
Great stuff Steve!

mockingbird812
06-03-2011, 06:05 PM
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/haha.gif beautimus!!

ANDY M
06-04-2011, 11:26 PM
I remember their commercial with an old guy bringing in a Model T.
At the end of the ad, the tag line was &quot;See ya again, boys&quot;.
That old man had a wicked grin, too. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

69biscayne
06-05-2011, 01:10 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9ztafi1V8w&amp;feature=player_detailpage

njsteve
07-31-2011, 12:44 AM
I got some NOS seat material from SMS Upholstery and had my upholstery guy replace the center section on the driver's seat bottom. The center seam ripped a couple winters ago when I made the idiotic move of kneeling on the center of the seat to get something in the car. NEVER DO THAT ON A COLD VINYL SEAT! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif

The NOS material was dated 1975 and matched perfectly.

I have around 600 miles on the rebuilt engine now. Still runs a bit warmer than it used to, but eventually it should cool down (by winter time, I guess).

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/seat.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/rear.jpg

grantprix
07-31-2011, 08:39 PM
Nice job on the seat repair! The car looks great.

MosportGreen66
08-01-2011, 02:22 AM
Steve,

Install a Milodon 160 deg thermostat! They make the engine a cooler place.

Dan

njsteve
08-01-2011, 03:15 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MosportGreen66</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Steve,

Install a Milodon 160 deg thermostat! They make the engine a cooler place.

Dan </div></div>

Dan,
I replaced the existing 160 Stant unit with another 160 Stant unit with no difference. I even drilled a tiny bleed hole in it to get rid of trapped air.

Have you had any better results with the Milodon unit? Better flow maybe?

njsteve
11-07-2011, 11:17 PM
Talk about a shock! I got a call this afternoon from Year One telling me that I won the contest give-away set of 17&quot; Ralley Wheels for my Gramma's Firebird. I initially thought it was somebody trying to sell me something, so I almost hung up on him. Turns out I haven't been answering my Facebook notifications so they had to track me down from an old purchase invoice that matched by name.

Now I have to buy some rubber for these rims. Any suggestions?

https://www.facebook.com/yearonemusclecars

Here's a shot of one of the rims from someone who recently bought a set:

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/17rally.jpg

Dave Rifkin
11-08-2011, 02:20 AM
Congratulations! Throw those babies on the Trans Am to give it a different look.

MrsBillyBobcat
11-08-2011, 02:59 AM
<span style="font-size: 14pt"> <span style="font-weight: bold"> <span style="color: #3366FF">CONGRATULATIONS Steve!!! </span></span> <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif </span> ...and Gramma Rose <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/wink.gif

Xplantdad
11-08-2011, 03:07 AM
Cool stuff! I agree...put them on the TA! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

njsteve
11-08-2011, 03:18 AM
When they called I thought it was a practical joke since it was my birthday a couple days ago. I figured the wife put them up to it. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

MrsBillyBobcat
11-08-2011, 03:31 AM
http://www.yenko.net/attachments/435994-happybday.gif <span style="font-size: 14pt"><span style="color: #3333FF"><span style="font-family: 'Comic Sans MS'"> Steve!</span> </span> </span>

njsteve
11-08-2011, 04:26 AM
...or maybe it was Rita? <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
11-11-2011, 11:10 PM
Look what arrived today! :-)

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/026.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/028.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/021.jpg

MrsBillyBobcat
11-12-2011, 02:32 AM
<span style="font-size: 11pt">BEAUTIFUL!</span> <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Xplantdad
11-12-2011, 03:53 AM
I like 'em!

CC Rider
11-12-2011, 05:12 AM
Nice! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

grantprix
11-12-2011, 05:47 PM
Those are beautiful wheels!

Stefano
11-12-2011, 08:18 PM
Great project, fun to follow. I hadn't seen those wheels before, very cool!

njsteve
11-12-2011, 08:26 PM
Year one just came out with them and had the contest to win a set and get the word out on the new rims. They recently came out with 17&quot; version of the honeycomb, as well, which is the other wheel I lusted after, but beggers cant be choosers I guess. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

They also have the 70 and up Z28 wheel in 17&quot; aluminum, too.

MosportGreen66
11-13-2011, 02:08 PM
Congrats! Those wheels are stunning...

njsteve
12-01-2011, 11:46 PM
Got the tires delivered over the weekend. BFG had a $50 rebate that ended Friday. Discount Tire had an additional $50 discount (which just conveniently happened to cover their &quot;free shipping&quot; which just so happened to boost the price of each tire to match The Tire Rack's price with shipping) <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif. I got the BFG 275/40x17 sports.

The car rides nicely, handles great and there is no rubbing whatsoever. Year One definitely got the offset just right to fit the second gen F-body cars.

If I had it to do all over again, I'd probably get a taller tire like a 45 series, just to fill the wheelwells a bit more. The 275/40s are 25&quot; tall, a 235/60x15 is 25.5&quot; tall and a stock Polyglas F60x15 is 26&quot;.


http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/S7007530.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/S7007535.jpg

njsteve
12-02-2011, 04:48 AM
And the &quot;before&quot; shot:

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/S7006746a.jpg

Slashnine
02-15-2012, 08:13 AM
Man that's a REALLY nice car there!!! I wish you good luck on that project. Dont forget to upload some new pictures of your progress!

The Boss
02-16-2012, 06:13 PM
Looks great Steve!

SmallHurst
02-20-2012, 05:19 AM
Kind of bummed that I won't get to sell you a set of Polyglas for Gramma's car, but I have to admit the car looks great!!! Keep the kids in it!!! Maybe I can convince my wife that I need to get another car so that I can have my son help build the motor!!!!

njsteve
03-15-2012, 02:02 AM
Finally got the speedometer working accurately. The car originally had a 2.56 rear gear ratio and I guessed and put in a blue 43 tooth driven gear years ago when I did the 3.42 rear swap. That never helped much.

It turned out that the trans had an 18 tooth green drive gear which makes it impossible to get a driven gear with enough teeth to slow down the speedo. They dont make a 49 tooth driven gear. So I ended up getting a 15 tooth grey drive gear and a yellow 41 tooth driven gear and the speedo now reads exactly right.

So with 20 years of the wrong gear, the 79,000 on the odometer is probably 69,000 actual miles. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

njsteve
03-22-2012, 02:20 PM
Celebrated the first day of Spring with a nice drive in Gramma's car. I let my daughter drive the car a little, too. She drives like a gramma: slow, both hands on the wheel, head on a swivel. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

We now officially have 1,000 miles on my son's engine rebuild. The car runs great, though he has a few years before he gets to drive anything other than a lawnmower, (which is what his sister learned how to drive on).

