Anyone know of a Fathom Blue '68 DICK HARRELL Chevelle? [Archive]

the_bowtie_gang

10-10-2001, 11:06 AM

Just as the Subject states.....

This car was from around the Wichita, Kansas area ORIGINALLY, and was last known to have been bought by someone in or near the Kansas City, MO area, or maybe the Missouri area. And NEVER re-registered in their name!!!

I do have the serial number (VIN) (don't ask) and had ran a title search back years ago (when still legal to do so) and have documentation of previous registered owners (all 6 of them) back to the ORIGINAL OWNER.

I also verified that it was a Dick Harrell car from the original selling dealership as well.

This car was described to me (by the last registered owner) as being a "really Dark Blue" I'm guessing Fathom Blue car, with white bucket interior.

He also described to me that it had (what seems to me NOW to be) a fiberglass hood just like the one on the red '68 DH Chevelle owned by Joe Sweezey on & in Muscle Car Review.

Anyone ever seen/heard about this car?

Comments anyone????

Chevy454

10-10-2001, 06:26 PM

Don't take this wrong away, as I don't ask to offend, but to learn: are you sure the car was a Chevelle? I am assuming (yeah, I know happens when you ass-u-me!) that you checked the VIN to make sure it's a Chevelle? Or that you personally saw it or remember it being a Chevelle, and are not getting the info second hand (which has happened to me). It sounds like a '68 Harrell Nova (http://www.yenko.net/reunion/sr2-rm.JPG) is what you are describing, except you are looking for Chevelle!

[Edited by Chevy454 (10-10-2001 at 01:26 PM).]

bkhpah

10-10-2001, 06:48 PM

What was the selling dealer? They built one Fathom Blue Chevelle, but I don't recall it having white interior. The article in which the car appears has black. Only two Chevelles are rumored to have the hood. The blue car had a white stripe on the front like Joe's. The other three cars are to have been red, yellow, and green. That makes five. That is the total the we were told by the people that built the cars. I may have taked to you before on the Chevelle page about the car you are talking about...BKH

68TopStock

10-10-2001, 07:02 PM

the-bowtie-gang

Welcome to the site! Your first post is interesting and I think may help other Harrell fans for future reference. The July '68 Super Stock and Drag Illustrated identifies the test '68 427 Chevelle as being a "midnight blue". Have you seen this article? In regards to the car you are trying to locate, is the "selling" dealership the same as the "originating" dealership?

I have some theory's, one that needs to be either deposed or confirmed. It is that many early Harrell Performance Center cars were orginally ordered through the Fred Gibb Chevy dealership, and then shipped to final destination dealerships after modification at Dick's shop. This is a known fact for the '68 Nova's, and ZL1's. When Dick first set up his shop in Kansas City, he was very close with Fred Gibb, and considered setting up his shop in LaHarpe. I have an article regarding Dick's personal '68 Chevelle Super Stocker, being inadvertantly dropped off at the dealership, in LaHarpe, instead of at the Kansas City shop, when being shipped from Detroit in January of '68. I may have to ask Helen about some of these details.

Does anyone else on this site have further information? I know I discussed this with Joe S. at the reunion, and found his car was ordered at the "selling" dealership. I know Dick was not considered an "official" dealership, however I have seen at least one pic of him in a jacket that read "Dick Harrell Chevrolet" on the back.

For the bow-tie-gang:
Please e-mail me if you would like, for further discussion, if you would like to keep details of your search private, I understand. I am the fellow who owns Fred's first racecar, "Little Hoss".

Chevy454

10-10-2001, 07:16 PM

I thought Joe's car came from Bill Allen Chevrolet? Wasn't this true with the "later" Harrell cars?

the_bowtie_gang

10-10-2001, 08:07 PM

Nope, 100% sure it's a Chevelle... vin starts 138378K....

And after also speaking with the last registered owner...

I think he'd at least KNOW if he owned a Nova versus a Chevelle!! LOL

68TopStock....

Actually there IS a notation on the paperwork (from the "selling" dealership) making reference to Gibb Chevrolet, LaHarpe, IL.

That also makes me wonder if this particular car ever even was at Dick Harrells place in KC.

Or if the paperwork made it seem like (for the "billing" and any "Chevrolet warranty type" paperwork) or reflect merely a transfer between the two actual dealerships, leaving out the stop at the Harrell shop.

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-10-2001 at 03:07 PM).]

Chevy454

10-10-2001, 08:14 PM

How long has the car been off the road (unregistered)? Who is listed on the MSO as the selling dealer? I assume by reading your post it was listed as Dick Harrell?

The reason I ask is, that I was under the impression that Harrell got his cars from either Gibb, and then later Bill Allen(?)...but then again, Ken theorized that Dcik had cars delivered to him...!

Brian:

What dealer did Joe's Chevelle come from?

[Edited by Chevy454 (10-10-2001 at 03:14 PM).]

bkhpah

10-10-2001, 10:28 PM

The Chevelle was Bill Allen. I would think the majority of Chevelles may have been from Allens. We think the 69 427 Camaro was from Bill Allen as well. It makes a good bit of sense to get the cars from Bill Allen after the COPO Nova run, since it would be a local dealer near Dicks shop. The Camaro does not appear to have been at Gibb's. It was sold at Ed Black Chevrolet in New Mexico new. That is a fact. We visited the original owners in New Mexico when we went of a mega road trip to Harrell's shop in Los Cruses NM...BKH

68TopStock

10-11-2001, 12:15 AM

the bowie gang

It seems the car you are trying to locate may either be the one in the '68 article or just another Chevelle, possibly modified by Dick Harrell. If the records show it going through the Gibb dealership, it could be the one in the article. I just spoke with Dave Libby, he worked for Dickie in '68-9.
He verified 5 Chevelles total, for 1968. The one meant to be Dick's Super Stocker apparently was never prepared for racing, just sat for awhile in the shop, until a drivetrain was put in it by Dave's brother. It was red with black vinyl top, just like Joe's. This car is the one I mentioned above, first going to the Gibb dealership.
It was totaled in 1970, per Dave. That leaves 3 others, other than Joe's. Anyone know of there whereabouts? Dave mentioned them being ugly green (2), red (2), and the blue one.

If you determine the possible build date from the VIN, it would probably be before Joe's car, if it went through Fred Gibb. This might help, but who knows. Don't give up until you find the car though, you never know how these things work out. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

SuperCars

10-11-2001, 12:28 AM

My Ralley Green Harrell COPO was delivered new through Bill Allen Chevrolet. I have a certified copy of the Bill Allen Chevrolet bill of sale from the State DMV. Also shows "MO" Motor ID on it. The original owner of this car is still alive and in speaking he told of buying from Bill Allen/Dick Harrell. My 68 Harrell Camaro was delivered through Branine Chevrolet. I have the same sheet and VIN's my Camaro and the Chevelle that Bowtie Gang has. (Len I responded to your email). It notes these two cars coming from Gibb. I also spoke to Mr. Branine whom is retired now, and he told the whole story. The original owner of my 68 is alive and in speaking with him; his family was friends of the Branine's at the time.

Brian, did you get my email I sent several days ago? Kevin

69yenkoman

10-11-2001, 01:24 AM

the_bowtie_gang:

I live in a small town about 10 miles outside the KC area. If you give me the VIN I will do some digging and see what I can find out. I know some people that might be willing to help out. Any rare supercar that comes close to my neck of the woods excites me !!!!

