1970 gto judge ram air IV

[mrmuscle]

also billy, the way the story was, the cars were sent to knafel to race and probably were not intended to be sold, but like so many others they got sold. did you see the new high performance pontiac magazine. i guess you dont believe the article on the 65 light weight cars either. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[BillyBobcat]

[ QUOTE ]
also billy, the way the story was, the cars were sent to knafel to race and probably were not intended to be sold, but like so many others they got sold. did you see the new high performance pontiac magazine. i guess you dont believe the article on the 65 light weight cars either. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

<font color="red"> SUNDAY! SUNDAY! SUNDAY! (AND MONDAY TOO!) </font>

<font color="blue"> See Mr ìGrumpyî Muscle take on the rest of the field.

Will his smokey burnout put the rest of the field on the trailer? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burnout.gif[/img]

Seeing how often he misses gears [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/[/img], I doubt it!</font>


In regards to recent continuous negative postings on the RAM AIR V subject in this forumÖGET A LIFE KID! You constantly badger and belittle other people and their statements on this site, even in the face of indisputable evidence. I am sure that the founders of this site are true car enthusiasts that never wished for this to happen. It only takes one or two problem people such as this person to take a nice site like this and make it bad for everyone. I am somewhat ashamed that a Pontiac person would conduct themselves in this manner on a site that is predominately Chevy oriented. I have never made any negative statements toward this individual, yet since I do not share HIS views; he constantly makes rude and sarcastic statements towards myself and anyone else who holds similar views. These forums should be entertaining &amp; informative. I can get this kind of excitement getting a ROOT CANAL! There is no logic in providing documented information and original 35 yr. old photos just to have someone who does not have a clue distort reality to fit his own.

Well, I think Iím going see if the Camaro guys have anything cool to say under a different topic! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burnout.gif[/img]

On a lighter noteÖposting on this site, my wife got "5 stars", and all I got was a headache! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif[/img]

BTW ìmrmuscleî~ I know all about Vanís 1965 GTO. He lives right here in the Detroit areaÖand I have a ìfileî on it too! His is the car in the recent magazine that you are talking about (which I have already had for about three weeks). This STILL does not have anything to do with FACTORY RA Vís! GTO DONís got it right! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[mrmuscle]

billyboy, you and gtodon have got some anger issues. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] ever tried anger management courses???? answer me a question, if vans car is real and what he said about backdoor handshake deals, then why could mr kafel not have done the same thing? again, you are so strong willed against the attempt to get these two cars proven, it just seems like you have something to lose if they are. you also, keep attacking the value of the silver judge. why? do you know the owner of it? if so do you have something against him? finally the value has nothing to do with this topic. calm down before you have a stroke. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Charley Lillard]

Mr Muscle.. I think alot of People here are leaning the same way as Billy in regards to your comments. I don't mind differences of opinion here and have learned more about RAV than I ever wanted to know but this has degraded to 12 year old type Name calling. Please tone down your arguements or take them elsewhere.
All of you thinking about commenting on this site please keep it Civil. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/scholar.gif[/img]

[gtomike1967]

As you can see im brand new to this board. I heard about this discussion from another forum and decided to check it out.
First I would like to say that this is a very informative thread and im enjoying reading it!

Everybody is trying to prove or disprove that a RAV car was made at the factory and delivered to a Pontiac dealership right?
In my opinion the posts by Jim Matteson, Billy and GTODON contain the most info regarding that a RAV was never made by the factory. It seems the other guys are bassing most of their argument on hearsay from an old dragracer. (no offense intended to Mr. Knaffel)

I still feel that the burden of proof is on the people that believe in a factory RAV car and they havent shown much to prove thier case.

Thanks
My 2 cents

[Steve_Hoog]

Mike

I think it's been established that these cars weren't regular production, more than likely back door race cars or favors. With whatever proof there may or may not still be at GM; it is either concealed as confidentail, or long lost.

Do you have any suggestions where or how to come up with said proof? It's not an easy task. Every single contact I have at GM is a dead end, with the exception of one GM employee still putting forth effort. I'm losing hope in that. There are two things left in the works outside GM, which have a 50/50 chance. One, there may be some paperwork still in the vehicle with notes. The second is weeks away, and so far out of my realm I'm not going to comment on it.

I would love some suggestions for other approaches.

Even though there is no proof available yet, it is possible it occured. I think it would be an awesome thing to set the record straight for historical purposes.

Please help.

Steve

[gtomike1967]

Steve
I agree that it would be awesome to prove that a RAV was factory installed in a Pontiac and I think its great that people are trying.
I wish I could offer you a suggestion as to how to prove it, but I cant.
If it was my car I would restore it with a RAV in it and just be happy knowing that its an awesome car with a great history.

Mike

[JoeC]

Other avenues to check would be shipper records and shipper insurance records. I would guess same company that shipped the new cars "could" have shipped a "scrapped" prototype car to a dealer. I agree that documentation is needed.
This has been a good post as I have enjoyed it and learned some interesting Pontiac history.
It has been a fairly clean post as at least no one's sexual orientation has been called into question as of yet. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
Less personal attacks - more car facts [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[L67WT1]

With all due respect Mr Knafel is not John Delorean, When you are the head of the Pontiac Motor Division and want something done it gets done. I have personally seen Billybobcat's GTO at events it is in fact the only GTO that has the engineering documentation to back up his words and is the only one acknowledged by most Pontiac people. He has owned this car since 1979 and it has more documentation then you can imagine. Stop attacking this man for what he speaks is the truth and he has paperwork to back it up. There is an extensive article in the GTOAA's Legend I will try to scan it in and post.

That 65 GTO is also a well known car to Pontiac people and in no way does this car built five years earlier when Delorean was in control and the Musclecar craze was in full swing give creedance to verbal word smithing.

[hvychev]

[ QUOTE ]
I am a little worried about the Mrs. HvyChev thing though... Do we have "Francis Queen of the Day 2 Chevelles"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Murphy you better still be in England!! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

I swear that was really her that posted on this site! She always asks me what new controversy is going on and really posted that. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]