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/SDC10301.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/SDC10300.jpg

SmallHurst
03-31-2012, 11:56 PM
This is one of the things I am looking forward to! I cannot wait to have my son help me out on building a car!!! Enjoy this for all it is worth!!

Slashnine
04-02-2012, 07:27 PM
You should upload more picture and show us some update <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

njsteve
08-31-2013, 08:20 PM
Looks like Gramma's car is being reunited with my Grandpa'a car....

njsteve
08-31-2013, 10:02 PM
Here's is Grampa's car's story:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/ubbthrea..._a_L#Post539151 (http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/539151/Oh_Lordy_I_now_own_a_Fordy_a_L#Post539151)

njsteve
08-10-2015, 10:48 PM
I'm getting itchy and I need a new project to work on with the boy. (Gotta drag him away from the x-box)

I have been thinking about finding a 455 short block to rebuild and then bolt on the 6X-4 heads and top end parts from the freshly rebuilt, original 350 on it. The 6X-4 heads that came with the 350 are the trick set up for a nice, torquemonster 455.

I already had Cliff Ruggles do the 1972 Quadrajet and Rocky Rotella set up the distributor. The 350 with its (barely 160 horsepower) is just too lame.

I'd throw on a set of the D-port ram air exhaust manifolds and have some fun.

Anyone have a lead on a nice 455 shortblock that needs rebuilding? (the cheaper the better)?

Day2_69Z
08-11-2015, 11:45 PM
Great theme ,,,,,,,
Way BETTER STORY of the Kids..... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/burnout.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/3gears.gif

A 25-35 horsepower
Lawn tractor ????
N02 ?

njsteve
08-15-2015, 11:24 PM
Well, I found a nice block here in NJ on craigslist. It's allegedly out of 1971 GTO convertible that some guy swapped an LS engine into. He traded the 455 engine for the LS engine but left the 455 at the machine shop for six years so not much of the engine was left at the shop as you would expect if you abandoned your engine somewhere for 6 years - just the block and some misc pieces remained.

The block was bored .030 over. The current bore is 4.180. Looks like it may have been bored and then used as a door stop at the machine shop for half a decade.

It's a 1971 YC (455/325 horse D-port) engine with two-bolt main caps. Maybe...

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1243.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1252.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1251.jpg

It's got a casting date of F050 (June 5, 1970) with a &quot;70&quot; cast on the back of the 9799140 block. Is it a late 1970 cast block from an early 71 455/325 horse car? or it is a late 1970 455/360 horse engine that was the one year only 455HO high compression engine? Feel free to chime in with more info if you have it. It seems to be a weird code/year from what I see on various websites and I don't seem to be the first person to run into this conundrum.

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1250.jpg

The partial VIN looks like 221302638

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1246_1.jpg

I spent the afternoon chasing every bolt hole and then scrubbing the thing down and finally power washing the cobwebs out. I then used a scotch bright on the cylinders and oiled them down once everything dried out.

PeteLeathersac
08-15-2015, 11:49 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: njsteve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The partial VIN looks like 221302638
</div></div>

Wouldn't that be a '72 Vin...and an Oshawa car?
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif
~ Pete

njsteve
08-15-2015, 11:57 PM
The seller also had some other parts that were from that car. A E211 dated (May 21st) 1971 intake and 7041262 dated 68th day of 1971 455 carb.

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1257.jpg

The intake is weird because it is a 1971 481733 casting number but has the unique rectangular 1972 choke pull that runs parallel to the carb and not perpendicular.

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1253.jpg

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt77/nk15268c/gramma%20engine/IMG_1255.jpg

njsteve
08-16-2015, 12:07 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PeteLeathersac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: njsteve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The partial VIN looks like 221302638
</div></div>

Wouldn't that be a '72 Vin...and an Oshawa car?
<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif
~ Pete

</div></div>

Here's a better shot of the vin:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30503-img_1246_vin.jpg

njsteve
08-21-2015, 08:14 PM
I found a standard dimension, original 455 crankshaft 25 miles from my house! I posted a wanted listing on the Performance Years site and someone just over the border in PA answered. It is a 1970 nodular iron casting and was just as rusty as the block I found last week. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30682-img_1276.jpg


So I bought four gallons of Evapo-Rust from advanceautoparts (using their $25 off $70 purchase coupon) and made a makeshift bathtub from a crankshaft box and heavy duty layers of plastic sheeting. If you're wondering, I also put a few beer bottles in to raise the liquid level up to completely cover the crank.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30683-img_1278.jpg

The stuff works amazingly well in the hot sun. Within seconds the rust disappeared. I let it soak for about an hour, turning it and wiping the journals every 10 minutes or so, to get the residue off so the liquid could work faster.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30684-img_1280.jpg

Here's the final result after drying it off and spraying it with oil.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30685-img_1282.jpg

njsteve
08-21-2015, 08:16 PM
OK, not really beer. It was Mike's Hard Lemonade. The wife drinks the stuff.

(and yes, I washed the bottles off before I put them back in the fridge)

markinnaples
08-21-2015, 08:37 PM
Wow, an amazing transformation. Nice work <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

cook_dw
08-22-2015, 11:54 PM
Nice.. I love watching engine builds.. Will be watching this one.. Love the 75 too btw.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
08-23-2015, 12:54 AM
Thanks for the moral support! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
08-23-2015, 01:09 AM
I decided to &quot;blueprint&quot; the oil pump today. Not much to it other than verifying that there is no crap inside the casting.

I'm glad I took a look. This is a brand-new Melling M54DS oil pump. Inside, all of the machined surfaces were incredibly sharp and I found tiny metal burrs and little shards that were just sitting there, waiting to get pumped in to engine. NEVER trust a new pump without looking inside it first.

Here is the housing once I pulled the gears out. See how sharp the edges are?

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30853-img_1284.jpg

Now take a closer look and you can see a metal splinter leftover from the machining process that was under the gear, as well as burrs on the edges of the machined passages.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30854-img_1285_a.jpg


I spent a while with a Dremel tool and some fine sandpaper smoothing all the internal edges. I also used a 1/2&quot; drill bit to open up the feed hole that mounts to the block to it's correct 1/2&quot; size. It was rough cast from two halves and they were not matched up correctly. I then washed and scrubbed and brushed the housing out in hot water and soap.