68TopStock

10-11-2001, 01:31 AM

supercars/bhkpah

Did Mr. Branine discuss what the connection was regarding Fred Gibb? I have several original Dick Harrell full page ads, from DragWorld, the one dated 4/12/68 lists Branine Chev. in Mulvane, another dated 7/5/68 does not. Both also list "Courtesy" in Phoenix, Arizona, San Diego, San Jose, and Thousand Oaks, CA, and Fred Gibb, Bill Allen and Burt Chevy in Engelwood, Co. A later 12/13/68 ad lists a new dealer, Riley Chev. in Jefferson City, MO. No further Branine Chev. notice.

I have an announcement article regarding Fred Gibb and Dick Harrell, came from Helen's albums),I think dated early January 1968. I will quote the beginning and other pertinent parts of the article:

"New Dealership for High Performance Cars"

"Fred Gibb, Jr., owner of the local Chevrolet dealership, has announced an expansion in the business activities of Fred Gibb Chevrolet. In association with Dick Harrell of Kansas City, Missouri they are planning the production and distribution of high performance Chevrolets through a limited number of selected Chevrolet dealers throughout the United States. The local firm will furnish the Camaros and Chevelles to the "Dick Harrell Performance Center" in Kansas City where the conversions will be made. The cars will also be sold locally....Speaking of the new business venture, Fred said, "We are quite enthused about this new business, but a lot of work lies ahead. We have been keeping the telephone lines 'hot' between here and Kansas City, Detroit, and the west coast for the past several weeks...As we will be the only dealer in this area, as well as distributor for others, I feel it will surely help business here."

Do you have further information or articles etc. to help understand these relationships?
Were these "gentlemen" agreements or specific contracts? I find the saga of Dickie Harrell and Fred Gibb quite intriguing, and would like to help other owners and those interested learn more about the racing and high performance machines they made and sold. Does anyone know about the Courtesy, Burt and Riley connections?

the_bowtie_gang

10-11-2001, 02:45 AM

Yes, this is the car Kevin is speaking about.
It's not just a modified car or a "tuner" car with wannabe stickers/emblems added.

It was sold new as a "DICK HARRELL" car.

I'm the one who originally documented BOTH Kevins Camaro, and this Chevelle I'm now asking about.

I still have the 1984 newspaper clipping advertising the Camaro (Kevins car) when I could have bought it but didn't.

I was able to document it AND the Chevelle in 1984-85, were any of you owners OR personally involved with ANY Harrell cars then?

I have the original copies of all of Kevins documentation (I believe), except for the later signed statements that he obtained from Mr. Branine & Larry Gann.

...Kevin, I suppose now you'll be "pumped" for the VIN now, like I have been. I had hoped it (the VIN) wouldn't get divulged since I (like you) probably would like a shot at obtaining the car.

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-10-2001 at 09:45 PM).]

68TopStock

10-11-2001, 02:47 AM

the bowtie gang

Just trying to help, I have no intention on trying to "scoop" someone. I have seen others not succeed just because they gave up when they were very close. BTW, Dave Libby lives in Kansas, same place since he worked for Dickie. Maybe he could help.

68TopStock

10-11-2001, 03:41 AM

OOPS (that who painted for Dickie Harrell)

My post above is incorrect regarding the Branine Chevrolet name in conjunction with the 12/13/68 Harrell Ad. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/frown.gif Branine Chevrolet is noted center stage above the Dick Harrell logo. As a note, the ads I have found in later 1969 DragWorlds are smaller, and not full back page ads, with no dealership names mentioned. I also forgot another Chevrolet dealer in California, appearing in the 12/13/68 ad, Crawford Chevy, in Ventura.

Has anyone heard about a "Harrell" car in New Ulm, MN?

the_bowtie_gang

10-11-2001, 05:06 AM

...looking at some of the previous registration documentation I have on these two cars...

Camaro 1st titled 07-30-68

Chevelle 1st titled 05-20-68

They were BOTH marked down on the "New Car check in sheet" (unloaded off of the transport truck??) on 05-07-68.

The Chevelle was titled 13 days later. The Camaro was titled a month and a half to almost a full month later.

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-11-2001 at 12:06 AM).]

68TopStock

10-11-2001, 05:26 AM

the bowtie gang

I didn't think it was directed at me, just covering the bases. I understand the VIN is useless in a search as you are going through. I am clarifying at this time whether some of the Gibb historians can check old archives, to see if they can run VIN's. This might be helpful if and once you have found the car, and are trying to document it fully. Or possibly the current owner has called someone connected with Gibb/Harrell cars.

I do not know if banking records ever are open for data base searches, such as when people are using vehicles for collateral, or listing "assets". This might be a far reach.
Also criminal history searches, when property of known criminals is confiscated by law enforcement.(an inside contact?) Just some thoughts.

Keep the search going, use all resources, knowing details about the car is priceless. That is how I found the "Little Hoss" car. Call all ads that reference the type of car, no matter where you find them. Track every last lead to its conclusion. Do not be timid when contacting people, just ask the proper questions and be polite. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

the_bowtie_gang

10-11-2001, 05:27 AM

68TopStock,

I wasn't directing that ..."pumped" for the VIN quote at you at all.

Since one can't do a "title search" or "title chain search" (as some DMV/state tax commissions/vehicle registrars call them) anymore due to the Federal Privacy Act of 199x, I'm not sure of a legit reason why anyone needs the VIN to help in tracking this car down.

Oh sure, once it's located it would provide final verification that it's the same car I'm looking for.

Maybe I'm missing something, but how would you track a car using it's VIN other than the following....

(a.) State DMV (any and all states it was every registered in.

(b.) NCIC

(c.) NICB (National Insurance Crime Bureau's

(d.) ????

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-11-2001 at 12:27 AM).]

JoeC

10-11-2001, 01:31 PM

According to the classicnovas.net Harrell had some type of arrangement with Courtesy Chevrolet for racing sponsorship and a dealer network. The Courtesy Chevrolet name was on some of the Funny Cars. This is a quote from the nova site "The Chevrolet Dealer Network he (Harrell) established in the state of CA included the Courtesy Chevrolet dealers of Los Angeles, San Diego, San Jose, and Thousand Oaks. Another CA Dealer was Crawford Chevrolet of Ventura, CA. Locations of others were Burt Chevrolet of Englewood, CO, Riley Chevrolet of Jefferson City, MO, Bill Allen Chevrolet of Kansas City, MO, Fred Gibb Chevrolet of LaHarpe, IL, and Courtesy Chevrolet of Phoenix, AZ."

The Courtesy Chevrolet name is still be in buisness and has a web site at

http://www.courtesychev.com/frm_nvh.htm

[Edited by JoeC (10-11-2001 at 08:31 AM).]

69yenkoman

10-11-2001, 02:39 PM

the_bowtie_gang:

I to am just trying to help since I live in the area. I am not interested in trying to take something out from under you. I love this site and these cars. The people here are very knowledgeable and care about authenticity of these automobiles. Anyway I couldnÃt afford the price tag even if I did find it. I understand your hesitation though, one cant be to careful.

69yenkoman

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-12-2001, 08:10 PM

Relax bowtie gang, this site is about sharing info - including VIN numbers - and helping each other with their info requests, verifications, ect.. You would be surprised how many of us were into these specialty cars as early as the mid '80's. I've been looking for a particular car in the KC area for a few years now, I know the frustration with the privacy act and the various DMV's. Were just here to help!!
M

the_bowtie_gang

10-12-2001, 09:19 PM

marlin,

I'm relaxed.

Post the VIN of the car YOU'RE looking for (in the KC area), maybe I can help if I have the VIN http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

THEN ponder the following....