Here is the housing after the edges were smoothed and before washing:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30857-img_1289_a.jpg


And the final pump reassembled. I packed it with grease so it will prime instantly when the times comes.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-30858-img_1291.jpg

njsteve
08-24-2015, 10:19 PM
Update from the machinist: He examined the crank and said I could run the crank &quot;as is&quot; but if it was his engine he'd cut it .010/.010 just to make it perfect. So that's what we're gonna do. We should know about the block dimensions tomorrow.

njsteve
08-25-2015, 09:25 PM
Got the block update this morning. It needs a little cleaning up of the .030 bore, so it will be bored to .040. The machinist said, &quot;yeah you could leave it at the existing .030, hone it, and slap it together, but if it was mine I'd make it perfect at .040 and start from there.&quot;

Since I have to order a set of forged pistons anyway, I went for the .040 (same price as the .030).

$312 for http://www.summitracing.com/parts/slp-l2359nf40

scuncio
08-25-2015, 09:45 PM
Love to see your progress. I will be going through a low-mile 0.030-over 455 short block and 6X-8 heads very soon.

Which begs the question...what will your CR be with the 6X-4 heads?

njsteve
08-26-2015, 12:39 AM
With the 6X-4 heads off a 350, around 9.5 to 9.75 to 1. They are the 93 cc heads but have been cleaned up to get them flat. The block will be surfaced flat as well. So it should make them a wee bit smaller. I will CC the heads once I get them off the 350 in the car now where they currently have 7.5 to 1 compression. (BTW, the 6x-8 heads off of a 400 are 100 cc)

Here is the chart info from the pistons

Pontiac 455 L2359NF

72cc = 11.5 1 to 1

87cc = 10.01 to 1

96cc = 9.3 to 1

111cc = 8.34 to 1

114cc = 8.17 to 1

scuncio
08-26-2015, 02:21 AM
Thanks! I'm using the same pistons. I keep hearing about Pontiacs being detonation sensitive so I was leaning toward a 9.1 CR...what do you think?

njsteve
08-26-2015, 11:04 AM
The detonation is really a function of camshaft centerline in these cars. You need a wide centerline on a big Pontiac to avoid detonation and get the most power. That was the nightmare of the engine in my black '72 455HO. Back in the 1970's an &quot;expert&quot; engine builder slapped in some domed pistons (which Pontiacs don't take kindly to) and a crappy cam choice. The thing would detonate under any load, even with the timing backed off 20 degrees! It had around 11.5 to 1 compression. When I did a compression check it showed 225 PSI!!!

A lot of guys swear by the Summit Racing 2802 cam (if they are not going the rollercam route). And you can't beat the price! That is what is going into this motor. - The Melling SPC7 reproduction RAIII/455HO 068 cam I had just installed in the 350 is too mild for the 455 with these heads. So I guess I'll save that for the next project.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-2802

There are some very informative discussions on cams on the PY site by some of the better engine builders. Here's one:

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=775018

cook_dw
08-26-2015, 01:36 PM
That is a great cam choice. I would run the almost same specs in a mild sbc but I would tighten up the LSA to 112.. Also impressed by how great the crank turned out.. Gotta love Evaporust.. Any time a new engine is being built and before the oil pump goes on I always pull them apart.. Something inside of me makes me not want to trust a machined part like that to go in an engine without inspection.. Excellent work! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

scuncio
08-26-2015, 01:46 PM
Thanks, great advice! I am going for a relatively tame street engine so the Summit cam may be a good choice.

What are your plans for the heads - valve size, porting, etc?

njsteve
08-26-2015, 03:42 PM
The heads were just done 1,500 miles ago, when we rebuilt the 350, so they are getting bolted onto the 455 short-block as is.

scuncio
08-27-2015, 06:24 PM
I may do some basic port cleanup to the 6X-8 heads I have here on the shelf. I believe these have the larger valves factory installed, so I hope it runs well.

njsteve
08-27-2015, 07:54 PM
Look what showed up today! Oooooh shiny new parts!

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31096-img_1304.jpg

cook_dw
08-28-2015, 12:31 AM
Nice..

njsteve
08-28-2015, 03:34 PM
Stopped by the shop to drop off the pistons and rings. The block has been bored and is awaiting the final honing to size.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31121-img_1315.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31120-img_1313.jpg

cook_dw
08-28-2015, 03:45 PM
Just curious do they use a torque plate on boring and honing?

njsteve
08-28-2015, 04:14 PM
It's an old time shop - lots of experience. They do use torque plates for the Chevies but he says from his experience that there is no measurable distortion with Pontiac blocks when bored with a plate or without one. He indicated that it has to do with head bolt location in proximity to the bore walls. He said that the 400 small block Chevies were the worst for bore distortion due to the siamese bore walls and the close head bolt locations.

cook_dw
08-28-2015, 04:38 PM
Interesting.. Did not take that into consideration..

njsteve
08-31-2015, 10:32 PM
Rods are refinished and awaiting the crank to come back from cutting. Then the reciprocating assembly goes for balancing.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31195-img_1320a.jpg


And the block is finished and home:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31196-img_1323.jpg

njsteve
08-31-2015, 10:34 PM
Here's something interesting. There are stamped letters next to the bores. Are these for selective fit piston assemblies? &quot;S&quot;, &quot;M&quot;, and &quot;L&quot; for small, medium, and large? The 1975 350 block in Gramma's car had similar stampings on the deck surface as well, only they were the letter &quot;P&quot; next to each bore. The machinist said he has seen these on other Pontiac blocks over the years.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31197-img_1324.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31198-img_1325.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31199-img_1327.jpg

Ryan1969Chevelle
08-31-2015, 11:03 PM
Cool, like Olds Select Fit!

Ryan

njsteve
08-31-2015, 11:59 PM
One of the guys over at PY just responded with this chart for selective fit pistons for 1970 and 1971 Pontiacs. Looks like I was right!

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/08/full-1359-31219-7071pistonsizes.jpg

cook_dw
09-01-2015, 12:22 AM
Great info!!!

njsteve
09-02-2015, 05:26 PM
Visited Roger's Automotive again today to drop off a spare flexplate in case they need it for the balancing process. Gotta love that Safest Rust Remover/Evaporust stuff. Two hours of soaking cleaned up the rusty flywheel nicely. (I degreased it completely first).