Just because all of you guys that post on this board might be "good guys" and "wouldn't take something out from under me".... well Ya don't HAVE to be signed in/on as a participant or member of this site to VIEW things.

There might be a troll or two (or a few hundred) who come to this site and just browse around just for the heck of it or because they truly are interested in these cars.

Some of THEM just might not be "goog guys" and would JUMP at the chance to have the VIN of a "missing in action" Dick Harrell car, a COPO car, or a YENKO Deuce... or something else.

Now let's see all of your VINs!!! :)

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-12-2001 at 04:19 PM).]

Belair62

10-13-2001, 12:07 AM

Charley Lillard has trained a Chevelle sniffing dog....he posted some results in a couple previous post topics. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/burnout.gif

68TopStock

10-14-2001, 11:17 PM

Just to add to the list of "Dick Harrell" dealers, I have an ad listing Francis Chevrolet, of St. Louis, MO, dated 4/12/68.
BTW: Herb Fox mentioned to me the place he met Dick Harrell was at a small shop in East St. Louis, MO, in summer of 1967. Anyone know what shop this would be?

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-15-2001, 01:55 PM

You don't sound too relaxed bowtie!! I understand a 'put up or shut up' post, so here it is.

The last '70 Yenko Deuce produced was a Cranberry Red, automatic transmission, with power steering car. This car was sold by Yenko Chevrolet to Capital Chevrolet in Montgomery, Alabama around 8/20/70, and was asigned Yenko stock number YS-145. The VIN number is 114270W368916. Camarojoe has some documentation from Capital Chev. that was sent to an interested customer in Sept. of 70 referencing this very car. This car was then involved in either a flood, wreck or theft, and was totalled. The car was most likely sold at auction in Alabama, and was purchased on 2/16/73 by a company called Underwriters Sales Corp in Kansas City, MO. The car had an 'F' title, which leads me to believe that it was a Flood that totalled it. Underwriters sold the car on 10/04/74 with a 'U' title, probably as a Used car. It is not known where this car ended up, but Underwriters is now selling mattresses after getting out of the used car business about 5 years ago. I have checked all surrounding states, all the way to Oklahoma, but have turned up nothing.

Your turn bowtie!! http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif
M

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-15-2001, 03:12 PM

I Forgot!!
My VIN is 114270W349363, Gobi Beige, 4speed '70 Yenko Nova 17th car produced, stock number YS-049, originally sold out of Nankivell Chev. in Indianapolis, IN.
M

Mr70

10-15-2001, 06:11 PM

Marlin, what is your Visa card number? http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-15-2001, 06:25 PM

1142 70W3 4936 3000 - same as my VIN!! http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/laugh.gif
M

COPO

10-16-2001, 01:06 AM

This has been quite an interesting thread. Not choosing sides here, but personally, I can't imagine any of us that were seriously pursuing a lead on an ultra rare car would post the VIN on this public website for all to see. While I agree it's doubtful one of the website regulars would try to scoop Bowtie Gang on the car, he does make a good point about the "lurkers or trolls". Bowtie Gang, I hope you are able to find it soon and we can all see it at a future Supercar Reunion.

ps: if you go back and read the thread on the 71 BM Camaro, I think you'd realize it was a different situation completely. A car that's advertised openly in Hemmings is certainly fair game for anyone.

[Edited by COPO (10-15-2001 at 08:06 PM).]

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 01:06 AM

Thank you, COPO.

And I'm still relaxed. It takes more than comments from a couple of ( ) you fill in the blank, to rile me up.

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 01:27 AM

Man, welcome to this site!!!

1st it was "implied" that I couldn't or didn't know if I was even looking for a Nova or a Chevelle for pete's sake!!!

Then I was "informed" that all five of the Chevelles were X Y or Z (color), that makes five, so the one you're asking about (somewhat implied, can't be the real deal). Maybe it's one modified or something.

Then I get told AGAIN a 2nd time about the five (and only five) built according to Dave Libby.

69yenkoman, you've YET to explain how having the VIN for the car will allow YOU to find it... still waiting...

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY,
If putting a grinning smiley face after a sentence ISN'T usually an indication of
"I'm just kidding", then what is it?

The paragraph after THAT explained my reluctance of posting a VIN for a car that MAY be available. And WAS NOT directly speaking of the ethics of the people on this site.

But, if you WANT to talk about that....
I was warned from ONE OF YOU GUYS ON THIS VERY SITE to watch out for at least some of you.

One of his prime examples was a while back when a guy asked one of you about a '71 Baldwin Motion car and the next thing he knew (while the sale was still pending) that the very same guy he asked questions to about the car buys it.

And then quite a few of you pile on the guy who originally was asking questions about the car... hummm.. sounds just like what I was doing...

http://www.yenko.net/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000456.html

Now before the REST OF YOU HERE ON THIS SITE all pile on ME, I'm just stating what I was told by someone who posts quite a bit here.

I'm NOT painting everyone with a broad stroke of the brush.

But, after the treatment I've had in just one short week by at least a couple of you... WHO'S got a right to want to keep a thing like a VIN number to himself when that example HAS happened?

It's also so highly intelligent for you pick out one misspelled word just to belittle someone. It really makes one understand the maturity level of the one being critical. Feel better about youself, now do you?

Pssst, if sew, what a reel dumbb shiit U R.

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-15-2001 at 08:27 PM).]

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 01:41 AM

COPO,

Yes, and if the guy WAS actively dealing with the broker AND a price "was agreed upon" I believe the post read, then other offers should be held pending outcome of the CURRENT offer.

And I quite agree that pending deals or offers are not binding forever. But whether the time-frame was four hours later, four days later, or a call was to be made by "such and such time", then there WAS a valid pending offer and that broker should have dealt with it BEFORE accepting another offer.

Charley Lillard

10-16-2001, 02:26 AM

I believe another Motion car recently came up for sale on Ebay that appeared to be just as nice as the one the potential buyer missed out on and was priced the same. I believe we suggested that he buy that car but I don't believe he did. I don't know the terms of his orig. offer but the second car should have fit the Bill OK. I even like the White stripes better on the second car. Bowtie..I agree it wouldn't be wise to disclose the vin to anybody also. As for Your comment " I was able to document IT and the Chevelle in 1984-5, were any of you owners OR personally involved with ANY Harrell cars then? " Does that make you better than us ? Sounds like that's the point you are trying to make. Maybe you're just crummier at finding cars. I hope after 15 years you finally find it. Right now I'm thinking I should be out trying to find that # 61 ZL1 with the Leads that were posted on this site.

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 02:27 AM

I was told by "deep throat" (ha ha) that this guy (the one dealing with the broker) had called up and spoken with the guy who ended up with it.

At least that is what I was told by one of you "in the know".

I certainly understand that it would be one thing if the two had not spoken. And the one now with the car, had bought it out straight out of Hemmings.

But with the way it was told to me, it's a slightly different story. And NO, "deep throat" is NOT the disgruntled guy that wanted to buy to car, it was someone else who's posted enough to know who/what is up.

So are we NOW saying NOT to ask questions and about a possible COPO, B/M, Harrell, Gibb, or Yenko BEFORE buying it? So that guy should have "Just jumped on it" and asked questions after buying it? The you snooze you loose thing you're all telling him.

I think I've seen mentioned on this very site where you all shake you heads over all of the people who do not know much about these cars, thinking with their wallets THEN asking questions.

And you guys also had a discussion on all of the fake Yenko crap on eBay... and the worry of how all of the young people today think (might think) it's the REAL DEAL.