Before:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31301-img_1335.jpg

After:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31302-img_1337.jpg

njsteve
09-02-2015, 05:28 PM
The balancing of the rods and pistons are done but they are waiting on the crank to get back from being ground. Good news was that both the rods and the pistons had less than a gram variance between each individual piece. So very little had to be done to them.

njsteve
09-04-2015, 10:10 PM
Since we will be adding a bunch of horsepower to the car I figured it was time to install a tachometer to keep an eye on things.

I did not want to change the dash in Gramma's car by installing a Rally gauge setup with tach because that would require a complete dash wiring harness change along with a ton of other items. So I decided to go with an old school tach I had sitting on a shelf in the garage.

I have had this particular Sun Super Tach II for at least 30 years and it has been in over a half dozen cars of mine in that timespan.

I also did not want to drill a hole anywhere in that pristine dash. And of course there is not enough room on the column for the old school hose clamp over the bracket installation as the turn signal lever is in the way. In addition, the majority of the lower column moves due to the functioning back-drive linkage that locks the shifter in place when the key is removed.

So I pulled the dash fascia and located some existing mounting screws. I then use some bodyshop hammers, a vise, and an anvil to hand-make a mounting bracket that extends out under the dash overhang. I located a vintage flat mount Sun tachometer bracket on ebay for $11 and drilled a couple holes in my handmade bracket and voila, the tach sits very nicely in view. It doesn't block anything behind it other than an idiot light or two, and it looks rather 1970's nostalgic.

My Franken-bracket:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31410-img_1351.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31411-img_1352.jpg


And the installation. The drop down distance of the horizontal bracket is just enough to keep the two mounting screws from touching the underside of the padded dash.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31412-img_1367.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31413-img_1362.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31414-img_1365.jpg

olredalert
09-04-2015, 10:18 PM
----Geez, Steve! you covered up all the idiot lights. What will you do???.......Bill S

njsteve
09-04-2015, 10:32 PM
They still function with all the existing stupid sensors. I installed an Autometer mini gauge pod in the console pocket a couple decades ago. Also using existing mounting holes. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

scuncio
09-04-2015, 11:01 PM
Nice work!

njsteve
09-05-2015, 12:52 PM
BTW, if you look at the above photo through the windshield, sitting by the woodpile, you will see two NOS 15&quot; studded, whitewall, radial, snow tires. Is anyone building a vintage 1960-70's station wagon they could use them on?

MarcDant
09-06-2015, 02:17 AM
Hello njsteve i noticed you used the bop rear seal from butler on your other post. how has the seal performed to date i ordered a butler 467 ci rotating assembly for a 69 400 &amp; included was that seal.Ive heard mixed negative and positive results about that seal.thank you marc.

njsteve
09-06-2015, 11:20 AM
I've used it on three engines in a row and none leaked. Just follow the directions to the letter. BOP have just come out with a new one-piece version that you make a single cut in, to install but I chose to go with what I know works. The bad rap about the seal you are referring to is mostly from bad knockoffs of their seal and not the actual BOP unit.

njsteve
09-07-2015, 02:59 PM
I still had the pressure washer that my buddy loaned me for cleaning the engine block a couple weeks ago, so I decided to throw Gramma's car up on jackstands and clean the underside. The frame rails look beautiful - never crunched in or rusted out! The only issue on the car is tail panel that is behind the urethane rear bumper fascia. Poorly repaired when the car was repainted 25 years ago. Glad I waited since they now reproduce the tail panel and inner reinforcement panel. Too bad I have to buy both full panels just to use the bottom couple inches of both.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31542-img_1384a.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31544-img_1392a.jpg

The frame rails look great (though I proceeded to blow off the grime and undercoating that hid the original white overspray. Please ignore the graffiti-esque marks in the wheelwell body schutz that the pressure washer made. I used a wider nozzle later to clean that up.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31539-img_1387.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31540-img_1385.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31543-img_1389.jpg

njsteve
09-07-2015, 08:56 PM
It's a slow day 'round here so me and the boy decided to play with the block. I showed him how to properly install the main bearings in the journals. (and made him read the tiny stamped print on the back of each bearing shell to verify that they were all the correct .010 undersize bearings).

We also painted the block with some of the leftover Bill Hirsch, Inc., engine paint that I had from when we did the 350. (1975/6 Pontiacs were painted a unique metallic blue color that looks very similar to Oldsmobile Blue engine paint. We used a sponge brush and it came out great. The stuff dries slowly enough so that no brush marks appear anywhere.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31560-img_1407.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31561-img_1409.jpg

KevinW
09-07-2015, 10:16 PM
oooooh, shiny paint! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

MarcDant
09-08-2015, 12:25 AM
Are you building that to stock specs.Looks like a nice project.Keep up the good work.

njsteve
09-08-2015, 12:31 AM
Not stock. They barely had any horsepower in 1975. Around 155 for the 350 and 200 for the 455. This one should be around 400 horses or so and 500 lbs of torque. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

cook_dw
09-08-2015, 12:12 PM
Ive always liked that blue.. Reminds me of LeMans.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
09-08-2015, 05:26 PM
Over the past couple years several people have asked me why I painted the engine the same color as the car. Just a coincidence that they look like the same color. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

njsteve
09-10-2015, 08:06 PM
Crank and the rest of the internals are all finished with balancing and ready to go.


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31648-img_1419.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31647-img_1418.jpg

scuncio
09-10-2015, 09:28 PM
Nice. What did you do with the rods?

njsteve
09-10-2015, 11:14 PM
They reconditioned them - they were a little out of round on the big ends so they shaved the cap mating surfaces and then honed them to proper circular dimensions. They also have ARP bolts installed. Everything all balanced up to match the crank. Probably a lot of overkill for an engine that won't be turning much RPMs but trying to teach the boy that you should do it properly the first time, so you don't have to do it over again a couple years later. Unless, of course you want to in order to make two or three times the horsepower. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

Ryan1969Chevelle
09-10-2015, 11:30 PM
Sounds right to me!!!

Can I stop by when you are bored with a W-31?

Ryan

cook_dw
09-10-2015, 11:57 PM
Nice.. Your machining guy this a crap ton quicker than mine.. My guy has had a customers shortblock for 2 months.. But what can you do when he is the best around.. I usually take him one and then another a month or 2 later.. He stays covered up.. I bet I know what someone is doing this weekend!!

njsteve
09-11-2015, 12:11 AM
Now that I have my parts home I can give you his name and number. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

It's Roger's Speed and Machine in Garwod, NJ

https://www.facebook.com/Rogers-Speed-Shop-136305069751697/timeline/

They are an old time shop and do great work on all sorts of engines - Chevy, Olds, Pontiac, Ford, Mopar.
Very reasonable prices and have always been speedy with the service.