So. Then here's what I'm supposed to do....

Post the VIN here and with all of the nice people here, who

"...this site is about sharing info - including VIN numbers - and helping each other with their info requests, verifications, ect.."

That means you guys will give ME first chance at buying the Chevelle, RIGHT?

Charley Lillard

10-16-2001, 02:55 AM

Bowtie..........Marlin might be into sharing vin #'s but we all know he is just Silly... Share the vin # with me and I will let you buy it after I'm done with it. As for Deep Throat, did he just hear the buyers side of the story or did he hear both.... The other side of the story that I was told was that there was no agreement on a sale and that about 6 people were interested in the car and that whoever stepped up to the plate would own the car. I have sat back and watched deals on cars where the buyer told me he wanted the car only to see him drag his feet until someone else scoops it up. I ask my friend why he didn't buy the car and then I find out he was trying to make some stupid trade to get it. We will probably never the exact way the Motion deal went but there are always two sides to a story. I'm not siding with either side but if 69Motion(I think that was the buyer)was ready to step up to the plate I would think that he would then go on to buy the second car that was offered. Maybe he has by now. Maybe he wants my 80 Motion......Hmmmm...

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 02:56 AM

and another "Welcome to this site"....

"Does that make you better than us ?"

No, I reply. But re-read the part where I was told...

"don't know if it's a Nova or Chevelle",

and

"all five of the Chevelles are this, this, or this"

(basically meaning I don't know what I'm talking about, and if that's so, that means that you/them are "better" than me?).

"Maybe you're just crummier at finding cars."

"I hope after 15 years you finally find it."

sweet, more nice things to say to me. Keep it coming.

68TopStock

10-16-2001, 05:14 AM

The_bowtie_gang

I know you are looking for help in trying to find this car. I understand there are those that desire to locate or "find" a car, so as to enjoy the discovery and recognition received from such an effort, and will undermine an other individuals' efforts. This really is hard work, and takes alot of time.

Just knowing the car may exist is great news as I have a strong interest in helping other owners of suspected or known Fred Gibb or Dick Harrell vehicles. I have only been associated with the folks surrounding these cars for a few years , however have found information available, if known, when asking for it. Feel free to e-mail me, and I will give you some names and phone numbers of other owners in the midwest, and the names of the Gibb historians. It appears to me this car is one of those shipped from Fred Gibb to Dick Harrells shop, and then reinvoiced to Branine Chevy. Take this offer as you may, hopefully, you will find the car you are searching for.

[Edited by 68TopStock (10-16-2001 at 12:14 AM).]

69yenkoman

10-16-2001, 05:24 AM

the_bowtie_gang:

Ok Mr negative put your VIN where your mouth is !!!! Marlin's not afraid are you? I really hope you donÃt live the rest of your life fearing someone's out to take something from you. Oh yea and spell checkers usually catch things like...."goog guys" what the heck is that???

I really doubt that with an attitude like that you will get much help from the people on this site. I'm not saying that you should or shouldnÃt post the vin, all I am saying is donÃt perceive everyone as a thief or bad mouth them for trying to help

69 Yenkoman

tom406

10-16-2001, 05:48 AM

I hope the bowtie gang isn't scared off, this is an excellent forum. For even if you look at the Motion deal thread, you'll find that both parties in that dispute handled themselves with decorum, no small feat when one man feels victimized, and another has his character called into question. I haven't found another site where so much information is shared, and the participants have so much hard core knowledge.

Marlin is an optimist, but you will note that he is very generous with his vast resources of Yenko (esp Deuce) knowledge. Its obvious he loves the sharing of information and he can't understand why everybody doesn't do the same. And as long as he feels this way, I will continue to learn from him, for free!

From what I understand, Charlie has bought and sold countless cars and has come to appreciate men of action, not just words. Probably because they actually buy things from him. His one reply was a little catty, but cut some slack-we all have our days.

Being a dealer/broker/appraiser, I've seen and heard a lot of classless moves. I once had a local jeweler copy a registration and go to the sellers doorstep to try and cut us out of a deal. (I wanted to go to the SOB's shop and ask if I could deal direct with his wholesaler when I had a need for gold or diamonds.) I've also held cars for people who promised me they'd buy a car, but neglected to tell me that they had to sell a few things, beg their wife, and win the lottery to pull it off. For the record, whenever I've held a car and not gotten a deposit, I've NEVER had the deal go through. I think I went 0 for 20 before I quit doing that. I'm not a hard seller, but if you're not confident or passionate enough to put money on a deal, buyers remorse will always prevail after a day or two. (Or a month, or however long the seller lets you drag your feet.)

As for sharing VINs and the like, I don't think limiting this type of info to e-mails or other more private means is rude. Chasing cars isn't like sharing information or history. Its more like poker where you play the cards you have to but keep a few close to your chest, so you still can win in the end.

COPO

10-16-2001, 12:05 PM

the bowtie gang, agree w/you 100% regarding the BM Camaro, my point was the broker was the smuck not the sucessful buyer as the car was openly advertised and not something learned about by confidential information.

[Edited by COPO (10-16-2001 at 07:05 AM).]

Steve Shauger

10-16-2001, 01:19 PM

I think you are spending wat too much time questioning our integrity and moral character. To make statements on the BM car which you have no first hand knowledge of, is very weak. Its not what you said but how you said it, that I find offensive. " I have the VIN Don't ask" give us all a break! I have been a member of this board for quite a while and you were the first to stir the pot. If you feel uncomfortable sharing information fine, just be polite about it. I think we all understand your point, but to start your first post like that invites, negative responses. Lets ALL start over and move on!!

sixtiesmuscle

10-16-2001, 01:28 PM

Good suggestion. No biting, no fighting!

Charley Lillard

10-16-2001, 01:54 PM

Caddy ? Me ? Bowtie, have I shown you Marlin's new Baby ?

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-16-2001, 04:02 PM

I agree with Paceme!!

Bowtie asked, I produced. If the smiley face was ment that he was joking - so be it. I was serious, we are here to help anyone that we can. If the VIN can't be used for a title search, and you prefer to keep it quiet - just say so without insunuating that others want it so that they can scoop the car.

Start this thread over, all this whining is making me drunk!! This is a hobby, remember?? Bowtie, sorry if I offended you, let's get back to the facts about this Blue Chevelle.
M

the_bowtie_gang

10-16-2001, 07:42 PM

Yes, and to make statements "ABOUT STATEMENTS" about something that YOU also don't have first hand knowledge of, is also JUST as weak or weaker...

..."To make statements on the BM car which you have no first hand knowledge of, is very weak."

So you're telling me that ALL OF YOU, PERSONALLY have "first hand knowledge" about the transaction on the '71 BM car, and you can therefor freely make comment on it when it gets discussed, simply because you've taken one side over the other.

But if I even hint that 69motion had a valid point to be upset, or even use that as an EXAMPLE why I chose NOT to post a VIN, I get then get hammered?

What hypocracy. Throwing up the "oh you don't have first hand knowledge"... like YOU ALL DO??

And excuse me for not saying the "magical" word PLEASE when I said... "I do have the serial number (VIN) (don't ask)".

Man, I'm smart enough (somewhat) to KNOW that soon a request for the VIN would
follow. It DID, in the ninth reply to my post!

Maybe I should have used that "magic" word...
"PLEASE don't ask". Would THAT have prevented someone from asking? Don't think so.

Steve Shauger

10-16-2001, 07:49 PM

You brought up the 71BM, not anyone else. Move on, your becoming annoying. PLEASE http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

Charley Lillard

10-16-2001, 07:51 PM

Geez...You're just a Happy Guy. Did I show you Marlin's new Baby ?

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-16-2001, 08:15 PM

Charlie;
You Silly freak!! My new baby is the cutest thing on this planet, now if I could just get a digipic of him to prove that he is not a Chi-wawa (sp)!! (Stinkin Boomspeed won't launch a .bmp file, why bbdon????)

Bowtie;
The only thing about your Chevelle description that doesn't seem to fit the photos in the old article is the white interior. Do you know if it was changed at some point? Do any of the prior owners remember it being black like the pics show? Was it a dual quad car or a single 4 carb? I think the hood was called a Stilleto hood from A&A in Georgia, there is a pic of it on a Chevelle in 7/69 or 8/69 SSDI.
M

MikeA

10-16-2001, 08:49 PM

Keep your VIN a secret thatÃs fine. This is a good site and the people here are willing to help those new to the Supercar thing (like me). I have learned a lot by reading and posting questions. I have received appropriate answers to my questions and some site members have emailed pictures etc to help me out. That is what the site is about. Marlin has provided me with more information regarding Ã70 Deuces than I could have ever found myself and answered countless questions concerning Yenko Novas.

It has been a rough first post but give the site a chance.

Mike

Steven J

10-16-2001, 09:14 PM

While the topic of sharing VIN's has come up, does anyone have a list of the full VIN's for COPO Camaros built, that they would be willing to email to me ?

[Edited by Steven J (10-16-2001 at 04:14 PM).]

Belair62

10-16-2001, 10:33 PM

Bowtie, I wouldnt give too much creedence to what people tell you offline.Lots of people out there with their own personal agenda. I posted some inane comment about the B/M deal and was chastised offline by one of our members because I did not feel the pain of the common man ! I AM the common man so it took me a bit by surprise.Hope you find the car.Hope whoever your "deepthroat" is gets over it....

bbdon

10-17-2001, 12:39 AM

Hi Marlin, I have emailed you about the picture.

the_bowtie_gang

10-17-2001, 05:22 AM

Thanks guys for some of those last few comments.

I've received FAR MORE POSITIVE offline comments (email) from some guys from this site, than all of the negative ones HERE.

What amazes me is all of the "Me-TOO, Me-TOO!!..GOOBERS" who made post(s) on this particular topic which absolutely had nothing to do with THE topic at hand.

All they wanted to do was pipe in with their snide, smart-ass comments. And no, not the humorous comments, but the acidic ones.

Yeah, maybe AFTER all was said and done, I came across myself as a smart-ass. But if ya sling the crap at me baby... ya better expect it to fly right back in your face. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

Now on to more fun stuff... work on the 427 '66 Biscayne, or swapping the wicked nasty 327 engine/TH350 combo into the '63 SS Nova... yeah R E A L F U N.

[Edited by the_bowtie_gang (10-17-2001 at 12:22 AM).]

Steve Shauger

10-17-2001, 12:38 PM

Great analogy (crap). Are you related to IGNITION MAN. Charley we need your picture!

[Edited by paceme (10-17-2001 at 07:38 AM).]

bowtie3168

10-17-2001, 07:12 PM

I have to chime in here. I went thru the Lincoln Tunnel last night and some guy would not "let me in"(in other words,would not allow me to merge into line, and by the way,no I did not "jump in" on the line if you were wondering). He rolled down his window and started yelling at me. I rolled down my window and said "after all of the crap that we have all been thru I hope that you realize what an a@#&%*! you are by treating others in the manor that you just treated me?" Lets all try to be nicer to each other. We all share a common interest. Let's keep it cordial. Here is a good tip: when people comunicate via any form of communication other than "face to face" it is very easy to "take things the wrong way". It is a good rule of thumb to give people the benefit of the doubt rather than to assume that that person was trying to insult or offend you. Always re-read your posts and try to make sure that you cannot be taken in a bad way. There are many people out there that do not like our hobby and would like to see it gone, lets not have internal fighting.

Andrew

SuperCars

10-17-2001, 09:44 PM

This is Kevin's wife not Kevin responding because Kevin is right now out in the middle of the Bering Sea fishing King Crab on his boat in some of the worse weather they have seen in a long time. He said it was like the Movie The Perfact Storm. One boat lost a man over board and another boat just got the windows knocked out of his pilot house. Kevin works very hard for what he has. I just want to say that he likes to share your forum with me on different views and I have always injoyed the fun banter that goes on between all of you. You have all seemed like good friends. I was surprised by some of the resent quotes about Kevin. I have always known him to be a man of complete integrity. I am sad that he is not here to respond. And I am saddened that gossip can cause some people such grief. Wenona

bowtie3168

10-18-2001, 01:18 PM

Wenona,
I want you to know that I consider Kevin a true asset to the sYc. I was very impressed with the cars that he has posted to his website. I have never met Kevin but I feel that he has contributed some great info to the forum and I hope that he continues to do so. I like to consider all of the members of the club to be friends of mine, if people do not feel the same way ,well, that is "on them". Let him know that there are people in the club that feel the same way that I do, we like having him around, and not to let any negativity keep him from being a member of the forum. Take care and I wish him a safe return, I hope that next year he might attend the reunion with or without cars. It would be good to have him there with all of us.

Take Care,
Andrew Hinckley

bkhpah

10-19-2001, 03:50 AM

Just got back from vacation and am reading the new posts. I gave out some information that came from a direct conversation with Dave Libby to us. We did not contact him. I shared what was told us and now we are attacked about the number of cars produced, colors etc. What's the deal? We never asked for a VIN or anything like that. I asked if we had talked to you before about this car? You never responded. We have always shared information on this board and once in a great while I wish we hadn't. This is one of those times. We have one of the Harrell '68 Chevelles and Joe has always been willing to share ANYTHING about the car. Whatever the number made or colors produced, it is a rare car. Since records are scarce, you have to rely on the people that can help. Why make enemies?...BKH

COPO

10-19-2001, 05:28 AM

Well said Andrew. While I can't claim to know Kevin well, I have had the pleasure of meeting him in person as well as having a number of telephone conversations. I have always found him to be a man of integrity, helpful and willing to share his knowledge and love of muscle cars.

Hope he makes it back safe. I saw "The Perfect Storm" <=== Frightening to say the least. Where do we go for the crab feast?? http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gifhttp://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

[Edited by COPO (10-18-2001 at 12:28 PM).]

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-19-2001, 01:02 PM

Hey there BK,
We were definitely 'one man down' with this last post, glad you are back - and good comment 'why make enemies?' We are only here to help!!! What do you make of the 'white interior'??

Hi Wenona,
We hold Kevin and yourself in very high regard on this site, but there always has to be a few bottom feeders! We know that Kevin has earned his collection, and appreciates his cars a lot more than most owners. After seeing the TV special on the 10 most dangerous jobs, I was amazed at the conditions under which these guys fish. I could not even work on one of those boats, I get sick in calm seas just going Blue fishing in the Atlantic. We hope and pray for his safety, and await his further contributions to our hobby.
M

fpcopo

10-20-2001, 01:36 AM

Hi All,

I have to respond to what was said about the '71 BM Camaro. I have first hand knowledge about the car and the deal that was made for it. I have known about (and ridden in) this car since '72. My shop was the one that restored the car for the gentleman that Kevin purchased the car from. When I saw what was written on the site I called him and asked him what happened. He informed me that the guy from back east did have a deposit on the car but had dropped the ball as far as coming up with the money to close the deal. As far as I know from what this man told me Kevin was the first one to "pull the trigger". Emotions run high when dealing on these rare cars. The same person that owned the BM car back in '72 sold me my COPO Camaro. Two years before I bought it he had offered the car to his nephew, the nephew screwed around and tried to chisel him on the price. When I was offered the car, I appeared on his doorstep in 30 minutes with a deposit and grabbed the Protect-O-Plate to ensure the car was mine.
The nephew was so mad that I ended up with the car that he wouldn't speak to me for about a year. The upshot of this ramble is,
not to give complete credence to the guy who "lost" the deal. Most of the time it was his own fault. Frank Payne.