Check out the page 3, storage room photos from the 50th Anniversary party for the shop. You Chevy guys will need a drool cup...

http://sharkeyimages.zenfolio.com/shop_tours_rogers_speed_shop_50th_anniversary

One of the machinists has an evil sounding, silver 1970 LS6 Chevelle that he brings to the cruise nights in my town.

njsteve
09-11-2015, 12:15 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ryan1969Chevelle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sounds right to me!!!

Can I stop by when you are bored with a W-31?

Ryan </div></div>

I need something to pry the boy away from that darned X-Box.

On Saturday we will be installing the crank, and a piston or two and then measuring the installed deck height. We need to find out exactly what it is to see what the eventual compression will be. Depending on the variation with the 6X-4 heads, could be from 92-96 CC chanbers, ranging from 9.3 to 9.8 to 1.

scuncio
09-11-2015, 01:09 AM
Cool Steve. I picked up my 0.030-over short block last weekend. This one has been balanced, and the beam edges of the rods have been polished as well as the ARP bolts added. I'm going to cross my fingers and run it as-is after I pull it apart and look it over.

cook_dw
09-11-2015, 01:14 AM
I am digging the blown 392.. I want to do a hemi at some point..



Page 3 is <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/drool.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/drool.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/drool.gif


I really like the crankshaft holder.. Great idea! Too bad they are in New Jersey.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/frown.gif

MarcDant
09-11-2015, 03:42 AM
Hi steve heres a pick of the 69 400 block im working on ordered milodon caps for the block.Threw it on the bridgeport and drilled and tapped the outer bolts before it goes for line bore.might have to do the thrust cap myself because alot of shops here are reluctant to do it.
p.s: sorry about the image angle, had trouble uploading it. http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-18984-31675-photo_3.jpg

njsteve
09-11-2015, 11:04 AM
That's the nice thing about the 455 blocks, they are already drilled and tapped for four bolt mains. But don't tell that to all the craigslisters who think it is something really special and should demand twice the price.... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

MarcDant
09-11-2015, 01:00 PM
We looked high and low for a 73 and under block for either 400 or 455 and couldnt find one here in canada.His rotating kit has the 400 journals in witch butler recommended to him.

njsteve
09-11-2015, 08:54 PM
Crankshaft and rear main seal installed. Lifting done by me. Boy did the torqueing. He was actually able to pull 120 lbs on the torquewrench this time. (he finally weighs 98 lbs.) Now it has to sit overnight for the BOP rear main seal to set.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31695-img_1422.jpg

MarcDant
09-11-2015, 10:04 PM
Steve the seal seats itself how does that work.thanks marc.

njsteve
09-11-2015, 10:49 PM
You have to set the two piece lip seal into position with a specific amount of silicone sealer in the anti-rotation notches that are built into the block. You do not fill the area with sealer, otherwise it will cause too much pressure and cause the lip seal to fail. That is why you drop in the crank, bolt the mains down and don't rotate the crank for a day, in order to give the sealer time to cure.

We just finished up measuring the ring gaps in the cylinders and then installing the rings on the pistons. Getting ready for piston/rod installation tomorrow.

MarcDant
09-11-2015, 11:51 PM
That makes sense good to know thanks.On the chevys i use the brown aviation sealer with the seal staggerd a quarter inch from the parting lines its always worked good for me.Those serrated knureled areas in the crank of a pontiac have puzzeled me.Almost every one i talk too around here has had leaks.

njsteve
09-12-2015, 11:06 PM
The boy and I installed the pistons and rods today. We each did four. I got the odd side and he did the even side. (Ignore the harmonic damper puller on the crank...it was the only thing I could find with the proper threads to go in the crankshaft. I didn't have a spare balancer bolt anywhere). <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

Got the old dial indicator set to TDC. Checked the deck height with using both a flat edge and feeler gauge and then verified with a depth caliper. Got -.016 for both readings on all eight bores. Checked the ring gaps yesterday prior to installing rings on pistons.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31768-img_1434.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31769-img_1441.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31770-img_1442.jpg

Showed him how to measure rotating torque...and told him several more times to keep his left hand off of the measuring indicator....I figured after he got incorrect readings after ten or fiftten revolutions he would eventually listen to me and do it properly without the interfering hand. He finally got a reading of 300 inch pounds. I made him do the math to convert it to foot pounds. (25 lb.ft.)

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31771-img_1439.jpg

69biscayne
09-13-2015, 01:36 AM
What do you use to lubricate the rings during assembly?

Steve

njsteve
09-13-2015, 02:03 AM
I used some 5W-30 oil on the bores, rings, and wrist pins. Lubriplate 105 on the bearings. I actually used up the tube that I had for the past decade or so, on this engine. Had to break down and buy another tube at NAPA for $7.99.

cook_dw
09-14-2015, 10:52 PM
Wow.. That photo of your son gave me flashbacks to when I was his age and my father passing down his knowledge.. Very cool and glad to see he is staying interested.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

njsteve
09-14-2015, 11:03 PM
I am trying!

I was just perusing some old emails and ran across this one from his sister about 9 years ago. She would critique his behavior as a toddler and then email me. Here is her description of his actions during a visit to his Gramma's house:

<span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">&quot;in about 2 hours he did the following: poked me with a pen, scribbled on my paper, destroied my tower, mimmicked me, scribbled on mom's drawings, stole grandma's french fries without asking, wiped syrup on me, spoke rudly to people, stole my french fry and then licked it, called mom a sponge head, clanded silverware even when mom said to stop 5 times, said mom draws horrible, kept poking me, stuck his tunge out at me, hit me 13 times, really hurt my arm by squezing it, made a mess with butter and got butter every where, threw a fit about not getting to sit in the back, and said &quot;shut up everyone i'm trying to sleep!!!&quot; and now he has that evil look in his eye so I better watch him closly&quot;</span></span>

Gotta love those memories. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Yesterday we visited my parents and on the way home he was trying to do his high school Algebra II homework in the car. His sister was helping him since she is a math wiz and a junior in college. It was an updated version of the email above. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

njsteve
09-14-2015, 11:06 PM
Checked the main bearing oil clearance today. They all seemed to be between .0015 and .00175 (just shy of .002 on the plastigage.