SuperCars

10-23-2001, 03:41 PM

I returned from Alaska night before last, read this thread after my wife's telling me about it. I finally have calmed down enough now to respond in a gentleman-like fashion.
I will again tell the real story on the 71 B/M Camaro for Bow Tie Gang since he is stirring up the controversy.

I contacted Jon Bischof about selling his 71 B/M Camaro 2 years prior and it was not for sale at that time. When 69 motion Jeff called me I had my Hemmings in my hands as well, which had the 71 B/M ad in it. Jeff asked me what he thought the B/M car was worth, and secondly if I was interested in buying his 69 SS396/375 HP Chevelle for $65,000; which coincidently was the asking price of the B/M camaro. I then called the owner Jon Bischof direct to re-remind him of my call asking to buy it a couple of years ago. He responds that the car had to go through the broker now but confirmed there were no deposits on the car yet. I felt my position in line for purchase of this car was first, having been two years prior to other potential buyers. I still waited another day, then called the broker who said he had no deposits but had approximately 10 prospective buyers, any of whom could buy it at any minute. I spoke for it and bought it.

We all know now there was a second like kind 71 B/M Camaro on eBay. After all this controversy, Jeff did not bid on it?? As it didn't sell, it could've been bought after the auction for $57,000. I think I would've done a favor to anyone wanting a 71 B/M Camaro as it was $8,000 less than what I paid.

It appears that Dan 68 Chevy II is the person behind the scenes fueling this controversy by emailing off-line. He had the only negative remark in the original 71 B/M thread as well. Another member of this Board had passed on to me that when asking for info on a 68 Big Block Nova, Dan emailed him stating that since he sided with Kevin, Dan wouldn't help him; as Kevin was a wealthy owner that didn't care about his crews whom where in danger on his boats in Alaska, and that Kevin's Dad gave it all to him. I've also emailed to Bow Tie Gang off-line asking if it was Dan emailing him off-line and fueling the 71 B/M controversy; but he has not responded. My assumption is that it is Dan.

Dan this is for your info: Although I have a great Dad, the only thing he gave me was the suitcase I packed my clothes in when I left home at age 17. I've not inherited nor have been given anything by anybody. I started my business from scratch. My crews and other boat captains are like family to me whom I care a lot about. This is because I spent 32 years of seasons at Sea risking my life with them, so I know what happens up there. I just returned from a season of which a storm took place and we fished in 40 foot seas. There was loss of life again and numerous vessels incurred heavy weather damage. My brother-in-laws boat recovered one of the bodies. Being there and listening to it happen on my radios tears your heart out. We are like a small tight-knit community of vessels at sea, as we are 100 miles offshore with no protection. There were vessels that had wheelhouse windows blown out, which results in destroying the vessels navagation and communications electronics. One vessel returned with the steel top of his wheelhouse peeled back like the lid on a tin can. Yet these are not small vessels as they are heavy duty steel and range in 120 to 165 feet in length. But all my vessels, crews and myself returned safely. Kevin

68l30

10-23-2001, 04:18 PM

Well said,welcome back!

Steve

NWYENKO

10-23-2001, 04:40 PM

Kevin, Wenona, that was more explanation than anyone deserved nor should you have had to make it!! Hopefully this thread can be put to rest. Welcome back (got back just in time for last nights storm which I am sure seemed very tame to you).
Jim

Dan 68 Chevy II

10-23-2001, 11:05 PM

Kevin I guess you just don't remenber me .I talked to you personally and you said would help me with imfomation about my car and did you ever call just to say no I couldn't find anything,Thanks for helping.This happen when you had your 69 BM Motion for sale in Hemmings and I called on your car .You told me you sold the car and that the new owner wanted to keep the price private.I could care less what you have and as far as what you just said ,if it makes you fill good say whatever you want,I heard different opinons off line and also phone calls from many people also.I just want to know one thing ,why do you feel you have to justify your ownership of 40 supercars?I don't come on here and defend why I have 3 muscle cars,I appreciate what I have and I'm dam lucky to have these.I think all of us work hard for what we have,but I've yet to see anyone else but you defend why they have what they have ,lets add that to the Profiles maybe since it seems to be the TOPIC NOW.

Dan 68 Chevy II

10-24-2001, 12:56 AM

Wow,I'm impress.Do you better now?
Sincerily Dan Palchanes

SuperCars

10-24-2001, 01:11 AM

Dan, I remember your phone calls to which I answered you the best I could. You were seeing some stripes resembling B/M stripes on your 68 Nova and asked me how to identify a B/M car. I answered you at that time that I had no way to identify it, but the only real way was to pay Joel Rosen $1500 to tell you whether it was or wasn't a B/M car. You were not happy to hear that but I can not be responsible for what Joel charges. If you were one of the dozens of guys calling when I had my 69 B/M for sale and then asking price after I said it was no longer available; I felt it was prying into ones privacy. It was a confidential matter between me and Charley Lillard as I promised it to him but the sale hinged on my buying a ZL1 B/M Camaro I was dealing with a guy on. The ZL1 ended up being a bogus car with no paperwork, therefore I was not able to sell mine to Charley.

As far as your question why I have to justify and defend myself; it is only because of your negative comments that prompt them. The first being your comment in the original 71 B/M thread about "elite secret guys with wads of money". All I want to say is I am the same as everyone else on this board and no better. Dan it is you that has me here again and again needing to defend myself after your emailing negative comments off-line about me to other members. The one about me not caring about my crews on my boats in Alaska really struck a sensitive nerve after seeing crews on other boats die and get injured this last two weeks, plus stressing heavily for my crews and boats safety. I am certain it was you that was fueling Bow Tie Gangs Controversy as well. I don't have a personal need to defend myself until people like you make negative statements against me, and then you can darn well bet that I will DEFEND myself!

10-24-2001, 01:44 AM

I'm a relative "newby," to you site, however I feel compelled to post. I have only recently re-entered the musclecar hobby, after taking 5-6 years off, with the re-purchase of a '70 LS6 Chevelle. I'm only 31, but I've owned alot of really nice cars. I would love to go out and spend 100K for B/M, Yenko, or ZL1 cars, but realistically that is not an option right now. I applaud Kevin, and others like him. I have never met Kevin, nor for that matter spoken with him via phone. We have only corresponded via email a few times. However he seems like a very up front, "real" ethusiast. Am I jealous of him for the money...hell no. I have seen what that can do firsthand.... I would like to publically thank Kevin for allowing me a glimspe of his collection via the internet. It is always great to be able to sit up and drool!!!For what it is worth....even though the internet does not show a person's jealous tone via voice, it does infer it through the words. Some of you need to remember that....I have a fellow devildog that always says, "never type something, you wouldn't have the bxlls to say to someone's face." Just my 2 cents.

Charley Lillard

10-24-2001, 02:36 AM

Arrgh..Instead of looking at that 69 BM Camaro in my garage I get to look at this...Kevin...Help....
http://members.aol.com/clill8567/maggie/

Dan 68 Chevy II

10-24-2001, 02:49 AM

Didn't I give you my Vin# on my 68 Nova when you asked? Now why did you ask me knowing you don't normally give this imformation out and then never respond?I often wonder about why you asked for my vin# yet never called to say yes I found something out or no I didn't.Did you a few months ago contact someone in N J about trying to buy a Black Motion Nova that is heavily documented?I talked to this person not to long ago.
Now as far as if you care about your workers,I DEFINITLY believe you do.I'm real glad you brought this point up.Without having and seeing all the imfomation that I said ,What I meant is all business work as a team and whether you want to admitt this or not business would not survive without the worker bees doing the grunt work at the bottom. Kevin,I was just trying to point out that most people don't give credit for what they have is do to the complete team and not just one individule.
These people at the bottom work their ass off for a tenth of what the people at the top make yet how many times do you hear a owner really say an mean that it's team and without the help of everybody I have on my team I wouldn't I have made the money I have or aquire the things I have. Life has gotten
way to fast and we need to slow it down and show appreciation for the good people around us. By the way I give your men much credit for being able to stay on the deck and still do their job through some of those tremendous violent storms.How these guys stay on deck through these storms is a miracle.
Peace Kevin,Dan
P.S. I'll leave you guys alone,I won't be posting anymore. Thanks

Denis

10-24-2001, 03:12 AM

Charley, I think you get more mileage out of that mutt than all of us put together with our cars http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

Denis

10-24-2001, 03:30 AM

Dan, Kevin feels compelled to explain himself because of your earlier postings, e.g.:

"Jeff,sorry to here you got screwed...since your not in this elite,secreted ,wads of money group...people play their stupid little games."

"I've seen NICB mention by a collector of rare muscle cars...I will call my friend tommorrow and tell them the NICB is for the rich and famous and it exist for the chosen few."

"...maybe we could help other people to find imformation they wouldn't normally no how to get, or why bother their not SUPERCARS."

[Edited by Denis (10-23-2001 at 10:30 PM).]

Charley Lillard

10-24-2001, 03:40 AM

Denis...There are 5 different Mutts and they all resemble some members of this web site ...or their Children.....That one looks like Belair I think.........

bkhpah

10-24-2001, 05:09 AM

I have been to Seattle and the first time I was there I met Kevin and he invited me to his home. He really didn't know me or my friend, but we were invited anyway. He was a complete gentleman and gave us the full tour of his home and cars. We never felt intimidated, just welcome. It is a grand collection to be sure. Kevin has been to my home as well and I have been with him at other events and he and his family have never been anything but splendid. It is disturbing that some people will condemn without any real facts. It is happening all to often on this site. I along with many others have tried to give the facts out on topics without any nonsence. I have been as calm as I can be about some of the things that have been said to me and others on this board. I have had times I just will not post because of the way the thread is moving. This is my favorite site to visit. I hope that we can all keep it that way. There is a lot of knowledge behind the keypads out there. I just hope we can continue to share it...BKH

MikeA

10-24-2001, 11:50 AM

Charley,

How about a group picture of your mutt collection. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

Mike

Charley Lillard

10-24-2001, 02:07 PM

I'm not sure you could handle it.

bowtie3168

10-24-2001, 03:43 PM

I have to say that I was not really surprised about the way that this post turned out. I could see where it was going after how it started with the negative comment (that turned me off) "don't even ask". I don't want your VIN# but, don't ask a question and insult us by implying that there is a lack of trust especially when you are the one asking for help. I always worry about how a group can experience a complete change over infighting. I do not wish to contribute more towards this fight but there was a comment made that I felt that I needed to address, Dan said something in reference to "adding this to Profiles" I want to know if that was a direct "dig" to one of my previous posts. If it is, then let your feelings be known, say it, if not, then I took it the wrong way. I like knowing who I am talking to. If I post something,work on a project,or build something then I put my name on it so people know who they are dealing with. I expect that from myself and I expect that from people that I deal with. I noticed that this negative post originated from a new forum poster who did not list anything about him/herself(s) and I have a problem with that. If somebody wishes to come on this forum and ask a question then I feel that they should let us know who is asking the question. This board is comprised of a group of friends who love this hobby, it is not a "hit and run"or a "get some extra info" and leave" bulletin board. If someone has this negative view ,well, feel free to leave any time the spirit moves you to do so. We don't need that kind of attitude here.I just want to remind all of the core members not to give up and quit because of some fly-by-nights that come in and ruin our group and then jet off to something else. Like I said before I have not met Kevin nor have we spoken on the phone but, I have friends that have, friends that trust implicitly who state emphatically that Kevin is a man of his word. I believe that! Do not attack him and question him and then question him about his explanation about his integrity. That is not right and it is not fair.

Andrew Hinckley

fpcopo

10-25-2001, 01:43 AM

I just want to add that Kevin's website is one of the most informative ones I've seen.
I think it is good of him to share these cars with us. Frank

PxTx

10-28-2001, 11:29 PM

I may be the only one who feels this way, but I think this thread has been good for the group. Kind of like a system of checks and balances. I just hate to see all of this scrutiny keep people from posting. Gosh knows there are already more than a few guys "in the know" of these cars that refuse to post here.

The fact is, Kevin is are a powerful collector who's capable of finding some of the rarest cars as well as their supporting documentation. Not that I am revealing anything new here, but there are these "urban legends" that float around this board. You know... about the guy who got a hold of certain information about "Supercar X" and later made arrangements to purchase the car- which quickly becomes a fully documented and very desirable car.

I am myself, curious to know what Kevin found with Dan's VIN#. Would you mind sharing this info Kevin, or at least the steps you took if you couldn't find anything?

Just ask Marlin how nice it is to have someone find the supporting information to the supercar you own. I'm sure finally receiving his POP felt darn good. Surely we hope that if anyone uncovers additional info on our cars, they would choose to share it with the present owner.

None of us want to be the guy in the "urban legend" who unknowingly sells a car to someone holding the unobtainable supporting documentation for our car. The truth is what most of these stories are based upon and history will repeat itself. I think these guys are justifiably cautious. I feel that all of the concerns addressed here by both Dan and the Bowtie Gang are legitimate, and I do not fault them for openly expressing them.

I want to make it clear that I consider Dan a friend. Since I first met him, he too has been a person of integrity and quickly earned my respect. He is very supportive and enthusiastic to help when he can- provided he doesn't feel that he's being taken advantage of. I think it is a shame the way Dan has been attacked here. I find it much easier to relate to Dan and his position than Kevin's. Looking at it from Dan's perspective, he is justified. Hopefully those who know or support Dan have at least shared your support with him outside of this group.

For those who have never met Dan or disagree with him, challenging him to a face to face confrontation is not in any of our best interests as it only serves as instigation for additional conflict. I do support any type of gentleman like debate that may continue as it helps to define who each of us really is- probably better than any self written profile could.

Best regards to all,

Paul Tholey

Belair62

10-29-2001, 12:09 AM

Paul I don't know Kevin,Bowtie Gang or Dan...I think part of the problem was the way things wer "typed" not spoken.Sometimes you can't tell whether the typed word comes off being cocky. Bowtie came off as kind of cocky in my opinion.Probably unintentional but thats what happens sometimes.I don't know Dan either...I asked him offline for a bit of info to identify a "real" big block 68 Chevy II because he knew what he was talking about on the subject.The response I got back offline was rather unusual.If you don't want to help someone out just say so or don't say anything.No need to make it personal.No one should have to kiss anyones a** around here to get info or help.Since most of us don't know each other personally, you can only base your impressions on responses posted.Lets move on now.......