Here's an .0015:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-31875-img_1460.jpg

SuperNovaSS
09-14-2015, 11:46 PM
Steve,

I don't comment on your threads enough but I am always following them. Well done. I love plasti gauge. Such an easy way to check the machine shop. Your offspring are going to be some of the few who still know how to build a vintage engine in years to come. I plan to pass the touch as well.

Currently in training:

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w301/super-novass/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps3o0htyyj.jpg (http://s179.photobucket.com/user/super-novass/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps3o0htyyj.jpg.html)n

njsteve
09-15-2015, 12:00 AM
Nice pirate hoard of parts!

My son was at the kitchen table a few minutes ago and was doing his history homework. The assignment involved interviewing someone about an event in the past. He picked the prior engine rebuild of Gramma's car from 2011. It seems that I remember a lot more than he does, about events four years in the past when he was ten years old. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/smile.gif

SuperNovaSS
09-15-2015, 12:31 AM
That's awesome Steve. I hope you don't feel like I was trying to hijack your thread. I just thought it was a decent parallel. Again, great job on the build and family.


Jason

njsteve
09-15-2015, 01:52 AM
No problem. Loved the photo. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

earntaz
09-15-2015, 02:23 AM
Will not Plastigage give a more accurate measurement on a dry surface -- no oil or Lubriplate? TAZ

njsteve
09-15-2015, 02:37 AM
The actual area where the plastigage was placed is clean, though it's hard to tell in the photo. I wiped the application area clean of oil and lubriplate prior to the application of the plastigage and retorquing the main cap. After taking the measurement I then clean the plastigage off with a little brake clean and then reapply the lubriplate prior to reinstalling the main cap and torquing to spec.

cook_dw
09-15-2015, 11:49 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: njsteve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I then clean the plastigage off with a little brake clean and then reapply the lubriplate prior to reinstalling the main cap and torquing to spec. </div></div>


Most people dont realize that leaving any of the plastigage on the bearing surface can cause a premature failure.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
09-17-2015, 11:54 PM
I sent that 1971 7041262 455 Quadrajet to Eric (Vintage Musclecar Parts) for some magic. Let's see what he does with it. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

VintageMusclecar
09-18-2015, 05:34 PM
Last month Steve approached me about building a Quadrajet for this project. Of course I enthusiastically agreed!

The carb arrived Wednesday. Nice packaging job Steve! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32008-001.jpg

I got the carb out of the box and immediately two things jumped out at me. See if you can guess the first one:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32009-002.jpg

Look closer...

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32010-003.jpg

Somewhere along the line, a ham-fisted &quot;mechanic&quot; has cranked this poor carb down to an intake with everything they had.

Can you see the resulting bow?

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32011-004.jpg

Look at the gaps at the end of the straight-edge:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32012-008.jpg

And in the center of the top casting here:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32013-009.jpg

I've seen a LOT worse, but this one still requires de-warping.

Now that the lid is off (not w/o a struggle, be back to that in just a moment), we can see she's nice and crusty inside.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32014-006.jpg

Here's the next clue something was amiss:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32015-004.jpg

Not an OEM fuel inlet fitting...that usually means....

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32016-005.jpg

Yep...a self-tapper. Someone's stripped the inlet threads at some point. Nothing we can't handle though.

As I alluded to above, the carb didn't want to come apart w/o a fight. It usually takes me ~45 minutes to break a Quadrajet down. I fought this one for over 2 hrs and <span style="font-style: italic">still</span> lost a couple of battles along the way lol.

One of these things is not like the other...

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32017-007.jpg

Both of them were stuck tight....with a lott'a heat and some penetrating oil I got one to break free, but the other wasn't having any part of it.

Lousy little....&amp;*@^*^!^$

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32018-010.jpg

I tried heat &amp; Vice Grips, again to no avail--broke off flush, so I had to drill the remnants out from the backside.

SO...the carb's 99% disassembled at this point, and the main body is currently cooling down on my de-warp fixture. Once it's done I'll de-warp the top casting, then it's back to the main body to remove the idle pick-up tubes. I don't normally remove the idle tubes when servicing a Quadrajet, but when one's this crusty inside, they really need to come out to make sure there's no corrosion in the main well and/or on the tubes themselves that could cause problems later on down the road.

More soon, stay tuned.

And before I forget, thank you Steve for letting me be a part of this build. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/beers.gif

markinnaples
09-18-2015, 05:48 PM
Wow, you do some amazing work. If I'm ever in the position of having one (or two) carbs rebuilt, you're the go-to guy.

njsteve
09-18-2015, 06:03 PM
Holy Bowly, Carb-Man. Looks like the Joker had his way with that quadrajet!

Sorry about that, Chief. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/eek.gif

VintageMusclecar
09-18-2015, 06:09 PM
LOL...no worries my man, we'll handle it. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Xplantdad
09-18-2015, 07:59 PM
Dang....and I was going to say that the screws on the choke plate weren't indexed <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/no.gif <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

Can't wait to follow along...and I've got to send something your way soon. Cruising season is fast approaching!

earntaz
09-18-2015, 08:25 PM
I think that baby was in the St Louis flood at one time ... looked like some Mississippi silt deposits in there ... TAZ

VintageMusclecar
09-18-2015, 09:28 PM
The main body is as de-warped as it's going to get, and the lid is now flat. Sometimes it's not feasible to remove all of the warp from the main body since the outer corners (where the 5/16&quot; mounting bolts pass through) actually get crushed slightly when the carb has been so badly over-tightened. If you manage to get the top of the carb 100% flat again, the bottom of the body where it meets the base will no longer be flat. You sort of have to split the difference. As long as the center of the top casting can seal against the main body where the circuits converge, chances are the carb will function just fine.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32025-011.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32026-012.jpg

The idle pickup tubes were removed, and there was definitely enough corrosion in the main wells to warrant their removal. Unfortunately I couldn't get a decent picture down in the main well, so you'll just have to take my word for it.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32027-014.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32028-015.jpg

Here is an OEM style fuel inlet fitting.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32029-016.jpg

As mentioned earlier, the carb had been equipped with a self-tapping fuel inlet fitting. Thankfully the casting wasn't damaged too badly by the self-tapping fitting, and I was able to cut the main body for a Heli-coil insert to go back to the original thread size (7/8&quot;-20) so an original style inlet fitting can be reinstalled.