[Edited by Belair62 (10-28-2001 at 07:09 PM).]

SuperCars

10-29-2001, 01:08 AM

Paul, I disagree with you 100%. It was Dan's off-line emails that were malicious and intentionally meant to harm me with vindictive comments to Bow Tie Gang and the other members of this board. Since when is this type of conduct to be considered gentleman-like and good discussion. I call it backstabbing. Additionally, I guess I read Bow Tie Gang's posts differently than you also, as I felt Bow Tie Gang was belligerent in his postings. It was Dan prompting him behind the scenes as well; how can you justify that. I don't think Dan has been attacked without reason. He has prompted all comments himself from his own postings.

Dan has taken a personal vendetta against me over 71 B/M Camaro car purchase I was every bit justified in doing. I considered myself first in line for that 71 B/M having attempted to buy it previously. Good grief, this transaction had nothing to do with Dan either, so why is it his mission to get involved. Furthermore when the second 71 Baldwin Motion of equal quality went unsold, it reconfirmed that I was the only buyer.

As far as Dan's VIN #; my only reason writing it down was trying to help Dan in the event I had a call from Joel or if I ever had occasion to call him. Joel has called me in the past. This has happened several times before my phone conversation with Dan. Joel's calls were to see if I was interested in various B/M corvettes and other cars. I thought if that were to occur again, that perhaps I could see if I could help Dan by getting a yes or no from Joel. But I have not talked to Joel since getting Dan's VIN. It is Dan's car and not mine so I didn't have any urgent reason to call Joel.

Even if I were to get a confirmation from Joel about Dan's car today, I would pass it on to him free of charge. i would do this even though I detest what he has done. I am in the hobby for the love of cars, not to make money or rip someone off.

I hate this thread continuing, as it is like beating a dead horse. But I disagree with Paul's intrepretation of this thread wholeheartedly.

NWYENKO

10-29-2001, 02:02 AM

What is an "urban legend"?? Kevin, I think you are wasting your time trying to explain anything to these 2 or 3 guys. This thread started off bad and has not gotten any better!!

Charley Lillard

10-29-2001, 02:57 AM

Don't make me post more Dog pictures.......I think we should all calm down and then go over to Kevin's and drive all his cars.

YenkoYS100

10-29-2001, 03:30 AM

That dog looks too cool with the B/M stripe on its nose. http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/laugh.gif
Has Joel verified the dog yet? LOL

[Edited by YenkoYS100 (10-28-2001 at 10:30 PM).]

Charley Lillard

10-30-2001, 02:45 AM

My Web site Enforcers...So you guys calm down.http://members.aol.com/clill8567/mutts/

COPO PETE

10-30-2001, 03:28 AM

This thread is really going to the dogs! http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif
Peter

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

10-30-2001, 12:42 PM

Hey;
What's wrong with the little dog in the background? Is it a little statue, or is he just shunned from the party??
M

Mr70

10-30-2001, 02:37 PM

Don't ever feed a Dog Peanut Butter.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1608634&a=12269112&p=55819797

Steven J

10-30-2001, 06:06 PM

Hey mr70, is that you working under a Chevelle with nothing more than a bumper jack holding it up ? Put me in your will, all I want is your car.

bowtie3168

10-30-2001, 06:16 PM

I don't want to encourage Charlie but, my grandfather owned a Boston Terrier back in the 1940s and he still brags about him. My grandfather even showed me home movies of the dog doing flips and jumps. They are cool!Now back to Yenkos, Motions, Bergers, Harrells, Danas, Gibbs, and more!

Andrew

Mr70

10-30-2001, 06:32 PM

Steven J
That is me and Posi in 1981.
I was wrenchin hard and that car was rocking.What an absolute idiot I was....An accident waiting to happen.
You don't want that Chevelle,thats a Fencl-Tufo 1972 SS 350 with Air Shocks.
http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/crazy.gif

helen

10-31-2001, 02:20 AM

wow. now i feel vendicted for a bad comment i made a bit ago. i want to thank 68topstock and kurt s for help they have given me to try to document a car i have. they are super guys who have bent over backward trying to help me. brent

68TopStock

11-01-2001, 04:51 AM

Whew, thank goodness this one is about over. Thanks helen.

All this excitement must mean something. I am looking forward to someday finding a Dickie Harrell car (any model will do) tucked away in a barn!

BTW, take a close look at all the interior pics of the above mentioned car article at Dick's shop.

[Edited by 68TopStock (10-31-2001 at 11:51 PM).]

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

11-01-2001, 06:27 PM

On a happy and related note, after meeting some really nice Supercar owners from Texas at the reunion, I offered to copy my somewhat limited Yenko Camaro info for them. (No attitudes, no ego's, just sharing info).

One of these guys shared my name/number with another Texas gentleman who it turns out has owned a Citrus Green '70 Yenko Deuce since the late '70's, and he called me last night to see if I could answer some questions for him. We never knew that yet another Colonial Deuce was driven home from the base at Norfolk. This turn of events is significant because it shows that one friendly deed turns out to further the cause of the hobby, in this case the Yenko Deuce Registry, otherwise how would we ever find a car like this?

A special thanks to the guys in Texas, hope you like the Yenko info!!
M

MikeA

11-01-2001, 06:48 PM

Marlin,

Any details on the Deuce; condition, mileage, etc.

Mike

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

11-02-2001, 12:48 PM

MikeA;
The car is in original condition, unknown mileage. We had a short conversation since I was holding Benjamin, talking on the phone, and handing out Halloween candy at the same time! When he gets my package of info, he will call back and I can get more details. He apparently did quite a bit of street racing with it while in high school.
M

MikeA

11-02-2001, 01:24 PM

M

What's the matter Marlin, you can not do three things at once? http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif Keep us informed!

Mike

YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY

11-02-2001, 01:30 PM

I'm a little clumsy!! (actually, I was eating some of the candy too). I have a hard enough time steering and shifting at the same time, 3 or 4 things is just too much http://www.yenko.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif
M

Chris396

11-03-2001, 04:34 AM

Charlie you should really call an exterminator. Those rats will eat clean through the ZL1's wiring harness. They also carry the plague.

BBIGG BLOCK 396

06-04-2002, 09:42 AM

Jealous,jealous,jealous man I never seen so much,I don't know anyone on this site but here is what I get from reading every post on this thread.Bowtie gang and Dan you guys need to move on!!if you don't trust the people on this site then why visit it.Bowtie gang you are the one who was asking for help!! but when offered seems you get a stick up the old rectum or something.Dan ,sounds like you just like stiring up #%^& if you get my drift.Ever heard of double sided.Kevin,I don't know you,have never talked to you,but sounds like you are a very hard working person that has created a good business,takes care of and cares about your employees,sounds like to me you deserve what you have.So you have 40 ,50 or even a 100 cars more power too you.Personally I have only one and hell it ain't even a super car,at least no documentation.But I worked hard for it and I am sure you worked hard for yours,especially having the most dangerous job in the USA.This is a very helpful site and some very nice people visit here and are willing to sacrifice some of there time and knowledge to help others.Just be proud to have a car,or cars,enjoy the hobby,be glad to be an American to where you have the freedom to do these things!!Think of all the people that do not have the things we take for granted each day!! like electricity,running water plenty of food to eat!!But yet you have the time to BITCH about someone else having a little bit more than another has. AND If you guys that are griping keep it up!! Charley will turn those ferocious Dogs on you.Enjoy your life and health while you have it!!

Bobby