Typically, when the castings are cut for Heli-coils, most rebuilders free-hand the job which results in the threads not being square to the original threads. As a result, the inlet fitting doesn't make contact all the way around on the sealing surface which obviously results in a leak. To address this, most rebuilders install a thick Teflon washer to compensate for the fitting not being square. This Teflon washer will compress unevenly which allows it to make a seal all the way around. That said, it's pretty unsightly and sticks out like a sore thumb on an otherwise nice rebuild or restoration.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32030-017.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32031-018.jpg

About a year ago, I came up with my own invention to be able to cut the castings for a Heli-coil square to the original threads. This allows the use of an original style thin rubber coated steel gasket.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32032-019.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32033-020.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32034-021.jpg

While that may not seem like a big deal to most, to me little details like this matter.

Please note that my tooling is proprietary, so I'm not going to show that process. At this time I'm only able to repair 7/8&quot;-20 threads, I can not do the later 1&quot;-20 threads. Also, my process requires there be at least a couple of good remaining original threads left in the casting to reference from. If it's stripped all the way to the bottom of the bore I can't repair it.

SO...the carb goes into the clean line tomorrow. There's more to come, hopefully I'll be able to pick this back up within a week or so.

scuncio
09-18-2015, 10:51 PM
And this is why I sent my GTO's Q-jet to you. :-)

njsteve
09-19-2015, 12:34 AM
Excellent. I am definitely learning a lot already. (Note to self: find carbs in better condition!) <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

njsteve
09-19-2015, 09:42 PM
We measured the connecting rod oil clearance today with Pastigage. The boy's calibrated eyes said they were .0015.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32060-img_1465a.jpg

VintageMusclecar
09-21-2015, 10:20 PM
Here's the carb post cleaning:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32135-010_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32136-011_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32137-012_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32138-013.jpg

Not much of the original finish left to speak of.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32139-014_2.jpg

After de-uglification:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32140-015_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32141-016_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32142-017_2.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32143-018_2.jpg

Compare the inside of the float bowl now to the pic posted earlier:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32144-024.jpg

The steel hardware will go out for plating shortly. As soon as I get everything back and get the carb back together I'll post another update.

njsteve
09-22-2015, 12:29 AM
WOW! It's naked! Amazing difference before and after. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

MarcDant
09-22-2015, 02:11 AM
Carburator looks like a new casting now. Nice stock appearence again.What cfm is it.

njsteve
09-22-2015, 04:17 AM
I think it is 750. Maybe Eric can give the correct info.

John Brown
09-22-2015, 05:09 AM
Looks to be a 750 by this picture.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32144-024.jpg

earntaz
09-22-2015, 12:51 PM
Yep -- doesn't appear to be a &quot;bump&quot; in the venturi ... TAZ

VintageMusclecar
09-27-2015, 04:54 PM
I must make a confession;

I wasn't sure I was going to be able to save this carb. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/blush.gif

When I started to build the sub-assemblies, I realized this carb was warped a <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic"><span style="text-decoration: underline">lot</span></span></span> worse than I'd originally thought. While the bow wasn't <span style="font-style: italic">super</span>-bad at the front, the carb was warped like hell in the center of the casting. I noticed this somewhat during dis-assembly but didn't realize how bad it was until it started to go back together. I actually had a little trouble getting a few of the screws started because the body still had some warp in it that I simply could not get out.

That said....

drum-roll.......

It runs.

Not only does it run, it actually runs pretty damned good.

It idles beautifully at ~750 rpm, transitions nicely on the way up, and the throttle response is razor-sharp.

I was all but certain this carb was going to kick my ass and make me look like a chump.

Whod'athunkit?!?

I didn't have a correct pull-off in stock so I have to order that in, but other than that it's done.

I'll post a couple of pics and a live test video later.

*whew*.

njsteve
09-27-2015, 07:11 PM
Awesome! For a junk carb that was thrown in with the engine block I bought, it's sure nice to know that there are artisans out there who can turn a sows ear into a silk purse. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
09-27-2015, 07:14 PM
I'm out in the garage today. Just got the 350 engine pulled out with the help of the wife and the boy (both of whom promptly ran off to go shopping and back onto the Xbox, in that order).

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32421-img_1485.jpg

VintageMusclecar
09-27-2015, 07:45 PM
A couple of pics on the test engine. Again note I didn't have a correct choke pull-off in stock so I just capped off the vacuum port so I could run it.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32427-001_2.jpg


http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32428-002_2.jpg


There are two small tabs on the top casting that are meant to act as a closing stop for the secondary air doors. Unfortunately on this carb, one was broken off completely and the other was badly worn. Since the carb <span style="text-decoration: underline">must</span> have some means of preventing the secondary air doors from trying to close <span style="font-style: italic">too</span> far, I employed a common trick of using a small flat washer under one of the rear-most screws to act as a stop.

Ain't pretty but it works, and it saves an otherwise junk (and somewhat hard to find) casting from the scrap heap.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1124-32429-003_2.jpg

Click the pic below for the video. Please note the air/fuel readings aren't entirely accurate on the meter. The rings in my test engine are beyond shot, and as such it huffs a considerable amount of oil which skews the readings. (I really need to get that poor thing rebuilt, but I just can't find the time!)

FWIW, the ~12.5 a/f ratio on my meter directly correlated to a ~14-1 a/f ratio on Kammers dyno, so you can extrapolate from there.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d73/VMCP777/MISC/th_Live%20test_zpsqun9i1rm.jpg (http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d73/VMCP777/MISC/Live%20test_zpsqun9i1rm.mp4)

Steve, I'll give you a shout next week as soon as I've got the pull-off in.

Thanks again for letting me be a part of the build.

njsteve
09-27-2015, 08:21 PM
That is way too cool. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

You know, Eric, I consider it your fault that I am going to have to detail the engine compartment to match that snazzy looking carb.

And then I'll have to repaint the 25 year old paint job on the car...

And then update the suspension...


another example of &quot;Give a mouse a cookie...&quot;

njsteve
09-27-2015, 08:25 PM
BTW, what vacuum ports are full vacuum and what are ported? I usually run the distributor vac advance off of the full vacuum coming from the big cast aluminum &quot;T&quot; that comes of the back of these Pontiac carbs. If this one actually has a port for the vac advance I'd be happy to use it. (It also needs to use of of the vac ports for the auto trans vac modulator).

VintageMusclecar
09-27-2015, 08:28 PM
This carb only has two vacuum ports aside from the one for the choke pull-off:

The one on the base is manifold, the one on the top pass. side above the pull-off port is ported.

The back of the base does have the 1/8&quot; pipe thread boss if you have a vacuum tree for it.

VintageMusclecar
09-27-2015, 08:30 PM
BTW, I wouldn't worry too much about having to detail the engine bay because of the carb...that's one of the cruel ironies of my profession--all my hard work is usually hidden beneath a big ugly-assed air cleaner lol.

njsteve
09-29-2015, 12:32 AM
Ran into the first engineering problem of the day...

The dipstick tube assembly that routes the dipstick away from the crankshaft and toward the oil pan sump had a little glitch in translating to a block five years younger.

See if you can identify the issue:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32489-img_1492.jpg


Yes, the bracket was designed for a 1975 block that had the #3 main cap with the two mounting bosses not a 1970 block that had #2 and #4 caps with the mounting bosses for a windage tray.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32490-img_1493.jpg

njsteve
09-29-2015, 12:44 AM
So I went to the old bolt bucket and found a Pontiac cylinder head bolt with the stud that the negative battery cable mounts to. It was the perfect stand to mount the modified bracket to. Thankfully 455 blocks are predrilled for four bolt mains and the bolt just screwed right in. (along with some red Loctite to keep it in place).

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32491-img_1495.jpg

And after two hours of test fitting, drilling, heating, bending, reheating, and rebending, the bracket mounted up nice and tight in the correct position. I used red Loctite on the nut as well as centerpunching the edges of the nut to crimp the threads slightly. I test fit the oil pan with the dipstick tubes in place, as well as spun the crank to make sure it was a long way away from the reciprocating assembly zone.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32493-img_1499a.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32502-img_1496.jpg

scuncio
09-29-2015, 02:07 AM
Nice fix. I have the same dipstick...but I'm using a '70 YH block which I believe (hope?) has those mounting bosses!

njsteve
09-29-2015, 02:17 AM
If you're using a 70 block you probably will run into the same problem. They ran a windage tray and the lower dipstick tube attached to it. Do you have the 70 tray and dipstick tube?

The later model years got rid of the windage tray and used an oil pan with a welded-in baffle, instead. Since I am using the 1975 baffled oil pan i wanted to retain the matching dipstick assembly.

njsteve
09-29-2015, 11:18 AM
Here's a shot of an earlier block with the factory windage tray mounted to the #2 and #4 main caps. When they went to the baffled pan, they stopped using the windage tray.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32503-engine_050_windagetray.jpg

And the later baffled pan that replaced it. It prevented oil starvation. Due to the gentle slope in the center of the pan, the non-baffled pans were notorious for the starvation issues on deceleration when all the oil tsunami'd to the front of the pan causing the oil pickup to suck air.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/09/full-1359-32506-cimg5864.jpg

TMagda
09-29-2015, 12:59 PM
Steve, just curious. How do you ensure the dip stick sits in the proper location to give you accurate oil level readings?

njsteve
09-29-2015, 03:11 PM
The lower half of the tube is bent at a specific angle and connects with the intermediate tube which is pressed Into the block. So, other than adjusting the swivel left or right, the angle is preset.

SuperNovaSS
09-29-2015, 03:17 PM
It seems like if you are worried about the dipstick possibly being inaccurate than you can verify on the initial fillup if you know what the oil capacity is supposed to be. Looking great Steve! Something tells me this isn't going to be a Grandma's car anymore. I imagine you are going to run a bit more aggressive bump stick. Are there any other changes coming like a converter or rear gears?


Jason

njsteve
09-29-2015, 06:31 PM
The cam is a Summit Racing #2802. It's the trick low budget ($78) hot cam for this setup. It came highly recommended from several Pontiac engine builders. Rear gears are 3.42 which may even be too much already. My SD455 has 3.08 gears and runs right in the most potent portion of the torque band.

SuperNovaSS
09-29-2015, 07:21 PM
Interesting. I would have thought the gears would 2.XX.


Jason

njsteve
09-29-2015, 07:59 PM
I swapped the single leg 2.76 rear for a 1980 3.42 posi rear 25 years ago.

SuperNovaSS
09-30-2015, 01:36 AM
Ah ha!

cook_dw
09-30-2015, 01:47 AM
Why didnt you just swap the 2 caps..??.. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif

Nice ingenuity..

<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif

njsteve
09-30-2015, 11:44 AM
I thought about that...for about a millesecond until I remembered the cost of align boring an engine. If I was going to go that route I would then go to a set of four bolt main caps. Once again, give a mouse a cookie... <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/rolleyes.gif

cook_dw
09-30-2015, 06:43 PM
I guess my humor didn't come across. I meant just swap caps now.. Lol. Who needs to Align bore <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/grin.gif

njsteve
09-30-2015, 07:18 PM
I got the humor! <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif and I thought the same thing for a half second and then came to my senses and wondered if it would be possible (but would require a bunch of extra money to do it).

I imagine there are some backyard rebuilders out there who would have done it without even thinking twice about it. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/eek.gif ...And then sold the engine on ebay as a &quot;balanced and blueprinted Big Block 455HO/SD&quot;

VintageMusclecar
10-01-2015, 05:25 PM
Here's the finished product;

Please note that all the peripheral steel components have been re-plated back to their original finishes--some builders run everything in yellow chromate, I try to keep the parts that were originally clear in clear and the yellow in yellow. The fasteners that were originally black are re-plated black.

Also, please note that some other builders will electroplate the castings in order to obtain a super-shiny chromate conversion. While this is an attractive finish, it's nowhere close to OEM. The castings were never plated from the factory, the chromate was applied directly to the bare castings. I reproduce the correct original finish on the castings the same way they were done at the factory, without electroplating them.

I mention this not to disparage anyone else's work, just to highlight the technical differences between my work and the work of other builders.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32634-005.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32635-006.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32636-007.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32637-008.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32638-009.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32639-010.jpg

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/pics/usergals/2015/10/full-1124-32640-011.jpg

Steve, I'll get with you later today.

Thanks again for letting me be a part of this project.

RPOLS3
10-01-2015, 06:12 PM
Wow <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/worship.gif

njsteve
10-01-2015, 06:43 PM
Can I just put this one on my mantlepiece above the fireplace for a while? Too pretty to use!

njsteve
10-01-2015, 07:00 PM
We cc'd the 1975 6X-4 cylinder heads today. One head had chambers all at 94.5cc and the other head were all 93cc. A Pontiac engine guru plugged all the technical info from the build into his desktop dyno and it comes out to 9.44 to 1 compression and a predicted 390 horspeower at 4500 rpm and 480 lb-ft of torque at 3400 rpm. Compare that to the SD455 net rating with 290 horsepower at 4000 RPM and 390 lb-ft at 3600 RPM. <<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/naughty.gif